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[LolaLei]

Lol those are hilarious!

[R2s Muse]

An interesting read from greywardens.com on DA3 possibilities, with a big shoutout to Cullen's possible inclusion. It's a little rambly, IMO, but discusses some interesting issues for the next game.

[LolaLei]

R2s Muse wrote...

An interesting read from greywardens.com on DA3 possibilities, with a big shoutout to Cullen's possible inclusion. It's a little rambly, IMO, but discusses some interesting issues for the next game.

Lol even the Grey Warden website knows Cullen is a popular choice, we're totally getting the word out there!

[R2s Muse]

LolaLei wrote...

R2s Muse wrote...

An interesting read from greywardens.com on DA3 possibilities, with a big shoutout to Cullen's possible inclusion. It's a little rambly, IMO, but discusses some interesting issues for the next game.

Lol even the Grey Warden website knows Cullen is a popular choice, we're totally getting the word out there!

Yeah, I think what I appreciated particularly was the positivity they included about Cullen, quoting what DG said about him being the voice of sanity.

[LolaLei]

R2s Muse wrote...

LolaLei wrote...

R2s Muse wrote...

An interesting read from greywardens.com on DA3 possibilities, with a big shoutout to Cullen's possible inclusion. It's a little rambly, IMO, but discusses some interesting issues for the next game.

Lol even the Grey Warden website knows Cullen is a popular choice, we're totally getting the word out there!

Yeah, I think what I appreciated particularly was the positivity they included about Cullen, quoting what DG said about him being the voice of sanity.

Yeah, it's nice to see some positivity surrounding him for once. Usually if there is an article about him it's either a squee fest or "rawr Cullen killed all the mages!!!" 

[PizzaThe Hutt]

Nice to know that he's getting some shout-outs on the interwebs though...

[MissRedZelda]

Makes you wonder if people who call Cullen a killer even paid attention to his "You've gone too far!" speech to Meredith at the end of DA2.

[LolaLei]

Here's a new question:

Do you suppose Cullen is the type of man to take pity on those less fortunate (like the people of Darktown) or do you think he's of the mindset that they should pull themselves out of the gutter and considers their situation as their own doing?

[LolaLei]

MissRedZelda wrote...

Makes you wonder if people who call Cullen a killer even paid attention to his "You've gone too far!" speech to Meredith at the end of DA2.

I think people just love to hate on someone (especially those that are completely anti-Templar) and unfortunately due to his epilogues in DA:O (dispite being retconned) they consider him to be a murderous nutjob, even when DG has clearly stated otherwise.

[meanieweenie]

LolaLei wrote...

Here's a new question:

Do you suppose Cullen is the type of man to take pity on those less fortunate (like the people of Darktown) or do you think he's of the mindset that they should pull themselves out of the gutter and considers their situation as their own doing?

I suppose it would depend on the circumstance.... those that are truly trying to better themselves he would take pity on. Those who sat idly by and moaned about thier plight and b!tched about the man holding them down I would assume he'd be more stern with and expect them to better themselves.

On a side note, do you think Cullen will forgive me if I started seeing Alistair again? I'm thinking about re-installing DA:O. lol

Also, MissRedZelda - I know you seem to be a Fenris gal (if I'm wrong forgive me) but have you seen this new thing Gideon Emery had filmed called "Survivor Type"? I watched some of the short and have to say I'm so very grossed out by the story. His performance is well given! (It's a Steven King short, I believe)

Modifié par meanieweenie, 31 juillet 2012 - 02:28 .

[Xilizhra]

LolaLei wrote...

MissRedZelda wrote...

Makes you wonder if people who call Cullen a killer even paid attention to his "You've gone too far!" speech to Meredith at the end of DA2.

I think people just love to hate on someone (especially those that are completely anti-Templar) and unfortunately due to his epilogues in DA:O (dispite being retconned) they consider him to be a murderous nutjob, even when DG has clearly stated otherwise.

I have paid attention. I've also paid attention to his participation in the Annulment and his condemnation of mages as not being people. I consider him a righteous ass, and I don't believe the thought necessitates not paying attention or simply loving to hate.

[TEWR]

MissRedZelda wrote...

Makes you wonder if people who call Cullen a killer even paid attention to his "You've gone too far!" speech to Meredith at the end of DA2.

I guess he's not a killer for being among a group that is taking part in murdering hundreds of men, women, and children for an act they didn't commit, all because his leader wants to appease a hypothetical mob that hasn't formed yet -- due to it being nighttime when everyone's sleeping -- and ignoring the fact that the guilty party was ready to submit himself to justice.

Nope, not a killer. He's a saint.

Any Templar that took part in that RoA which had no reason to be called other then because Meredith went so far into the loony bin -- after she'd been in there for who knows how long -- that she couldn't get out is, by default, a murderer and a killer.

[brushyourteeth]

While it's true that Cullen should have stepped in sooner, it's worth noting that he did eventually stand up to Meredith - an act that did save lives and throw his ass into the fire. It was late in coming, but it took guts, and there was nothing about the act that served him or made his life easier.

What makes Cullen so interesting is that he WAS a nutjob who couldn't wait to kill mages. Haven't you ever had a past you're ashamed of or done things other people would consider distasteful? I have. We can be opposed to punishing mages before they've even committed a crime ONLY if we also judge others (Chantry folk included) on the decisions they make, not HAVE made or MIGHT make.

As of the end of DAII, Cullen is a BA, anti-oppression-for-mages, do-what-it-takes-even-if-my-life-is-destroyed-for-it kind of guy. No hate, please - there's no call for it. And we have no idea where his actions will take him in The Next Thing.

[Xilizhra]

While it's true that Cullen should have stepped in sooner, it's worth noting that he did eventually stand up to Meredith - an act that did save lives and throw his ass into the fire. It was late in coming, but it took guts, and there was nothing about the act that served him or made his life easier.

Pfft. Cullen's intervention meant nothing to my party in terms of combat; he's just a guy in a metal suit and doesn't seem nearly as skilled as any of my own armed lunatics. And Meredith was clearly aiming to kill anything that moved by that point; Cullen was going to be a target sooner or later.

What makes Cullen so interesting is that he WAS a nutjob who couldn't wait to kill mages. Haven't you ever had a past you're ashamed of or done things other people would consider distasteful? I have. We can be opposed to punishing mages before they've even committed a crime ONLY if we also judge others (Chantry folk included) on the decisions they make, not HAVE made or MIGHT make.

I judge Cullen for the Annulment, then, if I can ignore the stuff from DAO.

As of the end of DAII, Cullen is a BA, anti-oppression-for-mages, do-what-it-takes-even-if-my-life-is-destroyed-for-it kind of guy. No hate, please - there's no call for it. And we have no idea where his actions will take him in The Next Thing.

There's no indication whatsoever that Cullen is against oppressing mages. He's squeamish about killing those who are actually helpless (though is totally happy to kill those defending themselves/others), but shows no other form of morality aside from trying to rein in Meredith's all-encompassing lunacy.

[LolaLei]

Xilizhra wrote...

LolaLei wrote...

MissRedZelda wrote...

Makes you wonder if people who call Cullen a killer even paid attention to his "You've gone too far!" speech to Meredith at the end of DA2.

I think people just love to hate on someone (especially those that are completely anti-Templar) and unfortunately due to his epilogues in DA:O (dispite being retconned) they consider him to be a murderous nutjob, even when DG has clearly stated otherwise.

I have paid attention. I've also paid attention to his participation in the Annulment and his condemnation of mages as not being people. I consider him a righteous ass, and I don't believe the thought necessitates not paying attention or simply loving to hate.

I'm curious as to why you keep returning to this thread then, you're aware that it's a Cullen fan thread right? Or do you just come here to enjoy our sparkling conversation and illuminating personalities? 

[MissRedZelda]

Xilizhra wrote...

LolaLei wrote...

MissRedZelda wrote...

Makes you wonder if people who call Cullen a killer even paid attention to his "You've gone too far!" speech to Meredith at the end of DA2.

I think people just love to hate on someone (especially those that are completely anti-Templar) and unfortunately due to his epilogues in DA:O (dispite being retconned) they consider him to be a murderous nutjob, even when DG has clearly stated otherwise.

I have paid attention. I've also paid attention to his participation in the Annulment and his condemnation of mages as not being people. I consider him a righteous ass, and I don't believe the thought necessitates not paying attention or simply loving to hate.

I'm sure anyone who witnessed the murder of close friends and comraddes would suffer from a mental breakdown and go through a heroic BSOD. He witnessed blood mages and mages turning into Abominations. It was when the Anullment thing called by Meredith when his sences returned. And I'm pretty sure he still has nightmares about the incident at the Tower. Cut him at least a tiny bit of slack, please?

Plus, in my game, as soon as Meredith called for the Anullment (or called for hawke's death), that was when he called her out.

Also, Gaider himself said that Cullen is supposed to represent the side of the Templars that aren't murdering, mage hunting a-holes.

[Xilizhra]

I'm curious as to why you keep returning to this thread then, you're aware that it's a Cullen fan thread right? Or do you just come here to enjoy our sparkling conversation and illuminating personalities?

Consider me a Cullen rivaler. We have to put up with that abomination known as the Merrill rivalmance in that fan thread, after all.

In any case, I only showed up this time due to what seemed suspiciously close to a personal attack on a group of people that included me.

[MissRedZelda]

What does the attack have to do with Cullen, sorry?

[Xilizhra]

I'm sure anyone who witnessed the murder of close friends and comraddes would suffer from a mental breakdown and go through a heroic BSOD. He witnessed blood mages and mages turning into Abominations. It was when the Anullment thing called by Meredith when his sences returned. And I'm pretty sure he still has nightmares about the incident at the Tower. Cut him at least a tiny bit of slack, please?

I have cut him a tiny bit of slack; I didn't kill him after Meredith. Or at least that was my Hawke cutting him slack.

Plus, in my game, as soon as Meredith called for the Anullment (or called for hawke's death), that was when he called her out.

Honestly, I would have liked an option to say "This goes too far now? With me? But none of the others? No; either stand down, now, or do your very best to kill me, because I'm definitely going to be doing the reverse."

Also, Gaider himself said that Cullen is supposed to represent the side of the Templars that aren't murdering, mage hunting a-holes.

It must be lonely being a side all by yourself. But I think Gaider's fallen prey to the Golden Mean fallacy and the belief that because mages and templars are opposed, it's a position between them that's the most correct. Which I don't believe in. In any case, Thrask and Keran fit the role way better.
Gaider also said there were no atheists in Thedas, IIRC.

[LolaLei]

Xilizhra wrote...

I'm curious as to why you keep returning to this thread then, you're aware that it's a Cullen fan thread right? Or do you just come here to enjoy our sparkling conversation and illuminating personalities?

Consider me a Cullen rivaler. We have to put up with that abomination known as the Merrill rivalmance in that fan thread, after all.

In any case, I only showed up this time due to what seemed suspiciously close to a personal attack on a group of people that included me.

I see no personal attack happening regarding any group of people, besides, if you thinking that's an attack try opening up a YouTube channel lol. As for the Merrill rivalmance I wouldn't know, I don't rivalmance any of the companions, it's cruel.

[Xilizhra]

LolaLei wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

I'm curious as to why you keep returning to this thread then, you're aware that it's a Cullen fan thread right? Or do you just come here to enjoy our sparkling conversation and illuminating personalities?

Consider me a Cullen rivaler. We have to put up with that abomination known as the Merrill rivalmance in that fan thread, after all.

In any case, I only showed up this time due to what seemed suspiciously close to a personal attack on a group of people that included me.

I see no personal attack happening regarding any group of people, besides, if you thinking that's an attack try opening up a YouTube channel lol. As for the Merrill rivalmance I wouldn't know, I don't rivalmance any of the companions, it's cruel.

Youtube? Forgive me, but I prefer to speak with humans, hence my staying here.

And I agree on the rivalmance part with Merrill and Anders. Fenris I couldn't say, really; Isabela, however, you're not being mean to her at all, just being nice to others around her.

[LolaLei]

I wouldn't exactly call a lot of the people on this forum human either, but each to their own!

[brushyourteeth]

Xilizhra wrote...

Pfft. Cullen's intervention meant nothing to my party in terms of combat; he's just a guy in a metal suit and doesn't seem nearly as skilled as any of my own armed lunatics. And Meredith was clearly aiming to kill anything that moved by that point; Cullen was going to be a target sooner or later.

Would love some clarification on this. I'm sure you're saying something intelligent - I just can't understand it.

I judge Cullen for the Annulment, then, if I can ignore the stuff from DAO.

You know, the funny thing about that Annulment is that Meredith was actually right - Orsino was practicing blood magic and hiding it pretty well. Not saying I agree with the choice, or that I admire Cullen's hesitancy to break the chain of command, but the point is that he did eventually grow a pair and do the right thing.

There's no indication whatsoever that Cullen is against oppressing mages. He's squeamish about killing those who are actually helpless (though is totally happy to kill those defending themselves/others), but shows no other form of morality aside from trying to rein in Meredith's all-encompassing lunacy.

Yeah, to protect mages. If Cullen loved killing them he'd have just whooped and hollared and had him a good ol' time. Heck, he'd have killed you too just for having the gall to conspire with some. Again, I'll admit he took his sweet time, but he did eventually do the right thing. Does someone have those quotes handy from The Last Straw about how he told Meredith he'd stand and defend the mages because "I believe that's what Templars are for"? Can't find those for the life of me. 

I'd love to hear more about your first comments, but we probably won't agree on this no matter what. Good discussion though.

Modifié par brushyourteeth, 31 juillet 2012 - 05:06 .

[Xilizhra]

Would love some clarification on this. I'm sure you're saying something intelligent - I just can't understand it.

What I mean is that I don't owe Cullen my life, and I doubt many others do either.

You know, the funny thing about that Annulment is that Meredith was actually right - Orsino was practicing blood magic and hiding it pretty well. Not saying I agree with the choice, or that I admire Cullen's hesitancy to break the chain of command, but the point is that he did eventually grow a pair and do the right thing.

Actually, Orsino hadn't used blood magic until the very end. In any case, I find it a bit difficult to actually admire someone doing what they should have been doing from the beginning, and what someone like Keran was doing far sooner.

Yeah, to protect mages. If Cullen loved killing them he'd have just whooped and hollared and had him a good ol' time. Heck, he'd have killed you too just for having the gall to conspire with some. Again, I'll admit he took his sweet time, but he did eventually do the right thing. Does someone have those quotes handy from The Last Straw about how he told Meredith he'd stand and defend the mages because "I believe that's what Templars are for"? Can't find those for the life of me.

I really don't get how anyone can say that with a straight face, in his position no less. Unless his ideas of protection have been warped to begin with. I won't say that he's sadistic (although Meredith isn't either, really), but it doesn't help his victims any.

[LolaLei]

Personally, I feel that his flaws (like taking his time to disobey Meredith directly etc) is what makes him such an good character. I mean, love him or hate him he has enough personal history and made so many bad decisions that people have a big reaction to him (be it good or bad), and to me that makes him a worthy potential companion for DA3. People want to get to know him/romance him or confront him/kill him, and we won't be able to do any of that unless he's a companion.

No two ways about it, he's a well written character.