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[Hellion Rex]

Well, some folks may find themselves attracted to Iron Bull or Solas, but the fact remains that the women so far are beautiful by most societal standards but the men are not. It is very obvious to me that straight men designed these characters. We had that little blog post from Cassandra's designer about how he wanted her personality to shine through and for her to not just be pretty... lo and behold, she's f***ing gorgeous. 

 

As for the three LI of each gender, I definitely do not want that because that means there'll be a 33.3% chance that Cullen will be straight, and then I might just completely lose it.

That's a VERY big generalization about the designers of the female characters. Just because they're well done hardly means they were designed by straight men. They could have just as easily been drawn by women, or gay men. And beauty is subjective, not objective. For one, I think Iron Bull is freaking gorgeous.

[Xilizhra]

It is very obvious to me that straight men designed these characters.

Or lesbians. Along with everything Eluvianix said.

[The Elder King]

Well, some folks may find themselves attracted to Iron Bull or Solas, but the fact remains that the women so far are beautiful by most societal standards but the men are not. It is very obvious to me that straight men designed these characters. We had that little blog post from Cassandra's designer about how he wanted her personality to shine through and for her to not just be pretty... lo and behold, she's f***ing gorgeous.

As for the three LI of each gender, I definitely do not want that because that means there'll be a 33.3% chance that Cullen will be straight, and then I might just completely lose it.

Considering that those same straight artists draw companions in DAO and DA2, I don't see the relevance with them being straight males. Plus, I really love Cassandra's design, but I woudn't call her beautiful by most societal standards. There are plently of people who hate/dislike her appearance, as it is with Solas, and they said That Bioware is creating ugly/not good looking females.

[Chanda]

This is old, but reposting it anyway:

 

Solas, Cassandra (from the back) Dwarfquisitor, and teeny tiny Cullen in the background, waving. And possibly his Templars, going to a safehaven now known as Skyhold?

 

[BFace]

That's a VERY big generalization about the designers of the female characters. Just because they're well done hardly means they were designed by straight men. They could have just as easily been drawn by women, or gay men. And beauty is subjective, not objective. For one, I think Iron Bull is freaking gorgeous.

And I don't think Cassandra is "gorgeous" by any means.

She's certainly got character in her face, but eh.

Also, Solas? I am sort of in love with his shiny elven head. I'm really really excited to learn more about him.

[Dirgegun]

This is old, but reposting it anyway:

 

Solas, Cassandra (from the back) Dwarfquisitor, and teeny tiny Cullen in the background, waving. And possibly his Templars, going to a safehaven now known as Skyhold?

 

 

Every time I see this, I keep focusing on that fem!Dwarf and those beautiful freckles. I will be so cross if there are no freckles in the CC. 

[Chanda]

I'm glad to see that the women in Inquisition aren't some comic-book doll with unrealistic body proportions. They look mostly normal, and their faces have character.

[CuriousArtemis]

That's a VERY big generalization about the designers of the female characters. Just because they're well done hardly means they were designed by straight men. They could have just as easily been drawn by women, or gay men. And beauty is subjective, not objective. For one, I think Iron Bull is freaking gorgeous.

 

Yes I can't say how many times folks have come at me with "beauty is subjective." I think this points to some troubling reading comprehension skills (of course I would say that, being an English teacher ); every time I've posted about this issue I've specifically spoken about "traditional" beauty or, as I said above, "beautiful by most societal standards." It can be a difficult concept to grasp, I grant, but think of it like masculinity and femininity. Those concepts do not empirically exist (like beauty) but they are socially constructed, as is beauty. The two released women conform to that construction, whereas Iron Bull and Solas do not. 

[BFace]

I'm glad to see that the women in Inquisition aren't some comic-book doll with unrealistic body proportions. They look mostly normal, and their faces have character.

Yes. This is awesome. I like that everyone seems to have character. I *like* this. But I am far less interested in their appearances than I am in what they're like. What they sound like, what they think, etc. Not enough information to make any sort of assumptions about friendships, rivalries, romances.

[Hellion Rex]

Yes I can't say how many times folks have come at me with "beauty is subjective." I think this points to some troubling reading comprehension skills (of course I would say that, being an English teacher ); every time I've posted about this issue I've specifically spoken about "traditional" beauty or, as I said above, "beautiful by most societal standards." It can be a difficult concept to grasp, I grant, but think of it like masculinity and femininity. Those concepts do not empirically exist (like beauty) but they are socially constructed, as is beauty. The two released women conform to that construction, whereas Iron Bull and Solas do not. 

Trust me, I understand where you are coming from, and I get what you're saying. But that still doesn't mean that these characters were created by all straight men, classical beauty or not.

[The Elder King]

I honestly don't think Cassandra is conventionally attractive.

[CuriousArtemis]

Considering that those same straight artists draw companions in DAO and DA2, I don't see the relevance with them being straight males. Plus, I really love Cassandra's design, but I woudn't call her beautiful by most societal standards. There are plently of people who hate/dislike her appearance, as it is with Solas, and they said That Bioware is creating ugly/not good looking females.

 

Well because, indeed, it was said that the artists were given free reign to create non-traditionally attractive characters. Presumably this didn't occur for DA:O and DA2. Hence why it's relevant here for DA:I to point out the gender and orientation of the artists.

 

Cassandra's design I would definitely say conforms to societal standards of female beauty. A somewhat strong jawline isn't enough to alter that. Now if she were bald with massive body builder muscles, then we might have something to talk about.

[Hellion Rex]

I honestly don't think Cassandra is conventionally attractive.

I don't either. Vivienne is more "conventional", I would say.

[Xilizhra]

Yes I can't say how many times folks have come at me with "beauty is subjective." I think this points to some troubling reading comprehension skills (of course I would say that, being an English teacher ); every time I've posted about this issue I've specifically spoken about "traditional" beauty or, as I said above, "beautiful by most societal standards." It can be a difficult concept to grasp, I grant, but think of it like masculinity and femininity. Those concepts do not empirically exist (like beauty) but they are socially constructed, as is beauty. The two released women conform to that construction, whereas Iron Bull and Solas do not. 

I think this line of thought bothers me because, if we had a bunch of men complaining that the women (not necessarily the ones who've been released for DAI, just any given possibilities) weren't pretty enough, I think we'd all be tearing into them for being shallow and likely sexist.

[CuriousArtemis]

Trust me, I understand where you are coming from, and I get what you're saying. But that still doesn't mean that these characters were created by all straight men, classical beauty or not.

 

Designed with the straight male gaze in mind, then. 

[The Elder King]

Plus, as I stated in another thread, writers influence the work on companions' appearances, and the writer team has one/two straight males (don't know about Lukas). And we have no clue if some female artists/homosexual male artists work on IB or Solas.

[Hellion Rex]

Well because, indeed, it was said that the artists were given free reign to create non-traditionally attractive characters. Presumably this didn't occur for DA:O and DA2. Hence why it's relevant here for DA:I to point out the gender and orientation of the artists.

 

Cassandra's design I would definitely say conforms to societal standards of female beauty. A somewhat strong jawline isn't enough to alter that. Now if she were bald with massive body builder muscles, then we might have something to talk about.

You still don't explain how an artist's sexual orientation has anything at all to with the design of these characters. A gay male designer can just easily create a "traditionally" attractive woman as a straight one can.

[CuriousArtemis]

Well, let's not worry about it then; I think I'm trying to communicate something in the wrong venue and to the wrong audience. Suffice it to say, I'm a little annoyed with the design choices so far, but of course we know very little at present. 

 

I'm sure I don't have to point out that I find their personalities a very important component in a romance, and also, as I've pointed out many times, I am not attracted to Fenris or Isabela, and yet these are my favorite romances. (But, again, both are conventionally attractive individuals. I wouldn't have romanced Fenris so much if he were bald, in all honesty. Or looked like any of those roided up versions Matt Rhodes produced before settling on the final version.)

[Hellion Rex]

Regardless, we still have 4 companions left, and as far as we know, their designs could look like damn near anything.

[Xilizhra]

Regardless, we still have 4 companions left, and as far as we know, their designs could look like damn near anything.

Four? I dearly hope not. Two preferably... I could stand three.

[CuriousArtemis]

You still don't explain how an artist's sexual orientation has anything at all to with the design of these characters. A gay male designer can just easily create a "traditionally" attractive woman as a straight one can.

 

True, and I meant to drop it, but I think what I was getting at is that the straight male gaze is usually what's catered to in gaming, usually because the developers themselves are mostly straight males. Now BioWare has a pretty impressive writing crew who buck that tradition, which is why we get some pretty progressive storytelling. The character design is somewhat progressive but not on par with the writing, so I would guess that its crew is not as diverse. Then again, it's not uncommon for women to conform unconsciously to patriarchal standards and to even defend them!

[Hellion Rex]

I think this line of thought bothers me because, if we had a bunch of men complaining that the women (not necessarily the ones who've been released for DAI, just any given possibilities) weren't pretty enough, I think we'd all be tearing into them for being shallow and likely sexist.

I agree with you entirely. But nonetheless, we should just let this thread die out for now.

[The Elder King]

Well because, indeed, it was said that the artists were given free reign to create non-traditionally attractive characters. Presumably this didn't occur for DA:O and DA2. Hence why it's relevant here for DA:I to point out the gender and orientation of the artists.
 
Cassandra's design I would definitely say conforms to societal standards of female beauty. A somewhat strong jawline isn't enough to alter that. Now if she were bald with massive body builder muscles, then we might have something to talk about.

I disagree on Cassandra, but I doubt we'll agree on this.
But you still don't know who work on those characters. You have females and gay males that love IB. Why would a female/gay artist not have the same opinion?
In the end, we have three males shown so far, with two that doesn't conform to traditional concept of beauty, but they're from different races (qunari weren't conventionally attractive since DA2). We haven't seen a male human yet, or how Ssra will look.

[Xilizhra]

True, and I meant to drop it, but I think what I was getting at is that the straight male gaze is usually what's catered to in gaming, usually because the developers themselves are mostly straight males. Now BioWare has a pretty impressive writing crew who buck that tradition, which is why we get some pretty progressive storytelling. The character design is somewhat progressive but not on par with the writing, so I would guess that its crew is not as diverse. Then again, it's not uncommon for women to conform unconsciously to patriarchal standards and to even defend them!

Then wouldn't your irritation be primarily with the female designs for conforming too closely to patriarchal standards (which I... could see but am unsure about)?

[Dirgegun]

Considering the amount of people that brutally tore into Cassandra for her 'masculine' jaw line and sharp features, which, I will admit, am personally aesthetically attracted to because I like me some strong, defining features, I don't believe Cassandra is conventionally beautiful. Her features do tell a story, however, which her designer has already gone over. The sharp angles match her aggression and strength, they tell a story about her character and her personality, and as a designer I personally prefer that to 'these mofos gotta be attractive'.

 

That's my feels, anyway. I'm coming at it from a designer, conceptualist, and demisexual point of view, though.