3405 réponses à ce sujet

[Gromnir]

My personal opinion is that 6/9 is the sweet spot for forcing choices without being point starved.

Even with being able to max 7 or 8 of the powers (or however many), remember that each power has multiple evolutions. I agree that being able to max 8/9 powers is too much, but power evolutions mean that there are still choices to be made.

[Bozorgmehr 2.0]

Josh123914 wrote...

well in ME2 once I reached the level cap, that was it! there really was no payoff for importing my shepard again just to have no bonus except a new power that I vouldn't put points into unless I retrained Powers, ME3 seems to give you a reason to go back because it doesn't seem like you would particularly WANT to go back and get your character up to level 60 unless there was some sort of major bonus at the end ( like, say, being ABLE to put points into your bonus power without having to divert points away from existing ones )

In my opinion that defeats the purpose of role-playing. There should be choice. I do NOT want to be(come) a Jack of all trades who's mastered them all.

[Gromnir]

Blacklash93 wrote...

I look forward to trying out the new Concussive Shot augmented by ammo types. A modified CS should be able to mimic many other powers. For example:

Incendiary Ammo CS = Incinerate
Cryo Ammo CS = Cryo Blast
Disruptor Ammo CS = Overload

An area CS (Concussive Blast, was it?) should also be able to mimic the area versions of those said powers.

So how gimped will these CS mods be compared to the powers they imitate? Will the modded CS grow more powerful as you level up the respective ammo powers as well?

I'm very curious how CS + ammo power will stack up to the dedicated power.  How should a maxxed CS + maxxed ammo power compare to a maxxed incinerate/cryo blast/overload?  There's more versatility, but you are paying for it by having to invest in 2 (or more) powers.  Hopefully different evolutions (in terms of recharge, aoe, overall dmg, etc) will give CS a different flavor than the powers it simulates.

I'm glad to see that cryo ammo looks like it will have an effect on protected enemies.  Also nice they are getting rid of pre-requisite/unlocked powers.

[Biotic Sage]

Bozorgmehr 2.0 wrote...

Josh123914 wrote...

well in ME2 once I reached the level cap, that was it! there really was no payoff for importing my shepard again just to have no bonus except a new power that I vouldn't put points into unless I retrained Powers, ME3 seems to give you a reason to go back because it doesn't seem like you would particularly WANT to go back and get your character up to level 60 unless there was some sort of major bonus at the end ( like, say, being ABLE to put points into your bonus power without having to divert points away from existing ones )

In my opinion that defeats the purpose of role-playing. There should be choice. I do NOT want to be(come) a Jack of all trades who's mastered them all.

My thoughts exactly.

@ Gromnir: I agree with your sweet spot of 6/9.  That is around the expected 70% that we got in ME1 and ME2.

Modifié par Biotic Sage, 01 septembre 2011 - 11:20 .

[Spartas Husky]

Biotic Sage wrote...

Spartas Husky wrote...

Spartas Husky wrote...

I'm sorry. I read the first few pages and most likely I missed this but...

God I hope not.... did Bioware stuck with Universal cooldowns? or do we have the individual cooldowns back?

bump?

Read through the thread and you will find that even though they are sticking with universal cooldowns, there are now workarounds and loopholes.  For example, an evolved version of Throw allows the cooldown to instantly reset if you use it on an enemy who is being affected by biotics.

...what? sigh. Thank you for letting me know.

Bioware testers apparently dont find anything wrong with planet scanning but have a problem with hybrid weapon system. And still they stick with universal cooldowns?... sad I guess.

Not sure wth does using your brain to use biotic powers have to do with the power supply within the omni tool...If any there should be type dependent cooldowns.

But oh well Bioware has been having a recent track of doing weird things.

Thank you for the reply.

[blitzkkrieg]

Gromnir wrote...

Blacklash93 wrote...

I look forward to trying out the new Concussive Shot augmented by ammo types. A modified CS should be able to mimic many other powers. For example:

Incendiary Ammo CS = Incinerate
Cryo Ammo CS = Cryo Blast
Disruptor Ammo CS = Overload

An area CS (Concussive Blast, was it?) should also be able to mimic the area versions of those said powers.

So how gimped will these CS mods be compared to the powers they imitate? Will the modded CS grow more powerful as you level up the respective ammo powers as well?

I'm very curious how CS + ammo power will stack up to the dedicated power.  How should a maxxed CS + maxxed ammo power compare to a maxxed incinerate/cryo blast/overload?  There's more versatility, but you are paying for it by having to invest in 2 (or more) powers.  Hopefully different evolutions (in terms of recharge, aoe, overall dmg, etc) will give CS a different flavor than the powers it simulates.

I'm glad to see that cryo ammo looks like it will have an effect on protected enemies.  Also nice they are getting rid of pre-requisite/unlocked powers.

Agree with you about the 6/9 sweet spot for powers.

And this post gives me an interesting idea for a class build; a soldier that switches between ammo types frequently to use different forms of CS to deal with different problems. 

Also, I'm curious to see (assuming that warp ammo is back), if concussive shot + warp ammo on a biotic effected enemy will result in the warp explosion.  If it does, my team is someone with pull field and someone with warp.

[Kabanya101]

Universal cooldown beingback sucks, even with loop holes. BUT it doesn't matter that much to me, cause my all time favorite class is the Soldier. EMPs can shut down Biotic Amps and Omni Tools, but it can't stop bullets. Nothing is more reliable than my best friend Matty.

QUESTION:
In the OP, you have written that Fitness is a power that all classes have. Is that what the Fortitude power has become from its testing stage of the game? And if it does affect health and shield strength, then I was right mother ****erssss.

[Rahmiel]

Anyone notice in the soldier gameplay vids of the demo walkthrough, that concussion shot+ammo power is not lighting enemies on fire? However when he tosses grenades they do light people on fire when grenades explode.

I'm wondering if we're still looking at "a work in progress" and they just never actually finished CS+ammo power, or if they've changed their minds and instead are leaving CS alone, and ammo powers affect the grenades only.

I'm not upset either way, the biggest limitation to CS was the cooldown. But they seem to have lowered its cd to an acceptable level. I mean, why would you ever use CS, when you can simply activate AR and gain so much +dmg and have that power cd in 3 sec as opposed to CS' 6. (me2 cd times)

Edit:  Bah!  Nevermind, I see on the first page that the ammo power + CS is actually a last tier evolution, so it's unlikely that in the demos they maxed CS.  Bah!

Modifié par Memmahkth, 02 septembre 2011 - 11:54 .

[The Spamming Troll]

Kabanya101 wrote...

Universal cooldown beingback sucks, even with loop holes. BUT it doesn't matter that much to me, cause my all time favorite class is the Soldier. EMPs can shut down Biotic Amps and Omni Tools, but it can't stop bullets. Nothing is more reliable than my best friend Matty.

QUESTION:
In the OP, you have written that Fitness is a power that all classes have. Is that what the Fortitude power has become from its testing stage of the game? And if it does affect health and shield strength, then I was right mother ****erssss.

except that sabotage is comming back in ME3, which overheats weapons.

yes, fitness is fortitude.

[Spartas Husky]

so instead of them actually not being lazy I gota wait for another gibb to shorten ALL of their cooldowns... damn how hard is it to put a cooldown on each.

[littlezack]

It's not hard at all, but that's not the system they're going for.

[Biotic Sage]

littlezack wrote...

It's not hard at all, but that's not the system they're going for.

Exactly.  The good people at Bioware know what they're doing.  They have 2 games worth of experience and feedback to draw from, so it will all work out, don't worry.

[Spartas Husky]

Biotic Sage wrote...

littlezack wrote...

It's not hard at all, but that's not the system they're going for.

Exactly.  The good people at Bioware know what they're doing.  They have 2 games worth of experience and feedback to draw from, so it will all work out, don't worry.

"they knew hybrid firing system wasn't fun.... but found planet scanning worth the time and resources"

"they knew taking out the RPG from the companions and selling you mediocre armors later on was good"

"they knew listening to people complain about 25 second long immersive elevator out were bad.... so they replaced them with 15-20 sec loading screens"

"they knew Individual cooldowns were good... so why not change it for the hell of it"

Begs the question... what is their definition of fun?... or whoa re their testers to begin with. For a game that blasts the word "choice" every time it gets... certainly Bioware has taken the time to make the choices for ya.

Modifié par Spartas Husky, 02 septembre 2011 - 07:48 .

[Biotic Sage]

Spartas Husky wrote...

Biotic Sage wrote...

littlezack wrote...

It's not hard at all, but that's not the system they're going for.

Exactly.  The good people at Bioware know what they're doing.  They have 2 games worth of experience and feedback to draw from, so it will all work out, don't worry.

"they knew planet scanning is better to dump resources in that a simply hybrid firing system their testers didn't found the latter fun"

"they knew universal cooldowns were better, the testers apaprently found that fun to"

"They found it fun to take the RPG out of your allies by removing armor cuztomizing for them"

begs the question... who are their testers.

Mass effect is the crown jewel or their progress. They added 10 giant precious stones to that crown... but took normal size stones out of the jewlery. Did they end up with more stones?

ME1 = Pendulum too far to the left
ME2 = Bioware attempts to course correct, but overcompensates, so pendulum ends up too far to the right
ME3 = Another course correction to meet in the middle and address all concerns

Please wait til ME3 is released, or at least until we have some substantial info, to jump to negative conclusions.  As a Mass Effect fan, there is no reason for you to be anything other than optimistic for this game right now.

Modifié par Biotic Sage, 02 septembre 2011 - 07:46 .

[littlezack]

Spartas Husky wrote...

Begs the question... what is their definition of fun?... or whoa re their testers to begin with. For a game that blasts the word "choice" every time it gets... certainly Bioware has taken the time to make the choices for ya.

You're right. They should have individually consulted everyone who played ME1 before making ME2.

[Spartas Husky]

Biotic Sage wrote...

Spartas Husky wrote...

Biotic Sage wrote...

littlezack wrote...

It's not hard at all, but that's not the system they're going for.

Exactly.  The good people at Bioware know what they're doing.  They have 2 games worth of experience and feedback to draw from, so it will all work out, don't worry.

"they knew planet scanning is better to dump resources in that a simply hybrid firing system their testers didn't found the latter fun"

"they knew universal cooldowns were better, the testers apaprently found that fun to"

"They found it fun to take the RPG out of your allies by removing armor cuztomizing for them"

begs the question... who are their testers.

Mass effect is the crown jewel or their progress. They added 10 giant precious stones to that crown... but took normal size stones out of the jewlery. Did they end up with more stones?

ME1 = Pendulum too far to the left
ME2 = Bioware attempts to course correct, but overcompensates, so pendulum ends up too far to the right
ME3 = Another course correction to meet in the middle and address all concerns

Please wait til ME3 is released, or at least until we have some substantial info, to jump to negative conclusions.  As a Mass Effect fan, there is no reason for you to be anything other than optimistic for this game right now.

Nothing but optimisitc?...
Universal cooldowns remain or are gone?
20 sec loading screens got replaced by 25 sec immersive elevator rides?
The testers that found planet scanning fun and hybrid firing system not fun still employed?
Being able to purchase armor pieces for your teammates without a complicated inventory system added... or are they going to sell us the inventory system again in ME3?

um....it doesn't look like the pendulum move away from the far right at all.

[Spartas Husky]

littlezack wrote...

Spartas Husky wrote...

Begs the question... what is their definition of fun?... or whoa re their testers to begin with. For a game that blasts the word "choice" every time it gets... certainly Bioware has taken the time to make the choices for ya.

You're right. They should have individually consulted everyone who played ME1 before making ME2.

lol sarcasm doesn't help your case. Bys tating ridiculous ideas your attempt to discredit my statements are quite pathetic.

before you spewed out whatever you thougth of first... ever heard of something called a beta?

Endwar
Gears
Prince of Persia (original xbox)
Fallout
hitman
Hawx 1 & 2

should I keep going?

These few mentioned had betas... its called "hmmm maybe our testers are too small of a group to get an accurate sample size regarding how our system works"
Some are multiplayer betas, some are single player... some are both.

Some are short games, some are LONG games. No reason for Bioware not having one aside from wanting to save money. Others have done it... why not them?

[littlezack]

Spartas Husky wrote...

littlezack wrote...

Spartas Husky wrote...

Begs the question... what is their definition of fun?... or whoa re their testers to begin with. For a game that blasts the word "choice" every time it gets... certainly Bioware has taken the time to make the choices for ya.

You're right. They should have individually consulted everyone who played ME1 before making ME2.

lol sarcasm doesn't help your case. Bys tating ridiculous ideas your attempt to discredit my statements are quite pathetic.

before you spewed out whatever you thougth of first... ever heard of something called a beta?

Endwar
Gears
Prince of Persia (original xbox)
Fallout
hitman
Hawx 1 & 2

should I keep going?

These few mentioned had betas... its called "hmmm maybe our testers are too small of a group to get an accurate sample size regarding how our system works"
Some are multiplayer betas, some are single player... some are both.

Some are short games, some are LONG games. No reason for Bioware not having one aside from wanting to save money. Others have done it... why not them?

For the same reason they never released a beta for any of the other games they made. The same reason a lot of companies don't release betas. Yes, a few have, but it's hardly company policy, and it's hardly required to make a good game. 

[littlezack]

Also, you typically make betas to iron out bugs, not to change fundamental aspects of the game's system.

[el master pr]

Spartas Husky wrote...

littlezack wrote...

Spartas Husky wrote...

Begs the question... what is their definition of fun?... or whoa re their testers to begin with. For a game that blasts the word "choice" every time it gets... certainly Bioware has taken the time to make the choices for ya.

You're right. They should have individually consulted everyone who played ME1 before making ME2.

lol sarcasm doesn't help your case. Bys tating ridiculous ideas your attempt to discredit my statements are quite pathetic.

before you spewed out whatever you thougth of first... ever heard of something called a beta?

Endwar
Gears
Prince of Persia (original xbox)
Fallout
hitman
Hawx 1 & 2

should I keep going?

These few mentioned had betas... its called "hmmm maybe our testers are too small of a group to get an accurate sample size regarding how our system works"
Some are multiplayer betas, some are single player... some are both.

Some are short games, some are LONG games. No reason for Bioware not having one aside from wanting to save money. Others have done it... why not them?

I'm about to think of you as a troll. Man, the game's not out. Universal cooldowns are gone forever, DEAL WITH IT. They're not coming back. If you don't like it don't buy the game, as easy as that. And they are giving you choices, just look at the new skill point allocating system: every power gets 3 possible evolutions. You can now customize your squad's armor. No more weapon restrictions for every class and even squadmates, I think. I think it's immature to derail a thread, which we are doing right now. If you want to get rid of universal cooldown so much, make a new thread, but stop it here. This thread is very informative and I'd rather not see it locked down.

[SykoShadow]

I really hope Throw gets an evolution that changes it to be like the Throw in ME1, i.e. instant direct hit, no curving projectile, sends enemies into the effing stratosphere. That would be awesome.

[Biotic Sage]

SykoShadow wrote...

I really hope Throw gets an evolution that changes it to be like the Throw in ME1, i.e. instant direct hit, no curving projectile, sends enemies into the effing stratosphere. That would be awesome.

There is another thread about this, so I won't go into it too much.

Suffice it to say that curving powers and instant direct hit powers do not have to be mutually exclusive.

[adonfraz]

Spartas Husky wrote...

Biotic Sage wrote...

Spartas Husky wrote...

Biotic Sage wrote...

littlezack wrote...

It's not hard at all, but that's not the system they're going for.

Exactly.  The good people at Bioware know what they're doing.  They have 2 games worth of experience and feedback to draw from, so it will all work out, don't worry.

"they knew planet scanning is better to dump resources in that a simply hybrid firing system their testers didn't found the latter fun"

"they knew universal cooldowns were better, the testers apaprently found that fun to"

"They found it fun to take the RPG out of your allies by removing armor cuztomizing for them"

begs the question... who are their testers.

Mass effect is the crown jewel or their progress. They added 10 giant precious stones to that crown... but took normal size stones out of the jewlery. Did they end up with more stones?

ME1 = Pendulum too far to the left
ME2 = Bioware attempts to course correct, but overcompensates, so pendulum ends up too far to the right
ME3 = Another course correction to meet in the middle and address all concerns

Please wait til ME3 is released, or at least until we have some substantial info, to jump to negative conclusions.  As a Mass Effect fan, there is no reason for you to be anything other than optimistic for this game right now.

Nothing but optimisitc?...
Universal cooldowns remain or are gone?
20 sec loading screens got replaced by 25 sec immersive elevator rides?
The testers that found planet scanning fun and hybrid firing system not fun still employed?
Being able to purchase armor pieces for your teammates without a complicated inventory system added... or are they going to sell us the inventory system again in ME3?

um....it doesn't look like the pendulum move away from the far right at all.

More thread derailment FTL.

We get it, you are part of the vocal minority that prefers ME1's gameplay over ME2's. Mass Effect 2 is a great game and considered by many to be one of the best games this gen due to its mix of a good story, choices, and good gameplay. Mass Effect 3 is going to be WAY more like Mass Effect 2 than Mass Effect 1, that ship has sailed. The majority prefers Mass Effect 2, the majority wins.

I respect your stance but I don't agree with it and apparently, neither does BioWare.

Mass Effect 1 is good game but has glaring flaws: Inventory/Economy System, Shepard becomes stupidly OP, little to no class/weapon diversity, copy/paste enemy bases.

Mass Effect 2 also has flaws like lack of exploration, weapon customization, linear levels, class balance issues on Hardcore/Insanity, and probably a bunch of other things you notice that I don't.

[Sideshow Jed]

Biotic Sage wrote...

Bozorgmehr 2.0 wrote...

Josh123914 wrote...

well in ME2 once I reached the level cap, that was it! there really was no payoff for importing my shepard again just to have no bonus except a new power that I vouldn't put points into unless I retrained Powers, ME3 seems to give you a reason to go back because it doesn't seem like you would particularly WANT to go back and get your character up to level 60 unless there was some sort of major bonus at the end ( like, say, being ABLE to put points into your bonus power without having to divert points away from existing ones )

In my opinion that defeats the purpose of role-playing. There should be choice. I do NOT want to be(come) a Jack of all trades who's mastered them all.

My thoughts exactly.

@ Gromnir: I agree with your sweet spot of 6/9.  That is around the expected 70% that we got in ME1 and ME2.

At 178 points, you're getting only 64% of the available power improvements. It looks like a lot because there's a mess of inbuilt opportunity costs.