6494 réponses à ce sujet

[dreman9999]

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

Dreman,did you play LOTSB?

Shepard's armor is clearly cracked and broken,you keep talking about snap freezing,that same cold would make the fabric in the armor brittle,hence the cracks.

I know it was apart then but for Shep body to servive the fall...It has to be apart after impact. If it was atthe moment....it would be paste.

Really nothing state the armor shattered, all we know is at some point the armor what taken a part some way.

 

I see the problem....you don't understand how dispersing the force works.

The suit absorbed alot-most of the impact around Shepards body,that would explain the lack of splat.

Yes, at the start of the impact...Not after. If the force is strong  enough to break the armor....What's stopping the body from  going forward .... The body would be a victim of friction and continued momentum....It would be like an egg being thrown to a wall.

[dreman9999]

111987 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

111987 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

111987 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

I know....I was referring to the high impact he came in.

And their's a reason to keep it....Do not I'm also specutlation on this,too I not saying they did take it of ...Just may have.

But not to the same degree if mutilple ships where taken out ot one. If the normandy is taken out, no matter how advance, it would not nessary mean the geth are  or anyone is critily dangerous.  Just that the geth may have found a way to track the normandy. If mutiple ship are taken out in one battle, that would mean the enemy  has something with  attack power  that's truelly devistating. Remember, the normady maybe the most advance ship but it never was invicible or the strongest fighting ship...It was a stelth ship.

What are you talking about? Shepard fell several miles and impacted on ice. His armor did not absorb the the impact force of that.

I'm going to take this as you conceding the point.

No. It makes no difference. For all the Alliance knows, it was a Geth fleet that took out the Normandy. By the way, the Alliance can't officially patrol in the Terminus system, so this is a moot point

As I said, in to carbon....Harden unpressurized carbon...That's graphite.....We us it in pencils. It's not very strong.
 
True they can't patrol the terminus.... But they can place their presence of Human colonies. Especially if the they put a base on the planet. The point is that they would get everyone's  attention earlier then they want and measure would be taken. They don't want that attention.

Shepard landed on ICE. It's what we're walking on during the mission there.

And no, human colonies are not under their jurdistiction if those colonies are in the Terminus. If a few more cruisers were destroyed, nothing would change. It took several colonIes being entirely abducted before the Alliance actually started evacuations.

He landed in ice and carbon. Hence the surface of the planet is carbon and ice water.

Just like Horizon is not under the jurdistiction of the Alliance... That didn't stop the alliance from trying to step in.

Yes, he impacted on ice and carbon...ice, which is hard. Seriously what aren't you getting here?

Horizon was an isolated incident, and was after several colony abductions. That example was completley irrelevant. You're just wrong here, so please stop trying to argue it.

It does not make sense that Shepard's body survived. You have failed to show how it could have.

Thank you, and good night.

Ice on a loose foundation is  fragile you know...
With Horizon, it is an example of the Alliance practicing some prevention. Nothing is stopping the Alliance for doing what they did on Horizon again. My point is that if the collectors down multiple rescue ship at the fall of Normandy....What the alliance tried to do on Horizon would happen earlier.

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

dreman9999 wrote...

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

Dreman,did you play LOTSB?

Shepard's armor is clearly cracked and broken,you keep talking about snap freezing,that same cold would make the fabric in the armor brittle,hence the cracks.

I know it was apart then but for Shep body to servive the fall...It has to be apart after impact. If it was atthe moment....it would be paste.

Really nothing state the armor shattered, all we know is at some point the armor what taken a part some way.

 

I see the problem....you don't understand how dispersing the force works.

The suit absorbed alot-most of the impact around Shepards body,that would explain the lack of splat.

Yes, at the start of the impact...Not after. If the force is strong  enough to break the armor....What's stopping the body from  going forward .... The body would be a victim of friction and continued momentum....It would be like an egg being thrown to a wall.

Maybe if Shepard landed head-first, if it was on the back or front the force could have dispersed from the suit directly into the ice,kind of how those bins full of water+crumple zones on your car work, you would still be VERY f---ed up but not dead,but since Shep was already dead it was just a limp meat bag hitting the surface...

[didymos1120]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

ME1 showed us a world and said "With this one big exception and everything we can extrapolate directly from it, we're not going to constantly hit you with things that are impossible based on what you already know." 

Um, er....what?  Telepathic plants (no, the spores weren't sufficient.  How did the thorian know when to "crack the whip", for instance?).  The asari mating mechanism, plus the other tricks they could do with melding (e.g., copying the "essence of a Prothean" from said aforementioned telepathic plant into another mind). A species of telepathic, sentient, giant arthropods.  Impaling spikes, which in a matter of mere hours turn a corpse into a combative techno-zombie with EMP powers.  Indoctrination: a vaguely defined "signal" that lets a sentient starship exercise remarkably fine-grained control over any member of any organic species. Complex pieces of technology that not only are still around after tens of thousands of years or more, but still work, often flawlessly and without any apparent maintenance (even after being buried for most of their existence).

[bwaha54]

okay this needs to stop, we can keep going on with threoies and guesses on how shep's body survived smashing in to a PLANET, but its pointless. shep's death was nothing more then a marketing stunt and a stupid way to turn him/her into a cyborg and introduces a new charator upgrade system. (and to give shep red glowing eyes if you go renegade)

could the dead and resurrection of shep been done better? yes.

Modifié par bwaha54, 18 septembre 2011 - 01:12 .

[Fixers0]

Arkitekt wrote...
Anyone with half a neuron understood what I said, but you clearly did not. You really don't need Smud's videos to "make a proper RPG", and not every review is a "waste of time", for instance see Plinkett's brilliant reviews (he has some reviews that are almost longer than the movies themselves, like the star wars ones, and still are not a waste of time).

And you still haven't told me why Smudboy's videos are a waste of time as they provide valid critism against a poor narative.

Arkitekt wrote...
And there's a good contrast. Plinkett smashes SW prequels to pieces and leaves the movies KOed, but he's no annoying nitpicker, master of irrelevance and ridiculous arguments like Smudboy.

So, what is is irelevant? in his intial plot analysis he sticks with the main plot line, an while that isn't saying much of course, you can't accuse him of making irrelevant arguments, he sometimes nitpicks about certain elements but always after he looks at the broader picture.

Arkitekt wrote...
When a movie is entertaining and "good", he's not going to get fussed at the details. He points at them, but generally explains why he likes the movie. See his review of Star Trek. (Star Trek is amazingly filled with gross plot holes, ridiculous sci fi ideas, etc. Doesn't matter, still a damned good movie). Smudboy is incapable of nothing but complaining.

You seem to forget the point that RLM reviews Movies as a whole while Smudboy analysisis the plot and narative.

Arkitekt wrote...
ME2 is, in comparison with a lot of other movies and games, very little annoying with plot holes, etc., but because it fails to be absolutely perfect, we have Smudboy et al doing hours of videos nitpicking every small detail.

"Very little plot holes" like not explaining the logic of the worst suicide mission plan ever,

Plot holes are not the only problem made at the writing level, other things as Lack of logic, Retroactive continuity, poorly desgined plot points, weak and pointless antagonists and nonsensical plot devices are all things that Smudboy addresses in his videios.

Arkitekt wrote...
And you call that not a waste of time, you even say that his analysis is "required" to make a "proper RPG"? **** yeah, let's all make a Smudboy inspired game and BORE OURSELVES TO DEATH.

Explain how applying Smudboy's five simple change to fix the most obvious problems within the narative is a bad thing to do.

And please watch Smudboy's fixing Mass Effect 2 series for ideas on how to create a challeging gameplay experiance and a compelling story.

And of course Smudboy's list of Mass Effect 2's plot problems.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Arkitekt wrote...

onelifecrisis wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

You really have some trouble suspending your disbelief.

Perhaps you have a point. I like my fiction coherent. If you can suspend your disbelief regardless then I envy you.

Look it happens to me all the time. I'm watching some sci fi and I'm all like "ok this is impossible but rule of cool" every five minutes. And when rule of cool is not enough, I just pretend it is and move on. If I were unable to do so, I couldn't enjoy any science fic movie I've ever seen (with the possible exception of Space Odissey).

I mean, take for instance Descent Freespace 2. This game is, IMHO, the best space sim war game ever made, period. It's a classic with an amazing story (very alike to Mass Effect in a way, btw) and a brilliant atmosphere. It has impossible and incoherent physics all through the game. Some node links (equivalent to mass relays) are incoherent. There are plot holes. Etc. Had Smudboy analysed it, he would have trashed it to smithereens. And I'd tell him to take a hike coz that was just the best game ever.

And therein lies the problem. Smudboy analyized the PLOT/WRITING/NARRATIVE. And you're talking about a game as a whole.

Great game DOES NOT equal great writing.

Untill you learn the difference, untill you learn to distance yourself from the object of analysis - we got nothing to talk about.

[Zaalbar]

I felt that Shepard's death and resurrection was nothing more then a marketing ploy to introduce a new game mechanic and leveling system hence the lack of exposition of how his body survived crashing into the planet. I think the best thing we can all do is wait for ME 3 and HOPE! the story gives us a better idea to how Shepard's body survived a planet crash and more importantly the Jesus juice Cerberus used to resurrect Shepard, A big ME 3 Revelation involving the Lazarus Project would be nice. Otherwise Shepard's death and resurrection will simply be a pointless waste of time from a plot perspective, having Shepard badly injured and in a coma would have worked just as well, Death and resurrection is not a good idea unless it involves magic or the Genesis Planet.

[Someone With Mass]

Fixers0 wrote...

And of course Smudboy's list of Mass Effect 2's plot problems.

I just laugh at how he thinks a mysterious enemy with hidden motives is a bad thing when it comes to a game that revolves around ancient machines from dark space.

Passive protagonist? You have only yourself to blame for that one.

One dimensional plot? The over all plot is: Stop the Reapers from utterly destroying everything in the galaxy. It can't get much more complex or deep than that.

Poor pacing? I thought it was good, since it didn't haste anything and I could prepare.

Plot holes? Name one game or story that doesn't have those. Even if BioWare is aware of them, there's not much they can do about it. It's simply a miss they did.

Complaining about random plot progression/explenation right before complaining about how the plot isn't progressing? Way to stay consistent there.

Oh, and believe it or not, not all retroactive continuities are bad. It's only a problem when people are expecting a masterpiece out of everything, when they clearly have different tastes than the developers, and then refuse to accept that fact.

Modifié par Someone With Mass, 18 septembre 2011 - 02:45 .

[SynheKatze]

I don't get what's with the retcon lately, every change made to the story structure now seems to be a good excuse to scream: Retcon!.

Modifié par SynheKatze, 18 septembre 2011 - 02:50 .

[Someone With Mass]

SynheKatze wrote...

I don't get what's with the retcon lately, every change made to the story structure is now seems to be a good excuse to scream: Retcon!.

It's a buzzword only "cool" kids are using when they're too lazy/stupid to explain what's wrong with a story or character in detail, even if the problem is a relatively small one.

[frozn89]

Oh god. I watched part 1 of his ME2 plot analysis, and I already want to punch him He actually made me post here for the first time lol

[Phaelducan]

Or maybe, just maybe some people can take off the d-bag hat for long enough to move on from a game that came out nearly 2 years ago and stop posting drivel all over the forums.

Seriously, how is one chucklehead posting "fixes" for one of the most successful games of all time productive in the slightest? The game was terrific, and all of you hipster foolio's saying "IT WOULD BE GREAT IF ONLY THEY WOULD LISTEN TO ME!" is both tiring and sophomoric.

Mass Effect 2 was a great game. The few dozen of you whining on these forums don't outweigh the millions who bought and loved it, not to mention the critical lauding it received. Could it use deeper RPG elements and some refined mechanics? Absolutely, and Bioware is addressing that.

Could it be improved by some youtube demagogue's fixes? No (LOL COUGH LOL).... no.

Move along.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Oddly enough, very little of the actual discussion has to do with Smudboy now, except for people who bring it up specifically to rail about Smudboy or the existence of this thread or the length of this thread...


As for Mass Effect 2, it was a good game. It could have been a great game.

[Phaelducan]

It was a great game, by all measurable standards of the industry... except forum whining? Your opinion is literally a drop in an ocean of titanic success. Look, get over it dude, the game kills it. KILLS it. GotY by a ton of different groups for a good reason.

Personally I liked Brotherhood better, but meh. My opinion doesn't matter either. Across the industry people crowned Bioware and ME2. The forum ****ing serves no purpose then fictitious self-aggrandizement of people who A) don't make games and are as biased as humanly possible.

[dreman9999]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

And of course Smudboy's list of Mass Effect 2's plot problems.

I just laugh at how he thinks a mysterious enemy with hidden motives is a bad thing when it comes to a game that revolves around ancient machines from dark space.

Passive protagonist? You have only yourself to blame for that one.

One dimensional plot? The over all plot is: Stop the Reapers from utterly destroying everything in the galaxy. It can't get much more complex or deep than that.

Poor pacing? I thought it was good, since it didn't haste anything and I could prepare.

Plot holes? Name one game or story that doesn't have those. Even if BioWare is aware of them, there's not much they can do about it. It's simply a miss they did.

Complaining about random plot progression/explenation right before complaining about how the plot isn't progressing? Way to stay consistent there.

Oh, and believe it or not, not all retroactive continuities are bad. It's only a problem when people are expecting a masterpiece out of everything, when they clearly have different tastes than the developers, and then refuse to accept that fact.

Heck, Name one plot whole in the story.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Phaelducan wrote...

It was a great game, by all measurable standards of the industry... except forum whining? Your opinion is literally a drop in an ocean of titanic success. Look, get over it dude, the game kills it. KILLS it. GotY by a ton of different groups for a good reason.

Personally I liked Brotherhood better, but meh. My opinion doesn't matter either. Across the industry people crowned Bioware and ME2. The forum ****ing serves no purpose then fictitious self-aggrandizement of people who A) don't make games and are as biased as humanly possible.

By making your "rebuttal" a spew of insults to anyone who doesn't agree with you, by caricaturing all criticism and commentary as "whining and ****ing", you become just another Smudboy, even if your opinion is different from his. 

Sales doesn't make a game, book, movie, or television show great.  Reviews don't make a game, book, movie, or television show great.  Awards don't make a game, book, movie, or television show great.  

[111987]

dreman9999 wrote...

Ice on a loose foundation is  fragile you know...
With Horizon, it is an example of the Alliance practicing some prevention. Nothing is stopping the Alliance for doing what they did on Horizon again. My point is that if the collectors down multiple rescue ship at the fall of Normandy....What the alliance tried to do on Horizon would happen earlier.

Ice is not always a loose foundation. It's obviously solid enough to walk on.

Horizon is a terrible example because the Alliance only showed up after several colonies had been abducted. A few more destroyed craft would have just suggested there were Geth in that area, and the Normandy got unlucky. So no, what happened on Horizon wouldn't have magically have happened two years earlier before any colonies were abducted.

Just give this one up.

Modifié par 111987, 18 septembre 2011 - 03:38 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

dreman9999 wrote...
Heck, Name one plot whole in the story.

WE HAVE. 

[Killjoy Cutter]

PS:  IT ALL MAKES SENSE BECAUSE OF SUPERCOOLED CARBON!!!! 

[Someone With Mass]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Sales doesn't make a game, book, movie, or television show great.  Reviews don't make a game, book, movie, or television show great.  Awards don't make a game, book, movie, or television show great.  

It's all about personal opinion. And hey, what do you know. They vary.

Also, reviews don't make a game bad either, by the same logic, so there's really no point in listening to Smugboy's rant.

[Beerfish]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...



Sales doesn't make a game, book, movie, or television show great.  Reviews don't make a game, book, movie, or television show great.  Awards don't make a game, book, movie, or television show great.  

Yes, yes they do  (or rather the game, book, music is considered good if they sell a lot or win awards.)  Are they good to everyone?  Nope, not at all but they are good to the people who vote or the majority who buy.  Unless you want to take the tact that there are 4 billion great books, games etc because each person in the world could pick out some obsucre never seen or read item and say that it is great. 

[Phaelducan]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Phaelducan wrote...

It was a great game, by all measurable standards of the industry... except forum whining? Your opinion is literally a drop in an ocean of titanic success. Look, get over it dude, the game kills it. KILLS it. GotY by a ton of different groups for a good reason.

Personally I liked Brotherhood better, but meh. My opinion doesn't matter either. Across the industry people crowned Bioware and ME2. The forum ****ing serves no purpose then fictitious self-aggrandizement of people who A) don't make games and are as biased as humanly possible.

By making your "rebuttal" a spew of insults to anyone who doesn't agree with you, by caricaturing all criticism and commentary as "whining and ****ing", you become just another Smudboy, even if your opinion is different from his. 

Sales doesn't make a game, book, movie, or television show great.  Reviews don't make a game, book, movie, or television show great.  Awards don't make a game, book, movie, or television show great.  

No, but apparently forum whining makes it bad. /yawn

[Fixers0]

Someone With Mass wrote...
Passive protagonist? You have only yourself to blame for that one.

A Big No.

With exception of a few rare scenese the player has almost no active influence on the suicde mission plan, which the entire game is about.

Is there a option in game to probe the Relay for Intel? No, Is ther an option in game to send information to the Council/Alliance, Hackett, Anderson and whomever? No, is there an option to discuss strategy and plan out the next steps of the plan? NO.

Someone With Mass wrote...
One dimensional plot? The over all plot is: Stop the Reapers from utterly destroying everything in the galaxy. It can't get much more complex or deep than that.

One dimensional plot devices, please read my post next time.

And any good writer can make a simple story feel compelling and interesting, by using creative new elements, various character conflicts, multiple themes and interesting complications along the way, it also matters how you set up you're story and how you are presenting it. If you're just telling your audiance "bad aliens are taking our colonists and you're going to stop them" without any kind of contexs, then sure they will know what's going on, but unless there is some serious plot development and deep twists, then they are going to get bored (of the story)

Someone With Mass wrote...
Poor pacing? I thought it was good, since it didn't haste anything and I could prepare.

Pacing in the sense of how one scene leads to the next and how Mass Effect 2 fails to conect the dots when need be.

Someone With Mass wrote...
Plot holes? Name one game or story that doesn't have those. Even if BioWare is aware of them, there's not much they can do about it. It's simply a miss they did.

Sure, so why bother contesting this point.

Someone With Mass wrote...
Complaining about random plot progression/explenation right before complaining about how the plot isn't progressing? Way to stay consistent there.

Okay this is totally a fail in reading, please tell me where was that said by Smudboy?

Someone With Mass wrote...
Oh, and believe it or not, not all retroactive continuities are bad. It's only a problem when people are expecting a masterpiece out of everything, when they clearly have different tastes than the developers, and then refuse to accept that fact.

Unfortuanlty Retcons may not be bad to you, but they are a result in bad writing.

[Il Divo]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
Heck, Name one plot whole in the story.

WE HAVE. 

Hell, multiple holes have been mentioned, the most critical of which include the Shuttle to Nowhere and the VS getting stung by the Seeker Swarm.