58 réponses à ce sujet

[Fata Morgana]

People are gonna die. Lots of them. Not everyone you meet is going to be saveable. Hope that your squadmates are not among those you can't save.

[CaptainHydra]

You wanna save the boy, you choose your path but ultimately the outcome is the same.

[Sh2dak]

marshalleck wrote...

Sh2dak wrote...

Call it all you like, but the fact remains that we don't know the outcome of both conversational options at this point. It doesn't matter how you look at it, or what you think you know, we simply don't.

Of course. But you don't know anything about that option either. So it could play out exactly as I described. This is hardly an interesting or meaningful basis for creating a thread.

The basis is evident in my initial post as defined by the 'evidence' present there; equally expanded upon with each consequential post of mine. The meaning is in the curiosity behind the basis, and its interest is a matter of subjectivity.

The point is, Mass Effect is about choice and the consequences of those choices; we're shown a demo where we encounter a boy in a vent, and at this time are given two options of dialogue - a choice. Jesse Houston puts emphasis on the impact of choice at the moment this choice becomes apparent. We also find out that a representative of an independent 'gaming' website was given an extended preview of the demo where the boy dies. Is it not logical to assume that the choice toward the boy has an effect on the outcome of the boy?

It's common knowledge now, yet Bioware has stayed quiet on the matter. Is it just a spoiler, or is there more to it?
This is the possibility, and if it's something you perceive as uninteresting or without a 'meaningful' basis despite my previous posts, then I wonder why you bother responding at all. And I can only assume that based on your lack of objectivity toward the subject that you're decided on how it plays out in its entirety.

[daddyjah21]

Sundance31us wrote...

Could you imagine...

Shepard coaxes the child out of the ducts, scoops him up into his/her arms only to have the child later die in his/her arms from a wound received while trying to evacuate.

Such a scene would make the final scene with mumHawk look armature…I could see Bioware doing it just to mess with our fragile minds.

  I would love to do that 

[Blooddrunk1004]

Arppis wrote...

CheeseEnchilada wrote...

You can't save everyone. The child is a prime example of that.

B-but... I'm PARAGON!

I should be able to!

Let me guess, you let Balak go right?

[Merchant2006]

Ok. One kid. Will he live? No. Cannibals everywhere, not to mention the Reapers gunning down everything. The kid is as good as dead.

[Sundance31us]

Merchant2006 wrote...
Ok. One kid. Will he live? No. Cannibals everywhere, not to mention the Reapers gunning down everything. The kid is as good as dead.

Good point. Perhaps the renegade response should be to end it right there quickly.

[Sh2dak]

Savber100 wrote...

Troll harder.  <_<

The devs during the SDCC said that you're suppose to feel helpless against the Reapers. There's almost no hope left as the whole game is depending on your feeble attempts to find a solution. The consequences of your past choices are still valid as anything from the Council Remnants to the Rachni are critical for your victory

Yes, and this is apparent in the atmosphere of the level. The Reapers are here, on our home planet, destroying all that we know with no regard for human life, the city is crumbling, people are dying, nobody listened, this is the last chance we all have. What can we do? The sense of urgency and despair couldn't be any more clear.

Honestly, have you even been listening to what Casey Hudson has said? Try to actually listen the next time Hudson talks about ME3. 

ME3 is the game where the beginning is suppose to make everything look downright hopless. The fate of the child emphasizes on how Shepard can't protect everyone. Shepard, the big Alliance hero and saviour of the Citadel, can do nothing now (in the beginning anyways).

I don't recall him saying at any point that the boy's 'fate' is an emphasis on Shepard's helplessness at that point, just some general repeated lines of how emotional the game is. Give me your opinion freely, I value it, but don't try to pass it off as something that is 'fact' without the means to prove it.

Also, I'm not trolling. You made your point in a way that deliberately undermined mine. You're certain you are correct and you wanted to make that clear to me. Why? Your ideas are based on as much conjecture as mine. I'm simply open to the possibility of what the series is all about, choice. Yet everybody seems to have played the game already and confirmed that there is no option of choice in this entry of the series.

Modifié par Sh2dak, 18 août 2011 - 07:44 .

[Sundance31us]

Anyone else bet the boy's name is MacGuffin? 

http://tvtropes.org/.../Main/MacGuffin

[xassantex]

the kid is perspicacious " you can't help me " .
the city is being wiped out, there's no safety zone Shepard could leave the kid in .

[Masquerade_Assassin]

I doubt that were on earth for most of ME3. The child represents the toll of the fight on civilans.

Reminds me of the final level of Splinter Cell Convictions. You basically walked around in the streets, watching the effects of the Emp blast. I don't think we can get that sort of look, because were escaping to the Normandy.

I think no matter what happens, we can't save the kid. If you remember the scene, we talk to the kid. Then Anderson diverts your attention to hurry up. You look back and see the child is gone.

[DarthCaine]

Hah! Completely different outcomes for your choices, that's not a line change or some crappy text? In a BioWare game? HAHAHAHAHA keep dreaming

Modifié par DarthCaine, 18 août 2011 - 08:39 .

[Dean_the_Young]

This is purely because I think Bioware's appeal-to-emotions hammer is more of an anvil, but I have little sympathy for the kid who refuses to follow the authority figure trying to help him and thus meets his death.

[King Minos]

Tell the child that he is a biotic god and watch him charge into a husk with a wooden sword, only to watch him get munched up and used to repaint the walls.

[Fata Morgana]

Here's the thing about that kid. If you watch the Demo, just before you find that kid, you kill two husks that came out of his house.

...his parents?

The reason you can't save him is that he just saw his parents get turned into monsters, and then saw you kill them. He probably doesn't want to live anymore, and even if he does he doesn't want to go with the person who just killed his mommy and daddy.

Modifié par Fata Morgana, 18 août 2011 - 08:51 .

[Savber100]

Sh2dak wrote...

I don't recall him saying at any point that the boy's 'fate' is an emphasis on Shepard's helplessness at that point, just some general repeated lines of how emotional the game is. Give me your opinion freely, I value it, but don't try to pass it off as something that is 'fact' without the means to prove it.

Also, I'm not trolling. You made your point in a way that deliberately undermined mine. You're certain you are correct and you wanted to make that clear to me. Why? Your ideas are based on as much conjecture as mine. I'm simply open to the possibility of what the series is all about, choice. Yet everybody seems to have played the game already and confirmed that there is no option of choice in this entry of the series.

So your sarcasm in the prior response was a sign of valuing the opinions of others you disagree with? Huh. If it was meant to be like that, I apologize. 

Anyways, I base my reasons on how the ME team have always regarded choice in their games. Unless the choice would make a massive difference in the story, these choices presented are generally superficial. It's more or less your reaction to the events that happen.  Several previews from IGN to Gamespot have already told us the fate of the child and I doubt Shepard's reaction would change it. Either way, the boy dies no matter what. Your choices in being kind or mean won't get the boy to follow you. On a side note, it doesn't make sense that being mean would make a difference here if Shepard's "kind" option didn't draw him out already. You can argue that I haven't played the game and therefore I don't know but I would point out that by simple inference from the nature of Bioware games (which generally gives you the option of reaction not action) and the previews, I would say it makes no difference. 

From a gameplay and story perspective, I think it makes sense as seen from my comments on the "helplessness" of Shepard during the early stages of the Reaper Invasion of which has been mentioned by the devs. Check the tweets or previews where the devs talk about how they wanted to focus on the hopelessness of the situation. I believe this scene with the kid just further emphasizes on this in a more personal tone. 

DarthCaine wrote...

Hah! Completely different outcomes for your choices, that's not a line change or some crappy text? In a BioWare game? HAHAHAHAHA keep dreaming

KOTOR 

Umm... Uh.. 

Baldur's Gate 2? Well, it did happen during quests AFTER visiting the Asylum where you talk to Saemon or go directly to Underdark. 

Uh.. what about ME2? You either lose men, everyone dies, or all survive. You can argue about HOW it was implemented but it's still there. 

Other than that, you're right. 

Modifié par Savber100, 18 août 2011 - 09:01 .

[Texhnolyze101]

Sundance31us wrote...

ReconTeam wrote...
Emotional investment? Seems Bioware isn't counting on people with shriveled black hearts like myself.

They could include a renegade interrupt where Shepard throws the kid at one of the Reaper minions.

I...support this

[King Minos]

Tell the child you have sweeties. Always works.

[King Minos]

And the renegade interrupt is sheploos smile.

[DarthCaine]

Savber100 wrote...

KOTOR

KOTOR's my favorite RPG ever, but aside from a different ending scene there's absolutely ZERO ingame consequences of your actions.

Uh.. what about ME2? You either lose men, everyone dies, or all survive. You can argue about HOW it was implemented but it's still there.

Having lots of choices isn't the same as having lots of consequences. BioWare games have loads of choices, but little to no ingame consequences of your actions (just some crappy epilogue/email texts)

The Witcher for example, has far fewer choices, but those choices change the game drastically, leading to completely different areas, completely different quests etc.

Modifié par DarthCaine, 18 août 2011 - 09:11 .

[King Minos]

Shove a flash into the vent and shut it, atleast the kid will die seeing a light at the end of a very dark tunnel, unlike Benezia.

[Medhia Nox]

While this is just a video game - some of you continue to reveal yourselves as cravens and monsters.

[Sh2dak]

Savber100 wrote...

So your sarcasm in the prior response was a sign of valuing the opinions of others you disagree with? Huh. If it was meant to be like that, I apologize.

I have no idea why you'd respond to that paragraph and ignore the one below it addressing this exact issue.
Still, it was a difusing response to a seemingly arrogant comment. An eye for an eye, get it?

I've not once said that anybody else who has posted in this thread was wrong. The whole point of this is possibility, choices, the underlying nature of the game itself. Nobody's wrong, so why is it that everybody's saying i'm wrong, how is that even possible? It contradicts everything I based the thread on.

Anyways, I base my reasons on how the ME team have always regarded choice in their games. Unless the choice would make a massive difference in the story, these choices presented are generally superficial. It's more or less your reaction to the events that happen.  Several previews from IGN to Gamespot have already told us the fate of the child and I doubt Shepard's reaction would change it. Either way, the boy dies no matter what. Your choices in being kind or mean won't get the boy to follow you. On a side note, it doesn't make sense that being mean would make a difference here if Shepard's "kind" option didn't draw him out already. You can argue that I haven't played the game and therefore I don't know but I would point out that by simple inference from the nature of Bioware games (which generally gives you the option of reaction not action) and the previews, I would say it makes no difference.

I was under the impression that the source of the boy's death was exclusive to one independent entity, and from there other entities adopted the idea. I'll take your word for it, but if you could provide two independent previews citing it, it'd be much appreciated.

Technically, Renegade isn't 'evil' and Paragon isn't 'good'. In one instance, there may be a diplomatic approach and a direct approach where the direct would be classified as Renegade and the other as Paragon.

I see where you're coming from though, but actually it's been stated, by Casey Hudson I believe, that Mass Effect 3 is based on the end-game decision system that was used in ME2, but a more refined version. This means that potentially we have whole different playthroughs for each individual, and although this is primarily for the resolution of the countless variables we've come to aquire through the series, it means a lot of new stuff too. Boy in the vent anyone?

From a gameplay and story perspective, I think it makes sense as seen from my comments on the "helplessness" of Shepard during the early stages of the Reaper Invasion of which has been mentioned by the devs. Check the tweets or previews where the devs talk about how they wanted to focus on the hopelessness of the situation. I believe this scene with the kid just further emphasizes on this in a more personal tone.

It does make sense, I agree, but I won't come to a conclusion on it's actuality until i've seen evidence of a certainty.

[PnXMarcin1PL]

He becomes Reaper Chow, simple

[Wynne]

Savber100 wrote...

On a side note, it doesn't make sense that being mean would make a difference here if Shepard's "kind" option didn't draw him out already. You can argue that I haven't played the game and therefore I don't know but I would point out that by simple inference from the nature of Bioware games (which generally gives you the option of reaction not action) and the previews, I would say it makes no difference.

...or maybe, just maybe, this is the one case where the kid is pragmatic and doesn't respond to wishy-washy "it's all gonna be okay" bs, and only Renegade Shepard has the no-nonsense, "get your ass out here, kid" manner which causes the child to trust him/her and respond. Maybe it's not likely, but it's possible they chose to have Paragon Shepard for once be the one who fails to connect despite trying.

Or maybe R-Shep gets him out of the ducts, but he dies another way. It would be interesting if that wasn't just two paths leading to the same miserable outcome, though I think it would have a strong impact, and that's probably what they're going for--giving us a sense of the scale. A sad memory to fight for.