6494 réponses à ce sujet

[Guldhun2]

BlahDog wrote...
It does not matter what Aria thinks it what every one on Omega thinks, about what everyone in that galaxy thinks, and about what everyone who cares abou that galaxy thinks. Once that thing blew up you would be officially screwed. 

Geth did it?

Blowing up the relay was just a (bad) example. You could place mines around it, guard it with ships, send some nukes in, doesn't matter. As long as it isn't as stupid as blindly using it, with the potential of meeting a billion collectors at the other side.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Mesina2 wrote...
Cerberus will need lot more then just money to stand a chance against Collector Ship.

Just use the SR-2? It completly curbstomps the cruiser no matter what.

[Guldhun2]

Mesina2 wrote...

Guldhun2 wrote...

-->..Or place some ships to guard it, cerberus apparantly has enough money..

Neither Alliance nor Turian Hierarchy ships stand a chance against Collector Ship.


Cerberus will need lot more then just money to stand a chance against Collector Ship.

The Normandy (2) can destroy a collector ship with standard not upgraded guns.

[RoboticWater]

Guldhun2 wrote...

BlahDog wrote...
when exiting a mass relay there is milions of miles (Not sure if its millions but it is big) of drift. Cerberus cant cover that area, infact no one could and be able to fight it. Also moving in a fleet of ships around that area may make people think you are going to start a war with Omega.

That's what the IFF is for...so you don't have millions of miles of drift. You know, that thing the collectors use.

The IFF is so you can go in and not alert the collectors. In the scene where you go through the relay you do drift and almost hit some debris.

[CroGamer002]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

I honestly wouldn't care what Aria thought, if given the opportunity I would have shot her to begin with moment I met her after gained access to the information needed to track down people was recruiting. Apparently Shepard can take out a Reaper and army of Collectors yet can't take out one woman and her bodyguards... After which put in place someone to run it of my choosing backed up with the threat of Shepards name attached to new person in charge if anything happens to that person.

Because Shepard never attempted to take out Aria?
I mean, she never posed any threat to Shepard and in fact was useful to him/her.

[CroGamer002]

Lizardviking wrote...

Just use the SR-2? It completly curbstomps the cruiser no matter what.

Guldhun2 wrote...

The Normandy (2) can destroy a collector ship with standard not upgraded guns.

Simple. Normandy made surprise attack on Collectors and weren't completely combat ready then.

In any other situation, Normandy would be doomed.

[RoboticWater]

Guldhun2 wrote...

BlahDog wrote...
It does not matter what Aria thinks it what every one on Omega thinks, about what everyone in that galaxy thinks, and about what everyone who cares abou that galaxy thinks. Once that thing blew up you would be officially screwed. 

Geth did it?

Blowing up the relay was just a (bad) example. You could place mines around it, guard it with ships, send some nukes in, doesn't matter. As long as it isn't as stupid as blindly using it, with the potential of meeting a billion collectors at the other side.

You obviously did not see the rebuttle to smudboy's vid, it clearly outlined that you would need to mine a huge area, that would disrupt operations in omega. Also Cerberus is a covert organizaion putting mines all over the place is really not stealthy.

Modifié par BlahDog, 28 août 2011 - 07:21 .

[lovgreno]

Mesina2 wrote...

Guldhun2 wrote...

-->..Or place some ships to guard it, cerberus apparantly has enough money..

Neither Alliance nor Turian Hierarchy ships stand a chance against Collector Ship.


Cerberus will need lot more then just money to stand a chance against Collector Ship.

Cerberus is too small and isolated for big projects, as is evident from all those "rogue" cells of failiure.

[Dragoonlordz]

littlezack wrote...

In ME1, all your team has to do in the final mission is follow you and shoot anything that shoots at them. Yes, personal baggage doesn't hinder them from doing that, but it doesn't hinder the team in ME2, either. Regardless of their personal state, they can fight. But it does hinder their focus on more complex task. You can't say the team from ME1 is superior in this regard, because they're never put into the same situation.

Ofcourse it's the same, going off to fight Saren and a gaint Reaper is just as likley to get them killed as heading off and fighting Collectors. You whole arguement is based on the loyalty missions affect their ability to fight yet you fail to understand that it is that flaw in having those issues arise that put the mission at risk in the first place and why I do not wish to waste time pampering them or resolving their personal issues prior to a major mission when there are other people in the ME universe who wouldn't let their personal issues get in the way. Of which the ME2 were so incompetant because the fact they do die if fail to do their loyalty missions or resolve their personal issues.

And on that note, it's not uncommon for an employer to have some interest in helping an employee with personal problems. It's not unheard of for jobs to offer counseling or psychiatric help for personal problems, in the interest of getting the employee help. I've spoken to my own boss on personal problems before, and while, no, he hasn't personally come to help my problem, he's a man with plenty of other things to do - unlike Shepard, who can spare an hour or two to help out and has skills for that sort of thing.

You can be the softly softly employer or commander if you so wish but my style of play if game allowed would not be the hold you hand type of commander, he is a baddass as you put earlier and in such has no patience to pander to crew mates personal baggage. Either they can do the job or they can't, if they can't keep focus then they are a liability and as such no place on that mission. The team mates of ME1 went off to fight Saren and Reaper and did not let their personal baggage affect the mission while in ME2 they did.

[Balek-Vriege]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

littlezack wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

littlezack wrote...

ME1 actually experimented with the concept a bit - certain crewmembers ask you to take time away from saving the universe and help them out with personal matters, like finding Dr. Saleon, or getting the armor, or helping Tali with her gift. Character-focused sidequests are no new thing, ME2 just tries to give them a llittle more meaning and purpose.

The difference is by choosing not to do so in ME1 they didn't all of sudden become magically imcompetant or killed for simply not resolving their issues while in ME2 they do. Based on that then clearly the only team he needs to take with him are the ones who didn't lose competance when their little issues were not resolved. So in other words the "Best" team would of been the first team because the second team loses 'focus' if they didn't see their daddy or son one more time.

ME1 didn't requier the squad members to do anything beyond backing you up in combat - which the team in ME2 never has any problem doing, regardless of the loyalty missions. Garrus, Liara, Ashely, Wrex, Kaiden - none of their unique skills come into play in the final mission of ME1. They just follow Shepard around.

The best team is always the one's who can focus on a mission without needing to resolve personal life issues, this was not the case for people in ME2 who all one way or another would die or lose focus if didn't resolve their issues therefore they were not the best by any meansout of the trillions of other people who many of which could handle a mission without their personal lives causing deaths of each other. What I am saying is in my mind they were neither the best or even the most appropriate people for the job at hand because of that massive flaw in their personalities that would cause them to lose focus on the mission. That is why I felt they were neither the best or most desired to take on the mission. The fact that they needed personal issues resolved else die is why I would want them to leave from the offset followed by finding someone without such issues which put the mission in jeopardy.

You may not like my assessment but by no means does it invalidate my point as the commander of that mission to me they would not have been part of the team if their personal lives can and does affect the mission from the start.

Your point is valid, but it's a bit of metagaming (using outside information/knowledge of the game to effect your decisions inside of it).  From a plot point of view, Shepard doesn't know there's "loyalty missions" and that doing them or not would effect the outcome of his/her final mission.  He doesn't know that by doing something for x ahead of time, later y wouldn't happen because x would have moved left instead of right.  Shepard does know that his squad members are really good fighters and skilled people, but they're far from perfect.  He/she can then make a decision to clear away any needless distractions and help them, or tell them to deal with it and the mission comes first.

Also not doing a loyalty mission doesn't automatically equal death for that squad member in every case (which is realistic).  Check the suicide mission thread for all the equations and different suicide run scenarios.  Again, Shepard doesn't know they will have an increased risk of dieing trying to perform the task.  We as players do know that's the case and how it's all calculated because it's a computer game and Devs tolds us how it works.


If I understand correctly you want the choice to have a team with no personal issues to deal with, or a choice for Shepard to not work on making the team "work together as a unit/family" and still get an optimal Suicide run.  That ends up killing the whole point of the choice if you get the same result either way (as many complain about in many ME decisions).

[Someone With Mass]

Guldhun2 wrote...

-->..Or place some ships to guard it, cerberus apparantly has enough money..

You're entrusting a task like that to Cerberus? The same organization that can't even handle a dead Reaper?

What's wrong with you?

[Dragoonlordz]

[quote]Mesina2 wrote...

[quote]Guldhun2 wrote...

-->..Or place some ships to guard it, cerberus apparantly has enough money..

[/quote]

Neither Alliance nor Turian Hierarchy ships stand a chance against Collector Ship.

Cerberus will need lot more then just money to stand a chance against Collector Ship.
[/quote]

Thats funny given Normandy took one out... So leave Normandy there or build more of them and you do not know that surprise was deciding factor that was a guess on your part.

[quote]Because Shepard never attempted to take out Aria?
I mean, she never posed any threat to Shepard and in fact was useful to him/her.[/quote][/quote]

What makes you think my Shepard was either Paragon or even a nice guy or cares what information Aria has, he has Liara as a very good alternative source of information.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 28 août 2011 - 07:25 .

[Iakus]

littlezack wrote...
There's nothing in the story to suggest that Ashely is anything more than a slightly-above average soldier, or that Garrus is any more fit and capable than your average C-Sec.

Besides the fact that Shepard (an N7 marine) finds Ash's fitness scores and reviews impressive and can't understand her being assigned to a backwater colony.  And Garrus was already considered potential Spectre material while at C-Sec.

[CroGamer002]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Thats funny given Normandy took one out... So leave Normandy there or build more of them.

Like I said above, Normandy made surprise attack on Collectors then.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

Mesina2 wrote...
Simple. Normandy made surprise attack on Collectors and weren't completely combat ready then.

In any other situation, Normandy would be doomed.

So just wait in the Omega nebula. Wait for the Collector ship to come out of the Omega 4 relay and kick its ass?

[Fixers0]

Mesina2 wrote...


Neither Alliance nor Turian Hierarchy ships stand a chance against Collector Ship.

If one frigate is able to destroy it with minimal damage, what would you think will happen when an entire flotilla of Alliance/Turian frigtes meets this thing?

Mesina2 wrote...
Cerberus will need lot more then just money to stand a chance against Collector Ship.

You can do everything with money, argument invalid.

[FataliTensei]

Brenon Holmes wrote...

Savber100 wrote...

A Youtube commentator that made it his mission to nitpick every SINGLE bloody flaw in a Bioware story. You should get Mac Walters to check him out. He makes several valid points concerning plotholes in ME2 but he generally ends up coming across as criticizing just for the sake of nitpicking. 

I haven't actually watched them, mostly because of the reactions that most people seem to have to it... so I can guess what the content is probably like...

Now if it was like RedLetterMedia's Star Wars stuff... I'd probably totally watch it. :happy:

'Cuz that **** is hillarious.

Basing whether or not to watch something off of fanboy reactions is pretty shallow.

Smudboy makes some good points on some plot flaws in ME2, he does nit-pick some smaller details that don't really matter in the long run, but relatively large inconsistancies that need to be pointed out are also in his vids, bioware fanboys just don't like having their veiwpoints challeneged.

[RoboticWater]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

BlahDog wrote...

All but the DLC team members came on without strings attached, only later did they learn about their problems.

And at that later stage is when they became a liability of which needed replacing. Which is why I pointed out the humour that all of a sudden everyone seemed to be getting this magical new information from TiM which put the mission at risk in the first place due to bringing up their pasts and putting their compentence at risk because of emotional baggage prior to which never had. Even the ones without TiM's involvment still had baggage such as Zaeed and Samara etc, which due to having baggage from the begiinning that could affect their focus I would not have brought along in first place.

What your saying is Bioware should have made a whole cast of new characters just because your team has a few problems that can be easily dealt with. I agree that your team needs to be in top mental shape but if the only thing preventing that is one simple mission then just do it and then not worry about picking out new crew members and going after them. Also you say that TIM withheld all info for all loyalty missions but the only info he had was for jacobs mission.

[Dragoonlordz]

Mesina2 wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Thats funny given Normandy took one out... So leave Normandy there or build more of them.

Like I said above, Normandy made surprise attack on Collectors then.

You assume it was surprise attack that tipped the balance, when clearly the Collector ship was attacking the Normandy no different than every other time. What won the battle was the ships upgrades and not purely the surprise in fact I don't think surprise had ziltch to do with winning against it. By the time The collector ship was out of the base it already had enough time to prepare to fight and did so. What won was Normandy was more maneuverable and firepower was increased.

[littlezack]

Guldhun2 wrote...

BlahDog wrote...
It does not matter what Aria thinks it what every one on Omega thinks, about what everyone in that galaxy thinks, and about what everyone who cares abou that galaxy thinks. Once that thing blew up you would be officially screwed. 

Geth did it?

Blowing up the relay was just a (bad) example. You could place mines around it, guard it with ships, send some nukes in, doesn't matter. As long as it isn't as stupid as blindly using it, with the potential of meeting a billion collectors at the other side.

One of Cerberus' biggest assets is anononymity. Sending out a fleet - assuming TIM even has that kind of manpower, which I don't buy - to guard a relay sort of runs counter to that. On top of that, you can't even say if such things like space mines even exist in ME.

Also, I'm fairly certain the Collector Ship has advanced cloaking technology. The colonies never detect it coming, and both Normandy's are taken by surprise from it. It seems to designed to drop out fast, do heavy damage, then leave quick. Yes, it's a few kilometers long, but it terms of space and compared to a relay, that's very small - it woud probably just slip through anything.

[Guldhun2]

BlahDog wrote...

Guldhun2 wrote...

BlahDog wrote...
when exiting a mass relay there is milions of miles (Not sure if its millions but it is big) of drift. Cerberus cant cover that area, infact no one could and be able to fight it. Also moving in a fleet of ships around that area may make people think you are going to start a war with Omega.

That's what the IFF is for...so you don't have millions of miles of drift. You know, that thing the collectors use.

The IFF is so you can go in and not alert the collectors. In the scene where you go through the relay you do drift and almost hit some debris.

The IFF does more, it also corrects for drift. See this video (from 05:18 to 05:48)

Modifié par Guldhun2, 28 août 2011 - 07:33 .

[Balek-Vriege]

FataliTensei wrote...

Brenon Holmes wrote...

Savber100 wrote...

A Youtube commentator that made it his mission to nitpick every SINGLE bloody flaw in a Bioware story. You should get Mac Walters to check him out. He makes several valid points concerning plotholes in ME2 but he generally ends up coming across as criticizing just for the sake of nitpicking. 

I haven't actually watched them, mostly because of the reactions that most people seem to have to it... so I can guess what the content is probably like...

Now if it was like RedLetterMedia's Star Wars stuff... I'd probably totally watch it. :happy:

'Cuz that **** is hillarious.

Basing whether or not to watch something off of fanboy reactions is pretty shallow.

Smudboy makes some good points on some plot flaws in ME2, he does nit-pick some smaller details that don't really matter in the long run, but relatively large inconsistancies that need to be pointed out are also in his vids, bioware fanboys just don't like having their veiwpoints challeneged.

Saying all criticism of Smudboy's videos is just fanboyism can be seen as pretty shallow too though...

Modifié par Balek-Vriege, 28 août 2011 - 07:31 .

[CroGamer002]

Fixers0 wrote...

You can do everything with money, argument invalid.

You can't create effective, loyal and huge army with just money.

[Dragoonlordz]

BlahDog wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

BlahDog wrote...

All but the DLC team members came on without strings attached, only later did they learn about their problems.

And at that later stage is when they became a liability of which needed replacing. Which is why I pointed out the humour that all of a sudden everyone seemed to be getting this magical new information from TiM which put the mission at risk in the first place due to bringing up their pasts and putting their compentence at risk because of emotional baggage prior to which never had. Even the ones without TiM's involvment still had baggage such as Zaeed and Samara etc, which due to having baggage from the begiinning that could affect their focus I would not have brought along in first place.

What your saying is Bioware should have made a whole cast of new characters just because your team has a few problems that can be easily dealt with. I agree that your team needs to be in top mental shape but if the only thing preventing that is one simple mission then just do it and then not worry about picking out new crew members and going after them. Also you say that TIM withheld all info for all loyalty missions but the only info he had was for jacobs mission.

I didn't say all.

Secondly my issues that the game most of the padding was around those missions and that is the problem as to why it felt like collecting Pokemon and then having to feed and burp them to help they grow into something of use.

[littlezack]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Mesina2 wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Thats funny given Normandy took one out... So leave Normandy there or build more of them.

Like I said above, Normandy made surprise attack on Collectors then.

You assume it was surprise attack that tipped the balance, when clearly the Collector ship was attacking the Normandy no different than every other time.

Um, no, it was completely different. The first and second time the Collector ship encountered the Normandy, it came in from behind and took it by surprise. The third time, the Collector ship had to take it head on.