528 réponses à ce sujet

[Rockworm503]

KaidanWilliamsShepard wrote...

Rockworm503 wrote...

KaidanWilliamsShepard wrote...

Weiser_Cain wrote...

After Bioware's dead we're all going to look back and wonder how we didn't see it coming.

Alot of us see it coming, its just that no one will listen...including Bioware.

LOL you guys sound like the end of the world people.  Mark your calenders December 21st I think?
The END IS NIGH SHOOTERS ARE A BLIGHT!

HAHA
Well, its Mass Effect dude. GOW in my Mass Effect, is like Whiskey in my Latte.

Hmmm makes me wonder when did the first GoW come out?  ME had a cover shooting in it from the start.  Were you complaining about it then?
Seeing as I don't like Whiskey or coffee.. where does that leave me?  In limbo I guess because by your standards I don't exist.

[shep82]

Sarevok Synder wrote...

Mike2640 wrote...

I'm not saying it didn't outsell ME2, but I question whether it was more profitable. ME2 came out in two years and was very successful. Dragon Age took six years (I think?) to get to shelves? Wildly successful yes and, in my opinion, their best work, but that's a lot of budget to cover.

And yeah, being part of a major publishing company probably did have an effect on where they go business-wise, especially since (I think) EA's in kind of a financial bind lately.

It wasn't actually in full development for six years, but there were people working on it for that period; true. But you can be rest assured DA:O made more profit than ME2. However; you're right EA are not doing well. They need huge successes to recoup the money spent on all their developer acquisitions. ME2's 4 million sales or so simply isn't going to cut it. They are looking for COD's 10 million plus. It's never going to happen.

IT could but not likely. COD fans are very um *thinks of appropriate nickname*
Damn can't do it.

[Mike2640]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

Mike2640 wrote...

Mr.Kusy wrote...

Mike2640 wrote...
And really, from what little i've heard, the game is bland, but has the Star Wars appeal and is, of course, from "The Creators of MASS EFFECT", so it could honestly go either way.

From what little I've heard moon is made of cheese. What we do now? We go argue about why I am wrong or you addmit that the little you know is not enough to judge the matter?

I'm not trying to judge TOR. It's not really something i'm interested in; just repeating what i've heard from the grapevine. I'm just saying that if the game itself is lackluster, the star wars lore coupled with potentially good writing could be enough to keep it going.

Exacly. The Old Republic is going to return investment money in the first or second year feeding only from the hype already build, Star Wars nerds, and BioWare fanboys. Opinions about it being bland is based only on assumptions of people who are, like half of this community resentful towards MMOs and multiplayer in general and hardcore WoW fans, while everyone who had time with the game on a live demo or as a beta tester says otherwise.

Actually I don't got to the TOR boards. I got the bland thing from Rock Paper Shotgun. And while it is incredibly likely that it will make bank, it's not always a sure thing. Star Trek, Lord of the Rings, and Conan are all pretty big properties that did not meet a huge success with their respective MMOs.


EDIT: Okay I misread your sentence and thought you were refering to the Bioboards community. It's possible that the RPS guys were biased, but it is all opinion in the end, hmm?

Modifié par Mike2640, 23 août 2011 - 02:49 .

[Bcuz]

shep82 wrote...

Sarevok Synder wrote...

Mike2640 wrote...

I'm not saying it didn't outsell ME2, but I question whether it was more profitable. ME2 came out in two years and was very successful. Dragon Age took six years (I think?) to get to shelves? Wildly successful yes and, in my opinion, their best work, but that's a lot of budget to cover.

And yeah, being part of a major publishing company probably did have an effect on where they go business-wise, especially since (I think) EA's in kind of a financial bind lately.

It wasn't actually in full development for six years, but there were people working on it for that period; true. But you can be rest assured DA:O made more profit than ME2. However; you're right EA are not doing well. They need huge successes to recoup the money spent on all their developer acquisitions. ME2's 4 million sales or so simply isn't going to cut it. They are looking for COD's 10 million plus. It's never going to happen.

IT could but not likely. COD fans are very um *thinks of appropriate nickname*
Damn can't do it.

Inexplicable.

[Xeranx]

Bcuz wrote...

Mr.Kusy wrote...

Honestly, some people itt sound like they actually believe that Mass Effect 2 had better story than KOTOR or Mass Effect 1 and that Dragon Age 2 had better story than Dragon Age: Origins... because that's what I understand when you guys keep on saying BioWare is concentrating more on story and less on the clunky mechanics.

Judging from DA2 and ME2 compared to previous games from this stable, they are not focusing on neither of those, instead they talk about it a lot.

Mass Effect 2 did not have as good of a story as ME1 by any means, but what it told, it told and played better than ME1. And honestly, ME2 is more the bridge between the 2 major acts to build up additional story, add context, and develop charicters. (On a semi-related note Liara is not derailment, it's charicter development, if you haven't read the comic please don't even try to say otherwise)

I have to comment on the bold because that's one of the biggest piles of garbage I've read, heard, or seen.  If I have to go outside the main stage of the story for development of a character then whoever's producing the main stage of the story is doing it wrong.  Plain and simple.  If I'm watching a show on television it makes no sense to go and read a book in order to find out more about why a character is acting a certain way.  That should be included in the show.  The only time I should have to go elsewhere to get more story/exposition is if said series is cancelled and there's books or comics that continue said story or expound on the character after the series' cancellation.

[Il Divo]

Sarevok Synder wrote...


It wasn't actually in full development for six years, but there were people working on it for that period; true. But you can be rest assured DA:O made more profit than ME2. However; you're right EA are not doing well. They need huge successes to recoup the money spent on all their developer acquisitions. ME2's 4 million sales or so simply isn't going to cut it. They are looking for COD's 10 million plus. It's never going to happen.

But does that take into account the costs associated with development? We don't really have specifics on how much resources was spent for Origins, but on the surface level 3 million sales with a 5 year development cycle seems less impressive than 2 million sales with a 2 year development cycle, though I could be wrong.

[Bcuz]

KaidanWilliamsShepard wrote...

Bcuz wrote...

Note the AFTER ME3.

ME3, ya. From preorders alone they probably already have a hit on their hands.
What comes after? Well once all the DLCs are done and over with and Bioware goes onto its next projects, it's going to be difficult to live up to ME's standard.

Exactly!
I mean, they ARE still begrudgingly keeping some things in ME3 that the core fans have protested against getting rid of. Once Mass Effect ends, the ENTIRE Bioware fanbase will change, and they may just end up slowly burning out, you know? When they just made RPGs and were their own company, they had a more secure operation, now they have hit the "big time" and they are going to be forced to change like every year, and they just need to be real careful now i guess.

Not at all what I meant but you are entitled to your delu... opinion...

[Mike2640]

shep82 wrote...

Sarevok Synder wrote...

Mike2640 wrote...

I'm not saying it didn't outsell ME2, but I question whether it was more profitable. ME2 came out in two years and was very successful. Dragon Age took six years (I think?) to get to shelves? Wildly successful yes and, in my opinion, their best work, but that's a lot of budget to cover.

And yeah, being part of a major publishing company probably did have an effect on where they go business-wise, especially since (I think) EA's in kind of a financial bind lately.

It wasn't actually in full development for six years, but there were people working on it for that period; true. But you can be rest assured DA:O made more profit than ME2. However; you're right EA are not doing well. They need huge successes to recoup the money spent on all their developer acquisitions. ME2's 4 million sales or so simply isn't going to cut it. They are looking for COD's 10 million plus. It's never going to happen.

IT could but not likely. COD fans are very um *thinks of appropriate nickname*
Damn can't do it.

If so then, yeah, i'm not sure why they aren't sticking to a more DAO formula. Maybe they just figure the Golden Goose game, ala Modern Warfare 2, is more likely to come from a shooter?

[Rockworm503]

KaidanWilliamsShepard wrote...

Rockworm503 wrote...

KaidanWilliamsShepard wrote...

Rockworm503 wrote...

Weiser_Cain wrote...

After Bioware's become bigger than ever we're all going to look back and laugh at all the naysayers .

Yes I agree.

Hmm...Well, at some point, they will start making games that even COD nor RPG fans will want to play.
You never know man...

Yes because Cod and RPG fans are the only fans in existance.

Edit: "games that no one will like"...

You don't know either.  Your saying right now that Bioware is going to go out of business because they alienated a bunch of cry babies who need RPGs or they'll be cranky. 
How dare nintendo put mario in 3D that changes the entire concept and alienated 2D platformer fans.
How dare any company ever do anything different ever.  Because I for one don't want to play the same games forever.  And I don't think any game company wants to make the same games forever.

[Il Divo]

Now now, children, let's settle down. Else I'll be forced to get out my beating stick...

[Boiny Bunny]

Il Divo wrote...

Sarevok Synder wrote...


It wasn't actually in full development for six years, but there were people working on it for that period; true. But you can be rest assured DA:O made more profit than ME2. However; you're right EA are not doing well. They need huge successes to recoup the money spent on all their developer acquisitions. ME2's 4 million sales or so simply isn't going to cut it. They are looking for COD's 10 million plus. It's never going to happen.

But does that take into account the costs associated with development? We don't really have specifics on how much resources was spent for Origins, but on the surface level 3 million sales with a 5 year development cycle seems less impressive than 2 million sales with a 2 year development cycle, though I could be wrong.

You'd be surprised.  The cost of producing a game is a function of many variables, time obviously being a prominant one, but certainly not the only one.  The size of the respective development teams is an important one.

I don't believe anybody outside of Bioware or EA can literally state without a doubt that Origins made more or less profit than ME2.  What we do know is that it sold more copies, by quite a margin.  That doesn't necessarily mean more profit though.

At any rate, ME3 will probably become Bioware's best selling game to date, I'm guessing with about 3.5 million sales after a few years.  It will never ever, even come close to 10 million.  Those sorts of numbers are more or less exclusive to very specific franchises (e.g. Mario, CoD, all Blizzard games, etc.)

[Bcuz]

KaidanWilliamsShepard wrote...

Rockworm503 wrote...


Hmmm makes me wonder when did the first GoW come out?  ME had a cover shooting in it from the start.  Were you complaining about it then?
Seeing as I don't like Whiskey or coffee.. where does that leave me?  In limbo I guess because by your standards I don't exist.

??? What? Whiskey was a metaphor for GOW and Coffee was a metaphor for Mass Effect, and i am sure you like both. So you do exist.

I havent found something worthy of this in a long time...
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[Rockworm503]

KaidanWilliamsShepard wrote...

Rockworm503 wrote...


Hmmm makes me wonder when did the first GoW come out?  ME had a cover shooting in it from the start.  Were you complaining about it then?
Seeing as I don't like Whiskey or coffee.. where does that leave me?  In limbo I guess because by your standards I don't exist.

??? What? Whiskey was a metaphor for GOW and Coffee was a metaphor for Mass Effect, and i am sure you like both. So you do exist.

I don't like GoW.  Played the first one at a friends house..  A game I can beat at my friends house isn't exactly something to get excited over IMO.
But what I will say this is that GoW got the Shooting and the Cover down right.  More importantly I like Uncharted (find it much more fun than GoW)  and that has great shooter cover stuff too.
My entire point from day one has been Mass Effect has never been a straight up RPG.  A game series that has guns from the moment you start it up and people are complaining about it having shooter elements in it LOL.

This is the same as going to GTA forums and complaining that there are too many cars.

[Sarevok Synder]

Mike2640 wrote...

If so then, yeah, i'm not sure why they aren't sticking to a more DAO formula. Maybe they just figure the Golden Goose game, ala Modern Warfare 2, is more likely to come from a shooter?

Despite its success (it sold over 5 million copies) it's no COD and that's what they want. But it's not going to happen.

II Divo wrote.....

But does that take into account the costs associated with development? We don't really have specifics on how much resources was spent for Origins, but on the surface level 3 million sales with a 5 year development cycle seems less impressive than 2 million sales with a 2 year development cycle, though I could be wrong.

Welcome to EA’s business model; minimum development effort and time; maximum profit. DA:O made a lot more money than ME2. But if you break it down to profit vs development time it made less. I don’t know about you; but I prefer my games to be made well no matter how long it takes. DA2 is a perfect example of EA’s influence.

Modifié par Sarevok Synder, 23 août 2011 - 03:15 .

[SojournerN7]

What I get out of the article is that Bioware doesn't want to get locked into labelling their games as RPGs or Shooters or otherwise, so their games don't fall into a categorized paradigm where you end up with a "CoD fans vs RPG fans [bs]" argument for every single game.

Granted, the way it was said in that RPGs are becoming less relevent wasn't the best way to say it, but its terribly easy to take something way out of context or even mis-quote. What I see bioware trying to do is to get away from labelling their games under a category, and just create games that have creative storytelling.

javierabegazo wrote...
Less about Sacred Cows and conventions and more about creative techniques and Storytelling.

Modifié par Sojourner83, 23 août 2011 - 02:54 .

[Il Divo]

Boiny Bunny wrote...

You'd be surprised.  The cost of producing a game is a function of many variables, time obviously being a prominant one, but certainly not the only one.  The size of the respective development teams is an important one.

I don't believe anybody outside of Bioware or EA can literally state without a doubt that Origins made more or less profit than ME2.  What we do know is that it sold more copies, by quite a margin.  That doesn't necessarily mean more profit though.

At any rate, ME3 will probably become Bioware's best selling game to date, I'm guessing with about 3.5 million sales after a few years.  It will never ever, even come close to 10 million.  Those sorts of numbers are more or less exclusive to very specific franchises (e.g. Mario, CoD, all Blizzard games, etc.)

Fair point. However much I may love Bioware games, the 10 mil mark is probably impossible in their current incarnation.

[Bcuz]

Sarevok Synder wrote...

Mike2640 wrote...

If so then, yeah, i'm not sure why they aren't sticking to a more DAO formula. Maybe they just figure the Golden Goose game, ala Modern Warfare 2, is more likely to come from a shooter?

Despite it's sucess (it sold over 5 million copies) it's no COD and that's what they want. But it's not going to happen.

Not to stall this thread for the runtime of this video but...
http://www.escapistm...to-EA-Marketing

EA has no shame, and will not resort to making a good game in order to gain financial success.

[Rockworm503]

KaidanWilliamsShepard wrote...

@Rockworm503 I can see you are trying to start an argument with me, (don't know why) but i am not interested...sorry. I think Polite said it the best. "Game changed so dramatically in the middle of the series and so on"...I am not against change.

Oh ok you have nothing worthy of discussing and when someone actually tries to debate with you "I'm trying to argue with you"

[slimgrin]

The problem is, Bioware hasn't been all that creative in story telling and quest design. They pretty much use the same formula for each game. So spouting off about relevance and evolution in RPG's seems a bit misplaced when other devs are more progressive in this regard.