1104 réponses à ce sujet

[Barquiel]

Yes

[Arppis]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Arppis wrote...

Yep, that's why we need our allies. To help us save the planet, not "alienate" them and push them away for some quick element zero.

They don't really have a military to speak of, how would the asari help us save anything? Best to use their resources and ships, just... without the Asari.

Ships don't mean everything.

[Nashiktal]

But thats not the scenerio here. If it was either earth, or thessia, which one would you sacrifice?

Adding anything else to the scenario just muddies it up and leaves to many whats ifs.

If it had to be earth, or thessia, I would choose earth.

If it had to be earth, or the flotilla, I would choose flotilla.

Asari will still thrive without thessia, the quarians would be dead without the flotilla. (no cheating by saying they wouldnt be on it)

humanity would be doomed without earth, but they would still have a slim chance compared to the dead quarians. See what I mean?

[Nashiktal]

Luc0s wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

I agreed with you until there. 

The Quarian flotilla is a fleet of scrap metal, full of bickering quarians who try to decide where to go, and hope to god no one realizes their military fleet is actually a bunch of small police vessles.

I will give you they have logistic skills and pure numbers, but sophistication? Firepower? Throw the flotilla at the reapers, and you will get scrap back.

If I used the flotilla, logistics would be its role. Supplies, transport, maybe even meat shields.

Hmm I wouldn't underestimate the quarian flotilla. They have over 50000 ships. Even if a quarian ship would be 10x as weak as an Alliance ship, the flotilla would still outmatch the Alliance.

How many battle ships does the Alliance have? 500 or so? Maybe I'm mistaken though.

But yeah, the because of fact that the migrant fleet is basically a mobile base of operations and can function as host to all the civilians that need to get evacuated, I still think the migrant fleet is worth saving.

Sure they could overcome the alliance through pure numbers, not taking into account the many ways humanity could destroy the quarians with simple tactics.

However we are talking about reapers here. REAPERS. Reapers that took the firepower of a several fleets without either slowing down, or showing any visible signs of damage. 

Like I said, they would valuable as logistics, meat shields, but straight up combat? 

[Arppis]

Nashiktal wrote...

But thats not the scenerio here. If it was either earth, or thessia, which one would you sacrifice?

Adding anything else to the scenario just muddies it up and leaves to many whats ifs.

If it had to be earth, or thessia, I would choose earth.

If it had to be earth, or the flotilla, I would choose flotilla.

Asari will still thrive without thessia, the quarians would be dead without the flotilla. (no cheating by saying they wouldnt be on it)

humanity would be doomed without earth, but they would still have a slim chance compared to the dead quarians. See what I mean?

Yep. If it was that black and white, gun to the forehead, I'd have to go for earth too. What about System Alliance? They don't have enough population to hold the humanity in viable numbers?

[Golden Owl]

Arppis wrote...


Yep, that's why we need our allies. To help us save the planet, not "alienate" them and push them away for some quick element zero.

I do have humanity's survival in heart. But I am not so black and white to think that other races are just throw-aways. When I help them, they are more likely see humanity as ally. Sure it doesn't always work, but chance is a better than no chance.

This^

[Dave of Canada]

Arppis wrote...

Ships don't mean everything.

They do when it's all they offer in a galactic space war.

[SandTrout]

Arppis wrote...

Yep, that's why we need our allies. To help us save the planet, not "alienate" them and push them away for some quick element zero.

I do have humanity's survival in heart. But I am not so black and white to think that other races are just throw-aways. When I help them, they are more likely see humanity as ally. Sure it doesn't always work, but chance is a better than no chance.

This is fine, but assuming equivalent tactical advantage against the Reapers, then where do the Asari fall on your list?

[Arppis]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Arppis wrote...

Ships don't mean everything.

They do when it's all they offer in a galactic space war.

They don't when wars are fought on planetside too.

SandTrout wrote...

Arppis wrote...

Yep,
that's why we need our allies. To help us save the planet, not
"alienate" them and push them away for some quick element zero.

I
do have humanity's survival in heart. But I am not so black and white
to think that other races are just throw-aways. When I help them, they
are more likely see humanity as ally. Sure it doesn't always work, but
chance is a better than no chance.

This is fine, but assuming equivalent tactical advantage against the Reapers, then where do the Asari fall on your list?

You are assuming there is no tactical advantage in helping asari.

Modifié par Arppis, 21 août 2011 - 10:06 .

[Dave of Canada]

Arppis wrote...

They don't when wars are fought on planetside too.

They don't have much of a military, great use they'll serve there.

[Arppis]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Arppis wrote...

They don't when wars are fought on planetside too.

They don't have much of a military, great use they'll serve there.

They have their commando units. And more people we have, better odds of surivival.

[SandTrout]

Arppis wrote...

They don't when wars are fought on planetside too.

Infantry isn't going to take down a Reaper, and there are units better suited for taking down husks. Elcor come to mind.

Edit: Quoted the wrong line.

Modifié par SandTrout, 21 août 2011 - 10:11 .

[Nashiktal]

Arppis wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

But thats not the scenerio here. If it was either earth, or thessia, which one would you sacrifice?

Adding anything else to the scenario just muddies it up and leaves to many whats ifs.

If it had to be earth, or thessia, I would choose earth.

If it had to be earth, or the flotilla, I would choose flotilla.

Asari will still thrive without thessia, the quarians would be dead without the flotilla. (no cheating by saying they wouldnt be on it)

humanity would be doomed without earth, but they would still have a slim chance compared to the dead quarians. See what I mean?

Yep. If it was that black and white, gun to the forehead, I'd have to go for earth too. What about System Alliance? They don't have enough population to hold the humanity in viable numbers?

While the reapers are around? The only way to get to earth is through the arcturs station... the seat of government for the alliance.

If the reapers are on earth, that means they went through arcturus unless they went the slow way. With arcturus gone, that removes the center of command, and thus a field promotion for whoever is around. (take a guess)

With the alliance government in shambles, and the alliance fleet in hiding after its initial defeat, that leaves the colonies (whose populations are equal to that of small countries, unlike the asari) defensless to not only the reapers, but to whoever wants to do them harm.

Unlike the asari who not only have elite commandos in each city, but every citizen has biotics. Or the turians where every citizen has military training.

[Dave of Canada]

Arppis wrote...

They have their commando units. And more people we have, better odds of surivival.

I'd rather have resources and manned ships than a handful of commandos at my disposal against gigantic spaceships.

[Arppis]

Nashiktal wrote...

Arppis wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

But thats not the scenerio here. If it was either earth, or thessia, which one would you sacrifice?

Adding anything else to the scenario just muddies it up and leaves to many whats ifs.

If it had to be earth, or thessia, I would choose earth.

If it had to be earth, or the flotilla, I would choose flotilla.

Asari will still thrive without thessia, the quarians would be dead without the flotilla. (no cheating by saying they wouldnt be on it)

humanity would be doomed without earth, but they would still have a slim chance compared to the dead quarians. See what I mean?

Yep. If it was that black and white, gun to the forehead, I'd have to go for earth too. What about System Alliance? They don't have enough population to hold the humanity in viable numbers?

While the reapers are around? The only way to get to earth is through the arcturs station... the seat of government for the alliance.

If the reapers are on earth, that means they went through arcturus unless they went the slow way. With arcturus gone, that removes the center of command, and thus a field promotion for whoever is around. (take a guess)

With the alliance government in shambles, and the alliance fleet in hiding after its initial defeat, that leaves the colonies (whose populations are equal to that of small countries, unlike the asari) defensless to not only the reapers, but to whoever wants to do them harm.

Unlike the asari who not only have elite commandos in each city, but every citizen has biotics. Or the turians where every citizen has military training.

Too bad. :S

Dave of Canada wrote...

Arppis wrote...

They have their commando units. And more people we have, better odds of surivival.

I'd rather have resources and manned ships than a handful of commandos at my disposal against gigantic spaceships.

You can most likely have resources if you help Asari, plus those commando units. So there you go.

SandTrout wrote...

Arppis wrote...

You are assuming there is no tactical advantage in helping asari.

Infantry isn't going to take down a Reaper, and there are units better suited for taking down husks. Elcor come to mind.

Cerberus too. They have a lot of forces on ground too. So yes, they would matter.

Modifié par Arppis, 21 août 2011 - 10:10 .

[SandTrout]

Arppis wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

This is fine, but assuming equivalent tactical advantage against the Reapers, then where do the Asari fall on your list?

You are assuming there is no tactical advantage in helping asari.

When compared to the alternative, which is theoretically any other species, then yes.

[Dave of Canada]

Arppis wrote...

You can most likely have resources if you help Asari, plus those commando units. So there you go.

So you'd sacrifice your army to protect useless people for a couple of commandos?

[Barquiel]

Luc0s wrote...

The asari is a big race but they seriously lack in militairy force and expertise. We would lose more power by saving the asari than we would gain.

The asari are the most advanced species in council space and they have the second largest fleet.

[Nashiktal]

The Quarians are not just for evacuation, they have serious logistics skills. They have the numbers, and the organization to provide coordination for any support needed.

Also meatshields. They have plenty of scrap ships they could sacrifice to protect the more valuable assets.

[Arppis]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Arppis wrote...

You can most likely have resources if you help Asari, plus those commando units. So there you go.

So you'd sacrifice your army to protect useless people for a couple of commandos?

I'm sure there is the way to deal with saving them without sacrificing "an army". As I said, I'm sure they have their way of helping fight the reapers.

EDIT: Like second largest fleet apparently.

Modifié par Arppis, 21 août 2011 - 10:15 .

[Nashiktal]

Barquiel wrote...

Luc0s wrote...

The asari is a big race but they seriously lack in militairy force and expertise. We would lose more power by saving the asari than we would gain.

The asari are the most advanced species in council space and they have the second largest fleet.

That was (annoyingly) before the battle of the citadel. Apparently both the Turians and the Asari were devastated after the attack.

This annoys me on so many levels, but I won't get into that.

[Dave of Canada]

Arppis wrote...

I'm sure there is the way to deal with saving them without sacrificing "an army". As I said, I'm sure they have their way of helping fight the reapers.

You can't sacrifice them when there's no threat, so you'd essentially have to defend them to use them if I'm going to be sacrificing them. Unless you think they'll pack their bags and Thessia will be perfectly fine alone.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 21 août 2011 - 10:17 .

[Barquiel]

Nashiktal wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

Luc0s wrote...

The asari is a big race but they seriously lack in militairy force and expertise. We would lose more power by saving the asari than we would gain.

The asari are the most advanced species in council space and they have the second largest fleet.

That was (annoyingly) before the battle of the citadel. Apparently both the Turians and the Asari were devastated after the attack.

This annoys me on so many levels, but I won't get into that.

During the year 2185 (Mass Effect 2), the dreadnought count is 39 turians, 20 asari, 16 salarians, and 8 humans.

[Arppis]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Arppis wrote...

I'm sure there is the way to deal with saving them without sacrificing "an army". As I said, I'm sure they have their way of helping fight the reapers.

You can't sacrifice them when there's no threat, so you'd essentially have to defend them to use them if I'm going to be sacrificing them. Unless you think they'll pack their bags and Thessia will be perfectly fine alone.

We'll see when Mass Effect 3 comes. It's all speculation. But suffice to say, I'd try to help them if I can, just like I'd try to help every race I am able to help. In order to get the largest possible army with wide range of expertese. Humanity propably doesn't even have much fleets left, so you might have to turn to alien races in this game.

Modifié par Arppis, 21 août 2011 - 10:19 .