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[Kirrahe1]

If it's any consolation many my community thinks she may be a man. Chers so cool! My mom that the Piano man was a women singing to a man about him playing the piano....I don't know why. And I thought Billy Gilman was a girl!

[Lorien19]

That seems plausible. In the Sims 3, you have 3 different voices to choose from and a slider to alter the pitch. So maybe they're doing something like this.

If that's the case,I'm definitely doing a chipmunk playthrough...Oh dear, The more I hear the more excited I get!

[Kirrahe1]

If that's the case,I'm definitely doing a chipmunk playthrough...Oh dear, The more I hear the more excited I get!

GASP! And we could make our companions sing really annoying Christmas songs with us! And occasionally when we get into to much mischief Cullen can scream "IIIIInquisitooooooor!"

[Lorien19]

GASP! And we could make our companions sing really annoying Christmas songs with us! And occasionally when we get into to much mischief Cullen can scream "IIIIInquisitooooooor!"

Or imagine the Inquisitor singing  love songs to his/her  LI in a chipmunk voice...Priceless!

[R2s Muse]

That's funny because I was just thinking how I liked her nose in profile. Which is usually an enormous problem for me. I'm just really weird about noses. Noses always causes me the most grief in character creations. I play the Sims a lot too and I collect faces so I don't have to deal with noses as much.

Meanwhile, not too keen on Solas' nose...

I have the worst time with sim noses! I'm worried about the fourth game coming out where you just pull on different body parts to make them long/shorter or different shapes lol! It seems...imprecise

I can never get the noses right in cc either. I always feel like there are so many degrees of freedom that it's too easy to end up with an unreal, gravity defying nose that looks good from the front only. I guess this pic makes it look to me like she has a glitchy, pinocchio nose sticking out the end... which obviously is just a weird feature of the pic, since I think her nose is rather adorable in most of the pics we've seen so far. Maybe she's picked up a bad habit from Varric in stretching the truth... 

[CuriousArtemis]

I could be wrong but wouldn't that be way tricker with an actual language? The sims language no one really understands so words high or low don't sound too weird to us. So the probably can't go crazy lol! Also aren't there some languages where voice pitch completely alters the word said? Although that's probably not something they have to worry about.

 

Simlish may technically be gibberish, but it is written and voice acted so that it sounds like a real language to the player/listener. In fact, if you play the Sims enough, you even start to recognize certain words. 

 

I'm thinking the Sims voice slider is just more sophisticated than the SR4 slider. You have quite a bit of leeway on the Sims slider before the voice starts to sound artificial. (Then again, within that leeway, there honestly isn't a whole lot of difference in pitch.)

 

Anyway, have they never messed around with pitch in the actual game? In Legacy, when we hear Hawke's father, I know it's M!Hawke's voice, but it sounds deeper. Also, the Arishok's VA; did they mess with his pitch, too?

[Xilizhra]

I find noses almost universally ugly and try to avoid looking at them.

[R2s Muse]

Er... I'd really rather not have it be gender-based, as my own Inquisitors would never find a male demon desirous despite being female.

Oh, I may have invited another member of the mage vanguard into this thread, as he's depressed by all the negativity in the DAI story section. I hope that's all right.

I'd like the think that since it's magicky demon, it would shift to whatever suits you/compels you. 

 

And, the more the merrier! 

[Xilizhra]

I'd like the think that since it's magicky demon, it would shift to whatever suits you/compels you. 

 

And, the more the merrier! 

Probably, but how would the game know without implementing some kind of sexuality toggle?

[R2s Muse]

Probably, but how would the game know without implementing some kind of sexuality toggle?

Aw, damn. Good point. Rats. 

[Lorien19]

Simlish may technically be gibberish, but it is written and voice acted so that it sounds like a real language to the player/listener. In fact, if you play the Sims enough, you even start to recognize certain words. 

 

I'm thinking the Sims voice slider is just more sophisticated than the SR4 slider. You have quite a bit of leeway on the Sims slider before the voice starts to sound artificial. (Then again, within that leeway, there honestly isn't a whole lot of difference in pitch.)

 

Anyway, have they never messed around with pitch in the actual game? In Legacy, when we hear Hawke's father, I know it's M!Hawke's voice, but it sounds deeper. Also, the Arishok's VA; did they mess with his pitch, too?

Yes, the sims slider is definitely more sophisticated than that of SR4,besides I think that if DA has a slider it will stop to a point before a voice sounds artificial to be honest.Although a ridiculously high pitched voice would be hilarious I don't think it will fit the concept of the game to have your inquisitor running around with a chipmunk voice...Bu then again you can't know for sure.

[CuriousArtemis]

Probably, but how would the game know without implementing some kind of sexuality toggle?

 

Flirt option in the first five minutes of the game

[VampOrchid]

Probably, but how would the game know without implementing some kind of sexuality toggle?

Could depend on when it appears in game. Depending on what choices you've made, or flirt options with companions you chose in game. If the demon appears half way threw the game, the engine might have an idea of what your character would prefer.

[SamaraDraven]

Probably, but how would the game know without implementing some kind of sexuality toggle?

 

I'd be thrilled with a sexuality toggle! It would make for fewer surprises like:

 

"But you're courting so-and-so!"

 

"Um... I am?" 

 

"You can't have both of us."

 

"Um... wot?    "

[Hellion Rex]

Gaider actually posted about that on Tumblr some time ago. Gimme a sec to find it.

[Xilizhra]

Aw, damn. Good point. Rats. 

Desire demons can take on any pleasing shape, but I believe their true form is feminine because of cultural unconsciousness: women have been portrayed as objects of sexual desire far more often than men, and it's that archetype that the demons take their shape from.

[Hellion Rex]

This is what Gaider had to say:

 

Ah, yes, the “toggle solution”.

I apologize if this comes across as dismissive. It’s just that I’ve seen this proposal quite often on forums like the BSN, to the point that it makes me wince just a little whenever it comes up. What it breaks down to, in essence, is that any design problem which causes disagreement among the fans can be solved by giving everyone what they want. Put a toggle in the options menu so the player can either have or not have whatever is in contention, and thus be pleased with the result.

There are a few issues with that, from a development perspective. The first is our need to treat every version of the game, whether that feature has been turned on or off, as a legitimate way to play and thus one we must test. The more fundamental a mechanic that is affected, the more things it can touch (even inadvertently) and thus the more testing it must receive. We need to be concerned not only about whether that variant works, but also how it affects the play experience.

It’s not about hand-holding or forcing the player to experience the game only a certain way, but about avoiding the player getting a radically different experience of which they may not be aware and for which we would be responsible anyhow, since we provided the option. You click that option in the settings, thinking it will do one thing, but end up getting something different. We have to consider that, and consider how well it meshes up with the experience we are otherwise crafting, and which we intend to support.

It is not, after all, like we can throw something into the options menu and absolve ourselves of responsibility for it. “Hey, you picked that option, man. It’s not our fault it changed your game experience.” We thus select our provided options carefully.

Beyond that, when it comes to content options like the so-called “gay toggle” …my question would be “why?” We don’t allow the player to de-select other sorts of content. A ‘violence’ toggle? A ‘mention of slavery’ toggle? A ‘sexual situations’ toggle? Why would we have a ‘gay’ toggle? Even if that was just to set the player’s personal preference, and we didn’t think that was incredibly on-the-nose to put up front, would de-selecting the ‘gay’ toggle mean a player should expect to encounter no gay characters? Ever? You don’t think there are those who would interpret it as exactly that?

There’s a degree to which, I think, players should be responsible for their own choices, and that doesn’t include filtering out anything which might potentially make them uncomfortable—not in a game which is labeled as big-M Mature. We’re always going to walk a line between accommodating player desires in-game, and having appropriate reactivity, but that doesn’t quite go so far as offering customizable story options out of the gate.

Some people might like that notion, but I suspect they like it in the purely theoretical and idealized sense. Practically speaking, it’s a rabbit hole that leads nowhere good.

[Hellion Rex]

This is Gaider's follow up to the same poster:

 

 

Normally I wouldn’t return to a topic I’ve already addressed, but I understand how those sorts of responses could be distressing to you. So I’ll touch on this one more time.

First off, I personally didn’t read anything into your motivations. The “toggle solution” gets brought up a lot, and my impression is that the people who do so generally mean well. They see fans who are unhappy, and are trying to propose something which (in their mind) would give everyone what they want. What could be better than that? It’s perfectly reasonable, and I don’t think you’re being narrow-minded at all for suggesting it.

What you would have to understand, in reference to the “gay toggle” itself (which wasn’t the entirety of your suggestion, though it’s clearly the one on which many have focused), is the nature of the fans who you’re suggesting should be placated. There are not, in my experience, many gay players requesting the ability to set their PC’s sexuality at character creation so that characters of the opposite gender never hit on them. This is mainly something that straight players request, so they never have to experience a character of the same gender hitting on them. Indeed, some go further than that and have asked for (I’m not joking about this) a “no ******” option so that they never have to encounter anything gay-related in the game at all (whether it has anything to do with romance or no).

So, while its understandably distressing on your part to be lumped in with those people (and it’s pretty common on Tumblr for folks to interpret what they read in the worst light possible), you need to also give their reactions the benefit of the doubt. BioWare doesn’t offer options to filter out other sorts of content that a player might find uncomfortable, so why should this request specifically be seen as more meritable? It’s not something that all players are requesting, but (as I pointed out above) ones that would prefer gay content (and, by extension, gay characters) simply didn’t exist. That’s bound to make someone a bit touchy, don’t you think?

So I’d suggest taking a breath. They’re talking about the people who you’re trying to suggest this toggle to please, and at worst are questioning your motives in trying to please them.

Because that’s the question, isn’t it? Is this an issue that needs solving? Ignoring the practical issues with implementing a toggle, as I brought up in the last post, obviously not everyone liked the “all-bisexual” romance options in DA2. I’ve spoken about this at length previously, and while I don’t think that all the objections can be easily summed up as homophobi a or biphobia, there are indeed elements to many of these discussions which make me uncomfortable. If there is an issue to be addressed, I don’t think it lies on the side of allowing players to “opt out” of content—not in an out-of-game manner (which a toggle would be), at least. It’s something better addressed in the way romances are introduced in-game, in the course of the story.

Improving the means by which a player can indicate to us what sort of story they’d like to have is always our goal, after all. That does not mean they get to have a story built to specifications, however. That’s not an issue for us to solve. Considering all the things that people find triggering, and which fans generally ask us to do better rather than expect us to filter out entirely on their behalf, the plight of someone who had a character of the same sex express interest, and whom they could tell “no thanks” and never hear about the topic again, is not exactly going to garner a lot of sympathy.

[VampOrchid]

Yes I remember reading those

[Xilizhra]

I'm riled tonight, it seems.

[SamaraDraven]

Thanks eluvianx.

 

I guess I didn't think of it that way, but my desire for the toggle is merely for customizing my character. I have played so many variations - both straight and not - that I truly feel being able to set a sexuality option is more a CC to me than a game filter. Being ninja-manced with Anders when I was aiming for Isabela and had been playing Hawke as a lesbian was just jarring to me. I suppose if it wasn't a "Yes-or-I-hate-you" kind of thing for Anders, I'd have felt differently. I know it's realistic to have someone come onto you that you would have to reject but it was a surprise and the fallout wasn't desirable. I think I feel it wouldn't have been an issue if I could have toggled Hawke's orientation and Anders would have "known" better than to even try.   That's why being able to set the orientation sounded good to me. i suppose a better answer would be to do better at companions interactions so there's no ninja-mancing.

[Xilizhra]

Thanks eluvianx.

 

I guess I didn't think of it that way, but my desire for the toggle is merely for customizing my character. I have played so many variations - both straight and not - that I truly feel being able to set a sexuality option is more a CC to me than a game filter. Being ninja-manced with Anders when I was aiming for Isabela and had been playing Hawke as a lesbian was just jarring to me. I suppose if it wasn't a "Yes-or-I-hate-you" kind of thing for Anders, I'd have felt differently. I know it's realistic to have someone come onto you that you would have to reject but it was a surprise and the fallout wasn't desirable. I think I feel it wouldn't have been an issue if I could have toggled Hawke's orientation and Anders would have "known" better than to even try.   That's why being able to set the orientation sounded good to me. i suppose a better answer would be to do better at companions interactions so there's no ninja-mancing.

But... there were heart icons, how could you be ninjamanced?

[BFace]

Aw, thanks, JerHopp! The sound file link is in my post on page 4000, actually. Also in my profile at the very end of my listing of "one shots."  It's Scr0ll's vid. 

 

On Cullen being damaged goods, no, I don't think he is, which is why I ship him hard with Hawke (and which might make DA:I a bit difficult for me, but /rolls up sleeves, a girl's gotta do what a girl's gotta do). But, I could see Varric and others thinking so. For ex, I could totally see Varric having the Come to  Andraste talk with Hawke about him, like he does about Anders, et al.  I mean, a priori, would you want one of your besties dating someone with such a traumatized past? With little else to go on regarding how he'd be as a boyfriend,  I'd probably caution someone. Til I got to know him. 

"Come to Andraste talk" *Snicker* That made me giggle.

[SamaraDraven]

But... there were heart icons, how could you be ninjamanced?

 

I don't know. I remember trying to stick with just the friendly and neutral options. I had picked heart stuff for Isabela. Yet somehow Anders had the idea that he and Hawke were courting. I think I recall coming upon a dialogue that was either a flirt, neutral or aggro - nothing for friendship. Picking the neutral option made him upset. Not sure where I went wrong. Regardless, of where I bungled it, I still wish I could have toggled Hawke's orientation to reflect how I was playing her. I don't see it as a gay/straight content filter unless it's designed that way. For me it was about customizing my character. But I also see DG's point. So I hope Bioware has done better at structuring the convos and romances.

[Xilizhra]

I don't know. I remember trying to stick with just the friendly and neutral options. I had picked heart stuff for Isabela. Yet somehow Anders had the idea that he and Hawke were courting. I think I recall coming upon a dialogue that was either a flirt, neutral or aggro - nothing for friendship. Picking the neutral option made him upset. Not sure where I went wrong. Regardless, of where I bungled it, I still wish I could have toggled Hawke's orientation to reflect how I was playing her. I don't see it as a gay/straight content filter unless it's designed that way. For me it was about customizing my character. But I also DG's point. So I hope Bioware has done better at structuring the convos and romances.

I think the problem here isn't a toggle, just not having a way to let Anders down gently.