6494 réponses à ce sujet

[100k]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Yes, and that we can prepare accordigally.

Oh, that would be really useful.

It's like me giving you this:



And then telling you to prepare yourself based on this image alone.

Incredibly useful, eh?

Actually, that would be great. I can see that it's not a homeworld I gotta worry about, but a base. I can attempt to calculate it's size, population, temperature, defenses, etc. 

So...good example of scouting? I'd say so.

[Fixers0]

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

Did you actually play ME2?

Yeah, that pretty much the only thing you can do with it right.

[111987]

Fixers0 wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

Since Reapers are a cyborg entity, I suspect the mechancial systems were still working and those systems would be similar to our own automatic functions. So the body was still regulated and the immune system still functioned. There simply wasn't any higher brain functions.

Reapers are Cyborg's?


since when Actually?

Since the end of the game......

By a bunch of writers who were in over their heads......

Now you're not even making sense. How do Reapers being partly organic=writers were in over their heads? Good lord...

[Notlikeyoucare]

Fixers0 wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

Since Reapers are a cyborg entity, I suspect the mechancial systems were still working and those systems would be similar to our own automatic functions. So the body was still regulated and the immune system still functioned. There simply wasn't any higher brain functions.

Reapers are Cyborg's?


since when Actually?

Since the end of the game......

By a bunch of writers who were in over their heads......

Contrived as it may have been they are still Cyborgs. Although I don't know hwo EDI knows this based on just the one. But the writers have confirmed it anyway.

[111987]

100k wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Yes, and that we can prepare accordigally.

Oh, that would be really useful.

It's like me giving you this:



And then telling you to prepare yourself based on this image alone.

Incredibly useful, eh?

Actually, that would be great. I can see that it's not a homeworld I gotta worry about, but a base. I can attempt to calculate it's size, population, temperature, defenses, etc. 

So...good example of scouting? I'd say so.

And here we go back to the whole 'a planet cannot exist in the galactic core' and the 'there aren't nearly enough Collectors to warrant needing a planet' thing...

[Notlikeyoucare]

111987 wrote...

100k wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Yes, and that we can prepare accordigally.

Oh, that would be really useful.

It's like me giving you this:



And then telling you to prepare yourself based on this image alone.

Incredibly useful, eh?

Actually, that would be great. I can see that it's not a homeworld I gotta worry about, but a base. I can attempt to calculate it's size, population, temperature, defenses, etc. 

So...good example of scouting? I'd say so.

And here we go back to the whole 'a planet cannot exist in the galactic core' and the 'there aren't nearly enough Collectors to warrant needing a planet' thing...

Thats an argument after the fact so its moot anyway.

[100k]

111987 wrote...

100k wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Yes, and that we can prepare accordigally.

Oh, that would be really useful.

It's like me giving you this:



And then telling you to prepare yourself based on this image alone.

Incredibly useful, eh?

Actually, that would be great. I can see that it's not a homeworld I gotta worry about, but a base. I can attempt to calculate it's size, population, temperature, defenses, etc. 

So...good example of scouting? I'd say so.

And here we go back to the whole 'a planet cannot exist in the galactic core' and the 'there aren't nearly enough Collectors to warrant needing a planet' thing...

And back further to 'an artificial construct like a dyson sphere or reaper construction can exist in to most hostile galactic environments, so it's probable that they could create an artificial home world equivalent'.

[Someone With Mass]

100k wrote...

Actually, that would be great. I can see that it's not a homeworld I gotta worry about, but a base. I can attempt to calculate it's size, population, temperature, defenses, etc. 

So...good example of scouting? I'd say so.

Again with the planet bull****? Really? 

For the last time, they have nothing to gain on building a planet, which in itself is a incredible waste of resources, in the galactic core.

[111987]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

111987 wrote...

100k wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Yes, and that we can prepare accordigally.

Oh, that would be really useful.

It's like me giving you this:



And then telling you to prepare yourself based on this image alone.

Incredibly useful, eh?

Actually, that would be great. I can see that it's not a homeworld I gotta worry about, but a base. I can attempt to calculate it's size, population, temperature, defenses, etc. 

So...good example of scouting? I'd say so.

And here we go back to the whole 'a planet cannot exist in the galactic core' and the 'there aren't nearly enough Collectors to warrant needing a planet' thing...

Thats an argument after the fact so its moot anyway.

Sure, we didn't know the Collector's were in the galactic core until midway through the game, but we knew there weren't millions of them, else their attacks would have been much larger and widespread.

Modifié par 111987, 06 septembre 2011 - 07:56 .

[Fixers0]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

Since Reapers are a cyborg entity, I suspect the mechancial systems were still working and those systems would be similar to our own automatic functions. So the body was still regulated and the immune system still functioned. There simply wasn't any higher brain functions.

Reapers are Cyborg's?


since when Actually?

Since the end of the game......

By a bunch of writers who were in over their heads......

Contrived as it may have been they are still Cyborgs. Although I don't know hwo EDI knows this based on just the one. But the writers have confirmed it anyway.

That has nothing to do with the plot of Mass Effect 2 , which is were Smudboy's analysis is all about, if the Writers weren't able to put such developments into the narative in serious way, without giving any kind of exposition or even a  reason. and just hand to making you feel like your're reading a very bad cartoonbook, then yest the writers didn't know what they were doing.

[111987]

100k wrote...

And back further to 'an artificial construct like a dyson sphere or reaper construction can exist in to most hostile galactic environments, so it's probable that they could create an artificial home world equivalent'.

Which is a). a huge waste of resources and . pointless because we know there aren't enough Collectors to warrant such a structure.

[Whatever42]

I don't know if its that a planet cannot exist per se.

The background radiation of the galaxy makes like almost impossible anywhere on its central plane. Our own system is above the plane, so the radiation is lower and permits life. In the galactic core, the radiation would be unfathomable. Only that mass effect field allowed the Collectors to survive, which I doubt could encompass a whole planet.

[Notlikeyoucare]

Someone With Mass wrote...

100k wrote...

Actually, that would be great. I can see that it's not a homeworld I gotta worry about, but a base. I can attempt to calculate it's size, population, temperature, defenses, etc. 

So...good example of scouting? I'd say so.

Again with the planet bull****? Really? 

For the last time, they have nothing to gain on building a planet, which in itself is a incredible waste of resources, in the galactic core.

We don't know that until we go through. That's the whole point. We made no attempt to gain any knowledge before we started recruiting which is where the conflict comes from, and its what makes the SM contrived.

[Anacronian Stryx]

111987 wrote...

So now the Bioware writers didn't invest any thought or feelings into their writing? Good lord, how am I supposed to debate people when THAT is really their argument?

There are INSTANCES of bad/lazy writing. Every writer in the history of the world has had these instances; it's part of being a flawed human. Charcterizing the writers themselves, in their entirety, as lazy is just crazy.

Instances?

The plot of the game is lazy writing, to the point where the plot only makes sense if you observe it in backwards fashion.

The collectors have a base we can blow up using a small team of specialists, Good thing we had the foresight to assemble a team even though we didn't know what waited beyond the Omega 4 relay.

I'm going on a quest to assemble a team of specialists so i can blow up that base i don't know about yet but will be there.

I'm the illusive man I'm gonna spend billions reviving Shepard and countless millions on constructing the SR2 so he/she can find a small team of specialists though the Omega 4 relay and blow of the base we have no idea exist yet.

Alright I'll admit it doesn't make that much sense in reverse but it still makes a whole lot of more sense than going forwards... let's try.

Hi I'm the illusive man : "Humanity is in peril, countless colonies have just dissapeared so I'm gonna revive a dead hero".
Servant : "Ehh mr illusive can i ask..why?"
Illusive man :" Ahem want?"
Servant :"Sure Shepard is a great hero and all that but why spend all these resources on reviving him/her.. i mean what does Shepard bring to the table?"
Illusive man "Well Shepard destroyed a reaper and.."
Servant "And?"
Illusive man : "hmmm shut up okay?... now moving on".
Servant :"okay".
Illusive man :" Now after reviving Shepard I'm gonna send him on a quest to find a bunch of specialists".
Servant :"Okay.. ehh why?".
Illusive man :"Why what?".
Servant :"How will a group of specialists help you discover why the collectors are attacking colonies.. you know satellites and probes are very effective on gathering such information?"
Illusive man :"I don't know.. just because."
Servant :"Okay".
Illusive man : "And then.. get this I'm gonna send Shepard into a trap on a stranded collector ship!"
Servant :"Ohh how dastardly of you sir... why?"
Illusive man :"I like toying around with my investments.. that's what got me so far".
Servant :"I see..."
Illusive man :" And then I'm gonna send Shepard to a 37 million years old reaper so he/she can fetch a Mcguffin that will allow access to the galactic core where they will find a base Shepard can infiltrate and blow up using his/her bunch of specialists that i had the foresight to put him/her on a quest to pick up even though i don't at this moment have any idea what will happen.. it's just screwy like that".
Servant : "Ehh okay i see". 

[dreman9999]

Fixers0 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
1. I descussed this already. The collecor are extremly isolated, so isolated at any normal attempt to their base of location end with falure and death.

And what does this have to do with Smudboy's video?

dreman9999 wrote...
Theirs a reason why the work throw the omega 4 relay that only operates with a certin IFF, because they don't what any onr to learn about them. And if not like the cast did not try.

What are you trying to say here?

dreman9999 wrote...
horizon and the collector ship missions where about finding out more about their enemy.

Yeah that turned out well, what plot relevant did we get on horizon or one the Collector cruiser, aside from now knowing were they are, which still doesn't increase our capability of surviving.

dreman9999 wrote...
The point Smudboy forget to mention this shows how much he doesn't understand the plot.

While i'm glad yo do.

dreman9999 wrote...
As for intell that he's speaking of, remember you facing an enemy with teck so powerful they can sense the most advance stealth ship. Any thing that goes through the relay is sence by the collectors and any amount of probing after getting the iff,

So what? i'm still looking for you arguments

dreman9999 wrote...
(you have to get that first before sending probes because you won't get to the right place with out it.)

But the Shadow broker sent probes and big surprise... they returned!

dreman9999 wrote...
will tell the collector you about to attack. Every probe you seen will tell the collectors where you ship is going to arrive which will allow for a surpise attack to be planned for your arrival.

And how do you know this, all they would know at this point is that there is yet another attempt to breach the relay, it doesn't tell anything about when or even if we are going to attack.

dreman9999 wrote...
Not a plot hole, just him not understand the plot and characters again.And I already stated thisin this topic already.

What?

dreman9999 wrote...
2.You do realize that's an analysis before the arrival dlc. It just points out that we didn't know the full detail of the reapers plan at the time. For one, their goal is earth and two, the reapers are on their way to the alpha relay. They using many plans now. Heck, the arrival can be played before the final suicide mission, which would mean in some peoples play through the reapers are already in the galexy. And even then as of what we know of ME3, they hit earth first, so their goal was always earth from ME2.
So why link me to something that outdated and lacking new infromation?
This is not a plot hole ether.

I would seriously like to remind you the analysis was about the main narative, also you haven't brought up any argument to defend the Collector's plan, or even what there purpose and role in the story was, infact this makes it even worse since the entire main plot of mass effect 2 did nothing and thus was there for now reason at all, that makes it a just plot filler rigged with holes in it.

1.They isolated themselves so much that it's hard to get info on them outside the omega 4 relay .You have to attack one of their ships to get info on them...Which Shepard did.

2. If we send a probe where tell them we are attacking. When you the jump to their space, you would be jumping into an area fill with Oculus at every corner. We'll be shot out of the sky.

3.The Shadow broker sent probes that came back and had no info...meaning they nave got close to the base. With out the iff, the ship or anything sent through the omega relay will  land any where in the core, which is why they got the iff in the first place.

4. And who is the only one they know now is trying to get to them.....Shepard. You thing they would think that it's a coincidence that a probe goes in to check the landing area  as Shepard, the only one out side collectors and reapers who has an IFF that let them get to the collector base, is trying to get in.


5.The entire story of Shepards deling with the reapers  is the main narritive. The narritive for arrial is about the reapers, so it's part of the main narritive. The point of ME2 was just you delaying the reapers plans so they don't have as stong as a foot hold as they would have in the war and get as much info and tech on them as possible.

[Whatever42]

Fixers0 wrote...

...making you feel like your're reading a very bad cartoonbook, then yest the writers didn't know what they were doing.

That's pretty much the way I feel about your shallow critques.

[Fixers0]

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

...making you feel like your're reading a very bad cartoonbook, then yest the writers didn't know what they were doing.

That's pretty much the way I feel about your shallow critques.

Good for you.

[dreman9999]

Someone With Mass wrote...

111987 wrote...

The Reaper IFF is a signal. Only the Reapers and the Collector ships have this signal. Since there are no Reapers in the galaxy, when the Collectors detect this signal, don't you think they'd investigate?

The Collectors being able to pick up and track their creators' signals is apparently a plothole in itself.

The brown star block the signal.......When it was hooked up to the normady, the signal was amptified. The reapers used it as a back door into the normady, hacked it and sent the collectors at them.

[Someone With Mass]

Fixers0 wrote...
That has nothing to do with the plot of Mass Effect 2 , which is were Smudboy's analysis is all about, if the Writers weren't able to put such developments into the narative in serious way, without giving any kind of exposition or even a  reason. and just hand to making you feel like your're reading a very bad cartoonbook, then yest the writers didn't know what they were doing.

I like to think they didn't flat out tell you that because they had the courtesy to assume that the players have half of a brain and can think for themselves.

It's not that hard to figure that out on your own if the game says: "The Reaper is made out of both mechanical and organic parts."

Modifié par Someone With Mass, 06 septembre 2011 - 08:04 .

[Notlikeyoucare]

dreman9999 wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

111987 wrote...

The Reaper IFF is a signal. Only the Reapers and the Collector ships have this signal. Since there are no Reapers in the galaxy, when the Collectors detect this signal, don't you think they'd investigate?

The Collectors being able to pick up and track their creators' signals is apparently a plothole in itself.

The brown star block the signal.......When it was hooked up to the normady, the signal was amptified. The reapers used it as a back door into the normady, hacked it and sent the collectors at them.

As I said earlier, based on that logic, the Collectors can't recieve any signals being surrounded by exploding stars. Which defeats the purpose of anything with an IFF going through.

[Someone With Mass]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

We don't know that until we go through. That's the whole point. We made no attempt to gain any knowledge before we started recruiting which is where the conflict comes from, and its what makes the SM contrived.

Okay. Tell me. What use would they have of wasting the resources to not only build a planet, but to also clone millions of Collectors, when they're not even trying to hit anything by force?

[Someone With Mass]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

As I said earlier, based on that logic, the Collectors can't recieve any signals being surrounded by exploding stars. Which defeats the purpose of anything with an IFF going through.

The Collector ship could've just been outside the galactic core at the time, which isn't that big of a stretch.

[111987]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

111987 wrote...

The Reaper IFF is a signal. Only the Reapers and the Collector ships have this signal. Since there are no Reapers in the galaxy, when the Collectors detect this signal, don't you think they'd investigate?

The Collectors being able to pick up and track their creators' signals is apparently a plothole in itself.

The brown star block the signal.......When it was hooked up to the normady, the signal was amptified. The reapers used it as a back door into the normady, hacked it and sent the collectors at them.

As I said earlier, based on that logic, the Collectors can't recieve any signals being surrounded by exploding stars. Which defeats the purpose of anything with an IFF going through.

i really don't know where this blocking thing came from. The Collectors couldn't find the Derelict Reaper because it was dead, and not transmitting any signals. When the Normandy tested the IFF, the Collectors could then trace that signal. After all the signal only activates when you're approaching a Mass Relay, as you transmit the iFF to the Relay for better jumping accuracy.

It seems pretty simple to me, or am I missing something?

[Sgt Stryker]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

111987 wrote...

The Reaper IFF is a signal. Only the Reapers and the Collector ships have this signal. Since there are no Reapers in the galaxy, when the Collectors detect this signal, don't you think they'd investigate?

The Collectors being able to pick up and track their creators' signals is apparently a plothole in itself.

The brown star block the signal.......When it was hooked up to the normady, the signal was amptified. The reapers used it as a back door into the normady, hacked it and sent the collectors at them.

As I said earlier, based on that logic, the Collectors can't recieve any signals being surrounded by exploding stars. Which defeats the purpose of anything with an IFF going through.

Not necessarily. If I'm standing in a skyscraper and have no cellphone reception, does that mean that I won't get any reception standing out in the street, surrounded by dozens of skyscrapers?

Besides, there is no indication that the Collector cruiser was waiting back at base when the Normandy activated the IFF. Of course, this brings up another question: how is the IFF able to send signals at FTL speeds?

[Fixers0]

dreman9999 wrote...
1.They isolated themselves so much that it's hard to get info on them outside the omega 4 relay .You have to attack one of their ships to get info on them...Which Shepard did.

Or you just send probes.

dreman9999 wrote...
2.If we send a probe where tell them we are attacking. When you the jump to their space, you would be jumping into an area fill with Oculusat every corner. We'll be shot out of the sky.

Again, you've got no point, a lot of ships or probes have attempted to go throug the relay, if we just send some probes, the collector's won't know anything besides that the probes got there, so why would they think we attack?

dreman9999 wrote...
3.The Shadow broker sent probes that came back and had no info...meaning they nave got close to the base. With out the iff, the ship or anything sent through the omega relay will land any where in the core, which is why they got the iff in the first place.

We don't know anything about the Shadow broker probes outside the fact that they came back, which means they would have passed through the Sister relay. which is also in the safe zone.

dreman9999 wrote...
4. And who is the only one they know now is trying to get to them.....Shepard. You thing they would think that it's a coincidence that a probe goes in to check the landing area as Shepard, the only one out side ;collectors and reapers who has an IFF that let them get to the collector base, is trying to get in.

And were are you getting this? what if it were Alliance Special-forces doing recon, i mean you can't just take once specif scenario, just because.

dreman9999 wrote...
5.The entire story of Shepards deling with the reapers is the main narritive.

That's true, and guess what, Mass Effect 2 had nothing to do with stopping the reapers.

dreman9999 wrote...
The narritive for arrial is about the reapers, so it's part of the main narritive.

Over-arching plot continuation in a DLC is good, but that has nothing to with the plot Of Mass Effect 2.

dreman9999 wrote...
The point of ME2 was just you delaying the reapers plans so they don't have as stong as a foot hold as they would have in the war and get as much info and tech on them as possible.

And were does this happen, All we know is stop the bad guys, we don't what for, how or what we are trying to accomplish.