127 réponses à ce sujet

[jtav]

I'd love to see the quasi-magical aspects of the Reapers and their technology shot down once and for all. Reaper tech is presented as this mystical, incomprehensible thing. Attempts to study it tend to end with indoctrination/disaster. The game heavily slants against keeping the base, with your entire squad criticizing you. The impression I get isn't "be careful" but "there are things man is not meant to know." Which is nonsense. Reaper tech is just that: tech. It can be analyzed, countered, and improved on. It's dangerous, but so is nuclear power. I refuse to treat the Reapers like gods.

Modifié par jtav, 11 août 2011 - 12:47 .

[Meshaber]

I think Sovereign said it best (actually, Legion did, but I can't be bothered to find the quote, it's when he's referencing this particular line).

[RoboticWater]

I think the main reason your team criticized you is because you gave it to the illusive man. I would have liked to see a way to give it to the alliance or the salarians.

[roflchoppaz]

Meshaber wrote...

I think Sovereign said it best (actually, Legion did, but I can't be bothered to find the quote, it's when he's referencing this particular line).

"Technology is not a straight line. There are many paths to the same end."

And I didn't even need to google it. ._.

[Ieldra]

I fully agree with you, jtav.

Reaper technology is technology, not some kind of evil mojo we "aren't meant to know". We are not living in a fantasy universe. If things go down that road in ME3, if Reaper technology is ME's equivalent of the knowledge of the Old Ones, forever beyond our understanding, that would be one of the very few things that would ruin the complete trilogy for me beyond any hope of redemption.

So I hope it won't go that way and we'll get a chance of analyzing and understanding the stuff.

(I have to say, though, that I find your thread title misleading. The term "god" can be understood as any kind of being that has powers beyond our current understanding - "techno-gods" is an appropriate appellation for the Reapers even if they aren't inherently mysterious.)

@the first three repliers:
You have missed the point. This is not about the question of whether we should use Reaper technology or not. It is about the question whether Reaper technology should be presented as technology or as "some evil mystery we aren't meant to know".

Modifié par Ieldra2, 10 août 2011 - 03:48 .

[Praetor Knight]

My Technomage... err Sentinel will be more than happy to pull back the curtain for the Galaxy to see the Reapers for what they really are big stupid cuttlefish.

[Soahfreako]

So I'm assuming that everyone forgot that the Thanix Cannon was created by studying Sovereign? Yeah. You forgot.

[GreenDragon37]

It's not that I didn't want to keep it because "Reaper tech is evil". I blew it up because I didn't trust TIM with it. If I had a choice to give it over to the Alliance, I would have.

[Soahfreako]

I destroyed it so no one would get indoctrinated by it and come back to bite me in the ass. But, seeing as how Cerberus can't keep their mits off it and with the preview of the next comic, it's obvious that no one could've handled the base let alone the Alliance. Who, as we all know, deny the existence of the Reapers.

[GreenDragon37]

Soahfreako wrote...

I destroyed it so no one would get indoctrinated by it and come back to bite me in the ass. But, seeing as how Cerberus can't keep their mits off it and with the preview of the next comic, it's obvious that no one could've handled the base let alone the Alliance. Who, as we all know, deny the existence of the Reapers.

Something tells me that the Alliance knows more about the Reapers than they are letting on.

I look back at Kenson's team and Keiji's grey box.

[Praetor Knight]

Soahfreako wrote...

So I'm assuming that everyone forgot that the Thanix Cannon was created by studying Sovereign? Yeah. You forgot.

Um... sure.

[Soahfreako]

GreenDragon37 wrote...

Soahfreako wrote...

I destroyed it so no one would get indoctrinated by it and come back to bite me in the ass. But, seeing as how Cerberus can't keep their mits off it and with the preview of the next comic, it's obvious that no one could've handled the base let alone the Alliance. Who, as we all know, deny the existence of the Reapers.

Something tells me that the Alliance knows more about the Reapers than they are letting on.

I look back at Kenson's team and Keiji's grey box.

Kenson didn't know what she had till it had her indoctrinated, the grey box though is a good point. Though I'm positive Kasumi would've shared it with Shepard if it was something huge like that.

[Soahfreako]

Ieldra2 wrote...
 We are not living in a fantasy universe.

That me LOL. 

[Ieldra]

Soahfreako wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...
We are not living in a fantasy universe.

That me LOL. 

Meaning: we are not playing in a story with the genre conventions of fantasy. I thought that went without saying.

[GreenDragon37]

Soahfreako wrote...

GreenDragon37 wrote...

Soahfreako wrote...

I destroyed it so no one would get indoctrinated by it and come back to bite me in the ass. But, seeing as how Cerberus can't keep their mits off it and with the preview of the next comic, it's obvious that no one could've handled the base let alone the Alliance. Who, as we all know, deny the existence of the Reapers.

Something tells me that the Alliance knows more about the Reapers than they are letting on.

I look back at Kenson's team and Keiji's grey box.

Kenson didn't know what she had till it had her indoctrinated, the grey box though is a good point. Though I'm positive Kasumi would've shared it with Shepard if it was something huge like that.

I thought Kenson knew what she had, she was just stupid and forgot about Indoctrination.

They were probably setting the Greybox up for Mass Effect 3. We never really hear about it again after the LM.

Modifié par GreenDragon37, 10 août 2011 - 04:27 .

[jtav]

It's not using the tech that was wrong. It's apparently spending 2,000 years using it without knowing or caring how it works. See: letting the keepers naintain the Citadel and never poking around the innards yourself. It's not exploring the galaxy, even when you have the lifespan to do it with FTL only.

[Soahfreako]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Soahfreako wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...
We are not living in a fantasy universe.

That me LOL. 

Meaning: we are not playing in a story with the genre conventions of fantasy. I thought that went without saying.

Well when the subject is a fantasy universe and then you say you're not living in one while immersed in it, it makes for a nice oxymoron.

[Soahfreako]

jtav wrote...

It's not using the tech that was wrong. It's apparently spending 2,000 years using it without knowing or caring how it works. See: letting the keepers naintain the Citadel and never poking around the innards yourself. It's not exploring the galaxy, even when you have the lifespan to do it with FTL only.

Well somewhere in the game I do remember seeing that "poking around" with Keepers usually resulted in self-destruction.

"Attempts to capture a keeper or take it into custody for study will cause the creature to undergo a sudden "self-destruct," with a form of acid being released internally."
  Straight from the wiki.

Modifié par Soahfreako, 10 août 2011 - 04:38 .

[Praetor Knight]

Soahfreako wrote...

jtav wrote...

It's not using the tech that was wrong. It's apparently spending 2,000 years using it without knowing or caring how it works. See: letting the keepers naintain the Citadel and never poking around the innards yourself. It's not exploring the galaxy, even when you have the lifespan to do it with FTL only.

Well somewhere in the game I do remember seeing that "poking around" with Keepers usually resulted in self-destruction.

"Attempts to capture a keeper or take it into custody for study will cause the creature to undergo a sudden "self-destruct," with a form of acid being released internally."
  Straight from the wiki.

In ME1, Keepers were scanned, and in ME2 you get an Email from Chorban on the research.


Edit: masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Chorban

Modifié par Praetor Shepard, 10 août 2011 - 04:40 .

[Soahfreako]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Soahfreako wrote...

jtav wrote...

It's not using the tech that was wrong. It's apparently spending 2,000 years using it without knowing or caring how it works. See: letting the keepers naintain the Citadel and never poking around the innards yourself. It's not exploring the galaxy, even when you have the lifespan to do it with FTL only.

Well somewhere in the game I do remember seeing that "poking around" with Keepers usually resulted in self-destruction.

"Attempts to capture a keeper or take it into custody for study will cause the creature to undergo a sudden "self-destruct," with a form of acid being released internally."
  Straight from the wiki.

In ME1, Keepers were scanned, and in ME2 you get an Email from Chorban on the research.


Edit: masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Chorban

But see that wasn't possible until the games timeline. He asked why they didn't do it for the 2000 years that the Asari, Salarians, Turians etc. used it.

Modifié par Soahfreako, 10 août 2011 - 04:44 .

[Praetor Knight]

Soahfreako wrote...

But see that wasn't possible until the games timeline. He asked why they didn't do it for the 2000 years that the Asari, Salarians, Turians etc. used it.

Now to distribute those findings.

Same with the Thanix Cannon; recent tech that is needed to help do away with the mystical reputation of the Reapers. So for ME3 we need to dispel the old theories with the new evidence.

[jtav]

And I meant the Citadel's inner workings, anyway. We just let the keepers handle it. Okay?

[didymos1120]

Soahfreako wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

Soahfreako wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...
We are not living in a fantasy universe.

That me LOL. 

Meaning: we are not playing in a story with the genre conventions of fantasy. I thought that went without saying.

Well when the subject is a fantasy universe and then you say you're not living in one while immersed in it, it makes for a nice oxymoron.

No, you're just conflating two distinct senses of the term "fantasy".  One being a genre of fiction, the other being a synonym for "imaginary".

[didymos1120]

Soahfreako wrote...

 But see that wasn't possible until the games timeline. He asked why they didn't do it for the 2000 years that the Asari, Salarians, Turians etc. used it.

It probably was possible, at least in terms of tech level.  I don't think Chorban invented something radically new.  He just figured out a novel way to use existing technology to avoid the "self-destruct" problem.  Mostly what kept people from doing this earlier was the previous attempts to mess with keepers failing, which lead to laws banning interference with them.

[Ieldra]

Soahfreako wrote...
So I'm assuming that everyone forgot that the Thanix Cannon was created by studying Sovereign? Yeah. You forgot.

No, I did not forget. Nor that EDI contains some of the stuff.

What I hope is that the Bioware writers haven't forgotten that! Given the way the Collector base decision was presented in the game, and the uniform reactions of the team, I'm not so confident of that.