72 réponses à ce sujet

[Porenferser]

Would have made the assault on Kirkwall a lot easier, maybe they could have even won (if it wasn't for Mr Superhero aka Hawke).

[whykikyouwhy]

I would imagine that the Qunari may not have had access to (or the freedom to acquire) the supplies needed for the Gaatlok. Javaris and the fanatical elf would have been able to use their contacts or move about town to get what they needed after acquiring the formula, but the Arishok and his group were pretty much confined to the compound.

[TEWR]

what whykikyouwhy said basically. Remember, they were in a shipwreck and lost much of their supplies. They could've made the saar-qamek and sent it towards the Gallows to delay or even keep the Templars from arriving.

Qunari only really went out for food supplies, delegate meetings, and to scout out the land. I imagine the ingredients to make the Saar-qamek are really hard to come by outside of Qunari lands, and the Arishok wasn't keeping correspondence with Par Vollen or Seheron.

As for the gaatlok, don't know why he didn't make that when Anders was able to make the same thing with some magic thrown in for extra kick.

[T3H Fish]

It could be that the gaatlok, which I would assume is some kind of gun-powder, requires different ingredients than Ander's bomb did and as others have said, since they were confinded to that compound, it's not like they had any connections to the market or even black market to get the ingredients they needed.

From what I know, the saar-quamek is not meant to be used as a weapon. The Qunari actually use it to brainwash those meant for slave labor to be mindless drones, though I think the crazy elf who got her hands on the recipe made it incorrectly considering everyone was going insane from exposure to it.

[dragonflight288]

Whose to say they didn't? We only saw what Hawke saw, and what I saw was that the Qunari took over the city and gathered up the nobles in less than a day.

[TEWR]

No, the saar-qamek is indeed a weapon. It's a poison gas


"The gas kills, but not before it drives enemies against their allies in a blind rage"


something along those lines.

[T3H Fish]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

No, the saar-qamek is indeed a weapon. It's a poison gas


"The gas kills, but not before it drives enemies against their allies in a blind rage"


something along those lines.

Ah, I may have just read something wrong then.

On the point of the invasion, it may have made it much easier to take over Kirkwall, yes, but the Arishok made a point he was going to convert the entirity of Kirkwall to th Qun and the Qunari, as a whole, are known not to waste potential. Elimanting all of those in political power is the best way to keep any threatening force from being organized. If the Arishok had succeeded in his take over, I'd imagine either people submitted to the Qun or they would be'retrained' to be slave labor. Using the gaatlok and saar-quamek would have killed alot of people, considering how crowded Kirkwall had become during the Blight.

Modifié par T3H Fish, 16 août 2011 - 03:35 .

[Chun Hei]

dragonflight288 wrote...

Whose to say they didn't? We only saw what Hawke saw, and what I saw was that the Qunari took over the city and gathered up the nobles in less than a day.

I agree with this. We saw a hell of a lot destruction in Kirkwall and there is not reason to assume that their secret weapons were not part of it.

[Herr Uhl]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

No, the saar-qamek is indeed a weapon. It's a poison gas

"The gas kills, but not before it drives enemies against their allies in a blind rage"

something along those lines.

Therein lies the problem with using it in the city. It didn't seem like they wanted to kill everyone. He was trying to bring order (in his own odd way). Using Saar-Qamek is indiscriminate, and something probably only used in battlefields far away form settlements. 

[TEWR]

Herr Uhl wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

No, the saar-qamek is indeed a weapon. It's a poison gas

"The gas kills, but not before it drives enemies against their allies in a blind rage"

something along those lines.

Therein lies the problem with using it in the city. It didn't seem like they wanted to kill everyone. He was trying to bring order (in his own odd way). Using Saar-Qamek is indiscriminate, and something probably only used in battlefields far away form settlements. 

He didn't have to use it on the city. That wouldn't make sense. But the Gallows would've worked well. By sending it to the courtyard, he could keep the Templars and Mages from leaving. So long as it's there, they wouldn't be able to move past it, so they'd have to remain in the Gallows if they wanted to live.

[Xilizhra]

Saar-qamek is the poison gas. Whatever the qunari use to mindrape their laborers is just called qamek.

[Northern Sun]

The Arishok was so pissed at Kirkwall he wanted to destroy it with his bare hands.

Though "they used it, we didn't see it" is more likely.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Because like everyone else, they turn out to be incompetent.

They didn't take advantage of a perfectly defensible chokepoint:
"People in Hightown feel safe, not because the city's walls are impregnable, but because an invader would need to scale the stairs from Lowtown in order to reach them. Many bloody battles have been fought on those narrow stairs, and in several wars Hightown has held out for months after Lowtown was taken."

Where they could have used the gas to make it even harder to break through it.

But no, let's go for your average hostage taker tactic.

[dragonflight288]

Aveline: *upon reaching the Keep* I don't see any of my guards!?!

The keep is the heart of the Guard, so I see a couple of things here. They were either out fighting the Qunari throughout the city, those who weren't out on patrol were all slaughtered, or they were quickly subdued and taken prisoner. Or they could be victims of the Saar-qamek and fighting each other.

[dragonflight288]

Because like everyone else, they turn out to be incompetent.

They didn't take advantage of a perfectly defensible chokepoint:
"People in Hightown feel safe, not because the city's walls are impregnable, but because an invader would need to scale the stairs from Lowtown in order to reach them. Many bloody battles have been fought on those narrow stairs, and in several wars Hightown has held out for months after Lowtown was taken."

Where they could have used the gas to make it even harder to break through it.

But no, let's go for your average hostage taker tactic.

The Qunari were the aggressors so the Nobles and the Guards weren't using the narrow stairs. Then they were moving onto forcible conversion, everyone of importance were all gathered in one place and as I stated above, the guards weren't there. The only way into the keep was those stairs a large group of Qunari were defending. You can either charge with Meredith with a large force and take them out or have Orsino distract them so you can sneak past them from behind the pillars.

The Qunari were using the choke points.

[EmperorSahlertz]

Who is to say the Qunari didn't use it? We did not see everything going on in the city, and there were ruins and fires all over the place. Gaatlok could possibly have been used.

[EmperorSahlertz]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Because like everyone else, they turn out to be incompetent.

They didn't take advantage of a perfectly defensible chokepoint:
"People in Hightown feel safe, not because the city's walls are impregnable, but because an invader would need to scale the stairs from Lowtown in order to reach them. Many bloody battles have been fought on those narrow stairs, and in several wars Hightown has held out for months after Lowtown was taken."

Where they could have used the gas to make it even harder to break through it.

But no, let's go for your average hostage taker tactic.

They did use all the defensible positions you just referenced....

[KnightofPhoenix]

dragonflight288 wrote...
The Qunari were the aggressors so the Nobles and the Guards weren't using the narrow stairs. Then they were moving onto forcible conversion, everyone of importance were all gathered in one place and as I stated above, the guards weren't there. The only way into the keep was those stairs a large group of Qunari were defending. You can either charge with Meredith with a large force and take them out or have Orsino distract them so you can sneak past them from behind the pillars.

The Qunari were using the choke points.

The Qunari were not defending the stairs linking Low and Hightown, they were defending the courtward. Hawke walked up those stairs with ease (didn't even run). No one was defending it. 

If they wanted to hold the keep and have time to convert, they should have fortified the stairs and focused on holding it. At least as a first line of defense. It's much more defensible than the small stair of the Keep.

[dragonflight288]

Again, the Qunari were the aggressors. They were defending the Arishok, and they only had a few hundred of survivors from the shipwrek at first. Taking casualties and numbers who became Tal-Vashoth, they likely didn't have the numbers to defend more than what they had.

[KnightofPhoenix]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...
They did use all the defensible positions you just referenced....

No, they did not. The stairs were undefended.
A few Sarebaas could have held those stairs for a long time. We didn't see Qunari lance throwers take advantage of it either and keep raining volleys on Hawke, who was casually walking up thsoe stairs. 

[dragonflight288]

Get to the top of the stairs as soon as they attack the city and there they are.

[KnightofPhoenix]

dragonflight288 wrote...

Again, the Qunari were the aggressors. They were defending the Arishok, and they only had a few hundred of survivors from the shipwrek at first. Taking casualties and numbers who became Tal-Vashoth, they likely didn't have the numbers to defend more than what they had.

It doesn't matter if they were the aggressors. Their objective was the keep and to defend it. By that time, they controlled Hightown and were the defenders. Hawke and Meredith were the aggressors.

The stairs are known for being highly defensible, and it doesn't require a large number to hold it. That's what narrow points are for, and let's not forget that scaling up thsoe stairs is very tiring. They would have gotten all the advantages they needed to buy a lot of time. Instead they didn't.

[KnightofPhoenix]

dragonflight288 wrote...

Get to the top of the stairs as soon as they attack the city and there they are.

They were there not defending the stairs we just saw Hawke casually walk up. Like idiots, they were defending the courtward that is spaceous enough to give the enemy the opportunity to bring more numbers to bear.

[dragonflight288]

Again....Meredith and her templars or Orsino and his fireballs of doom.

[EmperorSahlertz]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...
They did use all the defensible positions you just referenced....

No, they did not. The stairs were undefended.
A few Sarebaas could have held those stairs for a long time. We didn't see Qunari lance throwers take advantage of it either and keep raining volleys on Hawke, who was casually walking up thsoe stairs. 

In both Lowtown AND Hightown the Qunari are defending the stairs, and also using Saarebas in Hightown...