631 réponses à ce sujet

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

To be fair he was clarifying something someone said,not whining.

[Rahmiel]

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

ThePwener wrote...

Looks like BW finally found the right way to do it. Glad to see that the blind Paragon zealots will get what's coming to them.

To be fair, I hope the blind Renegade maniacs get what's coming to them, too.

To be fair I've never seen a paragon zealot,seen a few renegades though.

I make all my choices out to be paragon.  I mean, whether or not you choose renegade or paragon, you get bonuses or additional text for making paragon/renegade choices.  So.. why not keep making them to make sure you have the right tally of p/r point total to use in conversations.

I'm not against BW from making a game where you have to navigate through text and make decisions.  But so far in the Mass Effect series, you're rewarded for making p/r decisions, and infact the bonuses you get help you to make further ones.

I guess my point is.. why would BW change this now, going into the third game.  I'm not against it in another game series or game.. but really, in ME3 you want to start punishing players from gaining paragon/renegade points?  Meaning to make the "right decision" I have to have chosen a dialogue path I do not necessarily agree with, to gain points, to open up a conversation option in a later discussion.  Otherwise, I'm stuck with the "feels right" decision?

I dunno..

Modifié par Memmahkth, 24 août 2011 - 01:19 .

[ThePwener]

[Urazz]

I hope both sides have their consequences.

[Seboist]

Dave of Canada wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...

Since thus far Renegade choices have had zero real consequences, I fail to see how they're getting 'screwed'. Anything a Paragon can do a Renegade can bully his way into doing as well.

Incorrect.

Renegades get less references and cameos to stuff they do in Mass Effect 1, some outright don't mention the big choices you've done and there's little purpose in importing a Renegade from ME1.
People absolutely loathe you, which makes sense in some context, though they were supporting you five seconds earlier.
Renegade decisions make no sense (metagame) when the Paragon decision offers the same and more.
Renegades can't claim some loyalties they lose from certain choices, though Paragons can use their charm option for others.

Edit: Kind-of but not really, Renegades pay more resources.

Indeed but Renegades getting screwed is part of the larger problem that the choices and outcomes aren't really all that well thought out or taken all that seriously. One good example of this is that Okeer and Wrex/Wreav mention how Krogans are pissed at Shepard over destroying Saren's genophage cure but there's zero mention from them over the decision with the Rachni Queen.

[Someone With Mass]

Seboist wrote...

Tali has you so wrapped around her finger that you're working against the interests of your own people.

So?
Oh no, I happen to not give a damn about the race that have had little to no struggle achieving everything they point at, while whining to no end about their "rightful place in the galaxy". Because they're so special and good at everything they do.

Let me tell you something. That's as far from the real humanity as you can get.

Modifié par Someone With Mass, 24 août 2011 - 01:22 .

[Someone With Mass]

Dave of Canada wrote...

It's not whining if it's factual?

If it's posted in every single thread that questions the morality choices in Mass Effect, yes.

[ThePwener]

Seboist wrote...

but there's zero mention from them over the decision with the Rachni Queen.

In defense, it isn't common knowledge that the Rachni are out in the galaxy if you saved the Queen. Let alone in a backwater planet like Tuchanka. And I doubt that Wrex would stir such a heated problem by revealing they're existnace in such a critical moment in Krogan history (revolucion!).

[Boiny Bunny]

Memmahkth wrote...

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

ThePwener wrote...

Looks like BW finally found the right way to do it. Glad to see that the blind Paragon zealots will get what's coming to them.

To be fair, I hope the blind Renegade maniacs get what's coming to them, too.

To be fair I've never seen a paragon zealot,seen a few renegades though.

I make all my choices out to be paragon.  I mean, whether or not you choose renegade or paragon, you get bonuses or additional text for making paragon/renegade choices.  So.. why not keep making them to make sure you have the right tally of p/r point total to use in conversations.

I'm not against BW from making a game where you have to navigate through text and make decisions.  But so far in the Mass Effect series, you're rewarded for making p/r decisions, and infact the bonuses you get help you to make further ones.

I guess my point is.. why would BW change this now, going into the third game.  I'm not against it in another game series or game.. but really, in ME3 you want to start punishing players from gaining paragon/renegade points?  Meaning to make the "right decision" I have to have chosen a dialogue path I do not necessarily agree with, to gain points, to open up a conversation option in a discussion.  Otherwise, I'm stuck with the "feels right" decision?

I dunno..

You shouldn't have to make a decision that you disagree with to open up further conversation options - ME2 is exceptionally broken in this regard.

But, you shouldn't be able to get the 'most optimal ending' by just being 100% paragon, or 100% renegade, in my opinion.

[slimgrin]

I'm all for it. I like unexpected consequences.

[xxSgt_Reed_24xx]

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

INb4 marshalleck,every paragon decision ever.


I read something that said,you can make decision that feel right but they come back and bite you.

Being an EA game I suspect this may be a bit of hot air.


However,some choices should come back to bite you hard,CB,Saving hostages in btds,letting Rana live,etc.

I can see and definitely agree with the first two... but how would rana come back to bite you in the ass... other than sexually? 

[Dave of Canada]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

It's not whining if it's factual?

If it's posted in every single thread that questions the morality choices in Mass Effect, yes.

Oh gasp, ontopic bringing up of negative aspects of Mass Effect bring brought in threads about the topic? What shall I do?

[ThePwener]

xxSgt_Reed_24xx wrote...

I can see and definitely agree with the first two... but how would rana come back to bite you in the ass... other than sexually? 

BW wouldn't have put that line there if it wasn't for something......

[shep82]

Seboist wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...

Since thus far Renegade choices have had zero real consequences, I fail to see how they're getting 'screwed'. Anything a Paragon can do a Renegade can bully his way into doing as well.

Incorrect.

Renegades get less references and cameos to stuff they do in Mass Effect 1, some outright don't mention the big choices you've done and there's little purpose in importing a Renegade from ME1.
People absolutely loathe you, which makes sense in some context, though they were supporting you five seconds earlier.
Renegade decisions make no sense (metagame) when the Paragon decision offers the same and more.
Renegades can't claim some loyalties they lose from certain choices, though Paragons can use their charm option for others.

Edit: Kind-of but not really, Renegades pay more resources.

Indeed but Renegades getting screwed is part of the larger problem that the choices and outcomes aren't really all that well thought out or taken all that seriously. One good example of this is that Okeer and Wrex/Wreav mention how Krogans are pissed at Shepard over destroying Saren's genophage cure but there's zero mention from them over the decision with the Rachni Queen.

I dunno I must be one that likes both options and think they did it well. Being Renegade your choices do matter and do have an impact on ME 2.

[xxSgt_Reed_24xx]

ThePwener wrote...

xxSgt_Reed_24xx wrote...

I can see and definitely agree with the first two... but how would rana come back to bite you in the ass... other than sexually? 

BW wouldn't have put that line there if it wasn't for something......

oh crap... here comes a strongly worded email!

NOOOOOOO!!!!!!!! I'll have to reload and kill her!!! 

[crimzontearz]

Boiny Bunny wrote...

Memmahkth wrote...

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

ThePwener wrote...

Looks like BW finally found the right way to do it. Glad to see that the blind Paragon zealots will get what's coming to them.

To be fair, I hope the blind Renegade maniacs get what's coming to them, too.

To be fair I've never seen a paragon zealot,seen a few renegades though.

I make all my choices out to be paragon.  I mean, whether or not you choose renegade or paragon, you get bonuses or additional text for making paragon/renegade choices.  So.. why not keep making them to make sure you have the right tally of p/r point total to use in conversations.

I'm not against BW from making a game where you have to navigate through text and make decisions.  But so far in the Mass Effect series, you're rewarded for making p/r decisions, and infact the bonuses you get help you to make further ones.

I guess my point is.. why would BW change this now, going into the third game.  I'm not against it in another game series or game.. but really, in ME3 you want to start punishing players from gaining paragon/renegade points?  Meaning to make the "right decision" I have to have chosen a dialogue path I do not necessarily agree with, to gain points, to open up a conversation option in a discussion.  Otherwise, I'm stuck with the "feels right" decision?

I dunno..

You shouldn't have to make a decision that you disagree with to open up further conversation options - ME2 is exceptionally broken in this regard.

But, you shouldn't be able to get the 'most optimal ending' by just being 100% paragon, or 100% renegade, in my opinion.

but since tou are FORCED to pick 100% paragon or 100% renegade by the dialectic progression system you may as well get optimal endings following those paths or else you are screwed one way or the other

[shep82]

Boiny Bunny wrote...

Memmahkth wrote...

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

ThePwener wrote...

Looks like BW finally found the right way to do it. Glad to see that the blind Paragon zealots will get what's coming to them.

To be fair, I hope the blind Renegade maniacs get what's coming to them, too.

To be fair I've never seen a paragon zealot,seen a few renegades though.

I make all my choices out to be paragon.  I mean, whether or not you choose renegade or paragon, you get bonuses or additional text for making paragon/renegade choices.  So.. why not keep making them to make sure you have the right tally of p/r point total to use in conversations.

I'm not against BW from making a game where you have to navigate through text and make decisions.  But so far in the Mass Effect series, you're rewarded for making p/r decisions, and infact the bonuses you get help you to make further ones.

I guess my point is.. why would BW change this now, going into the third game.  I'm not against it in another game series or game.. but really, in ME3 you want to start punishing players from gaining paragon/renegade points?  Meaning to make the "right decision" I have to have chosen a dialogue path I do not necessarily agree with, to gain points, to open up a conversation option in a discussion.  Otherwise, I'm stuck with the "feels right" decision?

I dunno..

You shouldn't have to make a decision that you disagree with to open up further conversation options - ME2 is exceptionally broken in this regard.

But, you shouldn't be able to get the 'most optimal ending' by just being 100% paragon, or 100% renegade, in my opinion.

I disagree. It gives you different ways to do things each having it's own consequence I think they've done a fine job with the morality system.

[Someone With Mass]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Oh gasp, ontopic bringing up of negative aspects of Mass Effect bring brought in threads about the topic? What shall I do?

Stop playing the game by following the beaten path? Actually think before you make a decision? I dunno.

[Dave of Canada]

shep82 wrote...

Being Renegade your choices do matter and do have an impact on ME 2.

How?

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

xxSgt_Reed_24xx wrote...

ThePwener wrote...

xxSgt_Reed_24xx wrote...

I can see and definitely agree with the first two... but how would rana come back to bite you in the ass... other than sexually? 

BW wouldn't have put that line there if it wasn't for something......

oh crap... here comes a strongly worded email!

NOOOOOOO!!!!!!!! I'll have to reload and kill her!!! 

Perhaps she has been working on something extra shady,and it finally worked,and she tries to kill you,or perhaps she just attacks you like an animal in your captains quarters,who knows?

[Dave of Canada]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Stop playing the game by following the beaten path? Actually think before you make a decision? I dunno.

... except, I do think? I've given my reasoning countless times, you dismissed it by calling me a retard / whiner / ******.

[Seboist]

ThePwener wrote...

Seboist wrote...

but there's zero mention from them over the decision with the Rachni Queen.

In defense, it isn't common knowledge that the Rachni are out in the galaxy if you saved the Queen. Let alone in a backwater planet like Tuchanka. And I doubt that Wrex would stir such a heated problem by revealing they're existnace in such a critical moment in Krogan history (revolucion!).

If the Queen was spared Wrex could have discussed it in private with Shepard and voiced his concerns. Alternatively if she was killed he could have spread the word in order to gain more respect for himself and Shepard from the Krogan public.

This whole thing illustrates a major flaw with the decisions and outcomes, they exist in a complete vacuum from each other(with very few exceptions).

[shep82]

jollyorigins wrote...

Boiny Bunny wrote...

jollyorigins wrote...

I would hope that you always have the option to pick either paragon or renegade options through the whole game.  Filling up the respective paragon/renegade bars could give you some kind of stat boosts instead of just 'unlocking' further dialogue options.

That's what I'm hoping for, ME2's morality was a mess because it assumed if I decide to take the paragon route then I am forbidden to choose any renegade choices, making my Shepard more or less have the personality of a brick. Just because I'm paragon shouldn't mean I should be forced to do something I don't agree on because that's the paragon choice, what if I want to take the renegade choice because I believe it has a better outcome? The morality system should focus more on whether Shepard looks normal or had a volcano erupt on his face and perhaps some sort of function on gameplay; for example, paragons have a quicker cooldown on abilities whilst renegade's abilities do more damage.

The decisions in ME are more of a gray area no really right or wrong and I like that IMO.

[Boiny Bunny]

crimzontearz wrote...

Boiny Bunny wrote...

Memmahkth wrote...

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

SandTrout wrote...

ThePwener wrote...

Looks like BW finally found the right way to do it. Glad to see that the blind Paragon zealots will get what's coming to them.

To be fair, I hope the blind Renegade maniacs get what's coming to them, too.

To be fair I've never seen a paragon zealot,seen a few renegades though.

I make all my choices out to be paragon.  I mean, whether or not you choose renegade or paragon, you get bonuses or additional text for making paragon/renegade choices.  So.. why not keep making them to make sure you have the right tally of p/r point total to use in conversations.

I'm not against BW from making a game where you have to navigate through text and make decisions.  But so far in the Mass Effect series, you're rewarded for making p/r decisions, and infact the bonuses you get help you to make further ones.

I guess my point is.. why would BW change this now, going into the third game.  I'm not against it in another game series or game.. but really, in ME3 you want to start punishing players from gaining paragon/renegade points?  Meaning to make the "right decision" I have to have chosen a dialogue path I do not necessarily agree with, to gain points, to open up a conversation option in a discussion.  Otherwise, I'm stuck with the "feels right" decision?

I dunno..

You shouldn't have to make a decision that you disagree with to open up further conversation options - ME2 is exceptionally broken in this regard.

But, you shouldn't be able to get the 'most optimal ending' by just being 100% paragon, or 100% renegade, in my opinion.

but since tou are FORCED to pick 100% paragon or 100% renegade by the dialectic progression system you may as well get optimal endings following those paths or else you are screwed one way or the other

In ME2, with it's broken system.

I am assuming that Bioware will not be using the ME2 system for paragon/renegade in ME3, having realised how broken it was.