184 réponses à ce sujet

[AngryFrozenWater]

DuckSoup wrote...

razerdoh2k wrote...

because of one thing in the ToS:

"2. Consent to Collection and Use of Data.

You agree that EA may collect, use, store and transmit technical and related information that identifies your computer (including the Internet Protocol Address), operating system, Application usage (including but not limited to successful installation and/or removal), software, software usage and peripheral hardware, that may be gathered periodically to facilitate the provision of software updates, dynamically served content, product support and other services to you, including online services. EA may also use this information combined with personal information for marketing purposes and to improve our products and services. We may also share that data with our third party service providers in a form that does not personally identify you. IF YOU DO NOT WANT EA TO COLLECT, USE, STORE, TRANSMIT OR DISPLAY THE DATA DESCRIBED IN THIS SECTION, PLEASE DO NOT INSTALL OR USE THE APPLICATION. This and all other data provided to EA and/or collected by EA in connection with your installation and use of this Application is collected, used, stored and transmitted in accordance with EA's Privacy Policy located at www.ea.com. To the extent that anything in this section conflicts with the terms of EA's Privacy Policy, the terms of the Privacy Policy shall control."

http://tos.ea.com/le...a/US/en/ORIGIN/

Screw that.

Mark my words: When this comes to court, EA will simply defend themselves by stating that someone used "Search and replace" and accidently removed the word "not" in the entire document, later tried to correct it, but was interrupted by lunch.

[CroGamer002]

Warheadz wrote...

Mesina2 wrote...

Well, I really don't care.

I'm buying physical copies.

If you intend to play on PC, it makes no difference. Even with physical copies you will need Origin in the future.

Whatever.

I only have games on my PC and you can see more of my personal info on Facebook.

I'm not hurt in any way by Origin, despite one of rules is illegal.
But I can understand why people are upset.

[vometia]

I wonder if there's a virtual machine along the lines of VMware that could still get most of the performance of my hardware? It'd be nice to partition the likes of Origin in its own sandbox so it can't poke around my other stuff. Otherwise, I'm not thrilled about the idea: I know EA aren't the only culprits, but that doesn't make it okay (or mean I should be defeatist about the whole thing) and their EULA is one of the boldest statements of intent I've seen to date when it comes to announcing that they intend to rifle through my personal data. No, it isn't okay.

I can't remember the T&Cs of the software I bought prior to this clause appearing in (I think) EADM, but if they're also reliant on Origin and the options are "either accept our conditions or don't use it--and by extension, don't use the other software you've paid for", I can see that becoming a problem. For EA, I mean.

[StynesRebooted]

wrong thing is it doens't have interactive sex scenes.

[Shadow of Light Dragon]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Ah. Yes. Maybe those are the only advantages. I would gladly give up those incoveniences to protect my privacy.

I'm a little curious as to what you think EA is invading with Origins...I certainly don't recall providing any more info when signing up than I did to, say, BSN. I haven't plugged in any credit card details or anything.

Edit: Of course after a year, EA does not guarantee that you can download those install files if you lost them. Steam has no such limitation.

That's what backup CDs and external hard drives are for. No less protection than your old hard copies of old games that predate the 'download era'.

[Deathwurm]

Don't know why I didn't think of doing it sooner, but I just got done checking out the Forums on EA's Website.

There, the reaction to the EULA is almost universally negative, with a few exceptions.

There are multiple Threads on the issue and the Posters seem to be coming from multiple EA division's Fan Bases, not just here at Bioware.

The Good: EA is getting Posts made directly on their own site and if anyone from EA beside the one Moderator I saw bothers to read the Posts then they are going to learn that folks are not O.K. with this EULA's wording.

The Bad: The Moderator I mentioned above just keeps posting links to the "Updated" EULA, the one that talks about just how much they love us and care for our Privacy but doesn't change any of the broadly worded clauses that are causing the concern.

I intend to Post there and I encourage anyone who sees this EULA for what it is; overly intrusive, Post there as well.

EDIT: It seems an Origin account is require to Post on the Forums, there is no way I can see to sign up without also starting an Origin Account, so I will be un-able to make the Post I intended to and suggest anyone else who was going to Post not to do so unless you WANT to have an Origin account...Sorry

Modifié par Deathwurm, 26 août 2011 - 04:05 .

[Veex]

I think you'd all likely be surprised how many programs have similar clauses in their EULA. Steam itself has a nearly identical clause, with the caveat the the information is "Steam related" which in itself is so broad that it could effectively do the same thing.

[Deathwurm]

Veex wrote...

I think you'd all likely be surprised how many programs have similar clauses in their EULA. Steam itself has a nearly identical clause, with the caveat the the information is "Steam related" which in itself is so broad that it could effectively do the same thing.

True, that is broad but is not as broad as the wording EA is using.

[vometia]

Veex wrote...

I think you'd all likely be surprised how many programs have similar clauses in their EULA. Steam itself has a nearly identical clause, with the caveat the the information is "Steam related" which in itself is so broad that it could effectively do the same thing.

Even if that's the case, "everyone else is doing it" doesn't make it okay.

[Deathwurm]

vometia wrote...

Veex wrote...

I think you'd all likely be surprised how many programs have similar clauses in their EULA. Steam itself has a nearly identical clause, with the caveat the the information is "Steam related" which in itself is so broad that it could effectively do the same thing.

Even if that's the case, "everyone else is doing it" doesn't make it okay.

So true! EA needs a Maternal figure to wave her finger and ask the "If everyone else jumped off a bridge..." question! lol

[fchopin]

Just uninstalled Origin.

There was a message that some EA games may not work but who cares i pressed the button.

[Veex]

vometia wrote...

Even if that's the case, "everyone else is doing it" doesn't make it okay.

That is absolutely true. My only point of contention is in regards to the individuals protesting it because "EA did it" and not up in arms that Steam and many other applications have similar clauses.

fchopin wrote...

Just uninstalled Origin.

There was a message that some EA games may not work but who cares i pressed the button.

The only game I can think of that requires Origin at this point is BFBC:3, so its likely just an updated message for when that title releases.

[billy the squid]

Veex wrote...

I think you'd all likely be surprised how many programs have similar clauses in their EULA. Steam itself has a nearly identical clause, with the caveat the the information is "Steam related" which in itself is so broad that it could effectively do the same thing.

Not quite,  Valve’s policy is self-restricted to anything on your PC directly relating to its own products only. EA’s doesn't, it gives the publisher permission to scan your entire hard drive, and report back absolutely anything you may have installed, hardware, software or any peripheral tech and when you use it, then passing that information on the third parties.

Then combine it with personal information to address that directly to you via EA themselves or sold to another third party, which is one way, less than reputable individuals are able to gain more personal information. That doesn't even begin to cover the issues of Hacking as the PSN network illustrated. Whilst similar terms may be in the EA EULAs on other products it does not prevent me from using the product if I don't play online.

Whilst I am currently unsure if retail versions of products also require origins to install correctly. I believe they will, as it would be counter productive for EA to create origin if it could be so easily bypassed by simply pruchasing a retail copy.

When I was studying law, these kind of contracts could become a complete nightmare. Off the top of my head, many are left deliberately ambiguous so it can be left open to interpretation, of the company. As the EULA is a contract of adhession there is no possibility of negotiating contractual terms or clarification as such when it is accepted one is in effect accepting on their terms, even though those terms are not clearly defined. As such, the owness is on the individual who accepted the term to provide evidence of what they believed term meant and how they entered the term based on this premise, not EA.

Modifié par billy the squid, 26 août 2011 - 07:44 .

[AngryFrozenWater]

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Ah. Yes. Maybe those are the only advantages. I would gladly give up those incoveniences to protect my privacy.

I'm a little curious as to what you think EA is invading with Origins...I certainly don't recall providing any more info when signing up than I did to, say, BSN. I haven't plugged in any credit card details or anything.

Edit: Of course after a year, EA does not guarantee that you can download those install files if you lost them. Steam has no such limitation.

That's what backup CDs and external hard drives are for. No less protection than your old hard copies of old games that predate the 'download era'.

If you do not feel unfortable by its EULA and if you feel fine with the one year limitation then you sound like the perfect customer for EA.

Modifié par AngryFrozenWater, 26 août 2011 - 07:55 .

[Veex]

billy the squid wrote...

Not quite,  Valve’s policy is self-restricted to anything on your PC directly relating to its own products only. EA’s doesn't, it gives the publisher permission to scan your entire hard drive, and report back absolutely anything you may have installed, hardware, software or any peripheral tech and when you use it, then passing that information on the third parties.

Being that you've studied some law, how would one argue against Steam were it to claim that your hard drive contents or browsing habits effect its performance, and it gathered and shared that information in order to improve its service? You've already acknowledged that EULAs are left intentionally vague, Steam's isn't so restrictive that they couldn't make a legal claim at this.I can't see anyone versed in computers and law denying that the hardware and software you've got installed don't make an effect on a service like Steam or Origin.

Really, the only difference that I think is important is that EA is putting it down in black and white.

[Chromie]

Shadow of Light Dragon wrote...

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Ah. Yes. Maybe those are the only advantages. I would gladly give up those incoveniences to protect my privacy.

I'm a little curious as to what you think EA is invading with Origins...I certainly don't recall providing any more info when signing up than I did to, say, BSN. I haven't plugged in any credit card details or anything.

Edit: Of course after a year, EA does not guarantee that you can download those install files if you lost them. Steam has no such limitation.

That's what backup CDs and external hard drives are for. No less protection than your old hard copies of old games that predate the 'download era'.

Maybe just maybe thats the reason some people buy games digitally so they don't have to have CD's everywhere. Gog and Steam don't limit how many times I can download a game. How can anyone defend EA?

[Deathwurm]

Joystiq has just posted a Story on their website about the Origin EULA. Not much in the way of anything new in the Article, but this issue is now being picked up by more and larger Gaming News-sites.

The comments in general are strongly against the EULA with the few exceptions that are always found.

Modifié par Deathwurm, 26 août 2011 - 08:39 .

[Bryy_Miller]

It's going to be hilarious when the people who said they'd never buy an EA game again start buying them from GOG.

[k177sh0t]

EA rewrote the EULA

http://www.joystiq.c...-in-collection/

[slimgrin]

This thread is funny. I don't need to think much on it. EA is implementing invasive DRM, overpriced micro DLC; Bioware is denying at every turn that they even make RPG's anymore cause they're too cool for that now. Companies like Egosoft, Larian, and CDPR put EAware to shame. Origins is a f*ckin joke, another stupid 3rd person client I might have to install just to play the last game from Bioware that I'm interested in, before they delve into mutli-player crap and MMO's. Seems to be the fad now among publishers, each one requires their own rootkit when you buy their games. And all this to fight piracy? What a load of sh*t.

Modifié par slimgrin, 26 août 2011 - 09:17 .

[MassFrost]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Mark my words: When this comes to court, EA will simply defend themselves by stating that someone used "Search and replace" and accidently removed the word "not" in the entire document, later tried to correct it, but was interrupted by lunch.

And it would go to court, why exactly? Pretty sure EA isn't capable of forcing someone to agree to their EULA, just like they're not forcing you to use Origin.

[slimgrin]

k177sh0t wrote...

EA rewrote the EULA

http://www.joystiq.c...-in-collection/

Why in the hell do they need to collect any information at all? Go f*ck yourself EA. I hope ME3 is pirated to hell because of this. 

[Bryy_Miller]

slimgrin wrote...
I hope ME3 is pirated to hell because of this. 

Slim, piracy is not going to make things any better.

[AngryFrozenWater]

The cool thing about these threads on forums like this and articles on other sites around the world is that it can change the situation. Here is the second paragraph of their new Origin EULA which they changed because people like us thought they went too far:

2. Consent to Collection and Use of Data.

EA knows that you care how information about you is collected, used and shared, and we appreciate your trust that we will do so carefully and sensibly. Information about our customers is an important part of our business, and EA would never sell your personally identifiable information to anyone, nor would it ever use spyware or install spyware on users’ machines. We and agents acting on our behalf do not share information that personally identifies you without your consent, except in rare instances where disclosure is required by law or to enforce EA’s legal rights.

In addition to information that you give EA directly, EA collects nonpersonally identifiable (or anonymous) information for purposes of improving our products and services, providing services to you, facilitating the provision of software updates, dynamically served content and product support as well as communicating with you. The non-personally identifiable information that EA collects includes technical and related information that identifies your computer (including the Internet Protocol Address) and operating system, as well as information about your Application usage (including but not limited to successful installation and/or removal), software, software usage and peripheral hardware. As noted above, this information is gathered periodically for purposes such as improving our products and services, troubleshooting bugs, and otherwise enhancing your user experience.

This and all other data provided to EA and/or collected by EA in connection with your installation and use of this Application is collected, used, stored and transmitted in accordance with EA’s Privacy Policy located at www.ea.com. To the extent that anything in this section conflicts or is inconsistent with the terms of EA’s Privacy Policy, the terms of the Privacy Policy shall control.

It will take a while before all this is updated on their sites and localized to the different languages. It does show that posting about it helps.

Modifié par AngryFrozenWater, 26 août 2011 - 09:49 .