997 réponses à ce sujet

[RenegadeXV]

RubyRed1975 wrote...

This crap always happens. No one has actually answered the question of why do people feel that it would be a betrayal if Tali & Garrus were made s/s LI. Can we talk about that instead of religion or are people trying to get this thread locked on purpose?

Actually the first 8 or so pages did discuss the original topic. Before the whole religion bashing started.

[darkangelvxvx]

 this quote pretty much says it all how we feel about this thread getting closed:

[Davie McG]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

Davie McG wrote...

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

I have a good feeling Christianity will accept homosexuality in about 5-10 years.

Not in Catholicism. There are gay Bishops and priests in the Church of Scotland and the Church of England, but many other Bishops and priests converted to Catholicism to show their disappoval of the decision to include people who are openly homosexual in the clergy.

However I don't think this is the place for a religious discussion. My view regarding the topic is that I think characters that have alluded to their sexual orientation should stick to it. Anything else would be fan service.

Edit: Typo.

I'd say they'll do it to attract more members, as they are losing people.

Also, Bioware opened the door when they allowed Garrus and Tali to be romanceable.

There's a billion of us, I don't think el papa's too worried about numbers. 

Your right in what you say about Garrus and Tali, I just hope they don't go too far with it.

[RubyRed1975]

@ Cognition I saw that it was on topic for a few but, then it totally took a left turn and ran into a ditch lol

[darkangelvxvx]

you forgot about the massive s'plosion

[RenegadeXV]

RubyRed1975 wrote...

@ Cognition I saw that it was on topic for a few but, then it totally took a left turn and ran into a ditch lol

That's putting it lightly.

[Deejtage]

Rojahar wrote...

Bcuz wrote...

Wait, wait, wait.

The title doesn't seem to match up with what is currently being discussed.

"I am totally supportive of gays, but it shouldn't be allowed for story reasons! It can't possibly make sense!" is an argument I see a lot, but it's pretty easily debunked.

Tali and Garrus set a precedent for characters who were previously not LIs to become LIs. Not only were they not LIs, but they were aliens, and thus an unorthodox sexual preference. They had no hints of being sexually attracted to humans, just as many other characters have no hints of being sexually attracted to the same gender. Under that precedent established by Garrus and Tali, however, a character can become sexually interested in Shepard, even if its an unorthodox sexual preference, and even if there were no hints of such prior.

The argument is often made that someone is not against homosexuality or homophobic, but simply believe that a character changing their sexual preference, or someone not interested at all later becoming interested, is impossible. The Tali/Garrus precedent seems to solidly contradict that reasoning though.

I asked what reasons based on evidence, precidence, etcetera is there to actively fight against the existence of previously straight characters becoming s/s options in ME3. Someone brought up that, at the very least, Ashley is a previous LI, who was a straight, and couldn't be gay - because she believes in a God. The discussion has turned to validity of that as a reason. The rules of Ashley's religion, while also having a single God, may not be the same as Christianity, Islam, and Judaism. Also, even if the rules were the same, Ashley practices premerital sex, which is also not allowed under those religions - so its established that she doesn't follow the rules of Judeo-Christian religions, and thus not necessarily be averse to homosexuality. There's also the possibility of her being in the closet, in denial, or repressive. Many preachers against homosexuality have turned out to be homosexuals, for example.

Anyway, that's how the discussion has gotten to be where it is at the moment, from the original topic.

Considering those who were against s/s on principle of it being a character betrayal have not bothered to argue against the original argument, it appears people are grasping at any straw they can reach to justify fighting against s/s romance, when I think the real reason is they are just uncomfortable with it being in their game - want as little of it as possible - but don't want to openly say that's their reason.

Overall, the point is, it's looking like the only reason people vehemently oppose s/s romance, or oppose any aspect of it they possibly can, is that they simply don't like "the gays" instead of some non-homophobic or non-antigay reason.

Well said Rojahar. I think this discussion is complete, myself.

[darkangelvxvx]

The valid reason I see for "team Dextro" to be non-homosexual is that... well in Garrus' point of view, he'd be in more constant contact with levo-protein with less of an ability to protect himself form it. Also I dont think he has the proper... *ahem* equipment? for said homosexual interactions. Moreover... if you were a guy would you.. really... want those teeth near you? All kidding aside, I'd assume Garrus would be more birdlike in his orgins similar to a Salarian and posessing a Cloaca rather than a rectum.

As for Tali, she is the daughter of an Admiral, much is expected from her.

Yes its true she's romancable by a human, however that specific human is actually accepted into the flotilla as "her ships captain." Even if not She and Shepard can actually have children is speculative, however, because a Quarian's "sexual dimorphism (or appearance) is similar to humans," its may be actually likely for them to be able to produce a child, just not a healthy one.

More to the point there's the constant fear of Amino-Chirality between her and Shepard, and he needs to "Scrub up," and be careful.

Simple exchanges between men and women of bodily fluids can be prevented, but woman and woman would seem to sterilize the situation, leading to a negative sexual experience, leaving it, not "totally worth it." Moreover, the sheer mechanics of Lesbian sex would be a much higher risk for her than to be presented with heterosexual intercourse with shep, due to a more.. oral... approach. There's also the risk of tearing skin on internal skin. Tali getting injuries on the inside and sweat getting into the tears of an under protected hand, even humans have difficulty stopping bleeding "Down there" when things go ary, one would assume, it would be worse for her, with much greater risks.


We all know she got ill from the first encounter, it could be more or less dramatic if it was female to female.

Modifié par darkangelvxvx, 23 août 2011 - 12:52 .

[Destroy Raiden_]

wow I'm surprised this one is still up $20 says BW will not only lock but delete this thread from the records.

[darkangelvxvx]

Destroy Raiden wrote...

wow I'm surprised this one is still up $20 says BW will not onlylock but delete this thread from the records.

We actually finally got... sort of back on topic... or at least I did

[Sundance31us]

darkangelvxvx wrote...
We actually finally got... sort of back on topic... or at least I did

Things settled once all the growling and hissing calmed.

[darkangelvxvx]

I think they're all reading my scientific approach to the whole ordeal :3

[shepskisaac]

darkangelvxvx wrote...

We actually finally got... sort of back on topic... or at least I did

In such anatomic and body fluids details that no one will want to touch that post with a 10 feet pole, no offense

[darkangelvxvx]

Well people wanted the mechanics, so... yea... *shrugs and chuckles*





PS.. Win

Modifié par darkangelvxvx, 23 août 2011 - 01:08 .

[Sundance31us]

IsaacShep wrote...
In such anatomic and body fluids details that no one will want to touch that post with a 10 feet pole, no offense

[darkangelvxvx]

I think I made people not want to have sex... ever.

Imagine Garrus coming on to Shep now! 

Modifié par darkangelvxvx, 23 août 2011 - 01:11 .

[RiouHotaru]

LilyasAvalon wrote...

Sometimes, interest in a person just takes a while to develop anyway, so Kaidan or Ash being an S/S LI is possible.

It's not a case of 'I was hiding my gay', it's more a case of 'I wasn't sure how I felt at that time... and then you... you know died'.

This.  Because honestly, just because a person doesn't come right out and say it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.  The characters are already well established and well-cemented in terms of personality and development.  Anything after that is just icing-on-the-cake and fluff.

Besides, would it truly and honestly damage Garrus or Tali's character if they were determined to be bisexual?  Would it damage Kaidan or Ashley's characters?  No.  Because it's not the focus of their character.  Their sexuality is an afterthought.

[shepskisaac]

darkangelvxvx wrote...

PS.. Win

In "Talimancers are the biggest hypocrites on BSN" contest? Sure win!

[darkangelvxvx]

 Tali mancer or not, I dont want that near my doodle

Modifié par darkangelvxvx, 23 août 2011 - 01:16 .

[Sundance31us]

I have a Talimancer image, but been reluctant to use it for fear of repercussions.

[Sundance31us]

darkangelvxvx wrote...
*snip*

Another reason not to play femShep.

[Ianamus]

darkangelvxvx wrote...

:Sinpped. For the love of God, Snipped:

Tali mancer or not, I dont want that near my doodle

God thats scary 

Sundance31us wrote...

I have a Talimancer image, but been reluctant to use it for fear of repercussions. 

Haha, I want to see it now. Is it that weird foot one?

Modifié par EJ107, 23 août 2011 - 01:20 .

[shepskisaac]

darkangelvxvx wrote...

 Tali mancer or not, I dont want that near my doodle

But you want Tali, who knows what's under that suit, especially "down there"...