528 réponses à ce sujet

[Bcuz]

KaidanWilliamsShepard wrote...

Well, i can honestly say, that "Bioware Co-founder" may not have said that if they were not owned by EA. Thats just my opinion. Man, wouldnt it be cool if they still made RPGs? But the past is the past.

Vague post is still vague, and likely troll is likely trolling.

[Sepewrath]

luk4s3d wrote...

I agree.

To often these days dev's put features in just because they're "supposed" to, not because they belong there, or they believe in them. Creativity is being stifled in the Games industry!

Agreed, everything from armor, customization, even the class system is not something that MUST be in a game from a development standpoint. But its things that must be in a game to appease people preconceptions about what an RPG should be. This is why I say BW needs to stop listening to what people demand and do what they want. If the current audience doesn't want to play it, there are plenty of other gamers in the world.

[LoK-y-Yo]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...
Wrong, wrong , and wrong. There is no such thing as an rpg game. Only games with role playing elements. Some have more, some have less. Others have some in one way, others in another. There is no exact definition of an rpg.

And the cake was a lie.. And you may or may not exist since I can't see you. And my parent's may or not exist since I can't see them right now. And white is not white.And red is not red. We just call it red. But why not its real name is green. Or brown. Or califrajilisticoespialidoso.

But I think the genres of games are very clearly stablished. Then you can play with them and add a little from here and a little from there. Is Mirror's Edge a shooter?or is it a platform game? Is Portal a shooter? or a puzzle one?

If it looks like an RPG, smells like and RPG and speaks like and RPG then maybe is an RPG. But if it does not, then it isnt.

[Bcuz]

Sepewrath wrote...

luk4s3d wrote...

I agree.

To often these days dev's put features in just because they're "supposed" to, not because they belong there, or they believe in them. Creativity is being stifled in the Games industry!

Agreed, everything from armor, customization, even the class system is not something that MUST be in a game from a development standpoint. But its things that must be in a game to appease people preconceptions about what an RPG should be. This is why I say BW needs to stop listening to what people demand and do what they want. If the current audience doesn't want to play it, there are plenty of other gamers in the world.

Your post confuses me, you are saying that welcome bonuses such as customization are not welcome?

[Rockworm503]

Sepewrath wrote...

luk4s3d wrote...

I agree.

To often these days dev's put features in just because they're "supposed" to, not because they belong there, or they believe in them. Creativity is being stifled in the Games industry!

Agreed, everything from armor, customization, even the class system is not something that MUST be in a game from a development standpoint. But its things that must be in a game to appease people preconceptions about what an RPG should be. This is why I say BW needs to stop listening to what people demand and do what they want. If the current audience doesn't want to play it, there are plenty of other gamers in the world.

Ironic isn't it?  the crazy RPG nuts who refuse to let go of these things.  Yet its us so called "stupid shooter fans"  who just want an enjoyable game.

[Kusy]

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

Mr.Kusy wrote...

The Big Bad Wolf wrote...

Wrong, wrong , and wrong. There is no such thing as an rpg game. Only games with role playing elements. Some have more, some have less. Others have some in one way, others in another. There is no exact definition of an rpg.

Where Da Hood
Where Da Hood
Where Da Hood At...
this is all I have to tell you untill you change your avatar bro.

You can fire your lazor at me at best.

You mean this is all I have to tell me until you can come up with a better argument.

And honestly, your post just makes little sense. "RPG" is a genre of games. You cannot argue with that. It is used in the industry to describe a set of certain features and systems. Again, it's like saying there are no drama movies, just movies that are more or less dramatic. 

Modifié par Mr.Kusy, 23 août 2011 - 01:29 .

[flemm]

Well, as a longtime fan of games called "RPGs," I love the direction of the Mass Effect series. (I actually only got around to playing through both games quite recently.)

Traditionally, "RPGs" contain a lot of clunky design and busy work to go along with fairly boring gameplay. I'm willing to deal with that for the overall experience of the story and immersive world, but if the design can be cleaned up and the gameplay improved, then I'm all for it.

ME2 has just about the perfect balance between gameplay, characters and story imo. The individual elements are not perfect (they never could be, there will always be room for improvement), but in this game I am either doing meaningful plot and character stuff, or I am enjoying myself blowing up my foes. That's fun. More please.

Or scanning planets tbh (glaring exception).

Modifié par flemm, 23 août 2011 - 01:30 .

[Rockworm503]

Bcuz wrote...

Sepewrath wrote...

luk4s3d wrote...

I agree.

To often these days dev's put features in just because they're "supposed" to, not because they belong there, or they believe in them. Creativity is being stifled in the Games industry!

Agreed, everything from armor, customization, even the class system is not something that MUST be in a game from a development standpoint. But its things that must be in a game to appease people preconceptions about what an RPG should be. This is why I say BW needs to stop listening to what people demand and do what they want. If the current audience doesn't want to play it, there are plenty of other gamers in the world.

Your post confuses me, you are saying that welcome bonuses such as customization are not welcome?

Saying their not a MUST.  They are more then welcome additions but it doesn't make or break the game.

[Bcuz]

KaidanWilliamsShepard wrote...

Man i just cant win hugh, funny how trolls call me a troll instead.

The problem is you were just raging, or were apearing to be doing so.

Perhaps I should clarify, that all I wanted was for you to clarify, and after 2 posts of not doing so, it seemed likely you were merely trolling.

Saying "man I wish they still made RPGs" well what is wrong or missing about Mass Effect so that we may dicuss? If you simply state your opnion without context it makes little sense.

[marshalleck]

KaidanWilliamsShepard wrote...



Accidental post.

Troll!

[Sepewrath]

Bcuz wrote...

Sepewrath wrote...

Agreed, everything from armor, customization, even the class system is not something that MUST be in a game from a development standpoint. But its things that must be in a game to appease people preconceptions about what an RPG should be. This is why I say BW needs to stop listening to what people demand and do what they want. If the current audience doesn't want to play it, there are plenty of other gamers in the world.

Your post confuses me, you are saying that welcome bonuses such as customization are not welcome?

No what I'm saying is if customization doesn't flow with the particular idea the dev has come up with, they shouldn't force it in because "Its a shooter, if it doesn't have customization" I don't support development standards, because are no universal guidelines for a great game. Lets just say God of War, its not less of a game, because I cant have Kratos wear something besides his lion cloth.

[Bcuz]

Rockworm503 wrote...

Bcuz wrote...

Sepewrath wrote...

luk4s3d wrote...

I agree.

To often these days dev's put features in just because they're "supposed" to, not because they belong there, or they believe in them. Creativity is being stifled in the Games industry!

Agreed, everything from armor, customization, even the class system is not something that MUST be in a game from a development standpoint. But its things that must be in a game to appease people preconceptions about what an RPG should be. This is why I say BW needs to stop listening to what people demand and do what they want. If the current audience doesn't want to play it, there are plenty of other gamers in the world.

Your post confuses me, you are saying that welcome bonuses such as customization are not welcome?

Saying their not a MUST.  They are more then welcome additions but it doesn't make or break the game.

Ah now I see. Well I think that BioWare is smart enough... well... I hope they are... to realize that when people on any internet forum I have ever seen or are likely to see, when people say
"You must do _____ for _____ -company name- "

It is more about what people would love to see, not a making or breaking feature.

[Kusy]

flemm wrote...

Well, as a longtime fan of games called "RPGs," I love the direction of the Mass Effect series [...]

[...] ME2 has just about the perfect balance between gameplay, characters and story imo. The individual elements are not perfect (they never could be, there will always be room for improvement), but in this game I am either doing meaningful plot and character stuff, or I am enjoying myself blowing up my foes. That's fun. More please.

Then maybee as a longtime fan of games called "RPGs" you never found time to play with other genres. Because then it might hit you that Mass Effect 2 had incredibly bad gameplay compared to AAA tiles where the main point is blowing up yor foes. There are games that can delliver a fascinating, deep and rich story AND deliver in the mechanics department. For shooter mechanics look at Battlefield series. And for games that managed to balance fascinating storyline with great gameplay mechanics check out GTA4, Red Dead Redemption, Assassin's Creed series and many more.

My only point is - when you want to go into another direction, it's only natural that you substract from one part of the game... but it would be quite nice to add the same ammount into another department that you focused on. Mass Effect 2 was striped from those "clunky, annoying and pointless" features those bad oldschool RPG fans loved but there was nothing given to people who actualy know how a shooter looks. 

Of course it's a topic for debate because obviously it found it's customer niche.

Modifié par Mr.Kusy, 23 août 2011 - 01:39 .

[Weiser_Cain]

Greg Zeschuk takes the hand that feeds him, lovingly wraps it in italian bread and bites the hell out of it.

[Jaron Oberyn]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

KaidanWilliamsShepard wrote...

The Escapist article: "BioWare co-founder says RPG's are becoming less relevant...

Is it because people are becoming less intelligent?
What do i win?

This just made me ralise. Why are you people arguing that BioWare is making an evoultion of RPG when their co founder just said that they are actualy more into dumping that genre?

This. Also, what I think Bioware fails to realize is that an oustanding percentage of their sales comes from their RPG fanbase who has been with them since the beginning, because they make RPG's. If you want to ****** off your core fanbase, the fanbase who made you who you are today, by telling them the genre they've supported all these years is useless, be prepared for a lighter wallet the next time you launch a game. I can't exactly say that game would be ME3, because a lot of people were invested in that since ME1, but don't expect so much sales from future titles given your continuous irreverence for the people who keep you employed. Do you honestly think that Mass Effect would have done so well if only the people who played CoD bought it? If you think that by adding shooter elements into the game will make people who play CoD purchase your game you are more naive than I thought.

I can assure you that if your core fanbase didn't even purchase one copy of your Mass Effect games, and you marketed it the same way you're marketing it now, you wouldn't be bragging about how many copies it sold. Kicking dirt in the faces of the people who made you what you are today is not the way to go. You've shown that you aren't loyal to the people who've supported you since the beginning of your game career. Where were the CoD fanboys when you released your earliest titles? Where are they now? I'll admit you might have gotten a handful of people interested in it after watering down the RPG elements, but for your sake that's not something to get cocky about.

We've already got a marker oversaturated with shooters, what makes you think that an RPG developer trying to become a shooter developer will be any better than a company with a reputation as a shooter dev eloper?
You have a marketing director who continues to insult your core fanbase, you've made many remarks over the past few years about how you want to gear your games over towards the CoD crowd, and now this? It's as if you're on a campaign to ****** off your fans as much as you can.

I see a bunch of CoD players who are scared to even touch Mass Effect because of the dialogue wheel. You've already stripped some of it out in ME2 with the automatic dialogue every now and then, progressing the game into the action/adventure genre with a preset character. Apparently that's not good enough because they still hate the conversations. So what, are you going to throw out the entire conversation wheel that you innovated and substitute it with 100% automatic dialogue from a preset Shepard? You picked a fine time to change genres on us, right in the middle of the trilogy. Mass Effect is now a shooter wanabe, and Dragon Age is a Dynasty Warriors clone. Congratulations, you've lost your unique style and have become just like every other developer out there.

-Polite

[flemm]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

Then maybee as a longtime fan of games called "RPGs" you never found time to play with other genres. Because then it might hit you that Mass Effect 2 had incredibly bad gameplay compared to AAA tiles where the main point is blowing up yor foes.

Not at all. I've played a wide variety of other genres, though not exhaustively. While it is true that, where shooter mechanics are concerned, there is much better to be found, that is irrelevant to my original point.

Modifié par flemm, 23 août 2011 - 01:43 .

[Sepewrath]

The Mass Effect series was never striving to be the best shooter ever, that's not possible as long as they confine themselves within "RPG style combat" But what they did do, was take that clunky stuff from ME1 and turn it into far superior, smooth combat in ME2. Was it better than Battlefield, no, but it was never suppose to be. The same Battlefields story isn't better than ME's because it will never attempt to do so.

And GTA4 is terrible, that game is so boring, its like watching paint dry.

[marshalleck]

jreezy wrote...

Nozybidaj wrote...

javierabegazo wrote...

...snip...

What exactly do those comments, or BW games in general, have to do with the rpg genre?

Simple. BioWare refuses to pigeonhole their games into a specific genre. Which is great.

Heh. More like trying to shake off their reputation as an RPG developer, since it's clearly hampering their ability to access the CoD market.

[Kusy]

Sepewrath wrote...

The Mass Effect series was never striving to be the best shooter ever, that's not possible as long as they confine themselves within "RPG style combat" But what they did do, was take that clunky stuff from ME1 and turn it into far superior, smooth combat in ME2. Was it better than Battlefield, no, but it was never suppose to be. The same Battlefields story isn't better than ME's because it will never attempt to do so.

And GTA4 is terrible, that game is so boring, its like watching paint dry.

Oh we could go and look for quotes from marketing materials on how "Mass Effect 2 is offering the shooter fans what they enjoy in their games and holding it's ground to other games from that genre"... yes we could.

Well... when I think about it GTA4 might be a lame example. But RdR and AC stands up to what I said.