119 réponses à ce sujet

[Dean_the_Young]

ThePwener wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Why is there any reason to believe there was no video? They had audio for sure.

But, helmet or not, Shepard still introduces him/herself to Kenson, right inside the interrogation cell we know has microphones...

Shepard: "That's obviously altered"

'Can you support this claim, Commander?'

'I should go.'

Plus, I doubt that the Batarian empire or wathever they have would willingly give the Alliance video footage or recordings that easily. They hate each other!

Which is why the Hegemony would want to prove to the galaxy at large that Humanity's first Spectre, the Alliance's prized bestest soldier, blew up a planet.

The Batarian Hegemony going public with proof about Shepard's involvement isn't a favor to the Alliance.

[ThePwener]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Which is why the Hegemony would want to prove to the galaxy at large that Humanity's first Spectre, the Alliance's prized bestest soldier, blew up a planet.

The Batarian Hegemony going public with proof about Shepard's involvement isn't a favor to the Alliance.

I sometimes hate how many people are against you in this game. Reminds me of real life.

[ChaplainTappman]

ThePwener wrote...

Shepard: "That's obviously altered"

Plus, I doubt that the Batarian empire or wathever they have would willingly give the Alliance video footage or recordings that easily. They hate each other!

That's a good point. Even if the batarian Hegemony were willing to furnish the Alliance with whatever evidence they have (which is a big if), the Alliance would be unlikely to accept it, or give it much credence. The Hegemony is basically the future version of North Korea. Would you accept evidence from North Korea as legit? It's likely to be altered in some way. And even if it isn't, its authenticity is in question because of the source.

All of this is irrelevant, anyway. You're assuming that there's going to be a concerted, genuine effort to convict Shepard. That's not going to happen. It's a farce, a political show to mollify the batarians. Even if the Reapers didn't interrupt the trial, I have a hard time believing that Shepard would face serious consequences.

[ThePwener]

ChaplainTappman wrote...

ThePwener wrote...

Shepard: "That's obviously altered"

Plus, I doubt that the Batarian empire or wathever they have would willingly give the Alliance video footage or recordings that easily. They hate each other!

That's a good point. Even if the batarian Hegemony were willing to furnish the Alliance with whatever evidence they have (which is a big if), the Alliance would be unlikely to accept it, or give it much credence. The Hegemony is basically the future version of North Korea. Would you accept evidence from North Korea as legit? It's likely to be altered in some way. And even if it isn't, its authenticity is in question because of the source.

All of this is irrelevant, anyway. You're assuming that there's going to be a concerted, genuine effort to convict Shepard. That's not going to happen. It's a farce, a political show to mollify the batarians. Even if the Reapers didn't interrupt the trial, I have a hard time believing that Shepard would face serious consequences.

I wouldn't be surprised if it's just a bunch of guys sitting around and....

Judge: "Tell us one more time how it happened"

Shepard: "So I just push the button, call my ship, and when I get out, THE WHOLE PLACE BLOWS UP!"

Hackett: "HILARIOUS!"

[Dean_the_Young]

InviolateNK wrote...

1. I said "almost" because Thane's and Garrus' missions were on the Citadel. Very local things, like all other loyalty missions. If they weren't, Shepard would have to run from the Citadel after finishing them to avoid getting arrested. Everything else was none of the Council's business.

So, we're agreed that a Shepard who did Thane and Garrus's loyalty missions has, in fact, violated the conditions that Council set out in exchange for getting Spectre Status again?

Good.

2. Shepard killed everyone on his way to and from that prison. There's no one left who could confirm that Shepard visited the prison and that there can be video recordings of it.

I'd like to introduce you to the marvelous concept of 'computers' and 'recording devices'.

These things can 'store' what we call 'information.' Like 'pictures' or 'sounds' of things that have occured. They are very interesting devices because they allow people to 'see' things without being right there.

It's all part of this concept we call 'technology', which is rather useful and a big part of the 'science-fiction' universe.

3. Hackett:

"There's just enough evidence for a witch hunt"
"The evidence against you is shoddy at best"

There's just enough evidence.

just enough evidence.

enough evidence


Do you read what you transcribe, or do you not comprehend?

'Shoddy at best' doesn't mean unworkable. 'Just enough' does mean enough.

Modifié par Dean_the_Young, 14 août 2011 - 01:44 .

[Goneaviking]

redbaron76 wrote...

Lets see what your opinions are on this issue. Is the trial going to be a millitary tribunal or bunch of politicians trying to railrad shepard.

My opinion is that it will be bunch of politicians trying to make a name for themselves by railroading humanity's first spectre. 

I think it'll be both.

[ChaplainTappman]

Dean, your argument is invalid.

Regardless of whether or not the Council can or will rescind Shepard's Spectre status in ME3, they don't in ME2. Meaning Shepard is a Spectre when he goes into the Bahak system. Spectres have wide operational latitude and don't need specific instructions from the Council to act.

Shepard can prove that his actions, actions that inadvertently led to the deaths of 300,000+ batarians, halted an imminent threat to the galaxy. Spectres are authorized to use whatever means necessary to protect to Council, the Citadel, and the galaxy. Ergo, Shepard cannot be tried under the Citadel Conventions.

As I said before, the Alliance will put on this show for the batarians, and then quietly let Shepard go to do his thing. Or, they would, except the Reapers show up.

[Goneaviking]

InviolateNK wrote...
1. No. I only explained what I meant by  "almost".  On the Citadel he prevented a murder and dealt with a scumbag. That's all. And Shepard is still a spectre.

On the Citadel he prevented a murder and assisted a friend in committing another one (unless he refused to cooperate with Garrus).

Shepard is potentially reinstated as a Spectre if a)The council survived the first game and/or  Anderson is made councillor instead of Udina. Until the status is reinstated Shepard repeatedly describes himself as a "former Spectre", even after the status is reactivated there is nothing preventing the council from revoking it if he becomes an embarassment. Saren is a case point that Spectres who lose their status can be apprehended and punished for crimes committed while they had that status.

Even if Shepard does retain the status as of ME3 that will only help him if the council decides to make an issue of it when the Alliance tries to convict him.

2. As I said, Shepard killed everyone in the prison. Whether his visit was recorded or not, there's no one left to show up at the trial with the evidence.

If the batarians had acquired evidence that could be embarassing to the Alliance then why wouldn't they immediately forward it up the chain of command so that they could get a pat on their head and conceivably a promotion from the Hegemony who've been out to screw with the Alliance for years already? Why would they wait until after they were all dead before passing it on?

3. "There's just enough evidence for a witch hunt". For a f*cking witch hunt. Not enough evidence to send Shepard to prison or prove he was there at all.

Look "witch hunt" up, apparently you don't know what it means

Because no one in a witch hunt was ever successfully convicted? No one conducting a witch hunt has ever acquired (or manufactured) convincing evidence against their target? No one who was being targeted by a witch hunt has ever been convicted or punished in a dodgy trial process?

[BatmanPWNS]

I could care less I bet it won't even last longer then 15 minutes.

[Sundance31us]

Rogue Unit wrote...
No, Shepard being an idiot and staring the the Collector's laser while it tears the Normandy apart is the reason he/she died. It would have taken 2 seconds to jump in that pod with Joker. Two seconds that was wasted dicking around in more ways than one - like screwing around with the sleeper pods with the ship in crumbling around you.

The Captain’s Duty on a Sinking Ship By Craig H Allen

http://www.law.washi...ngShipTake2.pdf

"U.S. Naval Regulations direct commanding officers of ships suffering major casualties to remain with their ship "so long as is necessary." Should it become necessary to abandons ship, however, the Regulations provide additional direction. Article 0852 specifically states that the commanding officer is to be the last to leave....Finally, the commanding officer is charged with responsibility for the protection of the survivors until rescue can be effected." (page 3)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When we first encounter Shepard he/she is advises, “The distress beacon is ready for launch.” Evidentially distress beacons do not launch themselves in the ME universe.



The console he/she is working on appears to be related to the ship’s damage control systems. I’m willing to go out on a limb and say the blue button launches the distress beacon, whether it does anything else is uncertain. Though, I do find it interesting that none of the escape pods launch until after Shepard hits the blue button.

What frustrates me about the “rescue Joker” mission in addition to Shepard watching the ship get slit in two instead of escaping right away is that we can hear Joker over the comm, but can make no effort to contact him directly before reaching the Command Deck. <_<

[eye basher]

ChaplainTappman wrote...

Dean, your argument is invalid.

Regardless of whether or not the Council can or will rescind Shepard's Spectre status in ME3, they don't in ME2. Meaning Shepard is a Spectre when he goes into the Bahak system. Spectres have wide operational latitude and don't need specific instructions from the Council to act.

Shepard can prove that his actions, actions that inadvertently led to the deaths of 300,000+ batarians, halted an imminent threat to the galaxy. Spectres are authorized to use whatever means necessary to protect to Council, the Citadel, and the galaxy. Ergo, Shepard cannot be tried under the Citadel Conventions.

As I said before, the Alliance will put on this show for the batarians, and then quietly let Shepard go to do his thing. Or, they would, except the Reapers show up.

What threat to the galaxy? oh you mean the reapers which the coucil doesn't believe in the very same council that thinks that shepard is out of his/her mind and then there's the spectre status which you can only have as long as you stay in the terminus where the council has no authority.

[Zulu_DFA]

ThePwener wrote...

Zulu_DFA wrote...

Shepard must be allowed to deny every and all charges:

Court: What happened in the Bahak system?
Shepard: I don't know. I was on Illium at the time.
Court: Working for Cerberus, of course!
Shepard: Cerberus? Never heard of it.
Court: But how have you come into possession of a privately registered space vehicle with an illegal AI on board?
Shepard: I found it.
Court: Oh, you found it?.. Where?
Shepard: I don't really remember. Space is big.
Court: Shepard, you're not helping yourself here. Let's start over. Have you ever killed anybody?
Shepard: Yeah, but they were all bad.

Definitely.

And if things end up bad, I can just kill everyone between me and the exit. At this point I don't give a rat's ass about the Alliance. Oh, if Kiadan even tries to stop me with; "I r Spector! Stup!" I'll drop that ungrateful bastard in a second.

"Spectre? Didn't they tell you? They always go rogue!" [headshot]

[SirBoomstick]

Why do I get the feeling that we're gonna hear a line or two from Star Trek IV?

[MACharlie1]

InviolateNK wrote...
2. As I said, Shepard killed everyone in the prison. Whether his visit was recorded or not, there's no one left to show up at the trial with the evidence.

Do we know everyone in the prison is dead? All we fought was alot bunch of guards. What about the support staff like the cleaners (albeit very poor ones) and the Warden? The cooks? And I highly doubt that the prison was just an isolated prison that wasn't connected to any other facility. 

InviolateNK wrote...
3. "There's just enough evidence for a witch hunt". For a f*cking witch hunt. Not enough evidence to send Shepard to prison or prove he was there at all.

Look "witch hunt" up, apparently you don't know what it means

Ah yes...witch hunt. If I recall, they still found people guilty of witchcraft. Your point is only valid if a justice system worked ideally. It doesn't - people who did it get off and people who didn't do it go to prison. If theres enough outrage and just enough evidence then they will bring Shepard to trial. Who knows if it's enough to actually convict him. That is beside the point if there is enough to convict. 

And I doubt the Council will let you keep Spectre status - remember Tela Vasir? Yeah - you killed a Council Spectre after she blew up a building and basically blamed a "Cerberus terrorist". 

[Russianbear0027]

On the topic of evidence from the prison getting out to the hegemony, unless Shepard left someone with access to those records who then managed to escape the system before it got vaporized, then the records would never make it anywhere. Why? Bandwidth issues. I doubt the security footage from a prison is very high priority for transmitting across FTL comms.

[MACharlie1]

Russianbear0027 wrote...

On the topic of evidence from the prison getting out to the hegemony, unless Shepard left someone with access to those records who then managed to escape the system before it got vaporized, then the records would never make it anywhere. Why? Bandwidth issues. I doubt the security footage from a prison is very high priority for transmitting across FTL comms.

Amanda Kenson attempted to drive an entire asteroid into a Mass Relay. I'd say her interrogation footage would be very high priority. 

[Russianbear0027]

MACharlie1 wrote...

Russianbear0027 wrote...

On the topic of evidence from the prison getting out to the hegemony, unless Shepard left someone with access to those records who then managed to escape the system before it got vaporized, then the records would never make it anywhere. Why? Bandwidth issues. I doubt the security footage from a prison is very high priority for transmitting across FTL comms.

Amanda Kenson attempted to drive an entire asteroid into a Mass Relay. I'd say her interrogation footage would be very high priority. 

Hmm, true, I hadn't thought of that. Was the interrogation over by the time Shepard gets there? *forgot*

[ChaplainTappman]

eye basher wrote...

What threat to the galaxy? oh you mean the reapers which the coucil doesn't believe in the very same council that thinks that shepard is out of his/her mind and then there's the spectre status which you can only have as long as you stay in the terminus where the council has no authority.

As I said earlier, armor hardsuits have built in computers, capable of recording audio and possibly video as well. It stands to reason that Shepard recorded the conversations he had with Saren, Sovereign, Vigil, Harbinger, Kenson, etc. Besides, the operational latitude that Spectres are granted means that they don't need specific instructions from the Council to act, nor do they have to justify their actions to anyone, even the Council. Shepard acted to preserve the galaxy. If pressed, he can provide evidence to demonstrate that. Furthermore, if Spectres could only operate in Citadel space, they wouldn't be very effective. They're authorized by the Council to go where they must.

[Gregolian]

All I hope is I have a chance to blow a hole in the back of that idiot Turian councilor's head.

[MACharlie1]

Russianbear0027 wrote...

MACharlie1 wrote...

Russianbear0027 wrote...

On the topic of evidence from the prison getting out to the hegemony, unless Shepard left someone with access to those records who then managed to escape the system before it got vaporized, then the records would never make it anywhere. Why? Bandwidth issues. I doubt the security footage from a prison is very high priority for transmitting across FTL comms.

Amanda Kenson attempted to drive an entire asteroid into a Mass Relay. I'd say her interrogation footage would be very high priority. 

Hmm, true, I hadn't thought of that. Was the interrogation over by the time Shepard gets there? *forgot*

During I believe....and then Shepard introduces himself. 

See, I think Bioware is intentionally trying to mirror Saren in Shepard:

Tela Vasir = Nihlus (and speaking of Vasir, she basically frames Shepard and Cerberus for blowing up the trade center) 
Bahak System = Eden Prime
Geth = Cerberus 
Liara = Benezia 
Ash/Kaidan = Shepard

Couldn't Saren have also said "I'm doing this for the greater good of the Galaxy!" Nope. He devastated a colony and got his Spectre status taken away. I don't think any amount of evidence will keep Shepard's Spectre status. 

Modifié par MACharlie1, 14 août 2011 - 07:12 .

[Ryzaki]

Shepard: "..."

Alliance Representive: Don't you have something to say?

*they sit in silence and then all of a sudden screams and explosions as the Reapers come on through*

Shepard: I think that pretty much makes my defense for me.

*Shepard points towards Reaper that landed right outside*

[Sundance31us]

MACharlie1 wrote...
Amanda Kenson attempted to drive an entire asteroid into a Mass Relay. I'd say her interrogation footage would be very high priority. 

From one of the Batarian Security Logs:

"Our comm buoy intercepts paid off. We picked up a message to the Alliance coming from somewhere in the asteroid belt. We listened to the feed until we discovered an operation run by a human named Kenson -- smuggling engine parts and guidance systems into the system from Omega. We intercepted Kenson's vessel and took her and her people into custody. Interrogation has produced nothing but frenzied rambling so far."