286 réponses à ce sujet

[Jeth Prime]

Sunnie22 wrote...

Actually, I have. I find it just as ridiculous now as I have in the past similar threads. Just because you think Males are bigger and stronger doesn't mean a demure female isn't strong enough or smart enough to accomplish the same things. Yes, muscle mass is one thing, but physical size =/= equal stronger.  I am rather thin IRL, but I can lay out a 275 man any day of the week, no problem.  Like I noted, this subject has been done before, and they all end up locked. 

No one said anything about smarts. And this isn't about laying people out. It about physicaly challenging tasks, like lifting beams, and taking on a Yahg. You're ignoring what he's trying to say. That's why so many of these threads get locked.

[Arppis]

CommanderJessica wrote...

Jeth Prime wrote...

You're saying the enhancements REPLACE the natural strength? I'm not sure about that, as the muscle mass is still there.

Also true.. Guess that because the cutscenes are the same, that's what my head came up with for the equal strength excuse. 
I'm not a feminist in anyway so I'm not really bothered if Male Shepard is stronger than Female Shepard. Prior to ME2, I would say without question that he was stronger than she.

Well don't worry, you don't strike as feminist anyway.

Just like we don't try to be chauvonistic by saying the fact that males do have more muscle mass and size than women do.

Modifié par Arppis, 16 août 2011 - 07:54 .

[Darkelefantos1]

1136342t54 wrote...

Jeth Prime wrote...
I don't remember many displays of strength, other than Shepard throwing Ashley are Kaiden(which looked weird to me. Not the woman throwing the man, but the man being thrown by the woman), or maybe Saren getting punched in the face(doesn't really aply).

So picking up a large piece of debree off of Sheps comrades on the Collector station, punching out two armored guards, taking down two armored turians, trading blows with a Yahg etc aren't displays of strength? lol JK but those are some examples.

The focus in his post was "I don't remember...", which implies there were others.

I agree with the OP, Male Shep looks stronger and should have physical advantages. I doubt Lazarus would make them equal, I would make very little sense. It's not that all women are weaker or anything, but FemShep doesn't look like she's got it in her.
You know, not trying to be sexist, but if MaleShep combats the yahg, he looks badass. If FemShep does, the Yahg looks like a douche in comparison.

[Jeth Prime]

1136342t54 wrote...

Jeth Prime wrote...
I meant, I don't remember too many in Mass Effect. There were several in Mass Effect 2. And the punchs were so much displays of strength, but skill.

Kind of shows how skill kind of trumps strenght though. I did say they were equal in skill level and almost equal in strenght.

Yeah, I agree with you, completely. STOP TRYING TO ARGUE WITH ME!!!! jk

[Brand New]

Sunnie22 wrote...

Brand New wrote...

Sunnie22 wrote...

Soccer FeverMan wrote...

Well i see your point, but i also see his point.

The guy is truly not trying to sexist he's just using concrete scientific fact that says Males of the human race are dipositioned to be stronger and physically superior than their Female counterparts. Honestly even with all the Lazarus project enhancements Shepard still retains natural strength, that he/she had before.

Meaning that there is a very good chance mShep would be stronger than fShep.

Juss my take on it.

I think this is just another one of those males are better than females troll posts that have been cropping up and getting locked for the last year +. I predict a lock soon.

It seems that your are making quite the ignorant statement. have you even read the thread?

Actually, I have. I find it just as ridiculous now as I have in the past similar threads. Just because you think Males are bigger and stronger doesn't mean a demure female isn't strong enough or smart enough to accomplish the same things. Yes, muscle mass is one thing, but physical size =/= equal stronger.  I am rather thin IRL, but I can lay out a 275 man any day of the week, no problem.  Like I noted, this subject has been done before, and they all end up locked. 

Clearly you cannot comprehend this thread then. Ok tough guy go lay so people out. This thread isn't about your fantasy fights so I don't understand why you would bring that up. The point is that physcially a male and female are rather different so this should be reflected upon in game. I never made any specific accusations such as male shepard can knock down a 300lb man and femshep can't. I clearly stated an obvious fact that considering sheploo is much larger then femshep it is clear to me that there would be some physcial supperiorirty there.

Using your statement as an example to make you seem even less intlegent, you said exactly what I meant I'm sure you won't brute for take out a 275 man. There will be some other tactics involved in this unless you are of similar size or strength. its is jusy not realistic.

[1136342t54_]

Darkelefantos1 wrote...
The focus in his post was "I don't remember...", which implies there were others.

I agree with the OP, Male Shep looks stronger and should have physical advantages. I doubt Lazarus would make them equal, I would make very little sense. It's not that all women are weaker or anything, but FemShep doesn't look like she's got it in her.
You know, not trying to be sexist, but if MaleShep combats the yahg, he looks badass. If FemShep does, the Yahg looks like a douche in comparison.

Just look at it my way. Shepard is enhanced in such a way that fighting a Yahg and head butting Krogan doesn't kill them instantly like it should any normal human.

[1136342t54_]

Brand New wrote...
Using your statement as an example to make you seem even less intlegent, you said exactly what I meant I'm sure you won't brute for take out a 275 man. There will be some other tactics involved in this unless you are of similar size or strength. its is jusy not realistic.

Actually its not impossible at all. Smaller males and females with training can take someone much larger than them down with a few good strikes or even one. (one reallly good hit may kill the person lol)

I'm not saying that poster knocked someone else out but its not impossible nor unrealistic.

[Jessihatt]

Arppis wrote...

CommanderJessica wrote...

Jeth Prime wrote...

You're saying the enhancements REPLACE the natural strength? I'm not sure about that, as the muscle mass is still there.

Also true.. Guess that because the cutscenes are the same, that's what my head came up with for the equal strength excuse. 
I'm not a feminist in anyway so I'm not really bothered if Male Shepard is stronger than Female Shepard. Prior to ME2, I would say without question that he was stronger than she.

Well don't worry, you don't strike as feminist anyway.

Just like we don't try to be chauvonistic by saying the fact that males do have more muscle mass and size than women do.

Haha, I know. I feel for you guys when you're innocently debating stuff and my gender decides to crack down on you. It annoys me a lot! More than it should, I think 

But as for the topic of the thread, it would be great for the different genders to have different approaches to physical scenes, but the bioware guys have loaaaads to do already and I think it's not that important as it doesn't really change gameplay 

[Jeth Prime]

1136342t54 wrote...

Brand New wrote...
Using your statement as an example to make you seem even less intlegent, you said exactly what I meant I'm sure you won't brute for take out a 275 man. There will be some other tactics involved in this unless you are of similar size or strength. its is jusy not realistic.

Actually its not impossible at all. Smaller males and females with training can take someone much larger than them down with a few good strikes or even one. (one reallly good hit may kill the person lol)

I'm not saying that poster knocked someone else out but its not impossible nor unrealistic.

Exactly. With tactics. lol That's what he's saying. Shepard, on the other hand, and up on the Yahg, head on. It some what of a test of strength.

[adneate]

Remember when Indiana Jones got into the refrigerator to survive a nuclear blast? Punching out the 1500lb Yahng is the Mass Effect equivalent of that. The T-1000 could do it but not any normal human being regardless of how ripped he or she might be.

Want to test the theory that it's silly? Go find a half-ton truck and punch it and measure how far back it rolls.

[Jeth Prime]

adneate wrote...

Remember when Indiana Jones got into the refrigerator to survive a nuclear blast? Punching out the 1500lb Yahng is the Mass Effect equivalent of that. The T-1000 could do it but not any normal human being regardless of how ripped he or she might be.

Want to test the theory that it's silly? Go find a half-ton truck and punch it and measure how far back it rolls.

Done.... How do you measure it, when the truck explodes?

[1136342t54_]

Jeth Prime wrote...
Exactly. With tactics. lol That's what he's saying. Shepard, on the other hand, and up on the Yahg, head on. It some what of a test of strength.

Not exactly I remember this eight grade girl who is like 5'3 pick up a dude by the neckwho was in highschool and about 5'10 and probably weighed almost 200Ibs. I don't know how the hell she did that but it kind of scared me lol.

Shepard taking on the Yahg either male shep or female shep was a bit retarded but use my reasoning. They are both very far from normal human.

[Cancer Puppet]

@Pockles

Femshep can't romance Tali, Miranda, Jack, or Ashley. So no, she can't do everything manshep can do.

[Jeth Prime]

1136342t54 wrote...

Jeth Prime wrote...
Exactly. With tactics. lol That's what he's saying. Shepard, on the other hand, and up on the Yahg, head on. It some what of a test of strength.

Not exactly I remember this eight grade girl who is like 5'3 pick up a dude by the neckwho was in highschool and about 5'10 and probably weighed almost 200Ibs. I don't know how the hell she did that but it kind of scared me lol.

Shepard taking on the Yahg either male shep or female shep was a bit retarded but use my reasoning. They are both very far from normal human.

Hmmm I'll admit. My 4 year old nephew is pretty strong. lol jk

[cactusberry]

In comparison to the Yahg, I don't think even Sheploo could equally balance it. I just say it's because of enhancements from both the Alliance and Cerberus.

[Reptillius]

Jeth Prime wrote...

Sunnie22 wrote...

Actually, I have. I find it just as ridiculous now as I have in the past similar threads. Just because you think Males are bigger and stronger doesn't mean a demure female isn't strong enough or smart enough to accomplish the same things. Yes, muscle mass is one thing, but physical size =/= equal stronger.  I am rather thin IRL, but I can lay out a 275 man any day of the week, no problem.  Like I noted, this subject has been done before, and they all end up locked. 

No one said anything about smarts. And this isn't about laying people out. It about physicaly challenging tasks, like lifting beams, and taking on a Yahg. You're ignoring what he's trying to say. That's why so many of these threads get locked.

Sunnie I made an argument somewhere towards the first page of almost the same thing and they ignored it.

And I can make it again.  A Trained killer who's job it is to restrain and lock up trained killers. There are days when it's all about brute force. Out muscling the other guy and bouncing his head off the concrete floor harder than he can do to you.  I know a few MP's who are like 5'10" which physicall makes them smaller than several of the people they lock up. Yet they are able to restrain these much larger gentleman.

What does this mean in the end. Exactly the same thing that you and I have said. Size is not everything. Looking bigger and stronger does not make it so.

[RKB28]

Brand New wrote...

I doubt the lLazerus project made either of them physcially superior. The goal of it was to bring them back to life not make them stronger. Like said there were very few modifications and nothing to really change either shepards.

The Lazarus project augmented Shepard(male or female). Before that, firing the Claymore or the Widow would have been impossible to Shepard, but now he/she can do it normally.


Plus the upgrades/armors  enhance Shepard´s skills.

[Jeth Prime]

Reptillius wrote...

Jeth Prime wrote...

Sunnie22 wrote...

Actually, I have. I find it just as ridiculous now as I have in the past similar threads. Just because you think Males are bigger and stronger doesn't mean a demure female isn't strong enough or smart enough to accomplish the same things. Yes, muscle mass is one thing, but physical size =/= equal stronger.  I am rather thin IRL, but I can lay out a 275 man any day of the week, no problem.  Like I noted, this subject has been done before, and they all end up locked. 

No one said anything about smarts. And this isn't about laying people out. It about physicaly challenging tasks, like lifting beams, and taking on a Yahg. You're ignoring what he's trying to say. That's why so many of these threads get locked.

Sunnie I made an argument somewhere towards the first page of almost the same thing and they ignored it.

And I can make it again.  A Trained killer who's job it is to restrain and lock up trained killers. There are days when it's all about brute force. Out muscling the other guy and bouncing his head off the concrete floor harder than he can do to you.  I know a few MP's who are like 5'10" which physicall makes them smaller than several of the people they lock up. Yet they are able to restrain these much larger gentleman.

What does this mean in the end. Exactly the same thing that you and I have said. Size is not everything. Looking bigger and stronger does not make it so.

No one's talking about those people. We're talking about a Male Shepard in comparison to a Female Shepard, both equaly trained killers....

[Sunnie]

TheDarkRats wrote...

In comparison to the Yahg, I don't think even Sheploo could equally balance it. I just say it's because of enhancements from both the Alliance and Cerberus.

The argument works both ways. 

Don't forget that neither male or female Shepard could use the Widow without the Cerberus "upgrades". That alone puts them on equal ground strength-wise, doesn't matter what gorillaloo's physical appearance looks like. 

It would be one thing to argue this within the game world, but it's being argued compared to reality.  Well, the reality is this; very little in the game is realistic. Arguing that males in the game are stronger than females is rather ridiculous, since they are shown to be just as strong as males, in all cases and situations. And making it a real world argument just makes it more obvious that it's just another male >female argument.  I'm not saying that more muscle mass in real life isn't stronger, but size does not have anything to do with muscle mass. Look on any average street in any average major city and the average 275 pound male couldn't lift any more than the average fit woman clocking in at 150-160 pounds can.  So, when people stop arguing reality within a game world that is about as far from reality as it gets, I'll stop facepalming and shut up.

[Reptillius]

Jeth Prime wrote...

Reptillius wrote...

Jeth Prime wrote...

Sunnie22 wrote...

Actually, I have. I find it just as ridiculous now as I have in the past similar threads. Just because you think Males are bigger and stronger doesn't mean a demure female isn't strong enough or smart enough to accomplish the same things. Yes, muscle mass is one thing, but physical size =/= equal stronger.  I am rather thin IRL, but I can lay out a 275 man any day of the week, no problem.  Like I noted, this subject has been done before, and they all end up locked. 

No one said anything about smarts. And this isn't about laying people out. It about physicaly challenging tasks, like lifting beams, and taking on a Yahg. You're ignoring what he's trying to say. That's why so many of these threads get locked.

Sunnie I made an argument somewhere towards the first page of almost the same thing and they ignored it.

And I can make it again.  A Trained killer who's job it is to restrain and lock up trained killers. There are days when it's all about brute force. Out muscling the other guy and bouncing his head off the concrete floor harder than he can do to you.  I know a few MP's who are like 5'10" which physicall makes them smaller than several of the people they lock up. Yet they are able to restrain these much larger gentleman.

What does this mean in the end. Exactly the same thing that you and I have said. Size is not everything. Looking bigger and stronger does not make it so.

No one's talking about those people. We're talking about a Male Shepard in comparison to a Female Shepard, both equaly trained killers....

Your argueing a smaller lighter frame vs. a bigger heavier one...  Male vs. female aside (even if part of the argument here revolves around females having smaller lighter frames)...  My point remains valid.

[Jeth Prime]

Reptillius wrote...

Your argueing a smaller lighter frame vs. a bigger heavier one...  Male vs. female aside (even if part of the argument here revolves around females having smaller lighter frames)...  My point remains valid.

I'm not arguing anything. The game is what it is. They're equal, or at least close to it.

However; logicaly, if both of them have the same training, and what not, the one with more muscle mass should be able to do more, with that training. Right or wrong?

[magicalzero]

Dragon XIX wrote...

His arms are twice as big, and he only has equal strength?

Before making comments like this you might want to achieve at least a rudimentary understanding of human physiology. Even at exactly equal physical strength a female would still look smaller because of her lack of testosterone. That is why females do not get buff or bulk up in the same way males do; it has nothing do to with physical weakness. When you look at athletic and fit individuals, bulk is a very poor indicator of their capabilities - especially when you compare men and women.

It's certainly true that males have a higher potential "max" level of physical strength, but unless the Shepards are olympic level athletes or compete in strongman tournaments, it's completely irrelevant. They're soldiers; they're not going to perform herculean training regimens in order to perfect a certain part of their musculature.

Modifié par magicalzero, 16 août 2011 - 08:42 .

[Arppis]

Sunnie22 wrote...

TheDarkRats wrote...

In comparison to the Yahg, I don't think even Sheploo could equally balance it. I just say it's because of enhancements from both the Alliance and Cerberus.

The argument works both ways. 

Don't forget that neither male or female Shepard could use the Widow without the Cerberus "upgrades". That alone puts them on equal ground strength-wise, doesn't matter what gorillaloo's physical appearance looks like. 

It would be one thing to argue this within the game world, but it's being argued compared to reality.  Well, the reality is this; very little in the game is realistic. Arguing that males in the game are stronger than females is rather ridiculous, since they are shown to be just as strong as males, in all cases and situations. And making it a real world argument just makes it more obvious that it's just another male >female argument.  I'm not saying that more muscle mass in real life isn't stronger, but size does not have anything to do with muscle mass. Look on any average street in any average major city and the average 275 pound male couldn't lift any more than the average fit woman clocking in at 150-160 pounds can.  So, when people stop arguing reality within a game world that is about as far from reality as it gets, I'll stop facepalming and shut up.

Why even argue about facts anyhows? It is how it is, males are generaly stronger than females.

And yes, games aren't realistic. So I do understand if they want to make female Shepard as strong as male Shepard is. But wouldn't it be more impressive if she would use her brain to replace the lack of size and muscle mass? I'd think it would be great if they would have done it like that and bit more realistic too.

[magicalzero]

Arcian wrote...

Wow, people really still think "musclemass = physical prowess"?

Men and women both have the same muscle capacity, it's just that women's muscles are much more tightly packed. Swollen muscles in men are primarily a sexual characteristic, and not a physical one. Also, men have a much easier time building muscles than women due to significantly larger amounts of testosterone, which incidentally happens to be the male sexual hormone.

Besides, in combat hysterical strength takes over, anyway.

Word. It's interesting to note that the people who like to trot out "facts" about human biology in discussions like this never seem to know anything about actual fitness.

Modifié par magicalzero, 16 août 2011 - 08:46 .