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[LolaLei]

*Dances*

[LolaLei]

Wow, it's slow in the DA related forums/threads at the moment. Hopefully that'll pick up next week if they show us some stuff at the NYCC.

[Danny Boy 7]

So I was just thinking about the Orlesian Civil War and how Empress Celene could be likened to Queen Elizabeth I and how the Inquisition could be an unofficial arm of her faction or be her "spies" and the Inquisitor her Sir Wallsingham (sp). It could mean that Grand Duke Gaspard is either Mary Queen of Scots/King Charles of Spain or maybe even Napolean (who disliked religious intolerance and sort of used his circumstances to raise his standing while making himself the French Emperor).

To be honest the Mage-Templar War is not my prefered main setting, but I'll take whats given me. Any who the reason I'm interested in the OCW part of things is that we might be effecting the country's future and may even become the shadowy leader behind the country either by marrying someone or by placing someone weak on the throne whom you can control.

Anyway...I've thought of it.

[R2s Muse]

Danny Boy 7 wrote...

So I was just thinking about the Orlesian Civil War and how Empress Celene could be likened to Queen Elizabeth I and how the Inquisition could be an unofficial arm of her faction or be her "spies" and the Inquisitor her Sir Wallsingham (sp). It could mean that Grand Duke Gaspard is either Mary Queen of Scots/King Charles of Spain or maybe even Napolean (who disliked religious intolerance and sort of used his circumstances to raise his standing while making himself the French Emperor).

To be honest the Mage-Templar War is not my prefered main setting, but I'll take whats given me. Any who the reason I'm interested in the OCW part of things is that we might be effecting the country's future and may even become the shadowy leader behind the country either by marrying someone or by placing someone weak on the throne whom you can control.

Anyway...I've thought of it.

You know that just gave me an idea. There is mention in the leaked survey about how you can choose the way in which you utilize the original Inquisition mission/idea, sorta suggesting that the new Inquisition could build on the old or goes its own way. How sneaky would it be for the Divine to deliberately co-opt the Inquisition name before the rebelled templars can, to somehow legitimize the Chantry role in the mage problem and yet remake the face of the new organization however she sees fit?

[R2s Muse]

So once upon a time Lola asked for Cullen swaps with him in the hold of the ship coming into Kirkwall. Well... better late than never, I say!  I swapped out Aveline for Varric for... reasons...

[berelinde]

R2s Muse wrote...


You know, they did intend to implement lyrium addiction in the first game, but it apparently was too burdensome.  I can see the difficulties with balancing out the affects on templars vs. mages. FWIW:

David Gaider wrote...

Taritu wrote...
if there's a DAO 2, I'd LOVE to see lyrium addiction.  I mean, the way I had Wynne and Morrigan swilling back lyrium...

So would I. The implementation we had was that, if the addiction developed, the use of lyrium had diminishing returns. You needed more and got less. The problem we encountered, as you point out, is that mages pretty much needed to drink lyrium potions. Addiction was practically guaranteed. So there needed to be some method of dealing with the addiction without rendering it pointless, and ideally some kind of story implication...

...and you can see why it suddenly became costly. If we could come up with some other implementation that
was meaningful, I'd like to see return in the future -- it was something templar characters were meant to face as well as mages, after all. Suggestions would be welcome... though perhaps in another thread.

The place that fails is that they insisted that mages needed lyrium. That wasn't the case. Yes, your character would be able to cast less spells, but that totally makes sense. Mage spells are powerful compared to warrior and rogue talents. Spacing them out more makes sense. Also, increasing the mana regeneration rate would balance things out nicely. Not a huge bump. Maybe 15%. Given the theoretical (and never-implemented) rarity and expense of lyrium, swilling the stuff should never have happened. Lyrium potions in DA2 were pretty pointless. On my canon playthrough, the character had a bad experience with them in Act 1 and avoided them for the entire rest of the game. With that in mind, I deliberately avoided allowing him to take them during combat. When he was out of mana, he was out.

They seemed to have retconned the templar lyrium dependency between games. Institutional templars were always hooked, but Alistair said that it wasn't necessary. Then, the DA2 specialization description said that it was, that templars relied on lyrium for their abilities. Alistair has proven to be an unreliable explainer before (Wardens living 30 years instead of the 10-15 DG later fixed upon), so maybe this was one more thing. Unlike many of the situations players say were retconned, this one probably was. Fiction evolves. Fictional worlds do, too. Since lyrium dependence is now mandatory for all templars, PC or otherwise, they should probably rethink allowing templars unlimited access to those powers for free.

Maybe they could start their stamina bar at zero. Taking a lyrium potion puts it at full. Decrease the stamina costs for everything by about 50% to simulate long-acting drugs and we're back to being balanced. After all, even if the stamina drops to zero, the character still has access to his basic attacks, on which his DPS is based.

Anyway, ramble over.

[CuriousArtemis]

 I have a request for seeing Cullen in different armors/outfits 8D
And yeah Danny I'm a snob, I guess xD But not an English professor, just an instructor :innocent:

[brushyourteeth]

R2s Muse wrote...

meanieweenie wrote...

She's got Lola fever!

"Everybodies got the fever

That is somethin you all know

Fever isn't such a new thing

Fever start long ago

...she give me fever... "



There are just somethings that Britishisms capture better than Americanisms!

I'm proud to announce to the whole thread that Lola's American accent is coming along nicely! 

And @motomotogirl, I found DG's writing in the comics to be excellent (novels too, though if he says one more thing looks at me "balefully" i think I'll use the next novel as toilet paper).

He writes from Alistair's perspective, so it feels pretty organic. And the interactions between Alistair, Varric, and Isabela, are "accidentally grin from ear to ear" perfect.

*end endorsement*

[R2s Muse]

Yeah, I'm comfortable with the explanation that Alistair didn't really know quite what he was talking about when discussing lyrium dependence, since there are lots of inconsistencies. Gaider later said that eventually Alistair would have lost his abilities without lyrium as well.

From Thedas UK interview:

TUK: The Templar abilities, are they--despite the Chantry's protestations--a form of magic?

DG: I would say that they are magic, they derive from lyrium, which is magic. The tricky thing there is that the Chantry is awfully hypocritical when it comes to magic, in that there are sorts of magic that they will use. Actually I should take that back, it's not necessarily that they're hypocritical, they don't have anything against magic itself. Magic can be useful, they know the mages are useful. It's the elements of possession and blood magic, all the forbidden magic where things get really dicey. Even if Templar magic was recognized as spellcasting, it's not innate to the Templars, if they just stopped taking lyrium eventually they would lose the ability. Although as Alistair proves, they can use the ability for a long time afterwards. I think part of that was just the requirements of gameplay, for us to have a specialization as well, so some of that story doesn't quite match up with the gameplay, and I think eventually we'd like to work the lyrium requirement back into the gameplay as well. Regardless the magic the Templars use doesn't involve mind control, it's not forbidden magic, there's nothing about it--especially since it can only against mages--there's nothing about it that would make the Chantry step in and go "Wow, that's bad." But then we're talking about a Chantry that also has phylacteries in every Circle, which is a type of blood magic, so there's definitely an element of hypocrisy there.

But, indeed, I think the balance for lyrium use between mages and templars could be accomplished. I also never really used potions during my mage playthroughs in DA2 since thankfully I didn't seem to need them. Would be cool to see them manage those requirements to include the dangers of lyrium. Mostly, I'm just curious to see what the real effects are. If you limit your intake, how does it affect your abilities? Is there a balance point between addiction and stability? Does it depend on your and your metabolism? There's an interesting line in the templars codex that suggests that not all templars are actually addicted...

" Lyrium use is regulated by the Chantry, but some templars suffer from lyrium addiction, the effects of which include paranoia, obsession, and dementia. "

[R2s Muse]

motomotogirl wrote...

 I have a request for seeing Cullen in different armors/outfits 8D

...such as...?

[berelinde]

Hmm, the codex seems to define "addiction" as "overdose". It's possible. Where do you draw the line when you're talking about alcoholism? Is a college binge-drinker an alcoholic if they only drink once a month? How about a couple that has one drink a day together every single day while they go over the day's events? How about somebody who doesn't drink every day, but who will drink everything that's there until it's gone? How about somebody who is suffering from alcoholic cirrhosis? Teetotalers would say that they all are, but health insurance companies usually limit it to the last one. Most people will probably settle on a definition that involves dependency. The codex writer would probably agree with the insurance company.

Doesn't Evangeline say that she is addicted? She isn't suffering from any ill-effects.

This is actually Cullen-related! He has been a templar for longer than Evangeline (3 years?). A gameplay mechanic involving lyrium will affect him. I'm curious to see where they decide to go with it.

[R2s Muse]

So, how cute is this??

DA: Kiss for Ser Cullen by ~KimMcCloud

[R2s Muse]

berelinde wrote...

Hmm, the codex seems to define "addiction" as "overdose". It's possible. Where do you draw the line when you're talking about alcoholism? Is a college binge-drinker an alcoholic if they only drink once a month? How about a couple that has one drink a day together every single day while they go over the day's events? How about somebody who doesn't drink every day, but who will drink everything that's there until it's gone? How about somebody who is suffering from alcoholic cirrhosis? Teetotalers would say that they all are, but health insurance companies usually limit it to the last one. Most people will probably settle on a definition that involves dependency. The codex writer would probably agree with the insurance company.

Doesn't Evangeline say that she is addicted? She isn't suffering from any ill-effects.

This is actually Cullen-related! He has been a templar for longer than Evangeline (3 years?). A gameplay mechanic involving lyrium will affect him. I'm curious to see where they decide to go with it.

yeah, good point. Seems to be varying definitions... DA:O seemed to go with addiction is when you're suffering, like that dude in Denerim. And, yeah, Evangeline does confirm that she's addicted, doesn't she.

LOL ... what comes around, goes around... last time we talked about this...

[berelinde]

LOL - well, at least we're consistent!

[brushyourteeth]

Evangeline's got her secret stash of lyrium, and when that's out she says she's got about a week till she's "useless" to the party. Not sure what that means. Not dead, probably, but bad off.

But then her unique circumstance cures her of the addiction, but presumably without taking her templar abilities away? So, I don't know. I guess I always figured that templar abilities didn't require lyrium, but the Chantry gives it to them anyway to aid their abilities and/or just keep them on a leash so they don't go spilling Chantry secrets. So someone like Alistair or the Warden or Hawke could go their whole lives without being lyrium addicted, but poor Cullen won't be so lucky.

[brushyourteeth]

R2s Muse wrote...

LOL ... what comes around, goes around... last time we talked about this...

Reading that made me remember how sad I am that Jasmine isn't around anymore. 

[R2s Muse]

You know, I'm no longer so convinced Alistair never took lyrium. We just know that he never became addicted. I mean, if you're gonna learn how to smite someone, I'm sure they're giving you lyrium during training to try it out. I think there was a lengthy discussion on tumblr with some folks pouring over all his lines that concluded this interpretation wasn't ruled out.

I am curious about Evangeline now. I suppose it makes sense that her spirit would cure her of all sorts of things.

Modifié par R2s Muse, 02 octobre 2012 - 02:47 .

[CuriousArtemis]

R2s Muse wrote...

motomotogirl wrote...

 I have a request for seeing Cullen in different armors/outfits 8D

...such as...?

D'awww!! I like it when Amell is bold and Cullen is all omg 

Let's see, any modded outfits would be cool since I can't access them on the 360...

My favorite Hawke outfit is Dragonhide Mantle of the Predator, in various colors 

Maybe also Arms of the Champion... Flint Company Cuirass... can you tell I like rogue armor xD

[R2s Muse]

motomotogirl wrote...

R2s Muse wrote...

motomotogirl wrote...

 I have a request for seeing Cullen in different armors/outfits 8D

...such as...?

D'awww!! I like it when Amell is bold and Cullen is all omg 

Let's see, any modded outfits would be cool since I can't access them on the 360...

My favorite Hawke outfit is Dragonhide Mantle of the Predator, in various colors 

Maybe also Arms of the Champion... Flint Company Cuirass... can you tell I like rogue armor xD

I don't have any modded outfits, altho berelinde might be able to swing some of those with her new super re-meshing abilities!  I'm sure I have a few of those in my walk in closet... erm, I mean, my many trunks of DLC stuff.  I'll see what I can do.

[CuriousArtemis]

8D Yay!!! I just like to see him out of the heavy armor, ya know?

*not a fan of heavy armor on men... can barely tolerate it on Aveline*

[CuriousArtemis]

Do you have the Rogue Pack II? He'd look awesome in that outfit! And the Mage Pack II outfit, too.

[berelinde]

You want him in the Mage Pack II outfit? That's chainmail.

How about the Amell Ancestral Arms? That's one hot outfit! Since I change the individual item meshes to look like something else (I've made the warrior champion armor look like templar armor), I can put him in anything you want. And, with the Amell arms mod, there's an option that lets you swap it for finery, so he'll be wearing it any time he's in his mansion.

[CuriousArtemis]

Yeah it's chainmail but it's not ugly bulky heavy armor lol

Ohh I don't have that Amell Arms one. Haven't seen it. Sure

EDIT: Okay, I googled it, and YES, that would look amazing on him!! 

Modifié par motomotogirl, 02 octobre 2012 - 04:41 .

[CuriousArtemis]

Um, I'd like to apologize for consistently killing the thread today.... >.>

[berelinde]

You didn't kill the thread. It has been slow for a few days. Somebody will uncover some news or another hate thread will start or something and the place will be hopping again.