1310 réponses à ce sujet

[anzolino]

Ok, for all those who can read: This thread is about the Origin EULA (2011/24/08) and something like this:

(...) 2. Consent to Collection and Use of Data. (...)
In addition to information that you give EA directly, EA collects nonpersonally
identifiable (or anonymous) information for purposes of improving our
products and services, providing services to you, facilitating the provision of
software updates, dynamically served content and product support as well as
communicating with you. The non-personally identifiable information that EA
collects includes technical and related information that identifies your computer
(including the Internet Protocol Address) and operating system, as well as
information about your Application usage (including but not limited to successful
installation and/or removal), software, software usage and peripheral hardware.(...)

[TwistedComplex]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

There's a reason I won't install or use Steam...

Powerful statement bro!

FIGHT THE MAN!!!

[billy the squid]

Reptillius wrote...

billy the squid wrote...

TwistedComplex wrote...

billy the squid wrote...

TwistedComplex wrote...

Wow it does the same thing that Steam and Firefox does


ALERT THE F***IN NAVY

Read the Terms and Conditions.

I already read the terms and conditions, and it's the same as steam, firefox, internet explorer, even windows. Maybe you need to pay attention more

Clearly you read and failed to comprehend, as neither steam nor internet explorer goes rummaging around for data of an undisclosed nature, not linked with the developer's software application on my hard drive or software. And I don't like Steam's data collection much either.

i'd be careful making statements like this because even if you don't officially use internet explorer you still use at least parts of it when you use your computer.  Internet explorer is imbedded in the OS since some time long about XP... Certain parts of it are only brought into use when you use it as a web browser itself but parts of it are involved in things like viewing your folders and such as well. Linked through several program names...

It is the excessively intrusive nature, the undisclosed data collected and the vast breadth of access that the EULA allows, that is the root of the issue. Internet explorer will collect data on internet usage, temporary internet files etc. The same with many of the systems on Windows if one has a problem it asks if one wants to send data to the manufacturer via internet explorer on that fault, I think everybody has encountered this.

[TwistedComplex]

anzolino wrote...

Ok, for all those who can read: This thread is about the Origin EULA (2011/24/08) and something like this:

(...) 2. Consent to Collection and Use of Data. (...)
In addition to information that you give EA directly, EA collects nonpersonally
identifiable (or anonymous) information for purposes of improving our
products and services, providing services to you, facilitating the provision of
software updates, dynamically served content and product support as well as
communicating with you. The non-personally identifiable information that EA
collects includes technical and related information that identifies your computer
(including the Internet Protocol Address) and operating system, as well as
information about your Application usage (including but not limited to successful
installation and/or removal), software, software usage and peripheral hardware.(...)

"Valve may share aggregate information and individual information with other parties. Valve shall not share personally identifiable information with other parties, except as described in the policy below.

"Aggregate information" is information that describes the habits, usage patterns, and demographics of users as a group but does not describe or reveal the identity of any particular user.

"Individual information" is information about a user that is presented in a form distinguishable from information relating to other users but not in a form that personally identifies any user or enables the recipient to communicate directly with any user unless agreed to by the user in advance of such communication. This information may be used to improve Valve's products and online sites, for internal marketing studies, or simply to collect demographic information about Valve's users.
"

-Steam EULA


More news at 11

[TwistedComplex]

I dont think any of you realize that even being on the internet means your on the grid

Anti-piracy companies can call your internet company and threaten them with legal action if they don't give them your IP and personal information.


So no, not installing Origins isn't going to make you The Invisible f***ing Man

[anzolino]

If you signed up on this it's your problem not mine.

[TwistedComplex]

anzolino wrote...

If you signed up on this it's your problem not mine.

You do realize The Patriot act means that the government can collect all information and emails that are linked to you right? What makes you think Origin is ANY WHERE near your biggest problem when it comes to privacy?

[billy the squid]

TwistedComplex wrote...

billy the squid wrote...

Congratulations you linked to an article which has the revised EULA, which still retains the same undisclosed data mining clause. And missed the point entirely, I'm not going to imply anything regarding your reading skills, but you certainly aren't strengthening your position.

Its the same as Steam and Firefox. Jesus Christ get that through your head

"By using Valve's online sites and products, users agree that Valve may collect aggregate information, individual information, and personally identifiable information, as defined below. "

"Valve collects personally identifiable information on a voluntary basis"

"Valve also stores information on a user's hard drive that is used in conjunction with online play of Valve products

"Valve software automatically generates and submits to Valve bug reports upon a crash or other fault in the Valve software"

There is no voluntary basis for Origin, it collects it end of.

Valve's EULA limits software and hardware interaction to those applications which interact with valve or steam. Data is collected on this premise. Origin has no such restrictions.

Edit:
"Internet Protocol Address) and operating system, as well as information about your Application usage (including but not limited to successful installation and/or removal), software, software usage and peripheral hardware."

There is no restriction as to what hardware, software or applications are scanned or data collected, this is from the revised version.

Modifié par billy the squid, 30 août 2011 - 12:05 .

[TwistedComplex]

billy the squid wrote...



There is no voluntary basis for Origin

THE DOWNLOADING OF ORIGINS IS VOLUNTARY

Did you forget that part? Did you forget the part where you have to click "I AGREE" at the bottom of the EULA page?

BOTH use the same Privacy Policy. But you would know that if you knew what you were talking about

Modifié par TwistedComplex, 29 août 2011 - 11:59 .

[billy the squid]

That is a complete copout considering you have just spent the time arguing that they are the same. As having origin collect data if you want to use the product is not an option, steams is.

Modifié par billy the squid, 30 août 2011 - 12:03 .

[TwistedComplex]

billy the squid wrote...

That is a complete copout considering you have just spent the time arguing that they are the same.

BOTH are voluntary. When you click "I AGREE" you just told them that you agree to the terms in the EULA. There is NOTHING forced in that interaction

[Killjoy Cutter]

TwistedComplex wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

There's a reason I won't install or use Steam...

Powerful statement bro!

FIGHT THE MAN!!!

 
Come into a thread, belittle people's displeasure, use the word "bro", randomly tell people they're ignorant?

classic troll behavior.

[Killjoy Cutter]

TwistedComplex wrote...

anzolino wrote...

If you signed up on this it's your problem not mine.

You do realize The Patriot act means that the government can collect all information and emails that are linked to you right? What makes you think Origin is ANY WHERE near your biggest problem when it comes to privacy?

"But Steam does..."
"But the government does..."
"But X does..."

Yes, of course, if one guy has a pocket knife, and the other guy has an axe, you should completely ignore the guy with the knife...  [/sarcasm] 


Just because people are against Origin or upset about Origin, that doesn't mean they're not paying any attention to the other threats out there. 

[Killjoy Cutter]

billy the squid wrote...

That is a complete copout considering you have just spent the time arguing that they are the same. As having origin collect data if you want to use the product is not an option, steams is.

So what you're saying is that it's at least possible to opt out of the data gathering that Steam does, while with Origin the only choices are to agree to it, or not get any of the Origin-linked software?

I know that the "feedback and improvement" "feature" in other software often has an opt-out if you're paying attention.

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 30 août 2011 - 12:09 .

[anzolino]

This isn't about the patriot act this is about EA. How often we should repeat this? We're talking about EA.
Yes, the download is voluntary but I do not want to download it! And you can refuse the private data collection on steam and you can use it anyway. Or not? That is voluntary but not "Agree" or "Disagree"! That is a blackmail because if you don't agree you cannot use it. Do you see the different?

[billy the squid]

TwistedComplex wrote...

billy the squid wrote...

That is a complete copout considering you have just spent the time arguing that they are the same.

BOTH are voluntary. When you click "I AGREE" you just told them that you agree to the terms in the EULA. There is NOTHING forced in that interaction

Nope, missing the point, use of the product is voluntary, that is not the point at issue, don't change the subject.

It is the excessively intrusive nature of the origin system, which has caused problems, as for the forseeable future all EA games will use this, style of data collection should you wish to use the product. Steams, although it is not my favorite, does not do the same as that.

Modifié par billy the squid, 30 août 2011 - 12:28 .

[Kusy]

anzolino wrote...

This isn't about the patriot act this is about EA. How often we should repeat this? We're talking about EA.
Yes, the download is voluntary but I do not want to download it! And you can refuse the private data collection on steam and you can use it anyway. Or not? That is voluntary but not "Agree" or "Disagree"! That is a blackmail because if you don't agree you cannot use it. Do you see the different?

You sir, don't have the slightest idea what the word "blackmail" means. Unless since yesterday EA started to threaten everyone on the internet to cut off all of their fingers starting from the pinky ones if you don't downlad their software.

Modifié par Mr.Kusy, 30 août 2011 - 12:18 .

[billy the squid]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

billy the squid wrote...

That is a complete copout considering you have just spent the time arguing that they are the same. As having origin collect data if you want to use the product is not an option, steams is.

So what you're saying is that it's at least possible to opt out of the data gathering that Steam does, while with Origin the only choices are to agree to it, or not get any of the Origin-linked software?

I know that the "feedback and improvement" "feature" in other software often has an opt-out if you're paying attention.

 As far as I know, yes. Steam's personal information collection is voluntary, you can opt out, it varies from different developer products held on steam as each one may want to collect information, but you would have to look at the individual EULA, but I don't belive they are as  excessive as EA's, though there is no blanket rule.

The feedback and improvement feature in many cases is also an opt out in many cases, as far as we know from the origin and EA privacy policy there is no opt out, but that may be done on a product by product basis.

Steam, only collects data on hardware and software which interacts with that application, ie game. and sends an automated bug report, which i believe can be blocked, by administrative priviliges, or you can send it manually. From the origin EULA there appears to be no such restrictions on what is scanned or what is sent.

In short with the Origin EULA there is no option, accept it or don't. Steams one works on the same principle, but the terms are somewhat better, I don't really approve, but it is the lesser of two evils in this case.

[anzolino]

Mr.Kusy wrote...
You sir, don't have the slightest idea what the word "blackmail" means. Unless since yesterday EA threatens to cut off all of your fingers starting from the pinky if you don't downlad their software.

What you're talking about?

[Clonedzero]

TwistedComplex wrote...

Clonedzero wrote...
rofl wow dude, spread more misinformation

"ROFL like wow dude, totally like, omg wow man dude bro like wow"

Nice argument you have there, BRO

How about you get off the forums and read the f***in EULA yourself

some buddies hostile. or just trolling.

either way, you should probably take a beakf rom the internet. its not healthy.

[Kusy]

They collect the data. They might sell the information to third parties, they might make surveys, they might use them to analyse the market.

But nobody in their right mind would sue a single user over piracy using data surveyed by Origin as evidence, the case would go public, the product would become blacklisted by every single pirate using the Personal Computer platform... that means 90% of the market. It would be like if a dealer would report his customers to the police for money... WITHOUT HIDING IT FROM ANYONE.

You guys think why Valve never sued anyone for piracy even when they could prove it by data collected via Steam? Because people would stop using steam.

Modifié par Mr.Kusy, 30 août 2011 - 12:29 .

[JGDD]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

They collect the data. They might sell the information to third parties, they might make surveys, they might use them to analyse the market.

But nobody in their right mind would sue a single user over piracy using data surveyed by Origin as evidence, the case would go public, the product would become blacklisted by every single pirate using the Personal Computer platform... that means 90% of the market. It would be like if a dealer would report his customers to the police for money... WITHOUT HIDING IT FROM ANYONE.

You guys think why Valve never sued anyone for piracy even when they could prove it by data collected via Steam? Because people would stop using steam.

Why do you consistantly bring up piracy? That's not the issue. Most here with voiced concerns want to throw money at Bioware for making a great game. They do not want to expose any more of their personal data than necessary to reward the game maker with a purchase. Are you that thick to not be able to make the connection?

[billy the squid]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

They collect the data. They might sell the information to third parties, they might make surveys, they might use them to analyse the market.

But nobody in their right mind would sue a single user over piracy using data surveyed by Origin as evidence, the case would go public, the product would become blacklisted by every single pirate using the Personal Computer platform... that means 90% of the market. It would be like if a dealer would report his customers to the police for money... WITHOUT HIDING IT FROM ANYONE.

You guys think why Valve never sued anyone for piracy even when they could prove it by data collected via Steam? Because people would stop using steam.

What data? it is undefined in the terms, there don't appear to be any restrictions on what is being looked for nor what can be scanned, software, hardware or peripheral hardware.

Whilst I think you are correct, that EA is unlikely to litigate against an individual, it has happened, such as Microsoft's move against hacking the xbox. More than likely equitable remedies will be imposed which can range to quite a lot, its open to court discretion.

Steam collects data on applications and hardware interaction with its products. If a downloader application is on the computer system, it should not be interacting with steam and is, as such, beyond the remit of the terms. I don't know the specifics of application interaction on certain systems so I can't comment further. In addition if one used a DRM crack, even if I purchased the product legally I am still technically in breach of the product EULA, as the origin program can still scan my entire system.

[Kusy]

What else could it possibly be PC users might be afraid of giving info about?
Because if it's children pornography then I sure hope the data does get sold to the police, since Google already does that (and fairly, I think google has far more information on every single person using the internet than Origin about me, or anyone else). You have a gmail - your information is filtered and possibly sold to third parties, you use google search? Same thing.

You have a facebook account? Installed Windows? Use WinRaR? Live in the United States and go to the dentist regularly? You are a citizen of any country at all? You work and pay taxes? Welcome to the big brother show.

I don't see anything wrong with surveying customers for data that might improve retail or possibly even development, and I don't see how they could use the system against me, maybee it's just that I'm that kind of person who don't feels like defending freedom for the sake of defending it. Nothing to hide.

Modifié par Mr.Kusy, 30 août 2011 - 12:50 .

[Myaku1313]

For the time being Origin is optional. So just don't download it. I have it and I really don't care about it. It's just another steam like client for me. With that having been said The revised the EULA to pretty much say in that first paragraph that they know you guys are worried about invasion of privacy and they respect that but that they will need to collect some data. Anything that isn't too personal will be passed on w/o your name on it to someone other party to help better your experience. Whatever. If you use any form of social networking you already know what they are doing. If you want them to spell it out more clearly for you like how Steam did with it's EULA then write/call them and request the EULA be made more user friendly to read with amendments added to it so that the legal jargon is more easily decipherable. And also so you have piece of mind.