296 réponses à ce sujet

[ThePwener]

marshalleck wrote...

How am I ignorant and how are you a nihilist. I see you write those words, but I don't see any evidence you know what they mean.

I changed my post because what I said is harsh, but still what I truly feel.

And why do you need evidence of my competence? That's a very immature response that's used in the internet to no avail.

Saying things like; "you have to break a few eggs to make and omelette" or "if you want to build an ivory tower you have to kill a few elephants" are incredibly ignorant things. Humanity is caught in a suffering loop that it itself creates. You're proof of the ignorant end of it, like greed.

[Praetor Knight]

Oh, and didn't Monty get an unsavory rep, during the African campaign against the Desert Fox?

More googling, that's for sure.

[AdmiralCheez]

Pwener and marshal are fighting again?

God damn reruns.

[Bcuz]

ThePwener wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

How am I ignorant and how are you a nihilist. I see you write those words, but I don't see any evidence you know what they mean.

I changed my post because what I said is harsh, but still what I truly feel.

And why do you need evidence of my competence? That's a very immature response that's used in the internet to no avail.

Saying things like; "you have to break a few eggs to make and omelette" or "if you want to build an ivory tower you have to kill a few elephants" are incredibly ignorant things. Humanity is caught in a suffering loop that it itself creates. You're proof of the ignorant end of it, like greed.

You my friend seem to be overreacting to a justification of a background choice for a pretend character.

Modifié par Bcuz, 14 août 2011 - 06:42 .

[marshalleck]

ThePwener wrote...
Humanity is caught in a suffering loop that it itself creates. You're proof of the ignorant end of it, like greed.

Suffering is the result of unwillingness to accept reality in all its gory detail. Like the quote above attributed to Speirs from Band of Brothers.

I should clarify this. I am refering to an existential suffering, not physical suffering such as starvation or disease. 

Modifié par marshalleck, 14 août 2011 - 06:53 .

[Gregolian]

marshalleck wrote...

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Gregolian wrote...

ThePwener wrote...
You're ignorance is not cute. No wonder Im a nihilist.

You're living proof of how ****ed up Humanity is.

It's true though.

You think WWI, WWII, or the American Civil and Revolutionary Wars would have stopped if someone had said "Nah, don't charge that hill/bunker/island/trench system...  I don't want anyone dieing"

?

Do you?

Hmm... I need to double check what I'm remembering about the Civil War, after reading that, since there was one General that did seem hesitant.

Ohh, that's tickling my memory. I can't remember his name. He was a pretty big failure though. Got relieved of his command.

It wasn't Han**** as Han**** was loved by the men and the staff around Lincoln cause he cared about his men but knew he couldn't protect everyone.  I think the one that was a giant box of fail was McClellan cause him and Lincoln never got along.

[marshalleck]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Pwener and marshal are fighting again?

God damn reruns.

I'm not fighting. I am perfectly calm and rational, engaged in discussion.

[Bluko]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Bluko wrote...

Ruthless just makes Shepard seem like the sort of person who views everyone as expendable to their goals. Sure sometimes you don't have a choice, but Ruthless Shepard seems like the nasty officer that continues to send soldier after soldier to clear a path through a minefield. While it's just a game I can't really pretend to validate such a Character as a "Hero".

I hadn't thought of the Ruthless psych profile like that.

I had thought of that profile more like the movie, Hamburger Hill, where Shepard is given impossible orders, but chooses to carry those orders out regardless of the cost.

Edit: darn link shall link

Well I understand it can be viewed or interpreted that way. In that Shepard didn't really have any other choice and that they just had bad luck. To me anyways Ruthless Shepard is the sort who would see Jenkin's death as being no big deal.

Either way Ruthless Shepard gets lots of people killed, which is not in my opinion good leadership regardless of intention.

[Gregolian]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Oh, and didn't Monty get an unsavory rep, during the African campaign against the Desert Fox?

More googling, that's for sure.

Monty got it from US 101st Airborne and 82nd Airborne during Operation Market Garden for telling his tanks not to blast building down and too keep collateral damage down.  This is again, shown in BoB when the British tank commander won't blow a hole in a building that a Tiger is hiding behind.

[ThePwener]

Gregolian wrote...

ThePwener wrote...
You're ignorance is not cute. No wonder Im a nihilist.

You're living proof of how ****ed up Humanity is.

It's true though.

You think WWI, WWII, or the American Civil and Revolutionary Wars would have stopped if someone had said "Nah, don't charge that hill/bunker/island/trench system...  I don't want anyone dieing"

?

Do you?

Those wars shouldn't even have begun if Humanity was a little more assertive and a little less lazy. Yes, Im talking about the United States especially.

[Bcuz]

Now while I enjoy a good history discussion as much as the next guy, I believe we had best stop before a lockdown occurs due to off topic discussion.
(not refering to the justification of Ruthless shep and comparisons to history, though that is degrading into bickering regardless)

Modifié par Bcuz, 14 août 2011 - 06:46 .

[ThePwener]

marshalleck wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Pwener and marshal are fighting again?

God damn reruns.

I'm not fighting. I am perfectly calm and rational, engaged in discussion.

That goes for me as well.

[GodWood]

ThePwener wrote...

marshalleck wrote...

ThePwener wrote...

marshalleck wrote...
I just like the part about ruthlessShep murdering surrendering batarians

What about the part about sending members of you're team to die? Did you like that part?

ambivalent

have to break eggs to make an omelette

You're ignorance is not cute. No wonder Im a nihilist.

You're living proof of how ****ed up Humanity is.

As a nihilist you shouldn't even care about sacrificing a few inoccent lives.

[SandTrout]

Gregolian wrote...

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Hmm... I need to double check what I'm remembering about the Civil War, after reading that, since there was one General that did seem hesitant.

It was the one before Grant stepped in I believe.  But I was talking more along the lines of what Buford (I think that's his name) chose to do and tried to keep the high ground outside of Gettysburg or how Sherman willingly took his troops through Georgia.

Really, IIRC, every general before Grant (excluding Sherman) had refused to press their advantage after forcing the Confederates to retreat. The war lasted years longer than it should have because of northern generals that were unwilling to commit to a decicive engagement.

[Praetor Knight]

ThePwener wrote...

Gregolian wrote...

ThePwener wrote...
You're ignorance is not cute. No wonder Im a nihilist.

You're living proof of how ****ed up Humanity is.

It's true though.

You think WWI, WWII, or the American Civil and Revolutionary Wars would have stopped if someone had said "Nah, don't charge that hill/bunker/island/trench system...  I don't want anyone dieing"

?

Do you?

Those wars shouldn't even have begun if Humanity was a little more assertive and a little less lazy. Yes, Im talking about the United States especially.

Wait, how could the US have prevented WWI?



But yeah, we did need a Shepard type for the other three.

[ThePwener]

Bcuz wrote...

You my friend seem to be overreacting to a justification of a background choice for a pretend character.

I know Im acting like an ass and he doesn't deserve it, but stuff like that just gets me really mad.

[nranola]

I'm a fan of Colonist/Sole Survivor. I like me my tragic figures.

[ThePwener]

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Wait, how could the US have prevented WWI?

I was  thinking of WWII actually.....



Godwin's law is so perfect.

[Gregolian]

SandTrout wrote...

Gregolian wrote...

Praetor Shepard wrote...

Hmm... I need to double check what I'm remembering about the Civil War, after reading that, since there was one General that did seem hesitant.

It was the one before Grant stepped in I believe.  But I was talking more along the lines of what Buford (I think that's his name) chose to do and tried to keep the high ground outside of Gettysburg or how Sherman willingly took his troops through Georgia.

Really, IIRC, every general before Grant (excluding Sherman) had refused to press their advantage after forcing the Confederates to retreat. The war lasted years longer than it should have because of northern generals that were unwilling to commit to a decicive engagement.

It's cause they all went to school together at either VMI or West Point.

[marshalleck]

ThePwener wrote...

Bcuz wrote...

You my friend seem to be overreacting to a justification of a background choice for a pretend character.

I know Im acting like an ass and he doesn't deserve it, but stuff like that just gets me really mad.

If it makes you feel any better, I've got a pretty thick skin and your post really didn't bother me. 

[ThePwener]

GodWood wrote...

As a nihilist you shouldn't even care about sacrificing a few inoccent lives.

Okay, go and google what "nihilism" means and then come back.

Here, I'll do it for you: http://www.merriam-w...ionary/nihilism

[ThePwener]

marshalleck wrote...

If it makes you feel any better, I've got a pretty thick skin and your post really didn't bother me. 

Good for you. Now let's continue the topic before it gets closed.

[marshalleck]

1.a: a viewpoint that traditional values and beliefs are unfounded and that existence is senseless and useless

you seem to argue quite fervently in favor of a traditional, modern western moral value system, i.e. that my post about sacrificing soldiers to obtain an objective was repugnant, because either A) human life should not be callously disregarded, or soldiers should not be compared to eggs

take your pick

Modifié par marshalleck, 14 août 2011 - 07:01 .

[SandTrout]

@ThePwener,

Actually, if the French had been willing to force the Germans out of the Rhinland, which was supposed to be a DMZ buffer between the nations, a lot of historians predict that Germany might not can continued with the easy pickings of Europe.

WW2 occurred in as large of a scope as it did due to lack of ability to stomach the idea of actually enforcing a treaty through force of arms. Your example supports the idea of a Ruthless Shepard as someone willing to spend lives to save lives.