256 réponses à ce sujet

[Fredvdp]

Of the ones I remember I'd have to go with Fable 3, though I admit I've only see someone else play it. RPGs need shades of grey in the decisions and Fable morality is either pet the rabbit or kill it.

The problem with 'wost game' threads is that I tend to forget to really awful ones. I bet I've played crappy flash RPGs that I don't remember. That's why you'll see many known titles in threads like these. I personally didn't like Morrowind but that doesn't make it a bad game.

Could someone who picked a Final Fantasy title explain to me what makes Final Fantasy an RPG?

[Mercannis]

Two Worlds

Two Worlds 2 - Why did i punish myself?

Fallout 3

Dragon Age 2

Fable...

Forgot to add Final fantasy X-2 one of the only games i didnt finish i lasted 1 hr.

Modifié par Mercannis, 11 août 2011 - 12:06 .

[Bad King]

Haplose wrote...

Andarthiel_Demigod wrote...

Haplose wrote...

1. Oblivion (generic beyond belief, mind-numbiggly boring, small and disgustingly simplified compared with Morrowind, with worst imaginable character development mechanics)

*gasp* Sacrilege.
Oblivion was one of the best of it's time.
And I don't see how it's simplified. The mechanics are almost the same.

"Almost" would be the keyword here. Can you fly in Oblivion? Move at blazing speed? What the heck happened to enchantment? I think some spell effects were gone as well, though I don't remember exactly.
Can you fluidly fly into a city area and through the districts? I remembe having fun, flying around some high city in Morrowind.
The world is much smaller and far less varied.
Character development mechanics could have been similar, but at least the enemies didn't level with you in Morrowind, so you weren't penalized for gaining levels....

And this whole Cyrodill lacks style with it's generic-ness. And these awesome random treasures....

Still, people forget that they did a lot of things better in Oblivion. It had better sidemissions, better gameplay, and more depth for each skill. And I always found enchantment OP in Morrowind (it almost completely took the point out of every other magic skill).

And don't forget that you can move at blazing speed in Oblivion.

[Andarthiel_Demigod]

mrcrusty wrote...

Haplose wrote...

Andarthiel_Demigod wrote...
^Fly? What are you talking about? Unless you were cheating or modding your stats, flying and moving extra fast was never a feature in Morrowind. And you can still cheat your stats in Oblivion much the same way(there's also a mod which lets you fly Dragons:happy:)

Of course I could fly in Morrowind. Via a spell. No, it wasn't a mod. I didn't install any mods or even buy any of the expansions. That was vanilla game.

Technically, those are jump and/or levitation spells. But yeah, Morrowind had it and Oblivion didn't.

Scrolls of Icarian Flight, too.

"Sweet!"
"WWWEEEEEEEEE!!!"
"Haha! YYYYEEEEAAAAHHHHH-"
"Whoa wait... wait..."
"OH CRAP!"
"OH CRAP! OH CRAP! OH CRAP! OH CRAP! OH CRAP! OH CRAP! OH CRAP! OH CRAP! OH CRAP! OH CRAP! OH CRAP!"
*splat*



Of course, you just make yourself a Slowfall spell and Scrolls of Icarian Flight gives the meaning away more or less. But still hilarious.

Oh umm... worst RPG I played..

I don't know.

I did play Arcania (Gothic 4) though, so I think that it gets an instant mention.

And that's why it was removed in Oblivion:P
I never used it because it was too fiddly.

[Funkcase]

Bad King wrote...

Rockworm503 wrote...

I just don't get the Fallout 3 hate I still get excited playing it and just started a new game its still very fun.

Yeah I've always enjoyed Fallout 3. The game has great replay value and enjoyable gameplay (V.A.T.S never gets old for me).

Basically gamer hipsters hate it. Becuase they like the old vintage ones better. I personally love the old Fallouts (except for Brotherhood of steel and tactics) Always have. But I think what Bethesda did was great, just could have done with more side quests and voice actors I thought. The way I see it, Bethesda saved Fallout. Black isle are no more, and Interplay are on the verge of becoming bankrupt.

[Haplose]

Bad King wrote...
Still, people forget that they did a lot of things better in Oblivion. It had better sidemissions, better gameplay, and more depth for each skill. And I always found enchantment OP in Morrowind (it almost completely took the point out of every other magic skill).

Did it? I don't remember that. The scaling system entirely ruined Oblivion's gameplay for me. More depth for each skill? I also don't really remember that, but indeed, it was a long time since I last played it.

I do agree enchantment was OP in Morrowind. But why instead of balancing it, they decided to castrate it instead?
Why can't you make even basic permanent enchantments in Oblivion (that is, not using charges)? Why can't you add a few point of flame to your sword or something without constantly recharging it?
They even failed at making the system less OP. By stacking some weakness effects, you can still make weapons that kill any enemy in 3-4 swings in Oblivion.

And levitate worked very well for me, not quirky at all. I remember spending hours exploring the landspace, cities and towns from bird eye's view.

[Chromie]

Funkcase wrote...


Basically gamer hipsters hate it. Becuase they like the old vintage ones better. I personally love the old Fallouts (except for Brotherhood of steel and tactics) Always have. But I think what Bethesda did was great, just could have done with more side quests and voice actors I thought. The way I see it, Bethesda saved Fallout. Black isle are no more, and Interplay are on the verge of becoming bankrupt.

Please...worst reason ever.

Fallout 1 and 2 are just so much better. Bethesda made the game into a shooter.

Fallout 2 had great open ended quests .  Such dealing with the Slavers in the the Den. The Slavers have a buddy of yours, Vic, that you want to rescue. There were many ways of getting this done.You could go into the slaver headquarters and shoot them all up. If you were a explosive traps guy, (like my guy was), you could go in the building and plant dynamite, then leave, and blow everyone up. If you had high intelligence and high speech, you could convince the slavers to stop trading slaves, and get them to free Vic. If you were a jerk, you could join the Slavers, get a slaver tattoo on your forehead that would have consequences for the rest of the game, and sell your tribal companion into a life of servitude. If you were a chick with a decent charisma, you can have sex with the head slaver guy for Vic's freedom.The vast majority of quests in fallou 3 are like this: go talk to this guy. Kill everybody in your way. The end.


Also Bethesda messed up on tag skills. In the originals, you picked three tag skills at the beginning of the game. They were your character's specialties. You want a medic with a good throwing arm that can pick locks? Pick Medicine, Throwing, Lock Picking. For the rest of the game, every time you level, and skill point put into a tag skill will be doubled. So, like, it's easier to become proficient at your character's specialties.

In Fallout 3 you pick three tag skills at the beginning. These tag picks give you a +10 bonus to the skill and that's it. not much planning.

There are many more reasons but I'll let you think it's because "hipsters" like the originals better.

Modifié par Ringo12, 11 août 2011 - 11:23 .

[Haplose]

Not to mention what the hell happened to Perception? Agility->AP ratio? Intelligence->SP ratio?
Finally, where are my Fallout 1&2 critical hits!?

Stats are almost meaningless in Fallout 3.. while Fallout 1 & 2 were IMVHO the games with the very best character development, gameplay mechanics and balance in a crpg EVER.

Modifié par Haplose, 11 août 2011 - 11:29 .

[I Ryukage I]

Two Worlds 1&2...

Final Fantasy X-2...

Final Fantasy X .. probably need to replay this one.. couldn't get past the main character constantly crying and whining in the first hour....

Magna Carta 2....

Risen

[Andarthiel_Demigod]

Ringo12 wrote...

Funkcase wrote...


Basically gamer hipsters hate it. Becuase they like the old vintage ones better. I personally love the old Fallouts (except for Brotherhood of steel and tactics) Always have. But I think what Bethesda did was great, just could have done with more side quests and voice actors I thought. The way I see it, Bethesda saved Fallout. Black isle are no more, and Interplay are on the verge of becoming bankrupt.

Please...worst reason ever.

Fallout 1 and 2 are just so much better. Bethesda made the game into a shooter.

Fallout 2 had great open ended quests .  Such dealing with the Slavers in the the Den. The Slavers have a buddy of yours, Vic, that you want to rescue. There were many ways of getting this done.You could go into the slaver headquarters and shoot them all up. If you were a explosive traps guy, (like my guy was), you could go in the building and plant dynamite, then leave, and blow everyone up. If you had high intelligence and high speech, you could convince the slavers to stop trading slaves, and get them to free Vic. If you were a jerk, you could join the Slavers, get a slaver tattoo on your forehead that would have consequences for the rest of the game, and sell your tribal companion into a life of servitude. If you were a chick with a decent charisma, you can have sex with the head slaver guy for Vic's freedom.The vast majority of quests in fallou 3 are like this: go talk to this guy. Kill everybody in your way. The end.


Also Bethesda messed up on tag skills. In the originals, you picked three tag skills at the beginning of the game. They were your character's specialties. You want a medic with a good throwing arm that can pick locks? Pick Medicine, Throwing, Lock Picking. For the rest of the game, every time you level, and skill point put into a tag skill will be doubled. So, like, it's easier to become proficient at your character's specialties.

In Fallout 3 you pick three tag skills at the beginning. These tag picks give you a +10 bonus to the skill and that's it. not much planning.

There are many more reasons but I'll let you think it's because "hipsters" like the originals better.

I think you're exaggerating there. The quests in Fallout 3 aren't linear at all(some are, some aren't).

[I Ryukage I]

Fallout 3- Big Town Quest (forget the name of it) one of the non-linear quest

~You could save the prisoners, or tell the others the prisoners were dead instead of saving them.. you could save one and leave the other lying as well.

~ You could tell the people of big town that after saving them, your leaving. If you come back, they are all dead/ghost town

~You could save them by being a complete hero and fighting alone, or you could train them in guns/explosives

I think there's more to the quest, but that was one of the few I remember that had different consequences for it...I think the main reason many disliked it, is because Fallout 1&2 fans consider some story elements to be retconned, the story wasn't truly all that great (I for one at least like the beginning, I feel it gives more of a reason for you some motivation to go on your quest, rather than F:NV, however in time I came to like F:NV more anyway)

Also, the fact that they say it became a shooter... I still need to play both Fallout 1 & 2, but I think that it turning into first person view was inevitable, I wouldn't call it a complete FPS however... if it were, the game should have been "streamlined" completely, no stats., etc. Many of the shooter fans I have spoken to, (or those that go on forums) consider Fallout 3 to be too "hard" to understand so...of course not saying all, just the majority I spoke to....

Most people want instant gratification nowadays....

[Haplose]

That's part of the problem though. Gameplay mechanics were perfect in Fallout 1 & 2 for me. And stats had major impact on... well.. everything. No computer game ever came even close. By comparison, Fallout 3 would play almost the same if it had no stats at all. The system was brutally butchered and the stats are but a pale shadow of their past meaning.

[I Ryukage I]

Haplose wrote...

That's part of the problem though. Gameplay mechanics were perfect in Fallout 1 & 2 for me. And stats had major impact on... well.. everything. No computer game ever came even close. By comparison, Fallout 3 would play almost the same if it had no stats at all. The system was brutally butchered and the stats are but a pale shadow of their past meaning.

Do you mean how in NV, dialogue options sometimes have things such as "Surivival" or "Perception" in the speech checks???

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

Fallout 3 was relatively open, at least compared to it's contemporaries. There were some linear quests, they were others that rewarded creativity. It's not all linear, shooting stuff. The problem was that Fallout 3's quests were few and far between. The hubs were small and didn't offer much quests, so you'd end most of your time exploring and/or killing stuff.





That's not even counting F:NV DLCs.

Where I felt it (Fallout 3) failed was they couldn't adapt the character system to the point where it really mattered like in the originals (F:NV did better, but both still need stacks of rebalancing mods) while also suffering massive levels of derp in creating a cohesive gameworld.

It's still a good game, but it's got nothing on the originals (or F:NV). At least to me.

[Haplose]

I Ryukage I wrote...

Haplose wrote...

That's part of the problem though. Gameplay mechanics were perfect in Fallout 1 & 2 for me. And stats had major impact on... well.. everything. No computer game ever came even close. By comparison, Fallout 3 would play almost the same if it had no stats at all. The system was brutally butchered and the stats are but a pale shadow of their past meaning.

Do you mean how in NV, dialogue options sometimes have things such as "Surivival" or "Perception" in the speech checks???

Wouldn't know. Haven't played F:NV *Shrug*
Maybe they improved dialogues there, but there was way more to it.

Like Perception determined how well you aim at range. Agility stat = your number of Action Points to use every turn (this is huge... 10 was max and it usually took 3-5 points to fire a gun... once.. or each point meant 1 step).
Intelligence x2 = skillpoints you gain every time you level. Consitution translated into your hitpoints and resistances.
The impact of stats on gameplay was really huge. Even Luck was very important.... because it helped you find cool unique encounters, besides criticalling more often.
Oh and the critical hits in Fallouts.. how badly are you missed.... No game ever had such a cool implementation of criticals. It really mattered where you were aiming and what weapon using.... And the lovely animations...

Many of the more cooler perks in Fallouts have also been castrated.... like Sniper or Slayer...

[MacCready]

I've never bought an RPG that I thought was terrible, they usually have some redeemable feature. However the upcoming Final Fantasy 13-2 might make my list. Why? They're bringing back random battles. Oh be still my gaping anus, I don't think I can handle all the mind shattering innovation!

You know, I actually liked Final Fantasy 13, it was far from perfect but it held my attention long enough until the end. But my most hated of the FF traditions was the random encounters as it's so bloody annoying when you just want to explore an area or take in the scenery only to be interrupted by an out of the blue fight scene. I read the article by one of the designers who claim that it will heighten tension and suspense, no not really, it will just make me eject the game and use the CD as a novelty frisby for my dog.

[Turnip Root]

Actually now that I think of it I think there are a couple of RPG's I have played that are even worse than Beyond the Beyond.

Blaze N Blade for the PC was absolute rubbish. Also anyone remember Dungeon Lord for the PC? Felt like an alpha copy. The game was so unfinished and empty, complete worthless tripe.

[Veex]

The Witcher and Gothic 3 are the only RPGs I've made a legitimate attempt at finishing and simply couldn't complete.

[Chromie]

Haplose wrote...
Wouldn't know. Haven't played F:NV *Shrug*
Maybe they improved dialogues there, but there was way more to it.

What I really really loved abou  Fallout 1 and 2 you can go through the entire game with low Intelligence and all dialogue would be well...stupid. You'd get different dialogue and have to finish quests in different ways ofcourse.

I heard Fallout New Vegas has some of the retarded dialogue but not a lot, Crusty?

I Ryukage I wrote...
Also, the fact that they say it became a
shooter... I still need to play both Fallout 1 & 2, but I think that
it turning into first person view was inevitable, I wouldn't call it a
complete FPS however... if it were, the game should have been
"streamlined" completely, no stats., etc. Many of the shooter fans I
have spoken to, (or those that go on forums) consider Fallout 3 to be
too "hard" to understand so...of course not saying all, just the
majority I spoke to....

Most people want instant gratification nowadays....

I had to laugh at that.

Guns in Fallout 3 are all based on stats. If you hit with a Sniper Rifle it's because you were directly aiming it. There was no roll there was no stat check. Your stats decided how much damage you did but it didn't make you hit or miss that entirely depended on wether you were aiming or just shooting at air.

And difficulty! What happened there? Enemies have more health is that? Mayeb more damage not really sure the only reason it's harder is because you run out of ammo faster. Fallout 1 and 2 had a real difficulty setting.


Turnip Root just revealed he is Ironclaw...feign surprise!

Modifié par Ringo12, 11 août 2011 - 02:17 .

[HoonDing]

Menzoberranzan
Pool of Radiance 2
Vampire the Masquerade: Redemption

Modifié par virumor, 11 août 2011 - 02:18 .

[aridor1570]

Ringo12 wrote...

Haplose wrote...
Wouldn't know. Haven't played F:NV *Shrug*
Maybe they improved dialogues there, but there was way more to it.

What I really really loved abou  Fallout 1 and 2 you can go through the entire game with low Intelligence and all dialogue would be well...stupid. You'd get different dialogue and have to finish quests in different ways ofcourse.

I heard Fallout New Vegas has some of the retarded dialogue but not a lot, Crusty?

Yes, it does, I love the idea that when I have low intelligence points and select the intelligence dialogue I'll sound like a retard.

[A Crusty Knight Of Colour]

It has very few moments with stupid dialog and most of them were taken out in the latest round of patches.

There were too few NPCs who had VA to actually react properly to hurr durr dialog options, so Obsidian decided it was better to take it out if the NPCs are going to treat you like normal. Wonders of full NPC VA...

But there still are spots here and there which make you laugh at how dumb your character is. There's that robot factory where having a low INT character makes you shout "ICE CREAM!" when prompted for the password to the executive level.

New Vegas has more skill checks than you can poke at a stick at. Every skill has it's uses. Much more than the original games, I'd wager. But it's ruined by the fact it's displayed like [Skill X/X], so it encourages people to metagame and spam magazines, mentats, etc.

In any case, it's biggest weakness is the game engine. So, bugs, crappy animations, clunky combat. The SPECIAL system's been revamped, VATS nerfed and along with the skill checks, making perks come every 2 levels again, stats affecting accuracy/weapon spread, the character build is much more important until around level 20-25 or so. Then it becomes a mush of Mr. or Mrs. God Courier, with the exception of DLCs and/or mods.

Out of the box, it's a decent game. But where it really shines is the mods. That's where the gold is. Once modded, it takes it's place next to VtMB and Deus Ex as the best RPG/FPS hybrids ever. For me, at least.

----

Bad games, Arcania will stay my choice.

Modifié par mrcrusty, 11 août 2011 - 02:40 .

[I Ryukage I]

Haplose wrote...

I Ryukage I wrote...

Haplose wrote...

That's part of the problem though. Gameplay mechanics were perfect in Fallout 1 & 2 for me. And stats had major impact on... well.. everything. No computer game ever came even close. By comparison, Fallout 3 would play almost the same if it had no stats at all. The system was brutally butchered and the stats are but a pale shadow of their past meaning.

Do you mean how in NV, dialogue options sometimes have things such as "Surivival" or "Perception" in the speech checks???

Wouldn't know. Haven't played F:NV *Shrug*
Maybe they improved dialogues there, but there was way more to it.

Like Perception determined how well you aim at range. Agility stat = your number of Action Points to use every turn (this is huge... 10 was max and it usually took 3-5 points to fire a gun... once.. or each point meant 1 step).
Intelligence x2 = skillpoints you gain every time you level. Consitution translated into your hitpoints and resistances.

I haven't played F3 in a while, but isn't this in both F3 and F:NV for those that have played both??? Also, iirc not sure, i thought thats what perception did in F3?? In New Vegas I know it has nothing to do with aiming (even though the actual in-game description says otherwise), and has mainly to deal with compass markers and speech checks

Modifié par I Ryukage I, 11 août 2011 - 04:43 .

[Warheadz]

Lost Odyssey.

[Romantiq]

Haven't really played any rpg that I couldn't finish and that I would call terrible. Final Fantasy perhaps but its just because I despise jrpg so its absolutely a personal opinion.