2285 réponses à ce sujet

[AlphaJarmel]

KBomb wrote...

AlphaJarmel wrote...

Just noticed but Redshep's eyebrows are black, shouldn't they be some form of red?

My hair is a natural strawberry blond, more strawberry than blond. I have darker eyebrows and eyelashes. They look almost brown. It would make sense the deeper the red, the darker the eyebrow. However, every pale blond that I have encountered had blond brows and lashes. I am sure there are the ones who have darker shades, like my own and I just haven’t seen any. Most women do darken their brows and lashes. So it wouldn’t be unusual to see a blond or redhead with them.

Thanks for this answer.

[KBomb]

charmingcharlie wrote...


It doesn't matter what the blonde looks like.  The whole argument some are using here is that in the first vote we voted for the look of Shepard and this poll is for us to decide the hair colour.  Well that is a load of bull then because red haired Shepard is NOT the femshep 5 is she.

Bioware intentionally altered red femshep to give her a UNIQUE look and did nothing to improve any of the others.  Now that doesn't sound like a "fair" poll to me.  That sounds like a hell of a biased poll.  Yes if all four femsheps looked exactly the same except for hair colour then there is an argument that this vote was just for the hair colour.  That isn't the case though is it ?

Isn’t it? For argument’s sake, let’s just say the reason everyone voted for number five in the first poll was because of her hairstyle and not the overall look of her face and hair color. Let’s say a majority of those voters wished she could have had red or black hair instead. Another poll comes out with the same hairstyle (remember, we are talking style, not facial features) and each hairstyle has a different color. Those people who liked the hairstyle but wished it were another color jumps on the chance to change it and does so accordingly with voting. If this is the case, no matter what facial feature are presented, the votes would be allotted to the red or black haired Shepard.
 
Now, say the blond in the first poll won because everyone loved her look. They loved not only her hair, but her face, her blue eyes, her beauty mark etc. A second poll is made using the same blond Shepard, along with other Shepard with the same hairstyle. Those same people would not be swayed by freckles or green eyes. They would vote for the person they wanted regardless. There is logic there, but some people are trying very hard not to find it.

[slimgrin]

charmingcharlie wrote...

 The argument here is that the first poll decided the look for femshep and femshep 5 WON. 

No, you don't understand. See, I have a crystal ball, and I know the exact same people voted twice, and they changed their minds, and they wanted red all along. It's all in my crystal ball. :happy:

Modifié par slimgrin, 19 août 2011 - 08:12 .

[1136342t54_]

charmingcharlie wrote...

No I am not putting too much thought into this.  The argument here is that the first poll decided the look for femshep and femshep 5 WON.  Now this poll is for hair colour only yet red haired femshep has received extra details and changes that the others did not.  That is a bias right there and it skews the result.  It is wrong to say this is "just about hair colour" it isn't, this is about there being an inherent and intentional bias in the poll in red haired femsheps favour.

Red haired femshep has been given a UNIQUE look in this poll that the others have not, that is just one of the reasons why this second poll is inherently unfair.

Yes you are and we have went over this before many times.This unique look is basically the same as every other Fem shep except for the Freckles and green eyes. Its not bias at all unless bioware specifically did it so a certain shep would win. If they really wanted that they would have done it with the first poll which they didn't. Like I said before they likely just threw in those traits because its akin to red heads simple as that. Anyone who likely votes for that shep would like red heads not because of the green eyes or the freckles.  

[charmingcharlie]

Sylvianus wrote...
They LOOK the same even with one or two small different details.

If something has different details it cannot be said "they look the same" they do not look the same they have different details.  I really fail to understand how you cannot comprehend that extra details were added to red haired femshep which immediately means they do NOT look the same.

Sylvianus wrote...The same preset. When you compare them, do you see it's different people, different femshep ? Not at all. The freckles, before people told me, I didn"t even see them.

It is NOT the same present, the preset we voted for was femshep 5 a blue eyed, pale faced girl with a mole.  The other three in the second poll are the preset but the red haired one IS NOT.

Sylvianus wrote...Now, the success of redhead doesn't justify why platinum hair is behind Black femshep and Brunette femshep too. So I don't see why you scream against ginger shepard.

I am indicating that there is an inherent bias in this poll.  Your statement that "we voted the preset now we vote for the colour of the hair" is wrong.  They altered the look of red haired femshep but not the others that introduced a bias to the poll, you just refuse to see it.

[1136342t54_]

KBomb wrote...

Isn’t it? For argument’s sake, let’s just say the reason everyone voted for number five in the first poll was because of her hairstyle and not the overall look of her face and hair color. Let’s say a majority of those voters wished she could have had red or black hair instead. Another poll comes out with the same hairstyle (remember, we are talking style, not facial features) and each hairstyle has a different color. Those people who liked the hairstyle but wished it were another color jumps on the chance to change it and does so accordingly with voting. If this is the case, no matter what facial feature are presented, the votes would be allotted to the red or black haired Shepard.
 
Now, say the blond in the first poll won because everyone loved her look. They loved not only her hair, but her face, her blue eyes, her beauty mark etc. A second poll is made using the same blond Shepard, along with other Shepard with the same hairstyle. Those same people would not be swayed by freckles or green eyes. They would vote for the person they wanted regardless. There is logic there, but some people are trying very hard not to find it.

You are forgetting how epic freckles and green eyes seem to be. 

[1136342t54_]

charmingcharlie wrote...

Sylvianus wrote...
They LOOK the same even with one or two small different details.

If something has different details it cannot be said "they look the same" they do not look the same they have different details.  I really fail to understand how you cannot comprehend that extra details were added to red haired femshep which immediately means they do NOT look the same.

Sylvianus wrote...The same preset. When you compare them, do you see it's different people, different femshep ? Not at all. The freckles, before people told me, I didn"t even see them.

It is NOT the same present, the preset we voted for was femshep 5 a blue eyed, pale faced girl with a mole.  The other three in the second poll are the preset but the red haired one IS NOT.

Sylvianus wrote...Now, the success of redhead doesn't justify why platinum hair is behind Black femshep and Brunette femshep too. So I don't see why you scream against ginger shepard.

I am indicating that there is an inherent bias in this poll.  Your statement that "we voted the preset now we vote for the colour of the hair" is wrong.  They altered the look of red haired femshep but not the others that introduced a bias to the poll, you just refuse to see it.

You would have a good argument if the red head fem shep actually had some differences like a smaller jaw line, the nose was different the eye shape was a bit different the others etc.

[Sylvianus]

slimgrin wrote...

charmingcharlie wrote...

 The argument here is that the first poll decided the look for femshep and femshep 5 WON. 

No, you don't understand. See, I have a crystal ball, and I know the exact same people voted twice, and they changed their minds, and they wanted red all along. It's all in my crystal ball. :happy:

They didn"t change their mind.
Preset 5 with her hairstyle is still here, now they can choose their preference.

You make me laugh to think, you all voted for femshep because she was blonde. Try not to misrepresent the thoughts of others by yours so passionate.

And in a poll, we don't need to have exactly the same person. We need a majority.

Bioware don't  need Henry, Peter, and Christian, without to forget Julie and Margot who voted the first time, and must have voted the second time.

Bioware needs of thousands of votes, a majority again that may confirm a preference, a trend about haircolor.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 19 août 2011 - 08:20 .

[charmingcharlie]

1136342t54 wrote...
Yes you are and we have went over this before many times.This unique look is basically the same as every other Fem shep except for the Freckles and green eyes. Its not bias at all unless bioware specifically did it so a certain shep would win. If they really wanted that they would have done it with the first poll which they didn't. Like I said before they likely just threw in those traits because its akin to red heads simple as that. Anyone who likely votes for that shep would like red heads not because of the green eyes or the freckles. 

No you just refuse to acknowledge the bias that is what is happening here.  Look it is pretty simple if you are going to say the second poll is just about hair colour then all four femsheps should look EXACTLY the same but with different coloured hair.  They didn't do that though, red haired femshep has been altered to give her a unique look which may or may not help her.  But it is still bias in the poll which is supposed to be "just" about hair colour according to you guys.

You are just refusing to accept that pure and simple.

1136342t54 wrote... You would have a good argument if the red head fem shep actually had some differences like a smaller jaw line, the nose was different the eye shape was a bit different the others etc.

I have a good argument and you know it because eye colour and facial decorations are a pretty big change if you ask me.  I am actually quite partial to green eyes and love them on a character, freckles can be quite cute on a character as well.  So yes those details are enough to skew the results you just refuse to accept that.

Modifié par charmingcharlie, 19 août 2011 - 08:21 .

[Hotaru29]

page 64 already, i have the feeling this is going to hit 100 even faster than the original poll.

Voted brunette, because the color looked awesome to me, am fine with redhead though. Like every color better than blonde (and before anyone's going to kill me, that is based on personal preference =P never been a fan of blondes, be they male or female)

[Rogue Unit]

If they did this re-vote purely based off comments like "I like X but with Y hair color" are they going to do another vote for the people who made comments like "They all look too young"?

Modifié par Rogue Unit, 19 août 2011 - 08:22 .

[1136342t54_]

charmingcharlie wrote...
No you just refuse to acknowledge the bias that is what is happening here.  Look it is pretty simple if you are going to say the second poll is just about hair colour then all four femsheps should look EXACTLY the same but with different coloured hair.  They didn't do that though, red haired femshep has been altered to give her a unique look which may or may not help her.  But it is still bias in the poll which is supposed to be "just" about hair colour according to you guys.

You are just refusing to accept that pure and simple.

No I'm not. I am trying to tell you a pretty simple answer to this. What you are talking about is statistical bias on biowares part which is inaccurate. Bioware would actually have to prefer a specific fem shep over the others. You literally have no proof of that. The simple fact bioware made statements on why they did this second poll leads me to believe that the artist probably threw those features onto the red head because its akin to red heads. Its a very simple answer to a situation that is not complicated.

Now answer me this so I'm sure you know what bias is. Do you really believe that bioware actually preferred the red head shep over the others?

[GarrusV4karian]

Guess the winner will be the ginger. Sounds good to me.

[Sylvianus]

Rogue Unit wrote...

If they did this re-vote purely based off comments like "I like X but with Y hair color" are they going to do another vote for the people who made comments like "They all look too young"?

It's Bioware, which sets rules and limits. If they feel that it deserves consideration, they will, otherwise deal with it.
But, well, If you show me 1500 comments about Femshep too young on facebook, I promise you to tweet Casey. Good luck. :innocent:

[1136342t54_]

charmingcharlie wrote...


I have a good argument and you know it because eye colour and facial decorations are a pretty big change if you ask me.  I am actually quite partial to green eyes and love them on a character, freckles can be quite cute on a character as well.  So yes those details are enough to skew the results you just refuse to accept that.

You know what I would likely even accept some of your argument but you are just throwing around the word bias claiming that bioware liked the red head shep over the others. Now I would be more inclined to listen to you if you said it was unintentional bias since I doubt bioware would do this on purpose.

[charmingcharlie]

1136342t54 wrote...
Now answer me this so I'm sure you know what bias is. Do you really believe that bioware actually preferred the red head shep over the others?

I don't know what Bioware's preferences are.  I do know that saying "we voted for preset Fem in the first poll and now it is just hair colour" is wrong.  That is certainly what has not happened, they clearly put extra work into red haired femshep to give her a unique look but copy and pasted the other femsheps.

I can imagine what their motives were or why they did that, but whether the bias is unintentional or not the bias is still there.

[SalsaDMA]

Fata Morgana wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

It is when people attribute the hair colour to it, which have been done in the past and as such fuels the excuse to resent it.

When it's the blonde that get picked out between a blonde and a brunette, both whites, and racial slurs are hurled in between, then it seems like a pretty clear cut case, I'd say.

Uuuuuh.  Bimbo isn't a racial term? And, and.. if you like brunette over blonde, there's no race involved??

You know what, I'm just going to back away slowly.

I'm not sure what you are implying. I don't want to Godwin the thread, but a certain individual in europes past made claims that people of a certain skin AND hair colour were 'superior' to others. This have caused misguided people to agitate both for and against this postulate causing no ends of trouble. Basicly we're at a point where you have racists being racist towards new previously uninvolved people because of past racistic claims that contribute to a very sorry excuse for a circle of selffeeding racism.

There are certain parts of the city you just don't want to walk at night if you have looks that could be asumed to be "aryan" looking, while walking there as brownhaired, redheaded or blackhaired would give less issues.

[1136342t54_]

charmingcharlie wrote...
I don't know what Bioware's preferences are.  I do know that saying "we voted for preset Fem in the first poll and now it is just hair colour" is wrong.  That is certainly what has not happened, they clearly put extra work into red haired femshep to give her a unique look but copy and pasted the other femsheps.

I can imagine what their motives were or why they did that, but whether the bias is unintentional or not the bias is still there.

By claiming that bioware was simply biased pure and simple you are assuming that they wanted red head shep to win period. Just say that so your argument can be clearer to me and I can just simply disagree.

[slimgrin]

They just caved in. They've done it before, that's what happened. You can't please everyone, yet they continually try to do just that.

Modifié par slimgrin, 19 août 2011 - 08:31 .

[Fata Morgana]

Fair vote: When Blonde Shep wins
Unfair vote: When Blonde Shep loses

Why can't you guys get it already? It's so obvious!

[Rogue Unit]

Sylvianus wrote...

Rogue Unit wrote...

If they did this re-vote purely based off comments like "I like X but with Y hair color" are they going to do another vote for the people who made comments like "They all look too young"?

It's Bioware, which sets rules and limits. If they feel that it deserves consideration, they will, otherwise deal with it.
But, well, If you show me 1500 comments about Femshep too young on facebook, I promise you to tweet Casey. Good luck. :innocent:

Stop taking you seriously at "deal with it", but yes, there were alot of comments about her looking too young. Were there 1500? Don't know, didn't count, don't care enough to count.

I personally don't care which one wins anymore. I'm just glad I'll have a decent-looking FemShep to use now. (I use Sheploo simply because of the level of detail he has compared to custom Sheps.)

[charmingcharlie]

1136342t54 wrote...
By claiming that bioware was simply biased pure and simple you are assuming that they wanted red head shep to win period. Just say that so your argument can be clearer to me and I can just simply disagree.

You do know that people can be "unintentionally" biased towards a thing right ?  The bias is right there in your face.   They did extra work on red haired femshep, they gave her a unique look that they did not give the others.  Now from where I come from I would say that constitutes a "bias" towards a certain option wouldn't you ? 

I seriously cannot think how much simpler I can explain this.  There are 4 femsheps, 3 look EXACTLY the same but for the hair colour and 1 got a make over with different coloured eyes and facial details.  Now seriously are you telling me you cannot see how that is a "bias" in favour of one option over another ?

Modifié par charmingcharlie, 19 août 2011 - 08:34 .

[SalsaDMA]

Fata Morgana wrote...

Fair vote: When Blonde Shep wins
Unfair vote: When Blonde Shep loses

Why can't you guys get it already? It's so obvious!

What about:

Fair vote: when they keep tweaking and making new votes untill something I LIKE wins.
Unfair vote: When a choice I don't like wins despite me being vocal about it.

That basicly seems to have been what we can witness from looking at how bioware have handled this and past decisions.

[Fata Morgana]

charmingcharlie wrote...
there are 4 femsheps, 3 look EXACTLY the same but for the hair colour and 1 got a make over with different coloured eyes and facial details visual details that no one voting can actually see 

There, I fixed it.

[Fata Morgana]

SalsaDMA wrote...

Fata Morgana wrote...

Fair vote: When Blonde Shep wins
Unfair vote: When Blonde Shep loses

Why can't you guys get it already? It's so obvious!

What about:

Fair vote: when they keep tweaking and making new votes untill something I LIKE wins.
Unfair vote: When a choice I don't like wins despite me being vocal about it.

Nah, that's not how it works, because if it did then pixie-cut Shep fans (like me) would be in here demanding a second vote for pixie-cut. And we're not.

No, the only unfair votes are those where Blonde Shep doesn't win, it's pretty clear now.