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FEM SHEP VOTING ROUND 2


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#2176
Balek-Vriege

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Arkitekt wrote...

Balek, I'm really impressed by your analysis that sounds very much true. The results are very compelling indeed. What it shows too is that the first poll was also "unfair", since there were 4 black haired sheps against only one blonde shep, which also happened to have the favorite hair style. That unique coupling was what made that choice the steamrolling winner that it was in the first place.

Still, quite a good show there man. Very good indeed.



You know, a couple people have mentioned that, like Fata and I discarded the argument by how simple the vote was.  In a way the argument is right.  I never even thought of it while typing the % that voted for a black haired Shepard. It was just an interesting factoid I thought deserved to be in the notes.  If it were a truly fair first poll, at least with hair, there should have been a black, red and blonde choice for each hair type/face.

Edit:  Even worse if Dirty Blonde was in there since to be fair you would need 6 hair colours per Femshep choice to be fair.
/Edit

If poll 1 was the only one that existed, Bioware could have used the excuse or arguement with poll 1 that it was "artistic license," market tested Sheps or something along those lines which made them do that.
 
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Modifié par Balek-Vriege, 24 août 2011 - 02:08 .


#2177
RynJ

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@Balek-Vriege- Wow.

All of the whiners who are STILL whining (you know who you are) I just want to tell you right here and now.

DEAL WITH IT

I mean seriously, you guys are making me glad your choice didn't win because you're so annoying. Who goes on and on about the "integrity" of a Facebook poll? Why do you feel so entitled that Bioware has to tell you everything they do in their marketing campaign and make sure it's "fair" in your eyes?

They are simply trying to get the FemShep that most fans want, and guess what? They found it whether you like it or not or whether you think it's fair or not. I really don't think Bioware cares if you personally find the polls fair, they're just polls. For a haircolor. Of a videogame character. This is not the Presidential election.

The dedication of some people to naming any reason to call this poll unfair or calling anyone who disagrees with them trolls? I find it a little disturbing I have to say!

Modifié par RynJ, 24 août 2011 - 04:42 .


#2178
Radwar

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I must admit, this thread is pretty hilarious.

#2179
RynJ

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Radwar wrote...

I must admit, this thread is pretty hilarious.


NOOOO!!! IZ SERYUSS BIZNISS!!!!!!

#2180
LPPrince

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Balek-Vriege wrote...

*snipped*


Nice work!

#2181
Omega Torsk

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Is this entire thread going to have a point, soon? Cause all I'm seeing is a battle of extreme opinions, trivial matters getting blown amazingly out of proportion, stubborn disagreements, a few kernels of common sense that are rapidly drowned out by insanity...

You know, I can honestly say that I feel this will be the last time Bioware ever allows its fans a vote in order to pick something related to their franchise. Ever. I mean, look at what has happened on their own forums as a result!

Ultimately (and this is my opinion) Femshep belongs to Bioware. They (not you) decided to have the fans vote on a general appearance for Femshep. Then, they (once again, not you) decided on a second vote concerning hair color based (mostly) on the winning choice. And, they (opposite yourself) decided to give one of those choices freckles and green eyes and it happens to be the one that's winning. Why they did it, I don't know. Maybe the entire creative team decided on that appearance because it looked the best to them, and you know what? It's totally their choice to make (they own the freaking character!) You know what Bioware could just do? They could just axe the Femshep trailer and the box art altogether and give us the default we've had for the past two games. I don't think they're going to do that, though... you have to admire them. In regards to what they're up against, they're one of the most patient and generous gaming companies out there!

And if I just spent 10 minutes typing something that's basically been said over 100 times in this thread and gotten shot down by grousing almost every single time... :pinched:

Modifié par Omega Torsk, 24 août 2011 - 07:57 .


#2182
AlphaJarmel

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Are the same people still complaining about this? Do people have anything better to do with their time than complain about this? It's done. Move on.

#2183
Evilatem

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Why wasn't the default femshep an option in the first poll?
Why did we even need the first poll?
Bioware, just forget this nonsense and just use the default femshep from the first 2 games already.


Bioware: You can come out of the kitchen now femshep
Femshep: Really?
Bioware: Yup, now you can start laundry or vacuuming, your choice.
Femshep: uh.......Thanks...i guess.......*sigh

#2184
Balek-Vriege

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RynJ wrote...

@Balek-Vriege- Wow.

All of the whiners who are STILL whining (you know who you are) I just want to tell you right here and now.

DEAL WITH IT

I mean seriously, you guys are making me glad your choice didn't win because you're so annoying. Who goes on and on about the "integrity" of a Facebook poll? Why do you feel so entitled that Bioware has to tell you everything they do in their marketing campaign and make sure it's "fair" in your eyes?

They are simply trying to get the FemShep that most fans want, and guess what? They found it whether you like it or not or whether you think it's fair or not. I really don't think Bioware cares if you personally find the polls fair, they're just polls. For a haircolor. Of a videogame character. This is not the Presidential election.

The dedication of some people to naming any reason to call this poll unfair or calling anyone who disagrees with them trolls? I find it a little disturbing I have to say!


You have to admit though that a lot of the complaints were originally resonable and simple.  That this might not be entirely fair to people who voted for an option in Poll 1 and won.  They weren't attacking Red Hair Shep directly, they weren't making personal attacks on others, they just had a fair complaint.

That was met with a lot of condescending replies/personal attacks (hinting the people are losers) which made the argument that they had no point, had no basis to complain about the process, were being whiners/children because they were doing so and should just "Deal with it," because the "Deal with it" sigs that Blondes Shep people made in the face of major stereotyping hurt their feelings originally.

Those type of replies drive people to further explain their point or attack in kind.  If you keep ignoring valid examples to prove a point is at least valid, those examples will get more complex and detailed until they break down or are further proved.  Or they turn into a series of personal attacks since both people involve end of being fed up with what the other is saying.  So in part the extreme passion on one side is fueled by an extreme resistance to a fairly basic point.  The same way if somone in a serious discussion kept arguing it's possible to a negative numbers, but someone denies all the proof handed to them regardless.  Therefore in a way, sopme people calling others whiners are truly the immature ones in this and are partly to blame for how extreme this thread is.  Instead of making the point against their claims, they attack those people instead.

With my post, I didn't know what the outcome of those % would be (I only knew the base statistics of the real polls and put em into the post at the beginning).  It was a real possibility that my assumptions wouldn't add up to something even close to poll 2.  However, they did and were within 1%-3% margins.  Not only that, it showed that it's possible, without even taking in to account bad press for blondes etc. (and other more complicated unprovable assumptions), that the people who wanted another hair colour who voted for Femshep 5 could have actually been a minority in that first vote.  I didn't expect that and that calls into question the fact that Bioware could have overriden the will of 50%+ of the Blonde Shep vote with this new poll.

It also shows, which was fairly pointed out, that the first poll had problems with it as well possibly.  It was designed poorly if it were a poll to choose the Femshep the vast majority wanted, rather than one with most votes wins.

Now you're right.  In the grand scheme of things this vote is nothing.  There's nothing forcing you even to post how everyone is whiners etc except your passion for the issue no matter if you say otherwise.  If anything though, it's good mental exercise at the very least.
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Modifié par Balek-Vriege, 24 août 2011 - 02:13 .


#2185
Annie_Dear

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Am I the only one who doesn't care what the default Femshep looks like? I mean, of course I'm happy that she's going to be used in marketing and all that, but some people are taking this way too seriously.

#2186
Fata Morgana

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Annie_Dear wrote...

Am I the only one who doesn't care what the default Femshep looks like? I mean, of course I'm happy that she's going to be used in marketing and all that, but some people are taking this way too seriously.


No, you're not the only one. I think actually a majority probably feels this way.

#2187
gamer_girl

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Omega Torsk wrote...

Is this entire thread going to have a point, soon? Cause all I'm seeing is a battle of extreme opinions, trivial matters getting blown amazingly out of proportion, stubborn disagreements, a few kernels of common sense that are rapidly drowned out by insanity...

You know, I can honestly say that I feel this will be the last time Bioware ever allows its fans a vote in order to pick something related to their franchise. Ever. I mean, look at what has happened on their own forums as a result!

Ultimately (and this is my opinion) Femshep belongs to Bioware. They (not you) decided to have the fans vote on a general appearance for Femshep. Then, they (once again, not you) decided on a second vote concerning hair color based (mostly) on the winning choice. And, they (opposite yourself) decided to give one of those choices freckles and green eyes and it happens to be the one that's winning. Why they did it, I don't know. Maybe the entire creative team decided on that appearance because it looked the best to them, and you know what? It's totally their choice to make (they own the freaking character!) You know what Bioware could just do? They could just axe the Femshep trailer and the box art altogether and give us the default we've had for the past two games. I don't think they're going to do that, though... you have to admire them. In regards to what they're up against, they're one of the most patient and generous gaming companies out there!

And if I just spent 10 minutes typing something that's basically been said over 100 times in this thread and gotten shot down by grousing almost every single time... :pinched:


+1000

Well said. ^_^

Fata Morgana wrote...

Annie_Dear wrote...

Am
I the only one who doesn't care what the default Femshep looks like? I
mean, of course I'm happy that she's going to be used in marketing and
all that, but some people are taking this way too seriously.


No, you're not the only one. I think actually a majority probably feels this way.


Definitely not the only one. Fata Morgana and I are two of them. Sure we both had ones that we would have preferred, but we aren't going to be all butt hurt over a silly facebook poll. BW made their choices and I'm not gonna fault them for that. Clearly they made a good choice considering red head Shep is a huge winner.

Modifié par gamer_girl, 24 août 2011 - 05:28 .


#2188
Nozybidaj

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gamer_girl wrote...
Definitely not the only one. Fata Morgana and I are two of them.


You two have spent a lot of time posting about something you don't care about. /shrug


Clearly they made a good choice considering red head Shep is a huge winner.


Yeah, she's only about 12K votes behind blondeShep so far.  Quite a winner.....

#2189
Fata Morgana

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Nozybidaj wrote...

gamer_girl wrote...
Definitely not the only one. Fata Morgana and I are two of them.


You two have spent a lot of time posting about something you don't care about. /shrug


I don't care how FemShep looks.

I do care about people urinating on Bioware just because they didn't get what they wanted.

#2190
Nozybidaj

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Fata Morgana wrote...

I do care about people urinating on Bioware just because they didn't get what they wanted.


You're right how silly of folks who have voted for the winner to not expect the winner to have lost.  I'm also glad to see you were in such staunch defense of blondeShep when the level of bigotry and ridiculous discrimination was at its height.  We truly owe you.  It was great to see the BSN pull together at such times and support BW in their staunchness to not cave under the weight of such moronic arguments.

Modifié par Nozybidaj, 24 août 2011 - 09:51 .


#2191
Fata Morgana

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Nozybidaj wrote...

 I'm also glad to see you were in such staunch defense of blondeShep when the level of bigotry and ridiculous discrimination was at its height. 


I'm happy you at least noticed that I did.Though admittedly I didn't spend as much time in that thread as I did in this one, mostly because it was really an offensive thread.

Modifié par Fata Morgana, 24 août 2011 - 10:03 .


#2192
gamer_girl

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Fata Morgana wrote...

Nozybidaj wrote...

gamer_girl wrote...
Definitely not the only one. Fata Morgana and I are two of them.


You two have spent a lot of time posting about something you don't care about. /shrug


I don't care how FemShep looks.

I do care about people urinating on Bioware just because they didn't get what they wanted.


QFT

#2193
C9316

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Really people if for some reason redshep wins, just make a bunch of dumb threads filled with insane reasons why she is unfit to be shepard, say her hair makes her look like a dumb stereotypical **** and bioware will make another poll with even more hair colors! Oh and you'll even be able to vote on bust and ass size. Do you want a miranda type ass or a tali type ass???

#2194
Techo Angel

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C9316 wrote...
Oh and you'll even be able to vote on bust and ass size. Do you want a miranda type ass or a tali type ass???


Tali Type of course B)

#2195
Evilatem

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C9316 wrote...

Do you want a miranda type ass or a tali type ass???


I protest! Why wasn't Kasumi ass an option?

/sarcasm......or is it       o_O    the world may never know.

#2196
Balek-Vriege

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Techo Angel wrote...

C9316 wrote...
Oh and you'll even be able to vote on bust and ass size. Do you want a miranda type ass or a tali type ass???


Tali Type of course Image IPB


Definitely, no question. Image IPB

Evilatem wrote...

C9316 wrote...

Do you want a miranda type ass or a tali type ass???


I protest! Why wasn't Kasumi ass an option?

/sarcasm......or is it       o_O    the world may never know.


Deal with it! Image IPB

Edit:  Above fixed.  No clue what I did there lol.


Fata Morgana wrote...

Nozybidaj wrote...

gamer_girl wrote...
Definitely not the only one. Fata Morgana and I are two of them.


You two have spent a lot of time posting about something you don't care about. /shrug


I don't care how FemShep looks.

I do care about people urinating on Bioware just because they didn't get what they wanted.


Is it really urinating though?  Or is it actual valid complaints.  I will defend Bioware any day of the week or anyone who I think did something right/responsible, regardless of whether it's considered the "good" or "bad" thing to do in the eyes of many.  Now I won't defend Bioware or anyone else if I think that they didn't think something through or did something irresponsible.  If you didn't do the job right and it's possible something could have been done better, then I don't need to be defending those actions.

It's not like Bioware needs any defending here either.  This isn't going to destroy the company and everyone involved probably agrees no more polls, no retroactive changing of 1st or 2nd polls and bring on a Femshep trailer.  By defending Bioware's actions so vehemently in this controversial debate regardless of points made, Bioware's "stalwart" defenders are actually "urinating" on other's opinions which aren't so far fetched.  We get it, Bioware is not evil and no one is arguing that.  So they shouldn't be treated like their mindless raving mad men/women.

In the end Bioware possibly made a mistake on the way they did the polls and were a bit unfair to some fans, but the overall marketing scheme and idea is a good one and will probably be successful regardless.  By the end Bioware should know that some people/fans were unhappy about the way things went down in general, and attempt a better job next time or not do it at all.  They also know it's probably best not to debate/defend their actions in this thread (I would agree), since that just adds to the fire and doesn't really help anyone.

Again, no one should be portraying the complaints as whining simply because some fans didn't get what they wanted.  That's arguably what happened during the first poll with anti-blonde complaints.  This debate is about a group of people who felt they fairly got their way in the first poll, only to have it arguably taken away unfairly in a second, unplanned and seemingly less thoughtful poll.

Modifié par Balek-Vriege, 25 août 2011 - 03:29 .


#2197
RynJ

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The complaints are whining. They all are. This all mostly sounds like sour grapes because a group of people didn't get the Shep they wanted. Just like the whining about Blonde Shep was because a group of people didn't get what they wanted.

Don't pretend you're just honest debators angry at what you perceive as an "unfair poll". Let's be real. If blonde Shep was still winning NONE of you would be here and there would be no talk of unfair polls. And don't try to deny it either lovies!

#2198
Balek-Vriege

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RynJ wrote...

The complaints are whining. They all are. This all mostly sounds like sour grapes because a group of people didn't get the Shep they wanted. Just like the whining about Blonde Shep was because a group of people didn't get what they wanted.

Don't pretend you're just honest debators angry at what you perceive as an "unfair poll". Let's be real. If blonde Shep was still winning NONE of you would be here and there would be no talk of unfair polls. And don't try to deny it either lovies!



Ok lets be clear here.  So in the face of all the things said you're going to claim:

-Every single person who doesn't agree with you are whiners (high pitched, crybabies who are making no mature points)
-Every single person who's complaining loves Blonde Shep and it's a FACT they're all Redhead/Blackhair hating people!!  (yeah right, good critical thinking there)
Image IPB
-No one complaining has made any points with any intellectual argument.

All while:

-Not backing up you're point(s), if you even have a real one other than your emotional based opinion
-Ignoring actual numbers, math and the almost complete lack of Red Femshep bashing (like seriously)
-Making sweeping generalizations about others and their intentions, regardless of them saying/proving otherwise

Explain to me how this is the case and what brought you to these conclusions? 
It sounds more like a "I think it, therefore it is" argument to me. Image IPB

Meh, I like Redhair Femshep.  Actually she's about on par with Blonde Shepard (I have stated many times before).  You're argument is flawed and can't actually be supported.

Modifié par Balek-Vriege, 25 août 2011 - 03:46 .


#2199
Jayce

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Nozybidaj wrote...

Yeah, she's only about 12K votes behind blondeShep so far.  Quite a winner.....


....And the red head has 14,000 more votes than blondie does this time. So did you actually have a point other than spouting more butt hurt?

#2200
RynJ

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Balek-Vriege wrote...

RynJ wrote...

The complaints are whining. They all are. This all mostly sounds like sour grapes because a group of people didn't get the Shep they wanted. Just like the whining about Blonde Shep was because a group of people didn't get what they wanted.

Don't pretend you're just honest debators angry at what you perceive as an "unfair poll". Let's be real. If blonde Shep was still winning NONE of you would be here and there would be no talk of unfair polls. And don't try to deny it either lovies!



Ok lets be clear here.  So in the face of all the things said you're going to claim:

-Every single person who doesn't agree with you are whiners (high pitched, crybabies who are making no mature points)
-Every single person who's complaining loves Blonde Shep and it's a FACT they're all Redhead/Blackhair hating people!!  (yeah right, good critical thinking there)
Image IPB
-No one complaining has made any points with any intellectual argument.

All while:

-Not backing up you're point(s), if you even have a real one other than your emotional based opinion
-Ignoring actual numbers, math and the almost complete lack of Red Femshep bashing (like seriously)
-Making sweeping generalizations about others and their intentions, regardless of them saying/proving otherwise

Explain to me how this is the case and what brought you to these conclusions? 
It sounds more like a "I think it, therefore it is" argument to me. Image IPB

Meh, I like Redhair Femshep.  Actually she's about on par with Blonde Shepard (I have stated many times before).  You're argument is flawed and can't actually be supported.


Are you high? There was not one part of what you just said that was included in the comment I just made. You came to those conclusions yourself honey bunch!

I'm not backing up my points because if you want to see them they're around this thread. Also, I don't bash ANY Femshep darling! I was angry at the Blonde hate too!

Never said those that disagree with me are whiners, just said that people constantly complaining are whiners. What else do you call people who go on and on about something that isn't going to change as far as you know. Like I said, anti-Blondites are whiners too.  Oh and I love your description of said people, it's very accurate and I didn't even have to think of it! I'm glad you see it for what it is. And point to when I ever said that all Blonde Supporters are Black/Red hair haters?

You tell me to back up my arguments, yet you make statements that make absolutely no sense and that were never part of my arguments at all! Take your own advice kk? Tell ya what, go back and find my posts that ever said anything like this, and maybe I'll believe you. Good luck!

Oh and if your use of smilies was meant to be insulting, it didn't work. I love me some smilies, it actually makes certain posts tolerable!Image IPBImage IPBImage IPB

Modifié par RynJ, 25 août 2011 - 04:04 .