283 réponses à ce sujet

[hoorayforicecream]

Gibb_Shepard wrote...

Not true, the reason she can't stay tied down to one man or woman is because of her past. She wouldn't have nearly as many lovers if it wasn't for events that transpired in the past

Isabela likes sex because it feels good.

Isabela does not like relationships because of her past.

There is a correlation between these two things, but not necessarily causation. If that is all you're saying, I can agree. If you're trying to somehow imply that the reason she likes sex is because of her past, I'd probably disagree.

The stereotypical woman with a troubled past who falls into bed with everyone isn't because she likes sex, but rather because she is looking for emotional stability and failing at it repeatedly. This is not what Isabela does at all. This is what makes her different from the stereotype.

[Rinji the Bearded]

ZabiGG wrote...

Argh... history lesson. Filles d'Isabelle were prostitutes sent from France to the New-World (Nouvelle-France), for colonization purposes.  So yeah. They were one of these things I can't mention.

I thought those were the Filles du Roi.  And there was a misconception about them being prostitutes.

Modifié par RinjiRenee, 13 août 2011 - 02:13 .

[Carmen_Willow]

thats1evildude wrote...

I'm sort of glad that they introduced cursing, as I found it a bit awkward that the only curses were "Sod" or variations on "ANDRASTE'S XXXXX!"

I ran into this problem while trying to write a FanFic not too long ago, and I had to use "Andraste's Flaming Sword" when "OH S**T" would have worked so much better.

Sorry, but I like "Andraste's Flaming Knickers!"  It's much more fun than OH S**T.

[ZabiGG]

leggywillow wrote...

The fact that the name was later used in an active religious group's title, which is vastly more well-known than the incident you mentioned, shows that these prostitutes didn't do any lasting damage to the name.  So I'm really not sure what point you're trying to make.

That "incident" shaped an entire nation, since Filles d'Isabelle, or w*ores, are the foremothers of the majority of an 8,000,000-soul population. So, yeah. I kinda take it to heart. And there's nothing even remotely Catholic about that -- that's just PR. This said, can we please get back to the topic?

Thanks.

[leggywillow]

RinjiRenee wrote...

ZabiGG wrote...

Argh... history lesson. Filles d'Isabelle were prostitutes sent from France to the New-World (Nouvelle-France), for colonization purposes.  So yeah. They were one of these things I can't mention.

I thought those were the Filles du Roi.  And there was a misconception about them being prostitutes.

"There is a misconception that many filles du roi were recruited from among the lowest class of the population of Paris, and that many were prostitutes. This story is based on a few Parisian prostitutes being arrested in the 17th century and transported to a penal colony in the Antilles islands. Later historians mistakenly lumped them with the filles du roi, as if ridding France of criminals by banishment to Caribbean farms was part of the same program as recruiting women of childbearing age to help populate its Canadian colonies."

So yep, still absolutely no connection with the name Isabela to anything whorish.

Modifié par leggywillow, 13 août 2011 - 02:14 .

[Carmen_Willow]

Carol L S wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

Our rule with profanity is "occasional but impactful", with the occasional allowance for a character that swears as part of their personality-- indeed, for such a character the profanity would more or less fade into the background.

The only profanity we argued about was the f-bomb. We had it for a while but eventually removed it as it seemed too distracting.

Thank you!  Don't need it!

Agreed.  So overused IRL that it has lost meaning.

[ZabiGG]

RinjiRenee wrote...

ZabiGG wrote...

Argh... history lesson. Filles d'Isabelle were prostitutes sent from France to the New-World (Nouvelle-France), for colonization purposes.  So yeah. They were one of these things I can't mention.

I thought those were the Filles du Roi.  And there was a misconception about them being prostitutes.

Filles d'Isabelle and Filles du roi are exactly the same. And I was taught, from elementary school though university, that they were indeed prostitutes, misc. documentation, including Champlains' own journals (Des Sauvages), bearing fact.

[leggywillow]

ZabiGG wrote...
That "incident" shaped an entire nation, since Filles d'Isabelle, or w*ores, are the foremothers of the majority of an 8,000,000-soul population. So, yeah. I kinda take it to heart. And there's nothing even remotely Catholic about that -- that's just PR. This said, can we please get back to the topic?

Read my post after this one, in which the thing about the filles du roi were not actually ****s.  At best they were women who did their duty for the country, and at worst you could consider them mail-order brides.

Still not sure why the entire incident is offensive to you.  My great-great-grandmother was a ****, too.  It certainly doesn't bother me at all.

[ipgd]

ZabiGG wrote...

That "incident" shaped an entire nation, since Filles d'Isabelle, or w*ores, are the foremothers of the majority of an 8,000,000-soul population. So, yeah. I kinda take it to heart. And there's nothing even remotely Catholic about that -- that's just PR. This said, can we please get back to the topic?

Thanks.

Except they were apparently neither called Filles d'Isabelle nor were they prostitutes, unless there was some obscure second-wave of filles du roi of another name?

[leggywillow]

ZabiGG wrote...
Filles d'Isabelle and Filles du roi are exactly the same. And I was taught, from elementary school though university, that they were indeed prostitutes, misc. documentation, including Champlains' own journals (Des Sauvages), bearing fact.

Except no one calls them filles d'Isabella.

And no, they were not ****s.

[rpgfan321]

I'm glad the 'f-bomb' was taken out of Dragon Age's dictionary. While I found the plot of DA2 confusing, the moment to moment conversations were good. The language was fluid and well done. Swear words, when timed and used well, can paint a colorful picture, in my opinion.

I mean how can one understand or hear what's going on the screen when all you hear are bleeps?

[Neesee]

rpgfan321 wrote...

I mean how can one understand or hear what's going on the screen when all you hear are bleeps?

But there are no bleeps in DA2. Bleeps in TV shows or movies being shown on television can be annoying though.

Modifié par Neesee, 13 août 2011 - 02:31 .

[ZabiGG]

I'm so not going to continue on this track -- it's pointless. Believe whatever you will, I know what I've been taught and what I believe between party lines and what actually happened, because I experience it every day, and I've read about it over and over again. You don't -- but then I remain the minority, and I accept that and live with that -- I'm quite used to it in fact. The point still remains: intelligent dialogue does not need swearing as a shocker. Just creativity and wit.

[Sutekh]

ZabiGG wrote...

Filles d'Isabelle and Filles du roi are exactly the same. And I was taught, from elementary school though university, that they were indeed prostitutes, misc. documentation, including Champlains' own journals (Des Sauvages), bearing fact.

OK. Now I'm very curious. I'm French, and I have never, ever heard the prostitutes sent to the Americas being called "Filles d'Isabelle". I'm not saying they weren't called that at one point, but if I, having been educated in France from kindergarten to university through several schools, have never heard the apellation, then it must have been  a very confidential thing, right? And I've never seen "Isabelle" or any variation thereof being associated to what you so nicely call "wh*res".

This said, re: the frequency of the name, "Isabelle" is indeed a very common name in France for a certain generation (60's and 70's born)

And I'm a little lost, like many here, about how it's related to Isabela. 

Modifié par Sutekh, 13 août 2011 - 02:47 .

[leggywillow]

ZabiGG wrote...

I'm so not going to continue on this track -- it's pointless. Believe whatever you will, I know what I've been taught and what I believe between party lines and what actually happened, because I experience it every day, and I've read about it over and over again. You don't -- but then I remain the minority, and I accept that and live with that -- I'm quite used to it in fact. The point still remains: intelligent dialogue does not need swearing as a shocker. Just creativity and wit.

I'm sorry, but I really don't believe that you experience persecution every day for believing you share a name with a group of French settlers who may or may not have been prostitutes.  That is... beyond weird.  I share a name with a couple of active modern-day porn actresses and it's never given me any grief.

[leggywillow]

Sutekh wrote...
This said, re: the frequency of the name, "Isabelle" is indeed a very common name in France for a certain generation (60's and 70's born)

And I'm a little lost, like many here, how it's related to Isabela.

Ah, thanks for that, I couldn't find any census data about that name in France.

Anyway, to fill you in: it started when this poster claimed that she didn't like having a name similar to DA2's Isabela, because that name already had a strong connotation with promiscuity.  At this point, others of us said "WTF, it absolutely does not", and she started pulling out weird historical events.

[ZabiGG]

@leggywillow

Just go back to my first post. ipgd misread it and has been on my case ever since, and even when I said I gave up, he just kept going. I should have shut up, I know, but that narrow-mindedness, especially from someone who has probably faced a lot of contempt and bigotry, just irked me, so this very bad series of posts was retaliation -- sorry.

[Sutekh]

leggywillow wrote...

Ah, thanks for that, I couldn't find any census data about that name in France.

Anyway, to fill you in: it started when this poster claimed that she didn't like having a name similar to DA2's Isabela, because that name already had a strong connotation with promiscuity.  At this point, others of us said "WTF, it absolutely does not", and she started pulling out weird historical events.

That's what I'm genuinely curious about. Because it makes absolutely no sense. If there's that many "Isabelle" and many people associating that name with prostitutes to the point it can become a real problem and "harrassing", why on Earth would they name their daughters that?

I don't know where she's from, and I don't want to assume anything, but I can assure you that the first thing people associate with Isabelle here are: Isabelle la Catholique, Isabelle de France, the one who married Edward II (and seduces William Wallace in Braveheart) and Isabelle Adjani, an incredibly beautiful actress. I have never heard it associated with prostitutes.

[Yrkoon]

Elhanan wrote...


This seemed to have been missed by the Quote patrol.

It does not matter if Cassandra was a Seeker or secretary; hanging around the Divine and being a part of such an entourage would seem to require the needed ettiquette and demeanor.

LOL

You're talking about the leadership of an organization that launches exalted marches.  Ie.  WARS to destroy  civilizations and organizations that oppose them.

Remind me again where ettiquette comes into the picture here.  And while you're at it, explain to me why it's OK for Cassandra to kidnap Varric and stick a knife to his throat but Cussing is too "improper"...

Modifié par Yrkoon, 13 août 2011 - 02:57 .

[leggywillow]

ZabiGG wrote...
Just go back to my first post. ipgd misread it and has been on my case ever since, and even when I said I gave up, he just kept going. I should have shut up, I know, but that narrow-mindedness, especially from someone who has probably faced a lot of contempt and bigotry, just irked me, so this very bad series of posts was retaliation -- sorry.

You aren't really telling me that you face "contempt and bigotry" over a name based a relatively minor historical event that happened in the late 1600s?!

[ZabiGG]

Sutekh wrote...

leggywillow wrote...

Ah, thanks for that, I couldn't find any census data about that name in France.

Anyway, to fill you in: it started when this poster claimed that she didn't like having a name similar to DA2's Isabela, because that name already had a strong connotation with promiscuity.  At this point, others of us said "WTF, it absolutely does not", and she started pulling out weird historical events.

That's what I'm genuinely curious about. Because it makes absolutely no sense. If there's that many "Isabelle" and many people associating that name with prostitutes to the point it can become a real problem and "harrassing", why on Earth would they name their daughters that?

I don't know where she's from, and I don't want to assume anything, but I can assure you that the first thing people associate with Isabelle here are: Isabelle la Catholique, Isabelle de France, the one who married Edward II (and seduces William Wallace in Braveheart) and Isabelle Adjani, an incredibly beautiful actress. I have never heard it associated with prostitutes.

You're from France. I live in Quebec. Two solitudes... two different mindsets. Plus, you chose to leave our fate to the British, if I remember correctly... (only half kidding) Seriously, although our moms liked the sound of Isabelle -- and were good, obedient and faithful wives at the time --, any of the thousands of Isabelles you ask here now will tell you they hate their name and what it represents.

[ipgd]

ZabiGG wrote...

ipgd misread it and has been on my case ever since, and even when I said I gave up, he just kept going.

You keep posting in this thread, saying things I disagree with. Because I am reading this thread, I see them, and I respond to them, because this is a public forum. You may have noticed that I have also responded to the other people that are posting in this thread, which may be some sort of indication that I am simply responding to the people who are posting in this thread I am reading, rather than acting upon some sort of ridiculous personal vendetta. If you have have some sort of problem with the people who are reading the thread you are posting in responding to your posts, you should, again, probably not post in public forums.

narrow-mindedness

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

especially from someone who has probably faced a lot of contempt and bigotry

What?

[Dhiro]

ZabiGG wrote...

Sutekh wrote...

leggywillow wrote...

Ah, thanks for that, I couldn't find any census data about that name in France.

Anyway, to fill you in: it started when this poster claimed that she didn't like having a name similar to DA2's Isabela, because that name already had a strong connotation with promiscuity.  At this point, others of us said "WTF, it absolutely does not", and she started pulling out weird historical events.

That's what I'm genuinely curious about. Because it makes absolutely no sense. If there's that many "Isabelle" and many people associating that name with prostitutes to the point it can become a real problem and "harrassing", why on Earth would they name their daughters that?

I don't know where she's from, and I don't want to assume anything, but I can assure you that the first thing people associate with Isabelle here are: Isabelle la Catholique, Isabelle de France, the one who married Edward II (and seduces William Wallace in Braveheart) and Isabelle Adjani, an incredibly beautiful actress. I have never heard it associated with prostitutes.

You're from France. I live in Quebec. Two solitudes... two different mindsets. Plus, you chose to leave our fate to the British, if I remember correctly... (only half kidding) Seriously, although our moms liked the sound of Isabelle -- and were good, obedient and faithful wives at the time --, any of the thousands of Isabelles you ask here now will tell you they hate their name and what it represents.

Well... why don't you change it, then?

[Sutekh]

ZabiGG wrote...

You're from France. I live in Quebec. Two solitudes... two different mindsets. Plus, you chose to leave our fate to the British, if I remember correctly... (only half kidding) Seriously, although our moms liked the sound of Isabelle -- and were good, obedient and faithful wives at the time --, any of the thousands of Isabelles you ask here now will tell you they hate their name and what it represents.

I did nothing of the sort. I'm not that old, and by that time, most of my genes were scattered all over Spain and Algeria. Only half kidding too Thanks for the clarification, anyway. Still very puzzled over parents calling their daughters a name so obviously loaded, and about the appellation itself.

[ZabiGG]

lol Sutekh... It was actually because of a popular song from that period (Une rose for Isabelle)... Some of us just wish our mothers weren't so naive and uneducated at the time, but I guess that's life

@dhiro, I don't know how it works in your country, but changing names here is quite complicated
need
@ipgd

This is the last answer you will ever get from me. Contrary to you, I don't need define myself and my image according to my sexual preferences.

But I do feel for you because I have a lot of gay friends who were confronted with contempt and bigotry all of their life and paid a hefty price for their "choice" -- I don't believe it is a choice, I'm just stating a common misconception. Just stop TRYING to be a personnage.