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[Dunquixote]

LolaLei wrote...

Dunquixote: The thing that makes DA:O so great is it's replayability. You have 6 origins to choose from not to mention the fact that the game changes depending on if you play as a male or female. You also get random things that occur in the game that doesn't always happen everytime. Plus there so much to take in that you tend to miss things the first few times you play. Even now I keep discovering new stuff I didn't know about.

DA2 has a bit of replayability but not nearly as much. It's also a relatively short game, especially in comparison to DA:O (that's also partly due to the lack of dlc.) The last time I played DA2 I spent more time revisiting the Gallows to listen to the new dialogue you get with the different characters that hang out in the courtyard... (and to perv on Cullen of course.)

Yup .

Hi Samara .  I'm crabby because my dad is crabby <.<.  Thank you for asking.  How are you? 

[SamaraDraven]

LolaLei wrote...

SamaraDraven wrote...

Hey all! Been busy today. It's all I can do to check the page every couple of hours and skim the posts to keep abreast of what you all are discussing, never mind replying. So. Hi.  David Gaider just tweeted. But it's not Cullen related. How are all of you?

Allo, it's been pretty quiet in here compared to usual. How've you been?

Since the concept art for DA3 came out I've been checking up on David Gaider and some of the voice actors (like Greg Ellis and Steve Valentine) twitter profiles in case they give anything away lol... We probably won't hear anything else until E3 which is in June sometime. I really wish they'd give us some more details, the forums started to go quiet again.

I'm good. It's just this move... I want it over with but we're still searching for a place. So we're packing and paring down what we no longer want to keep with us. We've gotten rid of quite a bit of stuff. We've packed away our XBox and all its acoutrements. And he's gone through a bunch of old former work stuff, tossing a lot of it. He's more sentimental than he thinks he is. LOL! So busy, busy!

I always come in here when it's dead and then I get busy and when I think I should check the boards, I'm like "Nah, it's probably quiet" only to discover it was hopping and I missed it!

Back in the early days, I never thought twitter could be a useful tool in gleaning gaming info but it really can.
But the devs will still troll us in the meantime.

I'm sorry you're feeling glum Dunquixote. Why's he so grumpy, if you don't mind me asking?

Modifié par SamaraDraven, 13 mai 2012 - 12:16 .

[Dunquixote]

I have no clue lol. He's probably just tired from work.

[LolaLei]

SamaraDraven wrote...

LolaLei wrote...

SamaraDraven wrote...

Hey all! Been busy today. It's all I can do to check the page every couple of hours and skim the posts to keep abreast of what you all are discussing, never mind replying. So. Hi.  David Gaider just tweeted. But it's not Cullen related. How are all of you?

Allo, it's been pretty quiet in here compared to usual. How've you been?

Since the concept art for DA3 came out I've been checking up on David Gaider and some of the voice actors (like Greg Ellis and Steve Valentine) twitter profiles in case they give anything away lol... We probably won't hear anything else until E3 which is in June sometime. I really wish they'd give us some more details, the forums started to go quiet again.

I'm good. It's just this move... I want it over with but we're still searching for a place. So we're packing and paring down what we no longer want to keep with us. We've gotten rid of quite a bit of stuff. We've packed away our XBox and all its acoutrements. And he's gone through a bunch of old former work stuff, tossing a lot of it. He's more sentimental than he thinks he is. LOL! So busy, busy!

I always come in here when it's dead and then I get busy and when I think I should check the boards, I'm like "Nah, it's probably quiet" only to discover it was hopping and I missed it!

Back in the early days, I never thought twitter could be a useful tool in gleaning gaming info but it really can.
But the devs will still troll us in the meantime.

I'm sorry you're feeling glum Dunquixote. Why's he so grumpu, if you don't mind me asking?

Oh man moving is stressful as hell isn't it! I've just finished moving out and we've still not got everything unboxed and set up. I've done most of it though.

[Dunquixote]

I messed up on my drawing again. lol too much erasing to look good and he looked like he was about to cry (other wise I wouldn't have erased what I had). I think it had something to do with how I spaced his eyes and the eyebrow length.

[LolaLei]

Dunquixote wrote...

I messed up on my drawing again. lol too much erasing to look good and he looked like he was about to cry (other wise I wouldn't have erased what I had). I think it had something to do with how I spaced his eyes and the eyebrow length.

Aw, keep it as it is. I quite like the idea that he looks like he's about to cry... the poor guy has a lot to cry about I'd say! Hell, you could always pretend it's his reaction to hearing that the female Warden has gone to kill the Archdemon and he thinks she's died (cos obviously he wouldn't have known about the dark ritual etc.)

[Dunquixote]

wow. great idea ....only...it's too late >< I erased (well, not all of it) the shadings. I still have the saved copy I scanned and posted here that I could refer to. I just started over, but this time, it is the size I was trying to go with all along. I think this is my best attempt. The only thing is...do you think it's cheating if I use my computer screen to try to pinpoint the area where the eyes, since his eyes are at an angle in the picture, and then tracing a rough sketch over them? I erase some of the lines and make it neater then, and I fill in the eye. I just need to be able to know where the eyes are located since each time I've tried drawing the eyes previously, they weren't positioned correctly. The first two tries before the last attempt, I actually used a ruler to try to measure the distance, but, that didn't work in the long run.

[LolaLei]

Naw it's not cheating, you're only doing it for the positioning, I've seen lots of people that do it before.

[SamaraDraven]

Dunquixote wrote...

wow. great idea ....only...it's too late >< I erased (well, not all of it) the shadings. I still have the saved copy I scanned and posted here that I could refer to. I just started over, but this time, it is the size I was trying to go with all along. I think this is my best attempt. The only thing is...do you think it's cheating if I use my computer screen to try to pinpoint the area where the eyes, since his eyes are at an angle in the picture, and then tracing a rough sketch over them? I erase some of the lines and make it neater then, and I fill in the eye. I just need to be able to know where the eyes are located since each time I've tried drawing the eyes previously, they weren't positioned correctly. The first two tries before the last attempt, I actually used a ruler to try to measure the distance, but, that didn't work in the long run.

 
Don'tcha just love drawing mishaps? My current drawing has a green smudge on Hawke's face because one of my kids used my kneaded eraser on color pencil and I didn't know that the next time I went to erase. But I'm gonna fix it on my pc when I'm done with the lineart.

Personally I don't think it's cheating to use a reference or even trace. It can help teach an artist where they're going wrong. It's useful when the answer isn't apparent despite intense scrutiny. There are ways the body is assembled that escaped me without copying what I saw. So do what you must. If it helps you become a better artist, it's not cheating.

It sounds as if your scale might be off. If the Cullen you're drawing is a different size or on a different angle than the reference, measuring won't help. I hope you get it figured out soon. I'm rooting for you.

[LolaLei]

I'm looking forward to seeing everyone's art. I'm a rubbish drawer but I'll think of something to do to contribute, even if it's just hundreds of questions or photo editing a screenshot of Cullen to make it look different.

[SamaraDraven]

LolaLei wrote...

I'm looking forward to seeing everyone's art. I'm a rubbish drawer but I'll think of something to do to contribute, even if it's just hundreds of questions or photo editing a screenshot of Cullen to make it look different.

But those are good contributions. Keeps us talking and theorizing and squeeing about our favorite templar.

[Dunquixote]

Thanks you too! -hugs- I'm so glad Bioware has allowed me to post in this topic, in spite not having my own registered copy of DA II. ^.^ It's fun talking to everyone, especially the Cullen fans. -squees-

[SamaraDraven]

It's true. We are a very fun bunch. ^-^ And I'm glad Bioware lets you post here too.

[LolaLei]

Dunquixote wrote...

Thanks you too! -hugs- I'm so glad Bioware has allowed me to post in this topic, in spite not having my own registered copy of DA II. ^.^ It's fun talking to everyone, especially the Cullen fans. -squees-

I haven't registered either of my Dragon Age games, for some reason the codes aren't recognised.

[LolaLei]

My two favorite Dragon Age boys:

[LolaLei]

An amazing picture I found at random, unfortunately I couldn't find the artists name:

[VampOrchid]

You know what, I'm not surprised at how man haters and Lovers Cullen has. It seems though, those are the type of characters that always do well in a story. Love'em or Hate'em, just means that the writers are doing their jobs properly, they are making their audience 'feel' something towards that character. Any feeling at all is better then none. It means the character had an affect.

Take a look at Carth from KOTOR...many ppl loved him, many hated him. Goal achieved.
Alistair, bingo, same thing.
Morigan. Same thing.
Anders, same.
The list of successful characters is long for the history of BIOWARE!

So the thing that hints to me the most, in the case of Cullen, of being a very possible candidate for LI/Companion, is the fact that he does strike a nerve, whatever one that might be, in all BIO fans.

Nuff said!

[SamaraDraven]

That's awesome! It's from my favorite DA2 scene! I love BAMFY Cullen! And  I adored that shot they did. That perspective... does things for me.

Very well put VampOrchid!  And you're right. If a character does nothing for the audience then writing that character will do nothing for the story. People won't be waiting with baited breath to see what's going to happen next, to see if they'll be enraged by that character or overjoyed. Bioware has so many, the trick now is deciding which ones to take further. I wish they'd put it to a vote...

Modifié par SamaraDraven, 13 mai 2012 - 06:04 .

[SamaraDraven]

Ooohhhh Man! I was listening t my favorite Alice In Chains song for the first time in years and my brain starting seeing it as a good fit for Cullen's life. The part where Layne sings "Deny your maker"  I had to laugh at how appropriate it was. Like the dog metaphor in the song, Cullen's been the one that gets beat and he's waiting for someone to come save him and all he has is his faith which is being tested. The voice that says "deny your maker" is like the temptation to forsake what he believes because he would suffer less.

I dunno... It's probably jus me but it seems so apt. But I'll share the song with you. It's pretty heavy so if hard rock isn't your thing, you won't like it.

www.youtube.com/watch

[LolaLei]

SamaraDraven wrote...

Ooohhhh Man! I was listening t my favorite Alice In Chains song for the first time in years and my brain starting seeing it as a good fit for Cullen's life. The part where Layne sings "Deny your maker"  I had to laugh at how appropriate it was. Like the dog metaphor in the song, Cullen's been the one that gets beat and he's waiting for someone to come save him and all he has is his faith which is being tested. The voice that says "deny your maker" is like the temptation to forsake what he believes because he would suffer less.

I dunno... It's probably jus me but it seems so apt. But I'll share the song with you. It's pretty heavy so if hard rock isn't your thing, you won't like it.

www.youtube.com/watch

TUNE!

Your taste in music is impeccable! I'd say that sums up his life perfectly, someone needs to make a fan video!

[LolaLei]

VampOrchid wrote...

You know what, I'm not surprised at how man haters and Lovers Cullen has. It seems though, those are the type of characters that always do well in a story. Love'em or Hate'em, just means that the writers are doing their jobs properly, they are making their audience 'feel' something towards that character. Any feeling at all is better then none. It means the character had an affect.

Take a look at Carth from KOTOR...many ppl loved him, many hated him. Goal achieved.
Alistair, bingo, same thing.
Morigan. Same thing.
Anders, same.
The list of successful characters is long for the history of BIOWARE!

So the thing that hints to me the most, in the case of Cullen, of being a very possible candidate for LI/Companion, is the fact that he does strike a nerve, whatever one that might be, in all BIO fans.

Nuff said!

Amen to that!

The fact that he conjures up so many different feelings and reactions in people is a good thing! The more I think about it, the more I feel like the set up in DA2 for DA3 is tailor made for Cullen. He's bound to be a companion at this rate (hopefully!) Although there's a lot of rumours going around that Nathaniel might be the new Grey Warden companion... not that I mind, he was a rogue anyway so that still leaves a Cullen shaped warrior role to fill.

[vieralynn]

LolaLei wrote...

vieralynn wrote...

LolaLei wrote...

vieralynn wrote...

LolaLei wrote...

Oooo ladies, I've just had another thought.

What if Cullen is a companion/LI in DA3 but throughout the game he starts to suffer from lyrium withdrawal? (Perhaps he can't get hold of any or he's trying to come off it) but they withdrawl symptoms start to get so bad that when he's offered it by one of the "bad guys" he takes the offer in exchange for siding with them/killing you or something equally as dramatic.

Maybe if your friendship score (or whatever system they use this time round) isn't high enough then he'll take the deal, but if it is high or you're romancing him then he'll turn them down which makes him so ill that he ends up passing out or something, thus opening up a new quest to try and help/heal him or find him some lyrium (kinda like the way Zev will screw you over if you haven't friended him in DA:O.)

I like idea or something similar, especially if it has the same feel as Zevran's betrayal.  

I think it would satisfy the whole range of fandom. For the people who seriously hate him, they can have their satisfaction in watching Cullen betray them and then battling him (although I don't want to think about the possibility of a dead Cullen ).  Of course, for all the rest of us, we'll make sure he pulls through whatever the crisis is and that stays securily with our party. 

It would be like something for everyone lol. I'm not entirely sure of the implications of lyrium withdrawal but I know it can kill you (according to Samson and the Asunder novel.) Maybe he'd end up falling into a coma or being deathly ill... Mind you, a scene/quest like that might be too similar to ME3 with the Kaidan/Ashley death bed scene.

Lol, if Bioware used all the ideas we come up with here, the whole game would end up being entirely based around Cullen.. Not that I'd complain! I remember David Gaider saying he felt like he put too much emphasis on Alistair rather than the Warden and that he wouldn't be doing that in the future... so we probably won't see another super indepth romance/story arc like Alistair's was in a Dragon Age game; though I'd hope that if Cullen is a companion/LI then it would be heavily tied into the main story like Anders, Alistair, Isabela and Morrigan's were.

In DA:O, I actually liked the story's emphasis on Alistair and I don't think that the PC needs to be the most important character. In can become unbelievable if the bulk of the story is centered around the PC. What makes them so special? 

I found Alistair's story arc interesting no matter if you romanced him or not, or played a male or female warden. I enjoyed discovering more about how Alistair fit into the larger problems at hand, and working with him (or against him) to make decisions that shaped the future of Ferelden. 

As much as I love DA2, I think it suffered from having the Anders and Isabela friendship/romance quests feel too forced and too brief. Neither unfolds slowly and deeply the way Alistair does (and, presumably Morrigan, but I haven't tried romancing her yet).

Yeah I really liked it too, especially because I took a liking to Alistair instantly in quite an unhealthy fashion LOL. All the DA:O romances felt very indepth, just more so with Morrigan and Alistair because their story arcs/romance arcs were tied into the main storyline.

The romances in DA2 felt like a flirt/flirt/kiss/shag/kiss event all very rushed and once they'd moved in there was nothing else you could do with them romantically. You also don't get to know much if anything about the companions pasts... Aveline goes into a bit of detail about her father but it wasn't as indepth and it just didn't feel the same as it did in DA:O. I also have a theory that the ambience/atmosphere (or lack of) in DA2 played a big part in why the friendships and romances didn't feel as intimate. In DA:O you had the camp site, usually all the best conversations took place around the fire at night with the soft music playing in the background, in DA2 you had the companion areas, none of which had the right sort of ambience for romantic conversations.

In DA3 I'd like to see those intimate conversations take place in different areas and enviroments. To use an example I made a few pages back to give you an idea, picture the following: You're wandering around some Orlesian city and someone mentions seeing Cullen heading towards the city walls. You decide to check in on him  to see if he's alright (like in ME3 where your companions move around and mingle in different parts of the Citadel and the Normandy.) Eventually you find him staring out to sea taking in the breathtaking view of the sunset. You both take in the view for a while before you finally ask him whats wrong. He then proceeds to tell you about whatever it is thats bothering him or tells you a bit about his past and life in the Chantry as a boy etc, you learn that he's lead a very lonely life/never had a relationship/was an orphan/whatever. You then get a little cinematic where it looks like Cullen and your character are about to kiss... but they don't, instead both look away with a half smile/blush (because at that point it's fairly early on into the romantic pursuit.) *Que lots of approval points from Cullen.* Each of those little scenes would take place in different environments (some more romantic than others) and would be vastly different depending on each individual companion.

The same would go for the sex scenes. Your characters class should come into play during those scenes too. For example, if you're a rogue then maybe you'd use your daggers or murder knife to rip open your love interests clothes, if you're a warrior maybe you'd pin your love interest against the wall in a lusty manner and if you're a mage then your character would use his/her magic to pull the love interest close to him or you'd see his/her magic flaring during the act.

THIS is what they need to do!  Yes, the romances were completely flirt/flirt/kiss/shag/kiss and the flirting felt very fake whereas the flirthing in DA:O felt far more realistic. Some of the DA2 flirt options occur when Hawke hardly even knows the person they are flirting with. It was very jarring to me, especially during my first play through.

The only good thing about DA2's romances is that you never end up in the situation where you click on a character to see if they have any new dialogue but they have nothing to say (and then you give them a gift and click again). Although the romances in DA:O felt more natural, I didn't like having to repeatedly click on a character to see if any new dialogue had appeared.

Your description of an unfolding romance takes the best ideas from different games. I hope they decide to do something like this, with or without Cullen (although with Cullen would greatly prefered).

[Dunquixote]

Guess what everyone? One of my birthday gifts my fiance got me was a brand new copy of DA II . yay. Xbox 360 version, but still.

[SamaraDraven]

LolaLei wrote...

SamaraDraven wrote...

Ooohhhh Man! I was listening t my favorite Alice In Chains song for the first time in years and my brain starting seeing it as a good fit for Cullen's life. The part where Layne sings "Deny your maker"  I had to laugh at how appropriate it was. Like the dog metaphor in the song, Cullen's been the one that gets beat and he's waiting for someone to come save him and all he has is his faith which is being tested. The voice that says "deny your maker" is like the temptation to forsake what he believes because he would suffer less.

I dunno... It's probably jus me but it seems so apt. But I'll share the song with you. It's pretty heavy so if hard rock isn't your thing, you won't like it.

www.youtube.com/watch

TUNE!

Your taste in music is impeccable! I'd say that sums up his life perfectly, someone needs to make a fan video!

Thank you! I was sure I'd be alone on that one. I'll make lots of videos once I get PC versions of the game and install mods so I can get the footage I need. Until then, I'll daydream the music video I have in my head on repeat!

[LolaLei]

vieralynn wrote...

LolaLei wrote...

vieralynn wrote...

LolaLei wrote...

vieralynn wrote...

LolaLei wrote...

Oooo ladies, I've just had another thought.

What if Cullen is a companion/LI in DA3 but throughout the game he starts to suffer from lyrium withdrawal? (Perhaps he can't get hold of any or he's trying to come off it) but they withdrawl symptoms start to get so bad that when he's offered it by one of the "bad guys" he takes the offer in exchange for siding with them/killing you or something equally as dramatic.

Maybe if your friendship score (or whatever system they use this time round) isn't high enough then he'll take the deal, but if it is high or you're romancing him then he'll turn them down which makes him so ill that he ends up passing out or something, thus opening up a new quest to try and help/heal him or find him some lyrium (kinda like the way Zev will screw you over if you haven't friended him in DA:O.)

I like idea or something similar, especially if it has the same feel as Zevran's betrayal.  

I think it would satisfy the whole range of fandom. For the people who seriously hate him, they can have their satisfaction in watching Cullen betray them and then battling him (although I don't want to think about the possibility of a dead Cullen ).  Of course, for all the rest of us, we'll make sure he pulls through whatever the crisis is and that stays securily with our party. 

It would be like something for everyone lol. I'm not entirely sure of the implications of lyrium withdrawal but I know it can kill you (according to Samson and the Asunder novel.) Maybe he'd end up falling into a coma or being deathly ill... Mind you, a scene/quest like that might be too similar to ME3 with the Kaidan/Ashley death bed scene.

Lol, if Bioware used all the ideas we come up with here, the whole game would end up being entirely based around Cullen.. Not that I'd complain! I remember David Gaider saying he felt like he put too much emphasis on Alistair rather than the Warden and that he wouldn't be doing that in the future... so we probably won't see another super indepth romance/story arc like Alistair's was in a Dragon Age game; though I'd hope that if Cullen is a companion/LI then it would be heavily tied into the main story like Anders, Alistair, Isabela and Morrigan's were.

In DA:O, I actually liked the story's emphasis on Alistair and I don't think that the PC needs to be the most important character. In can become unbelievable if the bulk of the story is centered around the PC. What makes them so special? 

I found Alistair's story arc interesting no matter if you romanced him or not, or played a male or female warden. I enjoyed discovering more about how Alistair fit into the larger problems at hand, and working with him (or against him) to make decisions that shaped the future of Ferelden. 

As much as I love DA2, I think it suffered from having the Anders and Isabela friendship/romance quests feel too forced and too brief. Neither unfolds slowly and deeply the way Alistair does (and, presumably Morrigan, but I haven't tried romancing her yet).

Yeah I really liked it too, especially because I took a liking to Alistair instantly in quite an unhealthy fashion LOL. All the DA:O romances felt very indepth, just more so with Morrigan and Alistair because their story arcs/romance arcs were tied into the main storyline.

The romances in DA2 felt like a flirt/flirt/kiss/shag/kiss event all very rushed and once they'd moved in there was nothing else you could do with them romantically. You also don't get to know much if anything about the companions pasts... Aveline goes into a bit of detail about her father but it wasn't as indepth and it just didn't feel the same as it did in DA:O. I also have a theory that the ambience/atmosphere (or lack of) in DA2 played a big part in why the friendships and romances didn't feel as intimate. In DA:O you had the camp site, usually all the best conversations took place around the fire at night with the soft music playing in the background, in DA2 you had the companion areas, none of which had the right sort of ambience for romantic conversations.

In DA3 I'd like to see those intimate conversations take place in different areas and enviroments. To use an example I made a few pages back to give you an idea, picture the following: You're wandering around some Orlesian city and someone mentions seeing Cullen heading towards the city walls. You decide to check in on him  to see if he's alright (like in ME3 where your companions move around and mingle in different parts of the Citadel and the Normandy.) Eventually you find him staring out to sea taking in the breathtaking view of the sunset. You both take in the view for a while before you finally ask him whats wrong. He then proceeds to tell you about whatever it is thats bothering him or tells you a bit about his past and life in the Chantry as a boy etc, you learn that he's lead a very lonely life/never had a relationship/was an orphan/whatever. You then get a little cinematic where it looks like Cullen and your character are about to kiss... but they don't, instead both look away with a half smile/blush (because at that point it's fairly early on into the romantic pursuit.) *Que lots of approval points from Cullen.* Each of those little scenes would take place in different environments (some more romantic than others) and would be vastly different depending on each individual companion.

The same would go for the sex scenes. Your characters class should come into play during those scenes too. For example, if you're a rogue then maybe you'd use your daggers or murder knife to rip open your love interests clothes, if you're a warrior maybe you'd pin your love interest against the wall in a lusty manner and if you're a mage then your character would use his/her magic to pull the love interest close to him or you'd see his/her magic flaring during the act.

THIS is what they need to do!  Yes, the romances were completely flirt/flirt/kiss/shag/kiss and the flirting felt very fake whereas the flirthing in DA:O felt far more realistic. Some of the DA2 flirt options occur when Hawke hardly even knows the person they are flirting with. It was very jarring to me, especially during my first play through.

The only good thing about DA2's romances is that you never end up in the situation where you click on a character to see if they have any new dialogue but they have nothing to say (and then you give them a gift and click again). Although the romances in DA:O felt more natural, I didn't like having to repeatedly click on a character to see if any new dialogue had appeared.

Your description of an unfolding romance takes the best ideas from different games. I hope they decide to do something like this, with or without Cullen (although with Cullen would greatly prefered).

This is the kind of image I imagined for Cullen's scene, except the city would look more french building wise... It's funny, this picture actually looks like it's straight out of a Dragon Age game doesn't it.