619 réponses à ce sujet

[Dave of Canada]

Depends entirely on the situation and what you've done with Orzammar. King Harrowmont might indirectly assist the mages, he's cut contact with the surface and the only people who'd be capable of giving Lyrium to the Templar would be smugglers (who wouldn't be that great to rely on).

King Bhelen on the other hand has shown himself interested in profit, talking with citizens in Kirkwall leads them to mention that Orzammar has trade contracts with people throughout Thedas. Any anti-mage / pro-Chantry Noble or Royal can easily fund the Templar army's lyrium addictions with their contract.

Though on the flip side, Mages without lyrium can't cast their uber spells without resorting to Blood Magic and their unlikely to have sources providing it to them unless the Lucrosians fund it.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 24 août 2011 - 12:36 .

[TEWR]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Depends entirely on the situation and what you've done with Orzammar. King Harrowmont might indirectly assist the mages, he's cut contact with the surface and the only people who'd be capable of giving Lyrium to the Templar would be smugglers (who wouldn't be that great to rely on).

King Bhelen on the other hand has shown himself interested in profit, talking with citizens in Kirkwall leads them to mention that Orzammar has trade contracts with people throughout Thedas. Any anti-mage / pro-Chantry Noble or Royal can easily fund the Templar army's lyrium addictions with their contract.

Though on the flip side, Mages without lyrium can't cast their uber spells without resorting to Blood Magic and their unlikely to have sources providing it to them unless the Lucrosians fund it.

Bhelen's interested in more than just profit. He's also interested in fighting the Darkspawn. He would be a fool to think that mages wouldn't be able to help.

He also has connections with the Carta topside, and could use those connections to help the mages even more.

Harrowmont would probably just try and make compromises and stay neutral throughout the whole thing, though I doubt that would do much for him. The Templars might not like that, and I'm willing to bet the Dwarven nobility wouldn't either. Mages are iffy on how they'd react.

[Dave of Canada]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

Bhelen's interested in more than just profit.

Of course, though he's shown himself a shrewd businessman while ruling Orzammar.

He has contracts with everybody throughout Thedas, he's unlikely to refuse one noble's demands because they're claiming lyrium for the Templar.

Same thing with the mages, he'll likely help them as much as he would the Templar though that would depend entirely on if other nobles would cut off from using Orzammar's trade because Bhelen is assisting mages.

Would he really risk involving Orzammar in something that could doom Orzammar (by providing for a war he might not win) and cut off some contacts he has with the surface?

He also has connections with the Carta topside, and could use those connections to help the mages even more.

As could the Templar.

Harrowmont would probably just try and make compromises and stay neutral throughout the whole thing, though I doubt that would do much for him.

He cut himself off from the service entirely, chances are he'd not give a damn at all about the Templar or the Mages. He wouldn't have to stay neutral in this case, as he wouldn't be providing anything for either side. Chances are, this fate would probably damage the Templar ranks a lot more as they'd likely lose any chance of getting lyrium outside of smugglers.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 24 août 2011 - 12:58 .

[dragonflight288]

I think the mages chances depend entirely on the opening strategy of the war.

The first priority must be to either destroy or control the lyrium and phylactery stores. If every mage in a circle attacked, the templars would be overrun. They are not unbeatable. In my opinion, the only thing that gives templars so much power over mages is the psychological ingrained beliefs of both the mages and the templars. Remove the phylacteries and the mages can't be touched. Remove the lyrium and the mages have access to incredibly powerful rituals alongside depriving templars of their addiction.

Once that is done, the second thing to do was would be to lay low. Don't openly attack the templars at all. In fact, go out of the way to avoid them. The templar army vastly outnumbers the mages, and they have a structured military organization. In the first few months or even couple of years, any conflict with the templars would be suicide.

But if the templars, operating under chantry rule, no longer can find mages, they will be forced to break laws of kingdoms and the chantry in order to crack down on the apostates. They will grow desperate for lyrium. Smugglers charging exorbitant prices cannot possibly supply an army....it just isn't possible. The organization and disciplined structure of the army will crumble like a pyramid of cards without a strong, solid foundation. A foundation called lyrium.

In order to get it, many templars will rape and pillage across the land in order to get their fix. The people, once seeing templars as holy defenders will now see mindless brutes and thugs demanding all their valuables in order to get their fix. They will seem less and less like holy warriors in the eyes of the people. Many may even see this as a betrayal on the Chantries part because a thousand years the templars have claimed to be so, and have been associated with the Chantry (that's just my opinion).

When the mages come forward, they will not seem like the Maker-cursed beings they had been portrayed as by the Chantry but as powerful allies and possible protectors from the templar rampages, potentially giving them a great deal of popular support.

So yes....the mages do have a good chance if the war goes on long enough. There are risks with that as Thedas will be divided to a breaking point, the templars being religous zealots for the most part and not moral upright citizens. They will see themselves acting in the Maker's name even as they commit horrible atrocities.

I also see blood magic and abominations running rampant whenever templars find mages in hiding.

Time is definitely NOT on the Templars side, but discipline and training is not on the mages either. It's a gamble, but I'm confidant in the chances.

[Conduit0]

It seems to me we're missing too much information because things don't quite add up right now. To begin with, why did one failed annulment lead to all the Circles rebelling? Sure I could see a failed annulment emboldening a couple Circles into trying their luck, but not all or even most for that matter. So it seems to me that Kirkwall sparked another even bigger event that actually lead to a total mage rebellion.

Another question is, why did the Templar abandon the Chantry? That one really doesn't make sense, many people are simply assuming they went rogue to fight the mages on their own terms, but I can't really see that as making sense. The only way that makes any sense is if the Chantry tried to pursue a peaceful resolution to the rebellion and the Templars in their zealous blood lust decided they wanted wholesale mage slaughter instead. Now I'm sure theres mage hating zealots within the Templar ranks,(we already got to see some of them) but its hard to imagine that theres enough of them in sufficient positions of influence to get the entirety of the Templar order to defect.

Third, theres the entire fact that the mage rebellion even succeeded in the first place. There are enough Templars at each Circle to enact an annulment if one is required and only one annulment has ever failed, Meredith's, and her annulment only failed thanks to her being madder than a hatter and the Templar going, "screw this, we're out of here" after Hawke kills her. So its hard to believe that even if the mages of a circle rebelled en masse, they would be successful at overthrowing their Templar watchers.

[Neminea]

The question as to why the templars rebelled keeps nagging me, it's annoying!
Were they losing and turning tail?
Did the lyrium run out?
*insert a couple more of plausible reasons*
MEH!

[The dead fish]

LobselVith8 wrote...

We don't have the information we need to make an accurate analysis, but it seems like the mages have been holding their own, since every remaining Circle of Magi managed to emancipate themselves from being under the control of the Chantry of Andraste and the Order of Templars. If it was as simple as the templars winning, Cassandra wouldn't be trying to get the mages to negotiate with them and the world wouldn't be "on the brink of war." Hardly sounds like it'll be as one-sided as some people think.

This.

[T3H Fish]

I agree with the fact that there isn't enough information given to make any sort of accurate judgments or assumptions, but that's the point of having discussions like this, right?

I can see reasons for the Templars rebelling from the Chantry. Look at Thrask, he and several other Templars defected because he wanted mages and templars to live and work alongside each other and not in fear of one another. Unfortunately, he was betrayed and died for it. Some Templars may not have agreed with the policies of the Chantry and the Templar Orders, but it's not like they couldn't openly speak out and make a difference about it. Others may not have liked how the Chantry was handling the rebellions, so they broke from the Order to become rouge hunters of their own, killing mages indiscriminately just because they hate and mistrust mages so much. Others stood by the Chantry.

I am also puzzled by why ALL the Circles are said to have rebelled. I can't imagine the Ferelden Circle rebelling after Uldred's failed attempt at taking it over, whether the Hero annuls the Circle or saves it. There weren't a lot of surviving mages left, so their numbers would have been severely diminished, unless they received the majority of the misplaced mages from the Starkhaven Circle. Also, why would the Templar Orders have had a hard time stopping the rebellions when they first started? Any mages that escaped, their phylacteries are stored elsewhere, only apprentice phylacteries are stored in the Circle themselves (just guessing), so the mages would be easy to track and put down.

There's a big missing piece that's been cleverly hidden to leave all of us in the dark.

[Urzon]

Either the Chantry or some new very scary outside influence is riling up all the mages and templars. It would take alot of work and time to pressure all the mage Circles to think that open rebellion might be a good idea. Since, there would have been a good chance of death if mages even thought of the idea in the past.

Not to mention, the templars breaking away from the Chantry is HUGE. Templar's whole life seem to revolve around the the worship of the Maker and the Chant. For them to break away from the Chantry... Something very big and bad must be influencing a huge number of people around the Thedas. I'm guessing an higher being of some kind.

Flemeth?
The Old Gods?

My guess is Fen'Harel. Since he is best know for walking inbetween to opposing factions and playing them against one another.,,, Does that sound like the Mages and the Templar conflict anyone?

[dragonflight288]

It seems to me we're missing too much information because things don't quite add up right now. To begin with, why did one failed annulment lead to all the Circles rebelling? Sure I could see a failed annulment emboldening a couple Circles into trying their luck, but not all or even most for that matter. So it seems to me that Kirkwall sparked another even bigger event that actually lead to a total mage rebellion.

I think it has less to do with the Right of Annulment but why it happened. Anders was an apostate right there in front of the Knight-Commander. He committed the crime in front of everyone, and instead the entire Circle is punished for a crime they didn't commit. If I were a First Enchanter, I would call a meeting with the Senior Enchanters right there and say, "If the templars will kill us because of someone not related to us will do, what chance do we have if we maintain the status quo?"

Most Circles will lose their sense of security that the templars allegedly give them from the outside world when a RoA is called for a crime not committed by the Circle. Every other (limited) time in history it was because the Circle itself was irredeemable. In this case, it was an Annulment called with no evidence of wrong doing.

[SkittlesKat96]

Its hard to tell but a little speculation doesn't hurt.

Magic is very powerful and capable of great and destructive things.
The mages will stand a chance if:
1. The work together.
2. Have another group helping them / outside support.

Possible groups that could help the mages:
Grey Wardens - I highly highly doubt it but still, I remember hearing something somewhere about the the Grey Wardens being in urgent need of mages or something.

The Dalish - The Chantry are complete pricks to the Dalish iirc, maybe something will happen that will actually strengthen and unite the Dalish clans. The Dalish also have their own mages and blood mages I'm pretty sure. Some that are very powerful and could teach the Circle mages powerful things. They would be a very valuable ally.

The Dwarves - Maybe the Orzammar dwarves might supply the templars with lyrium but its possible that they could lean either way, Bhelen probably dislikes the Templars and Chantry, because they preach about the maker and care nothing for the dwarves and etc. the mages on the other hand he'd probably see as being worth keeping, after all mages are good at fighting Darkspawn. I think though that if Harrowmont is in power he would just ignore what is happening. Also here is an interesting theory:
Perhaps if you opened up the Chantry in Orzammar in DAO then that means more Dwarves in Orzammar are willing to support the Templars? I'm not sure if that would make sense or if Bioware even put that quest in the import flags but still.

Tevinter Imperium - Mind you I haven't done any reading on the DAO codex or wiki or payed attention much to the Tevinter Imperium, but I don't see why it wouldn't be possible for them to help out for some reason.

The countries of Thedas - Most of the common people probably fear magic and most governments would probably see Mages as a threat but still, we've yet to learn about all the countries in Thedas. Maybe Ferelden will help the mages depending on who is ruling. Mind you though that Ferelden is pretty weakened after the Blight.

Also considering the Mages have already overthrown most of the Circles in Thedas I think that means that the Mages are doing a pretty good job.

Last of all I agree that the phylacteries and lyrium will be involved too, I have nothing to say about that though.

Modifié par SkittlesKat96, 24 août 2011 - 04:19 .

[T3H Fish]

SkittlesKat96 wrote...

Perhaps if you opened up the Chantry in Orzammar in DAO then that means more Dwarves in Orzammar are willing to support the Templars? I'm not sure if that would make sense or if Bioware even put that quest in the import flags but still.

If you helped establish the Chantry in Orzammar, during the  Epilouge it's mentioned that tensions between the conservatives and the rapidly growing influx of converters caused problems and Brother Burkel is slain while being arrested. The news reaches the Divine and starts rumors of an Exalted March being led against Orzammar, even though the incident was an accicent.

I'm sure the dwarves will play some role, either for the templars or mages or even both, especially if Bhelen is king. The conflict would affect surface trade a great deal.

Modifié par T3H Fish, 24 août 2011 - 04:34 .

[CrimsonZephyr]

dragonflight288 wrote...

It seems to me we're missing too much information because things don't quite add up right now. To begin with, why did one failed annulment lead to all the Circles rebelling? Sure I could see a failed annulment emboldening a couple Circles into trying their luck, but not all or even most for that matter. So it seems to me that Kirkwall sparked another even bigger event that actually lead to a total mage rebellion.

I think it has less to do with the Right of Annulment but why it happened. Anders was an apostate right there in front of the Knight-Commander. He committed the crime in front of everyone, and instead the entire Circle is punished for a crime they didn't commit. If I were a First Enchanter, I would call a meeting with the Senior Enchanters right there and say, "If the templars will kill us because of someone not related to us will do, what chance do we have if we maintain the status quo?"

Most Circles will lose their sense of security that the templars allegedly give them from the outside world when a RoA is called for a crime not committed by the Circle. Every other (limited) time in history it was because the Circle itself was irredeemable. In this case, it was an Annulment called with no evidence of wrong doing.

Totally this. The Kirkwall annulment was about precedent. Forget for a moment the blood mages that were present in the streets of Lowtown, as Hawke did not know about them and Meredith had no conclusive proof they existed. Anders, an apostate, committed an act of terrorism and the entire, uninvolved Circle of Magi is punished for it. Orsino even calls Anders out for his actions and condemns them. As soon as the rest of the Circles hear about this, pretty much one thing would go through their minds: it could happen to them.

Also, having all fourteen Circles rebelling at the same time is beyond anything the Templars have ever faced before. Annulments are one-sided bloodbaths within a single circle where most mages are already incapacitated due to demon magic or possession. The fact that all of the Circles are rebelling after only three years, and the Chantry is on the verge of collapse, indicates the mages have been doing all right for themselves.

[dragonflight288]

Yup. And, having all the Circles rebel at once would make all the templars worried. May even give them motivation to leave the Chantry, especially if they are seeking a peaceful solution when the religious zealots would only see apostates. That or the Knight-Vigilant is similar to Meredith and ordered it. Can't say without seeing more.

[Syl the Third 2]

Yeah and I don't think Morrigan's child that supposedly has the soul of an old god will help the templars. If this person or thing will help the mages, the mages chances are not that bad.

[Sepewrath]

Conduit0 wrote...
Another question is, why did the Templar abandon the Chantry? That one really doesn't make sense, many people are simply assuming they went rogue to fight the mages on their own terms, but I can't really see that as making sense.

Third, theres the entire fact that the mage rebellion even succeeded in the first place. There are enough Templars at each Circle to enact an annulment if one is required and only one annulment has ever failed, Meredith's.

I doubt that is why they would have rebeled, I'm thinking there was some kind of Chantry betrayal, in those three years that led to them walking out on them.

And as we saw in Ferelden, I don't think there are enough Templar's to annul a Circle on hand. I would guess they get reinforcements from other places before they do it, sealing the Tower with the big doors like Gregoire did. I think Meredith rushing into it and then going crazy is why it didn't work and of course, PC interference.

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...
Until the epilogues are contradicted in some future installment of the franchise, I personally consider them canon.

The
epilogue itself is a contradiction as mine and yours might not be the
same. Then toss in the DLC for Origins and I think its safe to say, you
count on any of it.

[Vicious]

Neither side can win, and that's pretty much the point. It's all setting the stage for future calamities. Thrask said it was supposed to be Mages standing against Demons and Templars protecting them, as opposed to the jailhouse that it devolved into.

I think it will be like that again. A few years of war, veil sundered, Demons everywhere, they will have no choice but to band together or die.

[Conduit0]

CrimsonZephyr wrote...

dragonflight288 wrote...

It seems to me we're missing too much information because things don't quite add up right now. To begin with, why did one failed annulment lead to all the Circles rebelling? Sure I could see a failed annulment emboldening a couple Circles into trying their luck, but not all or even most for that matter. So it seems to me that Kirkwall sparked another even bigger event that actually lead to a total mage rebellion.

I think it has less to do with the Right of Annulment but why it happened. Anders was an apostate right there in front of the Knight-Commander. He committed the crime in front of everyone, and instead the entire Circle is punished for a crime they didn't commit. If I were a First Enchanter, I would call a meeting with the Senior Enchanters right there and say, "If the templars will kill us because of someone not related to us will do, what chance do we have if we maintain the status quo?"

Most Circles will lose their sense of security that the templars allegedly give them from the outside world when a RoA is called for a crime not committed by the Circle. Every other (limited) time in history it was because the Circle itself was irredeemable. In this case, it was an Annulment called with no evidence of wrong doing.

Totally this. The Kirkwall annulment was about precedent. Forget for a moment the blood mages that were present in the streets of Lowtown, as Hawke did not know about them and Meredith had no conclusive proof they existed. Anders, an apostate, committed an act of terrorism and the entire, uninvolved Circle of Magi is punished for it. Orsino even calls Anders out for his actions and condemns them. As soon as the rest of the Circles hear about this, pretty much one thing would go through their minds: it could happen to them.

Also, having all fourteen Circles rebelling at the same time is beyond anything the Templars have ever faced before. Annulments are one-sided bloodbaths within a single circle where most mages are already incapacitated due to demon magic or possession. The fact that all of the Circles are rebelling after only three years, and the Chantry is on the verge of collapse, indicates the mages have been doing all right for themselves.

Still, I don't think that completely adds up, like I said before, I could see a few rebelling either out of fear or emboldened by Kirkwall's successful rebellion, but not all of them, unless something else happened that cemented their fears of the same thing happening to them.

Also I rewatched the Varric and Casandra scenes and few things got me thinking. First of all Varric says, "the Chantry has fallen to pieces and put the world on the brink of war." A mage/templar war would hardly be, "the world" also why would a mage rebellion have the chantry falling apart? Varric also says, "You've already lost all of the Circles and didn't even the Templar rebel against you? I thought you left the Chantry to hunt mages?" He doesn't just say, the Templar left or abandoned, but rather they "rebelled" implying that they didn't simply go rogue, but the Templars actually turned against the Chantry. Also why would the Seekers, the only loyal military power the Chantry apparently has left, be out hunting mages if the Templar were fighting the mages on their own?

I'm thinking the excrement has hit the fan a lot worse than just a mage/templar war. My best guess would be when the mages first began rebelling the Chantry came down way too hard, possibly ordering exalted marches against entire cities simply because the local Circle rebelled.(Liliana said that could happen to Kirkwall after all) This in turn not only solidified the mages intent to rebel, but also caused a schism between the Chantry and various nations who's citizens were being slaughtered in the name of mage control. The Chantry starts losing credibility and begins to look like a bigger threat than even the mages themselves. The Templar sick of the heavy handedness of the Chantry turns against them and the nations of Thedas polarize between those who still support the Chantry and those who are opposed to the Chantry.
 
A Thedas World War if you will.

[Conduit0]

Sepewrath wrote...

Conduit0 wrote...
Another question is, why did the Templar abandon the Chantry? That one really doesn't make sense, many people are simply assuming they went rogue to fight the mages on their own terms, but I can't really see that as making sense.

Third, theres the entire fact that the mage rebellion even succeeded in the first place. There are enough Templars at each Circle to enact an annulment if one is required and only one annulment has ever failed, Meredith's.

I doubt that is why they would have rebeled, I'm thinking there was some kind of Chantry betrayal, in those three years that led to them walking out on them.

And as we saw in Ferelden, I don't think there are enough Templar's to annul a Circle on hand. I would guess they get reinforcements from other places before they do it, sealing the Tower with the big doors like Gregoire did. I think Meredith rushing into it and then going crazy is why it didn't work and of course, PC interference.

Gregoire wasn't waiting for reinforcements, he was waiting for approval. The Ferelden Grand Cleric is most likely in Denerim which is practically on the opposite side of the country from the Tower, so Gregoire had to send a messanger to the Grand Cleric, have her approve the annulment and then wait for the messanger to get back with the approval before he could proceed. Thats why Gregoire grudgingly lets the Warden in, because he knows the longer he has to wait, the worse its going to get.

[Augustei]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

I have to say that the mages have a pretty decent shot at winning this war (though most likely the Qunari will end up invading by DAIII's end, which will end the war), for many reasons:

1) The Aequitarians have begun to throw their lot in with the Libertarians, as seen here. It's hard to say what the Lucrosians will do, if anything. It's my opinion though that all of these fraternity goals will be irrelevant in this war. I think all of the mages will band together to fight. Hell the Lucrosians may use their money to hire mercenary companies to help the mages.
2) The Mages have other allies they could call upon. I'll address this further down, as I'm trying to make this post look neat.
3) Templars can die without their lyrium fix, so you have to take into account how many Templars die from that
4) Templars are recruited for their religious zeal, not their morality. Considering how many Templars abused their authority and even went after the population despite having their lyrium fix, I think it's entirely likely that the rogue Templars will ransack villages. And that will weaken their support
5) Templars are dying left and right in the White Spire that's located in Orlais.
6) Either their leader is going to be the Grand Enchanter (which I doubt) or it's going to be Rhys.
7) The Mages' Collective has been increasing the perception of magic by addressing the peoples' issues before the Chantry gets involved. See here


Now, let me address the allies mages have:

• Mages have their families, if they didn't shun them away when they were revealed to know magic.
  
• The Dalish. This isn't just a simple war between two factions. It's a war of ideologies, beliefs, and how to live your life. The Dalish would be fools to not involve themselves and side with the mages. If the mages win, then the Dalish no longer have to worry about losing their Keepers and Firsts to the Templars, though they will still have to be nomads due to the rampant racism towards elves. It's my opinion that the rogue Templars will attack the Dalish clans and this will cause the elves to fight against the Templars.
  
• Nobility. This goes in line with my first point, but nobility can do a lot. Depending on their influence, they can sway more people to the mages' side. Likewise, there may be nobility that supports the Templars.
  
• Ferelden should King Alistair tell the Divine and the Chantry to sod off. Queen Anora might do the same thing, as she granted the Circle Tower independence from the Chantry for a Mage Warden who did the US. If she wasn't pro-mage, she could've just said "We'll erect a memorial for him". Mages could help greatly in the war with Orlais, should it happen. And I don't trust Celene. She's been described as having expansionist policies. I await to be proven wrong however.
  
• Though highly unlikely, Tevinter. But I doubt they'll be anything more than indirect allies who defend their borders from rogue Templars, because involving themselves too much would threaten their power and be detrimental to the support of the mages (not like Tevinter would care about the support the other mages get). Not to mention Tevinter can't wage a war on two sides, since they're the ones who constantly assault Seheron and the Qunari are just going "Meh..."
  
• We also have to account for Rivain and the Chasind. Both societies have free mages and as I've said before the rogue Templars may not take kindly to that. The Chasind and Rivaini will ally themselves with the mages for the same reason the Dalish do. Also, the Chasind are a horde unto themselves, as you can see here, which would greatly bolster the strength of the mages' forces.
  
• My Wardens and my Hawkes. But they're gone so I doubt they'll play a major part in the war.
  
• Orzammar. Dagna's Circle leads to a Circle of free mages being established in Orzammar, where the Chantry contemplates marching on Orzammar. The Chantry and renegade Templars would be fools to assault them since Dwarves are the only people who can safely mine lyrium, save for the occasional accident (Garin). Even if you establish a Chantry there, Burkel gets slain and I imagine the Chantry is removed from Orzammar, which again leads to contemplation of an Exalted March. Even if the Chantry and a Chantry controlled Circle are there, I imagine that Burkel's death leads to the Circle falling under Orzammar jurisdiction, which would lead to a better reason for the Divine to contemplate an Exalted March. Now, I know that if you talk to Gregoir about Dagna's request he'll refuse, but that doesn't necessarily mean Dagna will give up her dream. For all we know, in the years between DAO and DA2's ending she showed up at the Ferelden Circle's doorstep and asked to see the new First Enchanter, and he/she accepted her much to Gregoir's dismay. Also, Ferelden's Circle isn't the only Circle. She could've also gone to the one in Orlais.
  
• If there are some Templars who abandoned the Chantry to help the mages, then them. I assume some Templars would have magic somewhere in their lineage. Maybe even a sister or brother. A son or daughter.
  
• Arl Eamon definitely, for his son. Which goes in line with my nobility point and Ferelden.
  
• If the renegade Templars decide to attack Grey Warden Mages, then the Grey Wardens will indirectly assist. Maybe not going to the mages side, but they will defend themselves which will help the mages.

Personally, I like to entertain the thought that the Divine is an extremely powerful anti-mage mage. By working her way up to the position of Divine, she is now able to further her anti-mage agenda.

I also want to know what the Black Divine looks like. I imagine he looks like Galenth Dysley, A.K.A Super Pope
Oh and Malcolm Hawke. I want to know what he looks like as well. I imagine he has this really epic, badass beard.

I think the dalish are not likely to get involved as the last time they rose up and fought alongside the humans of thedas for freedom.. The fall of the dales happened. I think they will still be bitter about that and not willing to take sides.

Nobility - The Templar codex and Orsino suggest the people of thedas will support the templars seeing them as protectors and guardians etc etc.

Ferelden - The Monarchs power lies with the nobility in the blight devistated ferelden. Alistair / Anora supporting the mages isn't enough The Arls and Banns need to support Alistairs position / Anoras position for it to mean anything so ferelden support could go either way it seems.

Tevinter- Yeah Mage political competition for the magisters, and a war on two fronts make tevinter support unlikrlu

Rivain possibly

My Warden and my Hawke. For me my Hawke yes, My Warden no. Warden would support templars, Hawke would support mages (My ones this is)

Sepewrath wrote..
I don't think you can take into account, anything from the epilogues,
because none of it is canon. I don't think this really will be a war
between mages and Templar's. Being in all the Templar's have rebelled,
they too are enemies of Chantry and will be dealt with just like the
mages, so I don't see them retaining any kind of military like
organization. They are likely just as scattered as the mages and
fighting for their own survival.

The Templars have their own hierarchy outside the chantry to unify them, They Have the Knight-Vigilant who commands all the Knight-Commanders.. Unless he dies in Asunder or something

Modifié par XxDeonxX, 24 août 2011 - 06:58 .

[Augustei]

Northern Sun wrote...

EmperorSahlertz wrote...
Edit: And the Templars will only be cut off from Lyrium if you assume the mages actually held the Circle Towers, and thus the Lyrium stores. Otherwise the Templars probably have enough Lyrium to last for a while.

Which is why controlling or destroying lyrium stores should be a top priority for the mages.

We are also forgetting a huge player, Flemeth. I refuse to believe that she didn't play some part in this, being the chessmaster she is. And she will certainly play a part in the future. While her true motives and goals are unknown, I'd bet a few silvers that it will benefit the mages more than the templars.

Something about her makes me think she is more pro-dalish or something the way she talks to merrill when you first ressurect her and the way the elves respect her etc.

[Jedi Master of Orion]

The templars status towards the dalish, chasind and rivaini has not changed since the circle mages' rebellion. They would have no new reasons to attack them unless they offered shelter to the rebel mages. In fact in the first game I didn't really get the impression the chasind have any major conflict with the local templars. It would make little sense for the templars to attack any of them because it makes their task of stopping the mages harder.

And even if the templars were somehow eliminated permanently, it would not solve the dalish elves' major problem. They aren't despised just by the templars or the Chantry, they are despised by most of humanity. Most of the threats they pose to the clans is not religiously driven. Major human populations would threaten them for secular racist reasons. The dalish shouldn't be so eager to insert themselves in a costly war that doesn't involve them and would essentially change very little.

[Urzon]

We are also forgetting a huge player, Flemeth. I refuse to believe that she didn't play some part in this, being the chessmaster she is. And she will certainly play a part in the future. While her true motives and goals are unknown, I'd bet a few silvers that it will benefit the mages more than the templars.

Dragon Age: Dissidia?

The heroes of Ferelden seem to have a habit of "disappearing", and not just the Warden and Hawke. Flemeth seem to be involved with a good number of them. We also know that she is interested in returning the Old Gods to Thedas as well.  She could be collecting them, so she can use them later is an ultimate battle against the greatest evil known to Thedas.... which we don't know yet. Maybe the creature/spirit/demon/God/person behind the creation of the blight. What/Whoever locked it up in the Golden City.

Though, it would be funny if Flemeth: the greatest supposed blood mage/ abomination, raper of templars, scarer of children, rider of broomsticks, and evilest witch of Thedas, turns out to be the greatest source of (relative) good in Thedas, and is the one whos actions save it in the end.

Oh, the irony if that happened. I wonder how many people in the Chantry head would explode.

Modifié par Urzon, 24 août 2011 - 11:00 .

[Conduit0]

Urzon wrote...

We are also forgetting a huge player, Flemeth. I refuse to believe that she didn't play some part in this, being the chessmaster she is. And she will certainly play a part in the future. While her true motives and goals are unknown, I'd bet a few silvers that it will benefit the mages more than the templars.

Dragon Age: Dissidia?

The heroes of Ferelden seem to have a habit of "disappearing", and not just the Warden and Hawke. Flemeth seem to be involved with a good number of them. We also know that she is interested in returning the Old Gods to Thedas as well.  She could be collecting them, so she can use them later is an ultimate battle against the greatest evil known to Thedas.... which we don't know yet. Maybe the creature/spirit/demon/God/person behind the creation of the blight. What/Whoever locked it up in the Golden City.

Though, it would be funny if Flemeth: the greatest supposed blood mage/ abomination, raper of templars, scarer of children, rider of broomsticks, and evilest witch of Thedas, turns out to be the greatest source of (relative) good in Thedas, and is the one whos actions save it in the end.

Oh, the irony if that happened. I wonder how many people in the Chantry head would explode.

Oh my moneys on it get even better than that, the Maker doesn't exist and it was Flemeth whispering in Andraste's ear, or better yet, that Flemeth is Andraste, now that would make Chantry heads explode.

[TEWR]

Jedi Master of Orion wrote...

The templars status towards the dalish, chasind and rivaini has not changed since the circle mages' rebellion. They would have no new reasons to attack them unless they offered shelter to the rebel mages. In fact in the first game I didn't really get the impression the chasind have any major conflict with the local templars. It would make little sense for the templars to attack any of them because it makes their task of stopping the mages harder.

The Templars are in a conflict with the Dalish. That's one of the reasons why they're nomads. Merrill tells you this. The Templars even go so far as to torture a Dalish child for information on a mage (Feynriel) and they make poorly veiled threats against the Dalish saying "convert or die" (Visell).

Though as far as the Chasind go, we haven't seen anything to suggest the Templars dislike their free mages, it's true. But to the Templars and the Chantry, a free mage is something they won't stand for.

And even if the templars were somehow eliminated permanently, it would not solve the dalish elves' major problem. They aren't despised just by the templars or the Chantry, they are despised by most of humanity. Most of the threats they pose to the clans is not religiously driven. Major human populations would threaten them for secular racist reasons. The dalish shouldn't be so eager to insert themselves in a costly war that doesn't involve them and would essentially change very little.

Which is why I said it eliminates one of their main worries. I know it won't eliminate the rampant racism, but it's still one thing they don't have to worry about. Hell, some of the Dalish prefer the nomadic lifestyle over being tied down to one area.