462 réponses à ce sujet

[Abispa]

Chylise wrote...

Abispa wrote...

And, of course, Bioware has set the precident for this many times in the past.

<_<

It was an extreme example that was supposed to be humorous. I guess I failed.

I apologize for taking your remark the wrong way. Sadly, versions of your example have been used by s/s critics for months now.

[rapscallioness]

DavieMcG said: "Just that you would decide at the begining whether you want to play as a bisexual character or a straight character or a homosexual one, just like you already decide whether to play as a white character or oriental or hispanic etc."

That's not bad....hmmm...not bad at all. Customizable sexual orientation right at the beginning.

Edit: and throw in a "none of the above"

Modifié par rapscallioness, 17 août 2011 - 12:56 .

[Davie McG]

ipgd wrote...

Davie McG wrote...

The race thing already is toggled, I think my use of the word toggle in my post was perhaps incorrect. What I mean to say is that you select your sexuality at the begining, just like you select your eye colour and skin colour and name and all that stuff.

I'm not insinuating people can choose their sexuality either as I also stated in my first post. Just that at the begining of the game you have the oppertunity to make a bisexual character or a straight one or a homosexual one, just like you decide which ethnicity or gender you wish to play as.

Setting the physical appearance of Shepard is not the same as setting an option to crystalize his or her sexual orientation and shut off any romance dialogue for same sex characters when playing a straight Shepard, nor is being able to choose Shepard's race equivalent to an option to shut off any romance dialogue for Jacob when playing a white Shepard.

Regardless, the functionality of it is not the inherent problem -- it is that its inclusion would be motivated solely by a desire to accommodate people who are prejudiced against homosexuality, which is unacceptable. An option to set Shepard's sexuality is such a functionally inconsequential change from the actual implementation of the same decisions in ME1 and 2 (i.e. you choose your Shepard's orientation by not sleeping with characters (s)he is not interested in) that it almost entirely boils down to a matter of intent, to spare people who are bothered by it the discomfort of even having to see same-sex romance dialogue on the wheel, and sending a message that legitimizes their concerns and implies that prejudice should be accommodated is not something Bioware wants to be doing.

Really, it is not that hard to understand how this is offensive and if you are really concerned with not offending people you should be able to see how this is not in any way a solution. The solution to prejudice is exposure, not concession and accommodation.

I must fail to agree when it comes to exposure being a solution to prejudice, but that's a whole other story.

I think if you were to be offended by the option that I described, I just don't see how you could be, if you want the option to romance both males and females then it would be easy to create a bisexual character. It would accommodate everyone, and to me it's the only one that does.

If you feel differently then that's fine, but that's just my opinion.

Edit: forgot a word, idiotic I know but it happens.

Modifié par Davie McG, 17 août 2011 - 12:55 .

[Abispa]

Professor Solus wrote...

I feel that same sex relationships AT THIS POINT in the game doesn't quite make sense. If it had been implemented from the beginning of the series than I could see that as working out fine. However, what sense would it make if you have had a Shepard that has all these meaningful heterosexual relationships, and then all of a sudden, he or she's just like,"No thanks, I'm actually gay". 0_o?

It'll be a option that YOU WON'T HAVE TO CHOOSE. You could be a bisexual "playa" if you want to, or you could be a character who has been waiting for a chance at the LI s/he has always wanted. Also, if your Shepard has had multiple heterosexual relationships in just two game, they probably weren't very meaningful. Still, I support your abllity to play your Shepard the way you want.

[CuseGirl]

AnAccountWithNoName wrote...
How would this be implanted in ME3?  I have heard some say that all of the party members should be Bi, however that means, if say i wanted to play a male shepard but not have romance, i would not only have to choose carefully when talking to females (which i had to do in the previous games), but also the males as well.

So? We're careful about all the choices we make in ME-1 and 2, so wuts changed?

[shepskisaac]

Davie McG wrote...

Just that you would decide at the begining whether you want to play as a bisexual character or a straight character or a homosexual one, just like you already decide whether to play as a white character or oriental or hispanic etc.

I don't get this at all. Why are you comparing the two? Are you suggesting defining skin color stops/or should stop people of a different skin color from hitting on you?

[Heather Cline]

I find threads like these to be annoying at best. The threads say "I'm not against s/s pairings" and so on and so forth but what they are really saying is "I hate homosexuals and I don't want it in my game" this gets old pretty fast.

My two cents.

[Rocket_Man77]

Jog0907 wrote...

cant we just choose if your character is gay or not (or bi) in the character creation menu and based on that it opens or locks romance paths with other characters, you know that way you avoid ending in a same-sex romance with garrus by accident because the romance path is locked from the start of the game if you choose to be straight.

Bioware should impliment this in all of there games. that way you can lock in your preferences. If you only want females hitting on your male shephard then you should be entitled to that. this would not be very hard for Bioware to do. Everybody still gets what they want.

[Ellyria]

Abispa wrote...

I apologize for taking your remark the wrong way. Sadly, versions of your example have been used by s/s critics for months now.

S'all right, humor doesn't always translate well in text.

I'll have to agree with you on the s/s critics using examples like that seriously. <_< Since, you know, it happens in BW's games ALL the time. 

[Asenza]

I don't mind if they add more same-sex romances in ME3... my only issue is that if you make EVERYONE Bi, like in DA2, it kind of lessens the incentive to play as a male or female character. For me, it also kind of cheapens the romance to me if a LI will act the same with a female Shepard as a male Shepard. Maybe not cheapens is the right word, but I feel like there should be, even just a few subtle differences in the relationship between M/M or F/F relationship.

It did annoy me that the only true, either-gender options in ME2 didn't actually count, didn't get you the achievement, kill you or refuse to enter into a romantic relationship.

The point that a previous person brought up, about Garrus not finding a female Shepard sexually attractive was a good one that could potentially apply to all the alien LI's... with the exception of Tali (because god knows she's basically human under there) and Asari. Personally, I think that is something that they should make more of with the other Alien love interests, that the basic, physical differences between the species are more of an obstacle than they would appear to be at first glance.

[Rocket_Man77]

Heather Cline wrote...

I find threads like these to be annoying at best. The threads say "I'm not against s/s pairings" and so on and so forth but what they are really saying is "I hate homosexuals and I don't want it in my game" this gets old pretty fast.

My two cents.

there is already a s/s forum. What do you think about that? so they must be against "heterosexuals."

Its obvious bioware should let you pick your sexual orientation at the beginning of the game. Its that simple.

this doesn't have to be a hateful topic

[Sundance31us]

Professor Solus wrote...

I feel that same sex relationships AT THIS POINT in the game doesn't quite make sense. If it had been implemented from the beginning of the series than I could see that as working out fine. However, what sense would it make if you have had a Shepard that has all these meaningful heterosexual relationships, and then all of a sudden, he or she's just like,"No thanks, I'm actually gay". 0_o?

You're making a broad assumption that everyone engages in a sexual/romantic relationship when playing; you can go thought the game and romance no one until ME3.

[Davie McG]

IsaacShep wrote...

Davie McG wrote...

Just that you would decide at the begining whether you want to play as a bisexual character or a straight character or a homosexual one, just like you already decide whether to play as a white character or oriental or hispanic etc.

I don't get this at all. Why are you comparing the two? Are you suggesting defining skin color stops/or should stop people of a different skin color from hitting on you?

Of course not. What I'm saying is Shepard is in his/her thirties, his/her sexuality by now is as much a part of him/her as any other aspect of himself/herself. Deciding that at the begining would accommodate everyone, whether they want a bisexual character or a straight one or a homosexual one.

[shepskisaac]

Rocket_Man77 wrote...

Its obvious bioware should let you pick your sexual orientation at the beginning of the game. Its that simple.

And if the next thing you see is someone demanding an option to turn off asian people from hitting on you right from the beginning? What argument will you use to not allow that person have his/her toggle?

Davie McG wrote...

Of course not. What I'm saying is
Shepard is in his/her thirties, his/her sexuality by now is as much a
part of him/her as any other aspect of himself/herself. Deciding that at
the begining would accommodate everyone, whether they want a bisexual
character or a straight one or a homosexual one.

Ok so we will define our sexuality at the beginning. The point of it? It's not like every living being in the Galaxy knows Shepard and what his sexual orientation is so there would be still confident people of both genders/different species hitting on him?

Modifié par IsaacShep, 17 août 2011 - 01:09 .

[rapscallioness]

IsaacShep wrote...

Davie McG wrote...

Just that you would decide at the begining whether you want to play as a bisexual character or a straight character or a homosexual one, just like you already decide whether to play as a white character or oriental or hispanic etc.

I don't get this at all. Why are you comparing the two? Are you suggesting defining skin color stops/or should stop people of a different skin color from hitting on you?

Oh, dear. You make a good point. I didn't think of it like that. I just saw it as defining your character even more, if you chose to. But then that would take away from my original theory that ninjamancing was more realistic. Gay men get hit on by str8 females all the time...even if they know they're gay. And I've been hit on by lots of other women. Some more persistent than others. It's something you deal with, just like (for me) a guy hits on you that you're not attracted to, or interested in. You navigate it.

Ah well, forget it. Ninjamancing...yes!

[Rocket_Man77]

IsaacShep wrote...

Rocket_Man77 wrote...

Its obvious bioware should let you pick your sexual orientation at the beginning of the game. Its that simple.

And if the next thing you see is someone demanding an option to turn off asian people from hitting on you right from the beginning? What argument will you use to not allow that person have his/her toggle?

that would be called racism, they can't do that.

[AnAccountWithNoName]

Heather Cline wrote...

I find threads like these to be annoying at best. The threads say "I'm not against s/s pairings" and so on and so forth but what they are really saying is "I hate homosexuals and I don't want it in my game" this gets old pretty fast.

My two cents.

Yes because you really do know the person behind the screen.  Please stop putting words in my mouth, you really don't know anything about me.

I really dislike people who scream "HOMOPHOBE" without any evidence at any oppurtunity they get in topics dealing with same-sex romance.

Modifié par AnAccountWithNoName, 17 août 2011 - 01:21 .

[Rocket_Man77]

AnAccountWithNoName wrote...

Heather Cline wrote...

I find threads like these to be annoying at best. The threads say "I'm not against s/s pairings" and so on and so forth but what they are really saying is "I hate homosexuals and I don't want it in my game" this gets old pretty fast.

My two cents.

Yes because you really do know the person behind the screen.  Please stop putting words in my mouth, you really don't know anything about me.

I really dislike people who scream "HOMOPHOBE" without any evidence at any oppurtiny they get in topics dealing with same-sex marriage.

I totally agree. The high school I went to, had at least 15 homosexuals in my graduating class. While I don't believe in homosexual activities, I do not, in any way, hate homosexuals.

Modifié par Rocket_Man77, 17 août 2011 - 01:13 .

[shepskisaac]

Rocket_Man77 wrote...

that would be called racism, they can't do that.

Yes. They shouldn't be allowed to "turn off" asian people because it shouldn't be allowed in real life. Is "turning off" gay people in real life allowed, acceptable?

[Quething]

Rocket_Man77 wrote...

there is already a s/s forum. What do you think about that? so they must be against "heterosexuals."

Its obvious bioware should let you pick your sexual orientation at the beginning of the game. Its that simple.

this doesn't have to be a hateful topic

BioWare does let you pick your sexual orientation at the beginning of the game.

BioWare then offers you opportunities to put that sexual orientation into practice. By tossing love interests at you and letting you pursue them, if appropriate.

You know. Like how they let you choose your moral outlook (paragon/renegade) at the beginning of the game, then let you put that into practice by tossing decisions at you and letting you choose which dialog option and actions you'll pursue.

We call this "roleplaying." It's sort of a core concept to the series. You get to choose who your Shepard is, then act that out through in-game choices. BioWare is simply finally evening the scale, and letting queer male Shepards act out their sexuality through active means (pursuing male suitors) rather than through passive means (turning down female suitors).

AnAccountWithNoName wrote...

Yes because you really do know the person behind the screen. Please stop putting words in my mouth, you really don't know anything about me.

I really dislike people who scream "HOMOPHOBE" without any evidence at any oppurtunity they get in topics dealing with same-sex marriage.

I was under the impression this was about s/s romances in Mass Effect, not s/s marriage? There's no marriage of any kind in Mass Effect, that I'm aware of. Hmn.

Modifié par Quething, 17 août 2011 - 01:17 .

[CuseGirl]

I still dont understand why people get so upset that a character could be gay in SOMEONE elses GAME! If some1 right now is having a gay ME-2/3 LI on their own console, I could not care less.....

"it cheapens the story if everyone is bi"....as if my story or some other guys story is going to leech onto your story thru the PSN/Xbox network

Modifié par CuseGirl, 17 août 2011 - 01:18 .

[SpEcIaLRyAn]

Just play the game and get over it. It's not that hard to just say NO. Having an option to turn off homosexual relationships is just asinine. What if you have a character in the game and them being gay is part of their character. So you just turn them off when ever you don't want them hitting on you. Might as well censor our words or tell us what to think.........oh wait...

[Chun Hei]

Rocket_Man77 wrote...

there is already a s/s forum. What do you think about that? so they must be against "heterosexuals."

Its obvious bioware should let you pick your sexual orientation at the beginning of the game. Its that simple.

this doesn't have to be a hateful topic

I am a regular in the s/s forum and I am heterosexual. I always choose the male LIs no matter what gender my hero is. And quite a few male players have admitted to playing lesbian characters.

I rarely start my characters off as straight or gay during my first play through and I react to whatever situations arises. That applies to moral decisions and violent decisions and romantic ones. When I buy a "mature" game I pretty much said I can make these decisions without training wheels. The game designers do not have to treat me like an idiot by giving me toggles to make different choices go away.

On second and later play throughs my decisions are not as "natural" since I know what is going on when my character shoud not and I begin to metagame so by then no toggle is needed either.

[Rocket_Man77]

IsaacShep wrote...

Rocket_Man77 wrote...

that would be called racism, they can't do that.

Yes. They shouldn't be allowed to "turn off" asian people because it shouldn't be allowed in real life. Is "turning off" gay people in real life allowed, acceptable?

in real life, you can pick and choose whoever you please. If you are racist, or gay, it is your life. all i can say is: if you are racist, and hate gays, then you are ignorant. you should except everybody, even though you may not agree with there lifestyle.

[Davie McG]

IsaacShep wrote...

Rocket_Man77 wrote...

Its obvious bioware should let you pick your sexual orientation at the beginning of the game. Its that simple.

And if the next thing you see is someone demanding an option to turn off asian people from hitting on you right from the beginning? What argument will you use to not allow that person have his/her toggle?

Davie McG wrote...

Of course not. What I'm saying is
Shepard is in his/her thirties, his/her sexuality by now is as much a
part of him/her as any other aspect of himself/herself. Deciding that at
the begining would accommodate everyone, whether they want a bisexual
character or a straight one or a homosexual one.

Ok so we will define our sexuality at the beginning. The point of it? It's not like every living being in the Galaxy knows Shepard and what his sexual orientation is so there would be still confident people of both genders/different species hitting on him?

I'm just saying it's an option that accommodates everyone and would result in a game world that the player would be happiest in. I'm not saying that's realistic but it gives everybody all options. If you want to be with LI's of both genders you can go ahead and be bisexual, have both sexes hitting on you, if you don't like it then that's fine too, chose a straight character or a homosexual one. 

If you don't like my idea then that's O.K., that's just my opinion on it.