150 réponses à ce sujet

[KnightofPhoenix]

I would love it if it's completely removed and if Bioware start getting passed their bipolarity. But I do not see that happening anytime soon.

[Elstraim]

Nashiktal wrote...

Elstraim wrote...

Yeah, let's get rid of the P/R system.

Because we need more people b*tching about "lack of RPG elements" and "MASS EFFECT IS A SHOOTAR NAO".

Removing the system would actually increase roleplaying.

This might be because it's 4 AM where I live, but I'm going to need you to explain that to me.

[Nashiktal]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I would love it if it's completely removed and if Bioware start getting passed their bipolarity. But I do not see that happening anytime soon.

At the very lest they havn't reached the phelps level of bipolarity.

PHELPS BADGE TWELVE FOURTY SEVEN

[Elstraim]

Modifié par Elstraim, 19 août 2011 - 08:11 .

[ThePwener]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I would love it if it's completely removed and if Bioware start getting passed their bipolarity. But I do not see that happening anytime soon.

If your Shepard is bipolar that's your problem. Maybe you should be more careful on what dialog you choose. Choosing only Paragon or Renegade is just retarded.

[ThePwener]

Elstraim wrote...

Great post buddy.

[KnightofPhoenix]

ThePwener wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I would love it if it's completely removed and if Bioware start getting passed their bipolarity. But I do not see that happening anytime soon.

If your Shepard is bipolar that's your problem. Maybe you should be more careful on what dialog you choose. Choosing only Paragon or Renegade is just retarded.

Except I don't do that at all.

By bipolarity, I meant the belief that there is only two available options in every scenario. Usually extreme opposites.

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 19 août 2011 - 08:15 .

[Elstraim]

ThePwener wrote...

Elstraim wrote...

Great post buddy.

Thank you. I accidentally double-posted, and I haven't figured out how to delete posts yet.


Great contribution to the topic, "pal".

[Nashiktal]

Elstraim wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

Elstraim wrote...

Yeah, let's get rid of the P/R system.

Because we need more people b*tching about "lack of RPG elements" and "MASS EFFECT IS A SHOOTAR NAO".

Removing the system would actually increase roleplaying.

This might be because it's 4 AM where I live, but I'm going to need you to explain that to me.

When you lift the restriction, you are free to shape your sheps personality as you see fit. Without worrying about some bar that increases an I win meter, you would be free to act as you wish without being encouraged to metagame. Want a shep who is angered to rage by the reporter, but still allowed to eloquently argue a case during Tali's trial? Or would you prefer a shep who is mild mannered, but simple and bad with words? Or perhaps you want a firecracker who does well with the krogan, but not with other people?

If they remove the system, and with it an I win system it would be all flavor. You could still "win" scenerio's without such persuasions if Bioware allowed the opportunity,  which they do, just look at Tali's loyalty mission, you don't need P and R to "win" it. When I realized I didn't need to grind P and R for Tali's trial, I played it differently than I usually did, and discovered extra conversations, not being restricted just opens up the game you know?

Have you ever modded ME to have full P and R bars? Its refreshing.

[Elstraim]

jreezy wrote...

People still complaining...I see.

[ThePwener]

Elstraim wrote...

Thank you. I accidentally double-posted, and I haven't figured out how to delete posts yet.


Great contribution to the topic, "pal".

I don't think you can delete posts here.

[Elstraim]

ThePwener wrote...

Elstraim wrote...

Thank you. I accidentally double-posted, and I haven't figured out how to delete posts yet.


Great contribution to the topic, "pal".

I don't think you can delete posts here.

Crap. Okay.

Nashiktal wrote...

Elstraim wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

Elstraim wrote...

Yeah, let's get rid of the P/R system.

Because we need more people b*tching about "lack of RPG elements" and "MASS EFFECT IS A SHOOTAR NAO".

Removing the system would actually increase roleplaying.

This might be because it's 4 AM where I live, but I'm going to need you to explain that to me.

When
you lift the restriction, you are free to shape your sheps personality
as you see fit. Without worrying about some bar that increases an I win
meter, you would be free to act as you wish without being encouraged to
metagame. Want a shep who is angered to rage by the reporter, but still
allowed to eloquently argue a case during Tali's trial? Or would you
prefer a shep who is mild mannered, but simple and bad with words? Or
perhaps you want a firecracker who does well with the krogan, but not
with other people?

If they remove the system, and with it an I
win system it would be all flavor. You could still "win" scenerio's
without such persuasions if Bioware allowed the opportunity,  which they
do, just look at Tali's loyalty mission, you don't need P and R to
"win" it. When I realized I didn't need to grind P and R for Tali's
trial, I played it differently than I usually did, and discovered extra
conversations, not being restricted just opens up the game you know?

Have you ever modded ME to have full P and R bars? Its refreshing.

I see what you're saying. But it's somewhat easy to do that in ME2 without mods. Every Paragon runthrough I do, I always pick the Renegade QTE prompts and end up with a full Paragon bar everytime. But you make a great point.

[ThePwener]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

By bipolarity, I meant the belief that there is only two available options in every scenario. Usually extreme opposites.

A guy is holding a gun at you. You....

A. [Fire at him]

B. [Convince him to surrender]

What? You want the "call down lighting bolts" option? What else are you supposed to do? The game couldn't handle so many options either.

[KnightofPhoenix]

ThePwener wrote...
A guy is holding a gun at you. You....

A. [Fire at him]

B. [Convince him to surrender]

What? You want the "call down lighting bolts" option? What else are you supposed to do? The game couldn't handle so many options either.

C. [attempt to disarm him or wound but not kill him]

For example.

[Elstraim]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

ThePwener wrote...
A guy is holding a gun at you. You....

A. [Fire at him]

B. [Convince him to surrender]

What? You want the "call down lighting bolts" option? What else are you supposed to do? The game couldn't handle so many options either.

C. [attempt to disarm him or wound but not kill him]

For example.

"GIMME THAT GU-"

*Critical Mission Failure*

[Nashiktal]

ThePwener wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

By bipolarity, I meant the belief that there is only two available options in every scenario. Usually extreme opposites.

A guy is holding a gun at you. You....

A. [Fire at him]

B. [Convince him to surrender] Sorry you didn't manage to save that box of kittens. You don't have the persuasion skill to do this.

What? You want the "call down lighting bolts" option? What else are you supposed to do? The game couldn't handle so many options either.

Fixed.

[Elstraim]

You should've saved those kittens, bro.

[PHub88]

I like the current system because I LIKE incentive and reasons to play the game again and again. I dont understand the people who dont like it and claim it negatively effects role playing.Isnt one of the graces of role playing games is having reasons to play the game again and again? So im lost as to how that makes sense when you have the option to play the game more than once? Having all choices available no matter what seems dumb...and it just takes one more RPG element away...and makes dialogue choice even more pointless than it already is.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Elstraim wrote...
"GIMME THAT GU-"

*Critical Mission Failure*

Kinetic barriers and we have seen Shepard being capable of shooting guns out of people's hands.

Or just shooting his hand.

[ThePwener]

Damn those kittens. They insulted me, thus I overreact and let them die at the hands of Geth ships.

No air quotes from **** kitty....

[Nashiktal]

PHub88 wrote...

I like the current system because I LIKE incentive and reasons to play the game again and again. I dont understand the people who dont like it and claim it negatively effects role playing.Isnt one of the graces of role playing games is having reasons to play the game again and again? So im lost as to how that makes sense when you have the option to play the game more than once? Having all choices available no matter what seems dumb...and it just takes one more RPG element away...and makes dialogue choice even more pointless than it already is.

What are you talking about? Bioware already gives that incentive, its call choice! There are at the very least, three ways to resovle the situation. Two of which, are the paragon and renegade flavors of the persuasion "win" scenerio.

If they were to get  rid of P and R, they would have to build the scenerio not based on "winning" but on choice. 

[Lotion Soronarr]

Nashiktal wrote...

ThePwener wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

By bipolarity, I meant the belief that there is only two available options in every scenario. Usually extreme opposites.

A guy is holding a gun at you. You....

A. [Fire at him]

B. [Convince him to surrender] Sorry you didn't manage to save that box of kittens. You don't have the persuasion skill to do this.

What? You want the "call down lighting bolts" option? What else are you supposed to do? The game couldn't handle so many options either.

Fixed.

QFT!

[Selene Moonsong]

Let's see, how to measure morality...

At it's core, there needs to be two at least two measurable extremes. Otherwise, there is nothing to measure all the possible shades of gray in between that would suggest a character's personal values.

Adjustments are made to Paragon and/or Renegade values based on severity from all I have seen in ME 2. ME 2 isn't exactly black and white from what I have seen and you can be awarded points for both Paragon and Renegade in ME 2 based on your choices in conversations or other action choices.

Paragon and Renegade actions are the whole measure of your character's 'morality'. I consider 'morality' in this context as a simplified 'catch all' term in measuring a character's total moral and personal values, similar to the far more complicated system used in earlier versions of Dungeons and Dragons and Advanced Dungeons and Dragons game rules.

Without some sort of measure for your character's 'morality' choices, there is less room for decision options that can make your character more interesting and provide more choices and opportunities later on based on choices made earlier.

Without some sort of 'morals' value system, there is far less depth to a character's persona, and less reason for making any particular decision one way or another beyond a player's whim.

[Homebound]

i hope paragon/renegade isnt a sliding bar then. would make playing renagon or paragade difficult.