117 réponses à ce sujet

[Clonedzero]

it should be satisfying.
and there should be multiple endings.

simple as that.

[stonbw1]

lknewsome wrote...

stonbw1 wrote...

Han Shot First wrote...

Disagree.

There should not be any ending where every character makes it through unscathed. In order to be a good story, Mass Effect 3 needs to have some emotional impact on the people playing it. That isn't going to happen if the Reapers never really seem like a threat to Shepard and his team or if the only people that die are unnamed billions (nothing more than a statistic) or characters that have very little screen time.

I couldn't agree more.  For ME3 to have the same impact as ME1, you have to inject an element of sacrifice . . .even if that means the loss of one of /multiple squadmates, a love interest, or even yourself.

Thats why I multiple endings are good.  Something to satisfy everyone.

Yes, multiple endings will clearly be available, but in a sincere question, do you really think that ME3 will  emotionally impact you if you start and end the game with all your friends unscathed? I suppose that option being available is the truest example of RPG (whatever that means in the ME series).  I think I'll sit back and feel unspectacular.  For instance, my first SM playthrough, I lost a squadmate.  I was a bit surprised and if I had actually gained an appreciation beforehand to this squadmate, I'd be more emotionally impacted.  Don't even get me started on the VIrmire issue . .

[JukeFrog]

I don't mind having characters die in ME3 and/or having sad endings as long as it's done right. It bugs me when characters are killed off solely for shock value.

[SerWhat?]

I didn't say that everyone should live. That REALLY would be unrealistic. I could deal with one or even two squad mates dying but not all. And I really don't want to see my LI die at all. For any of my Shepards it would be really crappy to be treated the way I have been and then swallow my pride and save everyone only to turn around and lose the most important person in the world to me. Shepard would end up bitter and alone in my mind. I wouldn't want to see that.

[Han Shot First]

Here is the problem with having multiple endings with everyone surviving in one of them:

If by default that ending is made the one with the best outcome, it removes any emotional impact from the other endings where people die. Because in those endings, people would only die if Shepard made tactical or strategic blunders. Those deaths would only come at the expense of Shepard being made into an incompetant combat leader.

The only solution IMO is to either not have an 'everyone lives' ending at all, (my preference) or have the 'everyone lives' ending not be the ideal outcome. In that ending the player would have put the lives of his team before the mission. The Reapers might be defeated and your team may have survived, but Earth is rendered uninhabitable and the civilizations of the galaxy lie in ruins.

[Enmystic]

I thought in a multiple ending scenario there wouldn't have to be a "default" ending since the outcome would depend on how you played...?

I don't like the idea of forcing character deaths without some kind of control over who it is.

Modifié par Enmystic, 10 août 2011 - 10:27 .

[Han Shot First]

Enmystic wrote...

I thought in a multiple ending scenario there wouldn't have to be a "default" ending since the outcome would depend on how you played...?

I don't like the idea of forcing character deaths without some kind of control over who it is.

The problem with having multiple endings where the everyone one lives ending is the best outcome, is that it cheapens the other endings. It it isn't satisfying to lose squad mates in Mass Effect 2 for example, because it only happens if Shepard makes tactical or strategic blunders.

Modifié par Han Shot First, 10 août 2011 - 11:26 .

[Undertone]

Han Shot First wrote...

Here is the problem with having multiple endings with everyone surviving in one of them:

If by default that ending is made the one with the best outcome, it removes any emotional impact from the other endings where people die. Because in those endings, people would only die if Shepard made tactical or strategic blunders. Those deaths would only come at the expense of Shepard being made into an incompetant combat leader.

The only solution IMO is to either not have an 'everyone lives' ending at all, (my preference) or have the 'everyone lives' ending not be the ideal outcome. In that ending the player would have put the lives of his team before the mission. The Reapers might be defeated and your team may have survived, but Earth is rendered uninhabitable and the civilizations of the galaxy lie in ruins.

Quoted for truth. I hated how in order for my squad mates to die I have to make tactically stupid decisions in the SM.

[Boiny Bunny]

Bioware devs have confirmed that there is not a single ending available which is 'sunshine and lollipops' in a manner of speaking.

Perhaps you can have your whole squad survive, but the entire human race is almost extinct at the end, or similar - as a 'good' option.

In all likeliness - there will be no ultimate 'good' ending - but rather, trade-offs to make.  Save the Turians?  The Krogans are wiped out utterly.

Save Ashley at some pivotal moment in the game?  400,000 innocent colonists are slaughtered.

etc.

Modifié par Boiny Bunny, 10 août 2011 - 11:00 .

[Enmystic]

Han Shot First wrote...

The problem with having multiple endings where the everyone one lives ending is the best outcome, is that it cheapens the other endings. It it isn't satisfying to lose squad mates in Mass Effect 2 for example, because it only happens if Shepard makes tactical or stragegic blunders.

Yeah the Suicide Mission was a start, it wasn't perfect by any means.  However, what if that similar method was implemented differently where simply "doing everything right" won't ensure squadmate survival.  Going above and beyond, whatever that entails, would only increase the chances, but you would risk something else.  I'm not talking planetary losses, but more "collateral damage" of some kind.

Getting the best ending wouldn't exactly be possible on a first run unless a guide, multiple playthroughs, or some previous knowledge on what to do, or not do were involved.

[BlueMagitek]

I'd like there to be a "Golden" ending; minimal causalities, maximum damage inflicted on Reapers, etc. It would involve making both Paragon & Renegade choices throughout the trilogy and it would be the most difficult to achieve.

Good endings depending on players actions; Cerberus takes humanity to the top, humans lose Council status, Race X ascends, etc. This goes for bad endings as well.

A bittersweet ending would be nice; you had to sacrifice party members (or your LI), or in some cases yourself in order to defeat the Reapers. This could go into some of the good endings.

Another ending that would be fun would be a Bolivian Army ending (if only for the rage); we see the remaining Reaper(s) surround the party... not likely to happen though.

But I think that, above all else, I'd prefer a Fallout stye of ending. We discover how our actions (or inactions) had an affect on every place and person that we've touched, with varying degrees of "goodness" of each place.

[Boiny Bunny]

Indeed - I am going to be VERY annoyed if only all Paragon choices lead to the best ending possible. Shepard should have to break all kinds of laws and moral boundaries if the cost otherwise is large enough.

[Homebound]

the sad ending is this will be the last game that has this depth and ambition that bioware will make at least for a long while.

[mopotter]

lknewsome wrote...

I have been browsing the forums and happened to notice a discussion going on about ME3 endings being sad.  I started thinking about it a lot and decided I don't want to purchase and waste my time and money on this game if there is no playthrough available where all main characters survive.  I know a lot of people are going to say I'm being a baby or unrealistic but come ON. There should at least be the option.  This is a game.  Games are usually meant to entertain.  I am not the kind of person that enjoys movies and TV dramas.  I need to lighten my load not add to it.

Other than I've allready pre-orderd mine, I agree.  I will be extremely po'ed if there is just one ending and its a suck, LI, best friend died couldn't save as many as possible one.   I'm hoping they have more than one kind of ending, sort of like the SM where you could save all or most if you worked at it.  

Has nothing to do with "being a baby" and all to do with feeling I've waisted 5 years of my life playing a game that is going to leave me depressed as hell.  And that would mean I no longer pre-order their games, but wait until I find out the ending after it's released.  

I don't mind if they have a sad ending, as long as there is a super heroic we won and survived ending too.

edit spelling correction

Modifié par mopotter, 11 août 2011 - 12:06 .

[SerWhat?]

I think it would be interesting and bittersweet if someone Sheppard trusts betrays him somehow and in the end is so guilt ridden that he or she sacrifices themselves in an effort of redemption.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Halo Reach went over huge. That was a sad ending. You died after you ran out of ammo or got sniped. Everyone knew it was going to be a sad ending when they bought the game.

I've stated my opinions, but I'll state them again. This is war. War is Hell:

1) The Sacrifice: Shepard sacrifices him/herself to save the crew of the ship and team during the final battle resulting in victory.

1a) The Sacrifice in vain: same as above except everyone dies anyway (Normandy + team + crew dead), but the galaxy is saved.

2) A Hero's End: Shepard and one or two others, incl the LI buy the farm during the final battle == and make it one heart wrenching scene for the LI death before Shepard's own. One that makes you scream "NOOOOOOO!" Cutscene after Shep's death showing the victory.

3) Hollow Victory: Shepard survives but otherwise the same as 2.

4) Better than nothing: The entire crew survives but several worlds and colonies are taken. Family members, if any die. End result Victory.

5) Charlie Foxtrot: while the above are tragic this one needs to be really tragic -- Shepard fails and through his/her own faults and deeds from the previous two games and ME3 sees the galaxy wiped out before joining them making one last suicide run to take out a reaper.

6) The flowers and fairy dust ending -- several worlds are almost taken by the reapers, but Shepard and crew with their strong alliances are able to turn the tide against the reapers and render all of them helpless. This only happens if Shepard is successful in negotiating peace between the Quarians and Geth, and getting the two to fight side by side against the Reapers. The Krogan are used as shock troops against the reaper husks and indoctrinated organic units -- maybe clones of Grunt.

Remember that Vigil mentioned that the reapers sent indoctrinated Protheans to other Prothean worlds to sabotage efforts against them. I would expect no different this time.

Be glad I'm not writing this. A war like this is never without a lot of casualties.

Modifié par sH0tgUn jUliA, 11 août 2011 - 12:16 .

[Enmystic]

Halo: Reach was a prequel to the Halo series while Mass Effect 3 is the final sequel in a trilogy...

If squadmates have to die I just want control. Otherwise I feel the same as mopotter.

[sedrikhcain]

Undertone wrote...

I thought the SM was pretty useless considering how easy it was for everyone to make it. What's so suicide about it. And yes I fully hope and expect people to die in ME3 one way or another. Because seriously it's a war. If you want sunshine and bunnies play Sims or something.

If the Reapers invade and everyone makes it it will be the most pathetic invasion in the history of video games. Not to mention it would make me wonder how the **** no one stopped them before. And also they are supposed to be unstoppable.

Now before all paragons start raging about my comment I also want a happy ending in there. But a realistically happy ending in which still somebody died, there was some sacrifice to be made. Because really if you achieved all without losing anything or anyone what worth was there in the victory in the first place?

I want a range of endings from complete victory of the Reapers, to morbid one in which Shepard has to sacrifices himself/herself, to one in which we barely win it but everyone desolated and exhausted and societies on the verge of extinction, to a moderately successful one in which few races get extinct but other ones survive and thrive. And last a "happy" one in which the galactic community while bearing losses manages to survive and I still lost a few companions but not all. And either way such happy ending should be very very hard to achieve - and certainly by using both renegade and paragon. I'm sorry but if only paragons are able to achieve some measure of happy endings and all their choices turn out to be right ones, this is going to be the last Bioware game I'll be getting.

Meh, it's all about the journey, not the body count. Just because good people die doesn't make a war story realistic. Just because every central character lives doesn't make it a saccharin farce. It's all about how they got there. If it's one thing the ME writers have got right from the start, it's the sense of epic drama. I trust them to pull it off again -- even better this time, as it's the last chapter and they don't have to hold anything back.

[nifedj]

If ME3 is true to what has been set up in the previous games there will be plenty of player input on the ending - BioWare has already said there will be loads of permutations. For example, rather than just killing a character, the player could be given a choice between saving that character or something else, like saving a bunch of innocents. I for one would have a hard time balancing the lives of my favourite characters against the lives of many strangers - particularly if there was still a fair bit to go in the game, because it's harder to sacrifice someone if they might be important/useful to you later.

There should definitely be a wide range. I would say that the worst ending should (obviously) be complete failure while the 'best' should still have plenty of civillian casualties and should also be very difficult to attain.

[sedrikhcain]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Halo Reach went over huge. That was a sad ending. You died after you ran out of ammo or got sniped. Everyone knew it was going to be a sad ending when they bought the game.

I've stated my opinions, but I'll state them again. This is war. War is Hell:

1) The Sacrifice: Shepard sacrifices him/herself to save the crew of the ship and team during the final battle resulting in victory.

1a) The Sacrifice in vain: same as above except everyone dies anyway (Normandy + team + crew dead), but the galaxy is saved.

2) A Hero's End: Shepard and one or two others, incl the LI buy the farm during the final battle == and make it one heart wrenching scene for the LI death before Shepard's own. One that makes you scream "NOOOOOOO!" Cutscene after Shep's death showing the victory.

3) Hollow Victory: Shepard survives but otherwise the same as 2.

4) Better than nothing: The entire crew survives but several worlds and colonies are taken. Family members, if any die. End result Victory.

5) Charlie Foxtrot: while the above are tragic this one needs to be really tragic -- Shepard fails and through his/her own faults and deeds from the previous two games and ME3 sees the galaxy wiped out before joining them making one last suicide run to take out a reaper.

6) The flowers and fairy dust ending -- several worlds are almost taken by the reapers, but Shepard and crew with their strong alliances are able to turn the tide against the reapers and render all of them helpless. This only happens if Shepard is successful in negotiating peace between the Quarians and Geth, and getting the two to fight side by side against the Reapers. The Krogan are used as shock troops against the reaper husks and indoctrinated organic units -- maybe clones of Grunt.

Remember that Vigil mentioned that the reapers sent indoctrinated Protheans to other Prothean worlds to sabotage efforts against them. I would expect no different this time.

Be glad I'm not writing this. A war like this is never without a lot of casualties.

I was under the impression that the OP was referring to deaths of central characters.

[Tommy6860]

I agree with you on this. Besides, if devs are going to designate games as RPGs in any classification, then what you desire should fit right into it. If the game ends totally sad against what you or I want, then it was RPed by the devs, not by us.

[Arken]

Bittersweet endings are fine by me. Every ending should be a little bittersweet the difference being what was lost. No matter what there should be heavy causalities but in the end Shepard should always be able to brush it off and move on. Han Shot said it best that there can't be an ending that is "perfect" because the other endings would feel pointless.

Why play the game this way if the "right way" saves everyone. It would be like if paragon players got a perfect ending were everyone lived while renegades lose everything. It would make playing as a renegade seem pointless. Both versions of Shepard should experience some loss but in the end they're the big hero.

Losing a love interest? I don't know. Batman lost his love interest in The Dark Knight and it pretty much fueled him for the rest of the film. Of course losing a love interest should be a clear consequence to a choice that shouldn't be easy to make.

Like it said before that maybe saving love interest A means sacrificing the krogan race. Something similar to Vimire. If Shepard has no love interest than maybe Joker since he is the closest to the commander in a non-romantic way.

Save Joker, or let the krogans burn?

[Destroy Raiden_]

I like the sad endings when the media I'm watching is leading that way for instance Ringu that didn't have a happy ending for all involved either they died or they were insane by the end the movie was dark and having the main character somehow come out of that ok would've been unrealistic to say the least but in ME I can see a bitter sweet one, I can see a tragic one, a sad one but an all happy rainbows everyone lives thanks to plot and LM armor would just suck I already felt the everyone can survive the sm to be a hallow and cheap ending for 2 considering most of them where not soldiers or had pure battlefield experience but rag tag nutters.

[Boiny Bunny]

Enmystic wrote...

Halo: Reach was a prequel to the Halo series while Mass Effect 3 is the final sequel in a trilogy...

If squadmates have to die I just want control. Otherwise I feel the same as mopotter.

Miranda and Johnson died in Halo 3.  Around 90% of the human race was killed in Halo 3 (or just before the game).  The Chief is left stranded in deep space at the end with little hope of ever being rescued.

I'm sure Bioware WILL give you a choice - but it won't be a 'save Kaiden or don't' choice - rather it will be a 'save Kaiden OR save 400,000 civilians' type decision.

[Destroy Raiden_]

I think if they do that choice it should be quantity vs quantity or person vs person not person vs planet/star system that's way out of proportion and any para would kill that one even BDTS's end choice was disproportionate.