EJ107 wrote...
xXljoshlXx wrote...
Hmmm you might be rightlegion999 wrote...
Was it not somewhere around 90%?
skip to 3:15, he says 100%
I think it was just a slip up on the writers part. 90% or so would have made sense.
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
Zulu_DFA wrote...
OK, you're right. It's impossible to tell with absolute certainty who knew what and who could what centuries ago, judging by a few lines of dialogue in the game. (But that goes to those who say "Oh, the Quarians didn't realize the Geth were already!" too.) And anyway I'd be the last to argue that the Quarians should not have even considered pulling the plug, if we did know for sure the Quarians realized that the Geth had achieved sentience. The fact remains, however, that they either failed to anticipate the geth's capabilities and retaliatory behavior, or refused to accept the situation. Which makes them victims of their own damn fault and not of their machinery. I guess, the Quarians didn't read history books either, as it appears the idea that orderly emancipation usually prevents bloodshed is totally alien to them.
Agamo45 wrote...
The geth were fighting for their very survival, you can't expect them to hold anything back. Again, this is war. You can't attach morality to it because there is no morality.EJ107 wrote...
Agamo45 wrote...
The geth are machines, they probably calculated that the most efficient way to defeat the quarians was to kill every last one of them, since that's what the quarians were trying to do to them. The Allies during the Second World War killed millions of German and Japanese civilians with bombing, completely breaking their will to fight and forcing them to surrender. That worked for the geth, the quarians lost so much that they were eventually forced to abandon their own civilization, securing survival for the geth. That's war, no morality just survival.
What does it say about the Geth if they're willing to do things like that? At least the allies in real life tried to avoid killing civilians.
People try to use "they're machines" to justify what the Geth have done, but all that proves is that they are dangerous, don't value life, and would readily slaughter the entire galaxy without hesitation if they thought it was logical. That makes them no better than the Reapers.AnAccountWithNoName wrote...
Just replace the word "French" with Quarian, and "Spanish" with Geth. and you have the belief of those who think the Quarians got what they deserved. It's a pretty stupid belief.
Exactly. Putting it in real life terms really shows what a stupid belief it is.
Modifié par AnAccountWithNoName, 13 août 2011 - 11:49 .
You can't blame them, the quarians don't know about the true geth.xXljoshlXx wrote...
The Qaurians attacked One hunderd percent of the time when victory was possible.
Modifié par Gust4v, 13 août 2011 - 11:56 .
xXljoshlXx wrote...
What does it say about the Qaurians if they are willing to revert a enitre species to pre-sentience or destory the species completely. Did the Qaurians deem which Geth were innocent or not?
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
didymos1120 wrote...
Here's a better question: why does everyone seem to forget that the quarians would have been required by law to revert the geth to pre-sentience anyway?
That we know of. Also, Haestrom was supposed to be an in-and-out mission that avoided engaging the Geth. The Quarians were there for the Haestrom data, not to claim Haestrom for their own.Saphra Deden wrote...
Just another reminder: since fleeing the homeworld the quarians have never attacked the geth up until Haestrom.
EJ107 wrote...
xXljoshlXx wrote...
EJ107 wrote...
xXljoshlXx wrote...
The Qaurians attacked One hunderd percent of the time when victory was possible.
When Legion says that piece of dialogue the Quarians have already let him on the fleet when they could easily have killed him, so that statistic is wrong.
Commander sherpard was with legion victory wasn't possible
Yeah, I'm sure that Shepard could take on the entire Migrant fleet <_<
In all seriousness though, I never understood that statistic. Like I said abouve, it just dosen't make sense.
Modifié par Ryzaki, 14 août 2011 - 12:14 .
Ryzaki wrote...
Uh...seriously? The Normandy could have the (and most likely does) Thannix Cannon and the multicore shielding along with special plating. I'm pretty sure the Normandycould rip the migrant fleet to shreds. It takes on a Collector Cruiser (which is most likely highly advanced tech 2nd only to Reaper Tech itself).The Normandy is built for fighting and stealth. The Migrant Fleet severely less so not to mention they have civilians on board. They'd surrender pretty quickly.
EJ107 wrote..
Ok, look: let me rephrase what I was trying to say.
When Shepard is standing in the entrance to the Migrant fleet with Legion it would have been easy for the Quarian's to kill Legion, so the "They attacked 100% of the time they could win" statement is false. Is that any better?
Ryzaki wrote...
EJ107 wrote..
Ok, look: let me rephrase what I was trying to say.
When Shepard is standing in the entrance to the Migrant fleet with Legion it would have been easy for the Quarian's to kill Legion, so the "They attacked 100% of the time they could win" statement is false. Is that any better?
And what makes you think the Quarians thought they could win? Doesn't paragon Shepard (I remember mine) step in front of Legion to stop them from shooting?
Modifié par EJ107, 14 août 2011 - 12:18 .
EJ107 wrote...
Ryzaki wrote...
EJ107 wrote..
Ok, look: let me rephrase what I was trying to say.
When Shepard is standing in the entrance to the Migrant fleet with Legion it would have been easy for the Quarian's to kill Legion, so the "They attacked 100% of the time they could win" statement is false. Is that any better?
And what makes you think the Quarians thought they could win? Doesn't paragon Shepard (I remember mine) step in front of Legion to stop them from shooting?
Legion, Shepard and Tali vs an entire ship of Quarian marines? The Quarians could easily have killed Legion there and then if they had wanted to. The only reason they did not was out of respect to Tali, and because they did not want to get into a fight with Shepard.
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
SandTrout wrote...
That we know of.
kidbd15 wrote...
I would go with the Geth... Legion is my bro
didymos1120 wrote...
Here's a better question: why does everyone seem to forget that the quarians would have been required by law to revert the geth to pre-sentience anyway?
Modifié par xXljoshlXx, 14 août 2011 - 12:25 .
In total warfare, civilians become military targets. The quarian military was being supported by the civilian population who no doubt manned the infrastructure and produced their weapons. You eliminate them, and you break the war effort. It's cold, hard logic which is what machines use. You talk about boundaries, but the quarians eliminated all boundaries when they decided to exterminate the geth.AnAccountWithNoName wrote...
Agamo45 wrote...
The geth were fighting for their very survival, you can't expect them to hold anything back. Again, this is war. You can't attach morality to it because there is no morality.EJ107 wrote...
Agamo45 wrote...
The geth are machines, they probably calculated that the most efficient way to defeat the quarians was to kill every last one of them, since that's what the quarians were trying to do to them. The Allies during the Second World War killed millions of German and Japanese civilians with bombing, completely breaking their will to fight and forcing them to surrender. That worked for the geth, the quarians lost so much that they were eventually forced to abandon their own civilization, securing survival for the geth. That's war, no morality just survival.
What does it say about the Geth if they're willing to do things like that? At least the allies in real life tried to avoid killing civilians.
People try to use "they're machines" to justify what the Geth have done, but all that proves is that they are dangerous, don't value life, and would readily slaughter the entire galaxy without hesitation if they thought it was logical. That makes them no better than the Reapers.AnAccountWithNoName wrote...
Just replace the word "French" with Quarian, and "Spanish" with Geth. and you have the belief of those who think the Quarians got what they deserved. It's a pretty stupid belief.
Exactly. Putting it in real life terms really shows what a stupid belief it is.
I beg to differ. Morality does play a part in war. For example, if a faction captures a town of an opposing faction, the winning faction of this battle should NOT go into the town and rape the women there. Why? Because its wrong. Even in war, there are certain lines you don't cross.
Here is an example: Say the nation of france is at war with the Spanish. The whole war was caused because Spain attacked them. Now the french troops enter spain, and not only do they wipe out the spanish military but destroy its government as well. Now according to you, morality has no place in war, therefore it should be perfectly ok for the french to after defeating what invaded their country, to also slaughter the non-combatents, including spanish children.
What the geth did can be compared to the example above, and what they did can not be justified. I know you have to do certain things in war that you normally wouldn't do, but there are still certain things you just don't do because it is wrong.
The geth sure slaughtered the Quarian Military, and i don't have a problem with that because it was the military attacking them, however they attacked those who were no actual threat to them (can babies fight back?). That is why they are worse then the Quarians. They kill those who can't even fight back.
This if you use a tactic it is free for the other side to use it. The Qaurians attacked a whole species of innocents.Agamo45 wrote...
You talk about boundaries, but the quarians eliminated all boundaries when they decided to exterminate the geth.
Guest_Saphra Deden_*
EJ107 wrote...
Ryzaki wrote...
EJ107 wrote..
Ok, look: let me rephrase what I was trying to say.
When Shepard is standing in the entrance to the Migrant fleet with Legion it would have been easy for the Quarian's to kill Legion, so the "They attacked 100% of the time they could win" statement is false. Is that any better?
And what makes you think the Quarians thought they could win? Doesn't paragon Shepard (I remember mine) step in front of Legion to stop them from shooting?
Legion, Shepard and Tali vs an entire ship of Quarian marines? The Quarians could easily have killed Legion there and then if they had wanted to. The only reason they did not was out of respect to Tali, and because they did not want to get into a fight with Shepard.
Modifié par Ryzaki, 14 août 2011 - 12:32 .
No, but he's been away from the Geth for 2 years, and apparently the Quarians have started operations on some of their old worlds (IE: Haestrom) in the mean time. Also, Legion would not have knowledge regarding any Heretic engagements. Everyone thought that we were fighting the main Geth collective until Legion came along.Saphra Deden wrote...
SandTrout wrote...
That we know of.
Are you calling Legion a liar?
xXljoshlXx wrote...
Medgel. If the qaurians actually tried to help the Geth they might have had a chance.
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