613 réponses à ce sujet

[dragonflight288]

My first reaction to Merrill was that if she has to turn to blood magic and demons to get what she wants, then it's already not worth it (I've somewhat gotten over this stance, however). Also that nearly everyone who deals with demons thinks they are being careful, thinks they can handle the consequences, thinks they can get the upper hand, and most of them are wrong. So when I first met her, I had no reason to trust her, and thought she was making a mistake. Merrill may not have had the opportunity to stop Marethari from being possessed, but that in itself kind of suggests that Merrill couldn't control the damage her association with the demon could do.

And that is also a perspective that can be taken. There is no right or wrong opinion. People condemn Merrill because they think she's stupid and somehow say (whether they mean to or not) that she outright attacks and murders her clan, practices blood magic regularly and summons demons as a past time.

I see Merrill naive to the ways of humans. Just look at how she interacts with the elves in her clan compared to any human. It's radically different. She's unsure of herself in a social situation that is completely foreign to what she grew up with. I see her actually use blood magic once as part of the story, and hear about a second. The time I see it is when she removes a barrier and the time I heard about is when she purified the eluvian shard.

I see her clan hater her over something that isn't factually a threat at the given moment. I see her clan outright attack her when she's in mourning and tells them that Merethari was an abomination. They would have had to kill her (Merethari) anyway. Only they blame Merrill for Merethari even becoming one.

People are free to disagree with my opinions and I can respect that. People are free to not trust her because of blood magic and the eluvian and I can respect that as well. I disagree based on how I interpret in-game evidence and my own view on what the Dalish are supposed to do, but that's me.

----

Keeping this on topic, I kind of, okay, I really disliked Fenris at times. He was a slave to a magister, yes. He was abused, yes. But does he really need to call Merrill a monster and treat every mage he meets as abominations in the making regardless of their personalities? Can't he at least try to be cordial?

[phaonica]

dragonflight288 wrote...

People are free to disagree with my opinions and I can respect that. People are free to not trust her because of blood magic and the eluvian and I can respect that as well. I disagree based on how I interpret in-game evidence and my own view on what the Dalish are supposed to do, but that's me. 

I respect your opinion and point of view, too. Thank you

[dragonflight288]

I respect your opinion and point of view, too. Thank you

You're welcome.

[maxernst]

I dislike both Anders and Fenris, for essentially the same reasons. They talk endlessly about their big issue and antagonize almost all the other companion characters. I got tired of having them around very quickly.

[Luckywallace]

I didn't like Isabella, as the topic creator said, she does seem rather too much like a fanboys' dreamgirl, I didn't like her overly-jokey attitude towards almost everything considering the darkness of the story and events and her costume is just stupid considering she fights in melee on the front lines. No, I don't expect a dagger-wielding rouge to wear full plate armour but more than Isabella does.

Aveline meanwhile was just boring and I really disliked the way she still magically managed to hook up with Donnic despite being a complete moron in handling that situation.

Everyone else was a good character, I didn't really like Anders but he was a well written and interesting character and I could see his point of voice. I liked Fenris and Carver especially *because* I kept butting heads with them, it made for some great arguments and drama (much like Morrigan in Origins).

[dragonflight288]

Morrigan and Alistair arguing were witty and entertaining. Fenris is just a plain jerk.

[Ashwraith]

Actually, I don't actively dislike any of them.
Sebastian kind of grated on me, but then again so did Anders' "MAGES MAGES MAGES" and Fenris's whining about being a slave. I still adore all three of them.
It was like that in DAO, too, with Wynne. Couldn't stand her constant preaching at first, but she grew on me with subsequent playthroughs. As a result, she's now one of my favorite companions.

My least favorite is probably Bethany, not because I dislike her, but because she... just didn't make that much of an impression on me. I don't know why; maybe just because of her passivity.




...

is that even a word.

[Dendens]

Bethany. I thought she was okay on my first playthrough, but after playing through as a mage, I realized what a waste of an opportunity she was. I guess if I meta gamed hard she could become an interesting character through rivalry, but I guess I never really cared enough to do so, Although Carver was annoying to no end, at least he had some semblance of a personality

[BroBear Berbil]

Anders - Not really even the same person that was in Awakening. After Nathaniel he was my next favorite but in DA2 I just can't deal with all his whining about templars. On top of that it kind of pisses me off that he complains so much about having been a Warden after I did so much for him in Awakening to the point where he was accepting of it. Him, and Justice for that matter, are dead to me.

Merrill...I'm romancing her on the character I'm currently playing cus I'm saving Isabella for my next rogue. Merrill just kind of bugs me and I have trouble putting my finger on it. Could be the fact that she's supposed to be adorable and all that.

[Sinaxi]

OnionXI wrote...

Anders - Not really even the same person that was in Awakening. After Nathaniel he was my next favorite but in DA2 I just can't deal with all his whining about templars. On top of that it kind of pisses me off that he complains so much about having been a Warden after I did so much for him in Awakening to the point where he was accepting of it. Him, and Justice for that matter, are dead to me.

Point. Missing it.

[hobbit of the shire]

DA:O
Zevran - creepy sexaholic who tried to kill me.
Oghren - overly obsessed with clobbering things and ale. Was he ever sober?
Shale - most dialogue rather irritating and I didn't find much use for her as a tank.

DA:A
Velanna - pissed me off right from the start, although I never had her as a companion...

DA2
Isabela - total flirt and sexaholic. Awesome rogue skills, though.
Carver - I want to rip his head off! What a total lame and uncaring brother. Here I am as mage Hawke doing all these good things in the world and my brother dumps me and becomes a mage hunter!!!??!
Fenris - his personality sort of annoyed me, but willing to give him a second chance.
Justice - I tried really hard to like Anders in DA2 since I loved him in Awakening. So I will not say I hate Anders (blasphemy!), but hated the Justice in him. You ruined my oh so cute and lovable mage!
Merrill - way too cutesy for me. She reminds me of anime characters.

[BroBear Berbil]

Tidra wrote...

OnionXI wrote...

Anders - Not really even the same person that was in Awakening. After Nathaniel he was my next favorite but in DA2 I just can't deal with all his whining about templars. On top of that it kind of pisses me off that he complains so much about having been a Warden after I did so much for him in Awakening to the point where he was accepting of it. Him, and Justice for that matter, are dead to me.

Point. Missing it.

Nah, I get the point - I just don't like it. They destroyed a really good character and made him a terrorist among other things.

They should have used his original voice actor too. idc if he's Cullen as well.

Modifié par OnionXI, 11 septembre 2011 - 08:23 .

[Asianwaste]

I'm on the boat of "Not disliking" any of the companions. I think they are all solid. If I had to choose least liked, I would go with Fenris but even then I was sorta happy to see him start to open up to Aveline, Varric, and Isabela. He's not a total social lost cause. I think Sebastian needed more work. Not only is he too similar to Nathaniel, he seemed to have had less development as a character than the rest. Personally, I think he will be an important character for later stories as I think Anders has made a very large impact on Sebastian's opinion of mages.

OnionXI wrote...
Merrill...I'm romancing her on the character I'm currently playing cus I'm saving Isabella for my next rogue. Merrill just kind of bugs me and I have trouble putting my finger on it. Could be the fact that she's supposed to be adorable and all that.

I think Merrill is one of the more interesting characters in the game.  She embodies the saying, "the road to hell is paved with the best of intentions."  Her sweet nature works in great contrast to the fact that she dabbles in blood magic while her adorable cluelessness sets off many alarms that despite her magical aptitude, she might not be as in control of the situation as she claims to be.  It not only makes for a good character but it's a good exploration of the DA mythos as to how and why mages even attempt blood magic.  I think she needs one more arc of quests for her character that will ask the final question, "Should I take blood magic further and complete what I've set out to do or should I reject blood magic entirely hence forth?"

Modifié par Asianwaste, 11 septembre 2011 - 08:53 .

[CulturalGeekGirl]

OnionXI wrote...

Tidra wrote...

OnionXI wrote...

Anders - Not really even the same person that was in Awakening. After Nathaniel he was my next favorite but in DA2 I just can't deal with all his whining about templars. On top of that it kind of pisses me off that he complains so much about having been a Warden after I did so much for him in Awakening to the point where he was accepting of it. Him, and Justice for that matter, are dead to me.

Point. Missing it.

Nah, I get the point - I just don't like it. They destroyed a really good character and made him a terrorist among other things.

They should have used his original voice actor too. idc if he's Cullen as well.

I agree. They destroyed a really great character an turned him into a terrorist.

And by "they" I mean "the Templars and the Chantry." 

That's one of the reasons I am so violently anti-templar and anti-Chantry: if it weren't for them, we'd still have happy, funny Anders. But no, they utterly destroyed his hope of experiencing any joy of freedom, even after he devoted his life to saving the world, so they've pretty much all got to burn. Seriously, read his short story.

Man, THEY suck.

At this point my Warden is like "Whoa guys, you almost convinced me that you were like, a valid social organization or something in Origins. I was like, this close to not wanting to destroy all of you and prevent your evil reign from corrupting and destroying all that is good and pure in the world. But then I go away for like a MONTH just to see if my friend's baby is OK, and you destroy my best friend? SERIOUSLY? Oh, you're going to pay for that. You're never going to stop paying for that. May the blight take you all, may you all die screaming, taint coursing through your veins. I will laugh when that happens... laugh.... because of what you did to Anders." 

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 11 septembre 2011 - 08:54 .

[TobiTobsen]

It wasn't the chantry that decided to merge with a spirit of justice...

[Knight of Dane]

TobiTobsen wrote...

It wasn't the chantry that decided to merge with a spirit of justice...

http://instantrimshot.com/

[berelinde]

TobiTobsen wrote...

It wasn't the chantry that decided to merge with a spirit of justice...

Justice did not destroy Anders. He was broken long, long before he even met the spirit. Yes, he was funny in DA:A. He was clever, witty, and always ready with a snappy come-back. He was also using humor to distract others from his flaws, insecurities, and the scathing hatred he felt toward templars and the Chantry. He is very good at it. It is his coping mechanism, and it has kept him sane despite numerous stints in solitary confinement for attempting to escape the Circle. His last incarceration lasted a year. In solitary confinement. The only thing that happened when Anders merged with Justice was that he could no longer hide behind the veil of humor. So, if you were to say that the Chantry did not take away Anders's crutch, I would say "Nope, that was Justice, all right." but the Chantry is certainly responsible for compromising Anders's mental state.

So, if you're determined to hate a character, by all means, carry on. But don't blame the character because you did not perceive the darker aspects of his personaliy in Awakening.

Modifié par berelinde, 11 septembre 2011 - 02:07 .

[Yuqi]

Anders.
Whats even more annoying, is his the only healer unless your a mage. So you have to listen to his whining..

[berelinde]

Or you can just chug restoration potions and learn to brew Mythal's Favor grenades. There are threads in the "Tactics" section dedicated to life without Anders.

[TobiTobsen]

berelinde wrote...

TobiTobsen wrote...

It wasn't the chantry that decided to merge with a spirit of justice...

Justice did not destroy Anders. He was broken long, long before he even met the spirit. Yes, he was funny in DA:A. He was clever, witty, and always ready with a snappy come-back. He was also using humor to distract others from his flaws, insecurities, and the scathing hatred he felt toward templars and the Chantry. He is very good at it. It is his coping mechanism, and it has kept him sane despite numerous stints in solitary confinement for attempting to escape the Circle. His last incarceration lasted a year. In solitary confinement. The only thing that happened when Anders merged with Justice was that he could no longer hide behind the veil of humor. So, if you were to say that the Chantry did not take away Anders's crutch, I would say "Nope, that was Justice, all right." but the Chantry is certainly responsible for compromising Anders's mental state.

So, if you're determined to hate a character, by all means, carry on. But don't blame the character because you did not perceive the darker aspects of his personaliy in Awakening.

I don't hate Anders. I just made that comment because of the amount of HATE that radiated out of the post above mine

[CulturalGeekGirl]

Oh come on, a little hyperbolic roleplay hatred is too much for you?

Also bear in mind that my Warden is Dalish, so she has extra double secret reasons to hate the Chantry. It's like someone who belongs to [minority group] hating all people who belong to [group that attempted genocide and enforced apartheid.] If she were from some other origin, I'm sure she'd probably feel differently.

I just finally got tired of people saying "they" ruined Anders. It makes me roll my eyes clear out of my head. The horrible abuses he was subject to caused Anders to finally break. He didn't just decide one day to merge with a spirit of justice on a lark: he did it because the templars had systematically taken away every scrap of freedom and shred of hope.

I can understand not liking Anders now. I can understand liking him more in Awakening. I would much rather have a vaguely bitter, funny, flirty mage on my arm than one who is being consumed by anguish at the injustice of the world. But Anders' decision to do what he did was perfectly in character for Awakening Anders. Awakening Anders' entire life was predicated on and devoted to the hope of achieving some kind of freedom, even though every piece of evidence he had was that such hope was probably false, he still kind of believed that someday, he'd find a way out. Then with the Wardens, he finally thinks he has: he's given up a great deal to do it but hey, he's won. So when that gets yanked away and corrupted, there's no lie to tell anymore - because he's already sacrificed so much to achieve freedom and even that didn't work. Now he's a warden, with all that entails: nightmares, darkspawn, death, but without any of the freedom he made the sacrifice for.

When you realize you've lost everything, even hope, and you're given a chance to try to make sure nobody else has to go through that again... if you're a good person, it makes sense that you would take that chance.

I'm fine if you prefer Awakening Anders, or if you don't like Anders at all and never did. But this wasn't just an arbitrary decision by some invisible "they." It was a realistic depiction of what an authoritarian system of persecution and internment does to people like Awakening Anders.

[Knight of Dane]

Very true, but don't forget that the developers also chose that Justice needed a body at all.

Before DA:2 i would have guessed that he could just fade away when Kristoff's body finally died(again) and wreak justice upon the demons of the fade all over.

Not that i am complaining, i think it was a great choise, those of us that played Awakening witnessed Justice's growing love for the mortal world, if i had been him I'd darn well ask a friend if i could become his subconsience too.

[Sinaxi]

OnionXI wrote...

Tidra wrote...

OnionXI wrote...

Anders - Not really even the same person that was in Awakening. After Nathaniel he was my next favorite but in DA2 I just can't deal with all his whining about templars. On top of that it kind of pisses me off that he complains so much about having been a Warden after I did so much for him in Awakening to the point where he was accepting of it. Him, and Justice for that matter, are dead to me.

Point. Missing it.

Nah, I get the point - I just don't like it. They destroyed a really good character and made him a terrorist among other things.

They should have used his original voice actor too. idc if he's Cullen as well.

Lol. Greg Ellis was not even that great at Awakening Anders. I'm sorry, but his voice acting was so overdone and way too "goofy" sounding. It was painful to listen to. He could have done more to show Anders distaste about the Templars while still being sarcastic and funny, but that cynicism that Anders had underneath the surface was rarely shown over the "I'm trying to change my voice for a different character" persona he took on while he was voice acting Anders. Just not that great, honestly.

And, lol...the writers did not destroy Anders. Him blowing up the Chantry does not = Anders is destroyed. If anything, he is stronger. He has taken a stand against an organization that has oppressed him, and people like him for THOUSANDS of years. He isn't going to take this **** anymore, and if he is called a terrorist for that - he is fine with it. And so am I.

Anyways. I also hate threads like this in general. It breeds more "WAH DA2 SUCKED" people. Instead of talking about how much you hate a character, why don't you try talking about why they developed these aspects you all hate so much to better understand why they are the way they are. (or here's a crazy thought: talk about what you liked) Boiling characters down into 1 word descriptions (Anders is a terrorist, Fenris is a dick, Isabela is a ****, Merrill is stupid) is idiotic and it only shows that the majority of you who do this have no ****ing clue what you're talking about or just don't care to understand. And I say that because several posts on here were basically just that. "I didn't like so and so, because they were stupid. The end." Good job!

Modifié par Tidra, 11 septembre 2011 - 06:55 .

[Aeowyn]

The reason they didn't use Greg Ellis to voice Anders in DA2 was because he was busy filming Pirates of the Carribean 4 or whatever. They did what they could with what they had and in the end I think Howden did a fine job voicing DA2 Anders.