150 réponses à ce sujet

[DRUNK_CANADIAN]

Up until the collector stuff... I can kind of see it...since didn't the reapers have some sort of crazy tech control/scrambling stuff...but the collectors...ya easy proof there guys

[_Somebody]

Clonedzero wrote...

Somebody wrote...

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

It's already absurdly easy to fake videos thanks to video editing software. Imagine how much easier it will be in the future? Having video and audio doesn't mean that much. Having hard evidence is another thing entirely.

Then we set it up to a live feed. Link it straight to the council.

you cant do that.

Why not?

[Lotion Soronarr]

Clonedzero wrote...

jollyorigins wrote...

Because they have suit recordings, as stated by Ashley in ME1, but then again no one on the team seems to realise they can use those audio files to prove the Reapers are real.

"look at this recording, the reapers are real, i was talking to one!"
"shepard. thats a VI hologram. my kid has one just like it for his video game. this proves nothing"

..but this hologram of Saren talking proves EVERYTHING!

[MrSuperCrazyAwesome]

Yeah. He should team up with Sam Fisher of Third Echelon and borrow his OPSAT.

[RinpocheSchnozberry]

Somebody wrote...

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

It's already absurdly easy to fake videos thanks to video editing software. Imagine how much easier it will be in the future? Having video and audio doesn't mean that much. Having hard evidence is another thing entirely.

Then we set it up to a live feed. Link it straight to the council or the Alliance or whatever.

No way to prove that the image Shepard is transmitting is actually live.  All the council would get would be what Shepard transmitted.  You can do things with vent and skype to change your voice, or pipe a totally different audio stream into it, or pipe a totally different video stream into it.

[Reptillius]

Actually. This isn't much of a plothole. Consider it like this. With that technology in the suits it would then become SOP to send those suit logs with any reports. You hear shepard in the first game at least have the option to file his reports with the citadel every time. They still don't believe him. they still claim that it's more likely Saren screwing with Shepard to throw him off and manipulate him into following false leads.

Vigil/Ilos is a little bit of an issue but at the same time. When you have a 2 year gap and your only real link to these possible death dreadnaughts being Dead and not knowing just what the Geth can make and a convenient excuse to calm the publics fears. Which is going to be a primary goal of the council by the way,...

Your going to end up exactly where they are. Recorded proof and all. Because quite frankly. There is not much proof to say their version of things isn't correct to begin with. The council's reaction to all of it reguardless of recorded material(classified material at that) is actually rather predictable. It would be more surprising if they didn't respond the way they did.

[Il Divo]

Someone With Mass wrote...

TMA LIVE wrote...

Yeah, but you have both a recording and witnesses, and one of them being the Hero of the Citedal, and the one who could have saved the Council.

Only for them to say, "Well, we didn't talk to the VI face to face, so sucks to be you".

Still, we're talking about a threat that would be on the levels of massing all their fleets, upping the production rate of weapons, ships and the recruiting of soldiers and sending out dozens or hundreds of scouting parties to verify all the facts, just because one man had a bad dream and blames it on a non-functioning VI and its race's beacons, which nobody fully understands yet.

You'd need something that's a little more solid than a camera recording.

Agreed, once more. Let's be honest here: if we're accepting belief in Reapers, that means I accept that they have never once failed in their overarching goal of mass extinction. At that point, I would likely suggest mobilizing every potential resource for war, including drafting civilians into the army, creating alliances with Omega/Batarians, etc, the whole nine yards.

That's not something which can be undergone merely on a camera recording and the possibility that Reapers do exist.

[Abispa]

At the time that Mass Effect occurs, it should be a very simple matter to "fake" any recorded evidence, so the council can be skeptical of any evidence that Shepard produces; especially since Shepard was dead and resurrected by Cerberus.

The most effective way video is used in current armed forces operations is that it allows commanders to see their troops' situation as it occurs. Radio signals do not travel faster than light and FTL communication can only be arranged in specific situations, so the council being able to watch Shepard action live is nearly impossible.

Still, a lot of Shepard's inability to convince most of the Reaper threat is a plot device that must be taken with a grain of salt, otherwise the whole adventure would have been over in ME1.

[Clonedzero]

Somebody wrote...

Why not?

how are you going to transmite the live stream?
to make a simple phone call they have to go to specific commerication buoy.

[Clonedzero]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...


..but this hologram of Saren talking proves EVERYTHING!

again. proving involvement in an attack. fairly straight forward and simple.

proving space unicorns want to kill everyone. gonna need alot more evidence than that.

[_Somebody]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

Somebody wrote...

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

It's already absurdly easy to fake videos thanks to video editing software. Imagine how much easier it will be in the future? Having video and audio doesn't mean that much. Having hard evidence is another thing entirely.

Then we set it up to a live feed. Link it straight to the council or the Alliance or whatever.

No way to prove that the image Shepard is transmitting is actually live.  All the council would get would be what Shepard transmitted.  You can do things with vent and skype to change your voice, or pipe a totally different audio stream into it, or pipe a totally different video stream into it.

Bah, then we just tell the council to go f themselves. 
There is no winning.

[_Somebody]

Clonedzero wrote...

Somebody wrote...

Why not?

how are you going to transmite the live stream?
to make a simple phone call they have to go to specific commerication buoy.

With the crap TIM uses on the SR2.

[TMA LIVE]

Someone With Mass wrote...

TMA LIVE wrote...

Yeah, but you have both a recording and witnesses, and one of them being the Hero of the Citedal, and the one who could have saved the Council.

Only for them to say, "Well, we didn't talk to the VI face to face, so sucks to be you".

Still, we're talking about a threat that would be on the levels of massing all their fleets, upping the production rate of weapons, ships and the recruiting of soldiers and sending out dozens or hundreds of scouting parties to verify all the facts, just because one man had a bad dream and blames it on a non-functioning VI and its race's beacons, which nobody fully understands yet.

You'd need something that's a little more solid than a camera recording.

Like pieces of Sovereign that suggests it isn't Reaper creation, and is unlike the Geth. Yet, they want to assume it's of Geth creation, despite it being more advanced then them.

[Someone With Mass]

You'd need something along the lines of the quantum entanglement...thing to show the Reapers live, because it'd take quite some time for ordinary signals to reach the Citadel and for them to send their feed back to you.

[Clonedzero]

Somebody wrote...

Clonedzero wrote...

Somebody wrote...

Why not?

how are you going to transmite the live stream?
to make a simple phone call they have to go to specific commerication buoy.

With the crap TIM uses on the SR2.

but thats super insanely expensive for one. and two, the council doesnt want to be aware of all the actions the spectres take. plausible denyability and all that. having a live stream kinda makes them guilty of anything and everything the spectre does.

[Il Divo]

TMA LIVE wrote...

Like pieces of Sovereign that suggests it isn't Reaper creation, and is unlike the Geth. Yet, they want to assume it's of Geth creation, despite it being more advanced then them.

What do you compare it to in order to prove that it's a Reaper? "Advanced tech" really doesn't cut it. The Council acknowledges that Sovereign is clearly an advanced space ship. But how does this prove that he's a sentient space ship, and that more are coming through the Citadel?

[TMA LIVE]

Seriously, we got recordings of Saren, Benezia, Sovereign himself saying the same damn thing Shepard is saying. Including a recording of a VI. And pieces of Sovereign himself. By this point, behind closed doors, you'd have to believe in the possibility.

[_Somebody]

Clonedzero wrote...

but thats super insanely expensive for one. and two, the council doesnt want to be aware of all the actions the spectres take. plausible denyability and all that. having a live stream kinda makes them guilty of anything and everything the spectre does.

That is true.

Then they will have to believe once the attack starts.

Modifié par Somebody, 14 août 2011 - 05:32 .

[TMA LIVE]

Il Divo wrote...

TMA LIVE wrote...

Like pieces of Sovereign that suggests it isn't Reaper creation, and is unlike the Geth. Yet, they want to assume it's of Geth creation, despite it being more advanced then them.

What do you compare it to in order to prove that it's a Reaper? "Advanced tech" really doesn't cut it. The Council acknowledges that Sovereign is clearly an advanced space ship. But how does this prove that he's a sentient space ship, and that more are coming through the Citadel?

You can compare it to any Geth ship we shoot down in Council Space. Which apparently we've been doing. And you'd realize how stupid it would be for one ship to be lightyears more advanced them the rest of the ships. You could at least consider that Sovereign wasn't Geth.

[Someone With Mass]

TMA LIVE wrote...

Like pieces of Sovereign that suggests it isn't Reaper creation, and is unlike the Geth. Yet, they want to assume it's of Geth creation, despite it being more advanced then them.

I think that's because they have nothing that indicates that it's not a geth creation. Being more advanced can simply just mean that they created a pretty advanced ship.

Not to mention that they had nothing else to compare the remains of Sovereign to.

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

Clonedzero wrote...

Somebody wrote...

Why not?

how are you going to transmite the live stream?
to make a simple phone call they have to go to specific commerication buoy.

Umm...quantum entaglement?

[The Interloper]

I've wondered the same thing. Though I suppose the council would still have found a way to dismiss it.

[Il Divo]

TMA LIVE wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

TMA LIVE wrote...

Like pieces of Sovereign that suggests it isn't Reaper creation, and is unlike the Geth. Yet, they want to assume it's of Geth creation, despite it being more advanced then them.

What do you compare it to in order to prove that it's a Reaper? "Advanced tech" really doesn't cut it. The Council acknowledges that Sovereign is clearly an advanced space ship. But how does this prove that he's a sentient space ship, and that more are coming through the Citadel?

You can compare it to any Geth ship we shoot down in Council Space. Which apparently we've been doing. And you'd realize how stupid it would be for one ship to be lightyears more advanced them the rest of the ships. You could at least consider that Sovereign wasn't Geth.

Which doesn't prove Reapers in any way, shape, or form. All it means is that we have advanced technology to explore. Should the Council be investigating into its source? Certainly, but it's not clear where the Reaper theory enters the picture.

[TMA LIVE]

Someone With Mass wrote...

TMA LIVE wrote...

Like pieces of Sovereign that suggests it isn't Reaper creation, and is unlike the Geth. Yet, they want to assume it's of Geth creation, despite it being more advanced then them.

I think that's because they have nothing that indicates that it's not a geth creation. Being more advanced can simply just mean that they created a pretty advanced ship.

Not to mention that they had nothing else to compare the remains of Sovereign to.

You wouldn't make one advanced ship that's lightyears ahead, yet leave the rest of the fleet behind in time. Especially when you have the turians already equiping stuff like Sov's canon.

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

Question:When you bring Legion to the council they say "Maybe those Geth were more advanced" were they acknowledging the different factions?