6494 réponses à ce sujet

[Arkitekt]

Sajuro, stop trolling. Star Wars is comprised of nothing else but rule of cool. Almost nothing in there makes any sense, sci fi or otherwise, except to be gorgeous on screen. About your first example, I didn't read it, but to say that a fantasy novel is not comprised of rule of cool is laughable.

[Sajuro]

111987 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Why would they take the VS? Their only goal was to draw Shepard in and try to overwhelm him.

No, they had two goals; lure Shepard, and abduct the colony.

The VS is a human, whom we know they are interested in. The Collectors, and Harbinger, were literally a dozen or so feet from the VS. Lillith, who was very close to where the VS fell, was taken.

What, did they forget to pick up the VS?

No, Shepard just murdered his way through the Collector's before they could pick the VS up.
I don't see why that is so hard to grasp since he interrupted them in the middle of their abducting <_<

[Sajuro]

Arkitekt wrote...

Sajuro, stop trolling. Star Wars is comprised of nothing else but rule of cool. Almost nothing in there makes any sense, sci fi or otherwise, except to be gorgeous on screen. About your first example, I didn't read it, but to say that a fantasy novel is not comprised of rule of cool is laughable.

=p, Just because it is fantasy doesn't mean 'it's cool so lets do it!' and for Star Wars, it is a space Opera that operates within the bounds of the laws of its universe.
Perhaps I think of Rule of Cool as more blatant things like Joker pulling that drop on Illos off or the Teppa Tengen Gurren Lagann. Suffice to say, I would not blame the other person for not going into specifics if you will just dismiss them like this

Modifié par Sajuro, 19 septembre 2011 - 04:24 .

[Arkitekt]

Half of the colonists weren't abducted. This is not something that wasn't said.

[111987]

Sajuro wrote...

111987 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Why would they take the VS? Their only goal was to draw Shepard in and try to overwhelm him.

No, they had two goals; lure Shepard, and abduct the colony.

The VS is a human, whom we know they are interested in. The Collectors, and Harbinger, were literally a dozen or so feet from the VS. Lillith, who was very close to where the VS fell, was taken.

What, did they forget to pick up the VS?

No, Shepard just murdered his way through the Collector's before they could pick the VS up.
I don't see why that is so hard to grasp since he interrupted them in the middle of their abducting <_<

So they managed to get Lillith, but not the VS just a dozen or so feet away?

Right...<_<

[Sajuro]

111987 wrote...

Sajuro wrote...

111987 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Why would they take the VS? Their only goal was to draw Shepard in and try to overwhelm him.

No, they had two goals; lure Shepard, and abduct the colony.

The VS is a human, whom we know they are interested in. The Collectors, and Harbinger, were literally a dozen or so feet from the VS. Lillith, who was very close to where the VS fell, was taken.

What, did they forget to pick up the VS?

No, Shepard just murdered his way through the Collector's before they could pick the VS up.
I don't see why that is so hard to grasp since he interrupted them in the middle of their abducting <_<

So they managed to get Lillith, but not the VS just a dozen or so feet away?

Right...<_<

Well Lillith did run away a little in the scene, and they had to cut off somewhere, so right, they abducted Lilith but before they could carry Ash all the way to the Ship, Shepard was like "DENIED"

[Arkitekt]

Come on Sajuro, the Death Star is rule of cool made out of steel, since it doesn't make any sense whatsoever to have something that huge. Light sabers in an age of lasers? Please. Trench run when you can approach the death's star hole by directly above it? Come on. Destroying planets filled with billions of people and gargantuan economies just because the rebeld's base is too far off? Sajuro don't toy with me.

[Sajuro]

Arkitekt wrote...

Come on Sajuro, the Death Star is rule of cool made out of steel, since it doesn't make any sense whatsoever to have something that huge. Light sabers in an age of lasers? Please. Trench run when you can approach the death's star hole by directly above it? Come on. Destroying planets filled with billions of people and gargantuan economies just because the rebeld's base is too far off? Sajuro don't toy with me.

okay, that is pretty freaking awesome, and liberal rule of cool.
lets see >.> ummm Farenheit 451?

[Bourne Endeavor]

Phaelducan wrote...

Not even close. I specifically cited all three general benchmarks. Fan acclaim, profitability, AND critical praise. Twilight is almost universally lampooned by critics. Conveniently, you ignore fully 33% of the equation to support your own erroneous assumptions. Typical of this "argument."

Furthermore, Spudboy doesn't analyze the elements of ME2. He crucifies them based on subjective matters of taste and his own narrow definitions of VERY wide elements of a body of work (such as plot, setting, and character). It's not a critique, it's a whine session. You are now adding to it.

What delightful irony. Read the first paragraph of what you quoted and you'll find I discuss critical praise, which you completely ignored. Likewise, you might want to actually look up what is being said about Twilight, because it certainly is not "universally lampooned by critics." In fact, Meyers has awards for the bloody thing, as ridiculous as the notion is. Now praise is hardly good, however it equates to average far more than "horrendous." We'll move on though before I have an aneurysm for partly defending that god awful series.

I never claimed to agree with Smudboy wholeheartedly, nor his approach when discussing the plot. Nevertheless, no his points are not all subjective, in fact many have merit. I shall meet you half way through and offer Shamus Young's analysis: similar intentions; less presumptuous attitude. If you merely scream "it isn't a critique" yet cannot refute the arguments, then you have no leg to stand on. Coincidently, you have now engaged in what you just called, "a whine session?"

Arkitekt wrote...

Ok, this is sufficient to know that you didn't play ME2 with your brain turned on (the nice detail of calling the side missions "suicide missions" is an obvious bonus).

Nah, I try to keep it off during the plot missions. It hurts trying to figure out that thing. 

Since you don't actually bother to refute anything here. Did you have a point or had you just need attention?

There was no rush except on your own head.

Yep, it was in my head, along with, "Uh, why are we going through the Omega 4 Relay when we have no idea what the hell is on the other side?"

So you failed to see all the collector's levels. 

Nope played them all. There was no mention of the cipher whatsoever nor is Shepard plot integral.

These are good points. Of course, if they worked for more two years the game could reach a state where others would say "why not add this and that, as it implied it should?"

Well I appreciate you taking a break from insulting everyone to actually have something positive to say. Nonetheless, it would not have taken two more years, since current aspects of the story would be replaced. Likewise drop a few characters who have little reason to be here (looking at you Thane) and more time for plot development and missions would have been added.

Modifié par Bourne Endeavor, 19 septembre 2011 - 04:39 .

[dreman9999]

iakus wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

As I said before...
"What would happen if he picked the best of humanity only on the suicide
mission and most of them died? They would not be with humanity to fight
the reaper invasion. What would happen if an alien die in the suicide
mission? The would not be there to help their race to fight the reaper.
Why so something risky with your own stuff and lose it when you can use
the something that belongs to someone else, wreck it and keep yours?"
The fact remains it's a suicide mission. The collector were so alienated that no info gathering on them is possible. So all they had to do to stop them is to get ready and do a suicide run. And yes, the difference in leader ship is different from Garrus and Grunt. Each character was a specials in their own right. That was the reason we got them. The whole point of the story is to get ready for a mission. You may not see the logic to a suicide run but concept is simple...We are stopping the reapers from getting a strong foot hold and getting as much info and tech from them as possible. We are trying to get as much of an advantage on the up coming war as possible. The reason why we got a team of badasses is because TIM wanted to make sure that the chances of success is high with out using the best of humanity to do it outside of Shepard.

It's been my theory that the reason why TIM provided those particular dossiers is they each represented a potential threat to Cerberus i the future.  He was hoping for a major bloodbath and gave Shepard just enough resources to ensure it.

But I believe Bourne's point was why these particular bad****es?  It's a great team for infiltrating a base.  But how did they know that this is what was needed?  How did they know that the cruiser wasn't the Collector version of the Normandy and on teh other side of the relay wasn't the Collector version of Admiral Hackett and the Fifth Fleet?  

Looking at the dossiers, only three stand out as making sense:  Mordin, for expertise in defeating Collector technology.  Okeer for past dealings with the Collectors.  And Tali, a former squadmate of Shepard's.  The rest of the bad****es are thre simply because they're bad****es.

Look at any caper story, Ocean's Eleven for example.  First they figure out what the goal is, then they plan a con, then they recuit and gather the equipment they'll need.  Here they recruited before figuring out the plan, or even the goal.  Well, beyond "Let's go through the relay no one's ever come back from before!"  

That whole situation could have been avoided if Veetor had somehow gotten hold of some Collector data on Freedom's Progress that indicated a base.  Then at least we'd know that TIM was gathering dossiers for an infiltration team, rather than going through his "potential enemies" list.

When Shepard says "If this is a war I'll need an army.  Or a really good team"  I believe that is a literal statement.  He might need an army.  Or a really good team.  Or anything in between.  There is literally no way of knowing what is needed yet.

All they did is get the best of the best they could find that were disposable. It's as simple as that. Why them and not someone else is made clear by who they are. Jacks's the strongest human combat biotic, Garrus went on attack and held at bay 3 gangs on omega, Mordin is a super scientist,Samara is a close to a 1000 year old justicar, Thane is a super assassin, Kasumi is an expert in entry anywhere and master escapist, and then there's Tali's experience. What got them chosen is what they did. A better question is why wouldn't you choose them?

[Bourne Endeavor]

dreman9999 wrote...

All they did is get the best of the best they could find that were disposable. It's as simple as that. Why them and not someone else is made clear by who they are. Jacks's the strongest human combat biotic, Garrus went on attack and held at bay 3 gangs on omega, Mordin is a super scientist,Samara is a close to a 1000 year old justicar, Thane is a super assassin, Kasumi is an expert in entry anywhere and master escapist, and then there's Tali's experience. What got them chosen is what they did. A better question is why wouldn't you choose them?

Iakus was correct, and you did not answer the rebuttal. What if after going through the Omega 4 relay we find the Collector version of the Citadel or as was mentioned, a "fifth Fleet"? Our group of guys would be fundamental worthless, since the Normandy would be decimated in mere moments. How do we know there is a need for a Biotic, let alone two, when we still have yet to determine if this was an infiltration mission. Likewise, what use Kasumi, ever? She is a master thief, great... except we are not looking to steal all the Collector's worldly possessions. We have less need of a contract assassin, whose talents are better attributed to quiet killings, not large missions. Coincidently, Thane is completely useless on the Suicide Mission, being the only squadmate with literally no role.

If there was no other alternative, then rushing blind through the relay is acceptable, this precise scenario was depicted in ME1. Unfortunately, that is not the case. We had plenty of time, the Collectors or the relay weren't going anywhere. This is where the probe theory comes into play, which the Shadow Broker was intuitive enough to attempt. We need to learn the scope of our goal, so we can properly prepare; or contrary to that, be told with absolute certainty there is no other way. Putting all our eggs in one basket and hoping everything works out isn't a suicide mission so much as simple suicide.

Modifié par Bourne Endeavor, 19 septembre 2011 - 05:55 .

[didymos1120]

Bourne Endeavor wrote...

 Coincidently, Thane is completely useless on the Suicide Mission, being the only squadmate with literally no role.

Uh, hardly.  What's Mordin's role?  What's Grunt's?  Zaeed's?  And don't give me "They're useful in Shep's squad", because Thane is too.  More than many to boot, as he's one of only two squadmates with Warp, and he has the same damage bonuses as Zaeed.  And also don't give me "good defenders", because none of that is made transparent by the game the way other roles are, and in any case, neither Zaeed nor Grunt are necessary for success during the "Hold The Line" sequence.

[111987]

didymos1120 wrote...

Bourne Endeavor wrote...

 Coincidently, Thane is completely useless on the Suicide Mission, being the only squadmate with literally no role.

Uh, hardly.  What's Mordin's role?  What's Grunt's?  Zaeed's?  And don't give me "They're useful in Shep's squad", because Thane is too.  More than many to boot, as he's one of only two squadmates with Warp, and he has the same damage bonuses as Zaeed.  And also don't give me "good defenders", because none of that is made transparent by the game the way other roles are, and in any case, neither Zaeed nor Grunt are necessary for success during the "Hold The Line" sequence.

Mordin was needed to analyse Collector tech, and find a way to protect the squad from Seeker Swarms. The rest of what you said is fair though.

[didymos1120]

111987 wrote...

Mordin was needed to analyse Collector tech, and find a way to protect the squad from Seeker Swarms. The rest of what you said is fair though.

Not during the Suicide Mission.  He's just as "useless" at that point as Thane, as he'd already done that ages ago, before Horizon.  Also, his tech wasn't good enough to deal with the seekers during the SM, if you'll recall.  Hence the "Long Walk" sequence.

Modifié par didymos1120, 19 septembre 2011 - 06:10 .

[111987]

didymos1120 wrote...

111987 wrote...

Mordin was needed to analyse Collector tech, and find a way to protect the squad from Seeker Swarms. The rest of what you said is fair though.

Not during the Suicide Mission.  He'd already done that ages ago, before Horizon.  Also, his tech wasn't good enough to deal with the seekers during the SM, if you'll recall.  Hence the "Long Walk" sequence.

Oh sorry, I thought you meant generally speaking. Yes, Mordin wasn't needed for the actual assault, but they might as well bring him along since he's already there.

[dreman9999]

Bourne Endeavor wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

All they did is get the best of the best they could find that were disposable. It's as simple as that. Why them and not someone else is made clear by who they are. Jacks's the strongest human combat biotic, Garrus went on attack and held at bay 3 gangs on omega, Mordin is a super scientist,Samara is a close to a 1000 year old justicar, Thane is a super assassin, Kasumi is an expert in entry anywhere and master escapist, and then there's Tali's experience. What got them chosen is what they did. A better question is why wouldn't you choose them?

Iakus was correct, and you did not answer the rebuttal. What if after going through the Omega 4 relay we find the Collector version of the Citadel or as was mentioned, a "fifth Fleet"? Our group of guys would be fundamental worthless, since the Normandy would be decimated in mere moments. How do we know there is a need for a Biotic, let alone two, when we still have yet to determine if this was an infiltration mission. Likewise, what use Kasumi, ever? She is a master thief, great... except we are not looking to steal all the Collector's worldly possessions. We have less need of a contract assassin, whose talents are better attributed to quiet killings, not large missions. Coincidently, Thane is completely useless on the Suicide Mission, being the only squadmate with literally no role.

If there was no other alternative, then rushing blind through the relay is acceptable, this precise scenario was depicted in ME1. Unfortunately, that is not the case. We had plenty of time, the Collectors or the relay weren't going anywhere. This is where the probe theory comes into play, which the Shadow Broker was intuitive enough to attempt. We need to learn the scope of our goal, so we can properly prepare; or contrary to that, be told with absolute certainty there is no other way. Putting all our eggs in one basket and hoping everything works out isn't a suicide mission so much as simple suicide.

So your saying the intell we got from the collector ship would not have detail about that?
The thing is, if they did, why use one ship? And why not just attack earth and be done with it and not nick colonies?
As for the crew, they made it so we have something of everything. More than something then everything. As for Kasumi, she a master thief , think about what your skills have to be in Mass effect to be a master thief and you'll understand her use.

As for the probe theory, as I said before in this topic, that would giveaway the fact that the Normandy is about to attack and allow the collectors to be able to set a trap to contour it. No matter how long you wait and try to plan out the attack by probing the relay, all your doing is giving the collectors time to set a trap.

[dreman9999]

didymos1120 wrote...

Bourne Endeavor wrote...

 Coincidently, Thane is completely useless on the Suicide Mission, being the only squadmate with literally no role.

Uh, hardly.  What's Mordin's role?  What's Grunt's?  Zaeed's?  And don't give me "They're useful in Shep's squad", because Thane is too.  More than many to boot, as he's one of only two squadmates with Warp, and he has the same damage bonuses as Zaeed.  And also don't give me "good defenders", because none of that is made transparent by the game the way other roles are, and in any case, neither Zaeed nor Grunt are necessary for success during the "Hold The Line" sequence.

Grunt and Zaeeds's role is fighting. With out them, even loyal members die in the final line. Grunt has the best defence in all of ME so far with characters.

[didymos1120]

dreman9999 wrote...
Grunt and Zaeeds's role is fighting. With out them, even loyal members die in the final line. Grunt has the best defence in all of ME so far with characters.

One, that isn't true: you don't need them for everyone to survive and Grunt, Garrus and Zaeed have identical defense scores.  Two, I already explained why that isn't a "role" the same way the biotic barrier or squad leader ones are.  But here's another reason: you never select someone for the express purpose of staying behind to defend.  You pick people to go with you.

Modifié par didymos1120, 19 septembre 2011 - 06:26 .

[Quole]

Squee is more annoying than smudboy. Not that they both arent.

Modifié par Quole, 19 septembre 2011 - 06:28 .

[dreman9999]

didymos1120 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
Grunt and Zaeeds's role is fighting. With out them, even loyal members die in the final line. Grunt has the best defence in all of ME so far with characters.

One, that isn't true.  Two, I already explained why that isn't a "role" the same way the biotic barrier or squad leader ones are.  But here's another reason: you never select someone for the express purpose of staying behind to defend.  You pick people to go with you.

No, it's true. Take them off the line and people die. Garrus is a great fighter but he can't cover everyone. Jack and Samara are strong fighters but have dismal defense. Miranda's Support. Kasumi is best at miss direction. Mordin dies no matter who is at the line. Thane is great at killing but bad attacking on groups directly pointing at him. Tali is limited to her drone and debuff. Legion maybe a great fighter but once his shield is down, he's done.And Jacob can only be a mid ranged fighter.
With out Grunt and Zaeed there...Garrus is the best endurance fighter. He's the only one that can take hits. And, as bioware stated, the line is where the fighter classes shine. Like the biotics have the swarm and the techs have the tunnel. The fighters have the line.... And you saying that some of the best fighters have not part in it?In the line , the fighter job is to protect the other squad members and fight.  That's why they are there.

Modifié par dreman9999, 19 septembre 2011 - 02:00 .

[Nashiktal]

To be fair, you don't know that grunt will be better for holding the line. You don't even know there is a defence score unless you go digging around the game files.

There were plenty of people asking why so and so died for seemingly no reason, and if not for adventurous computer users and chatty developers it would still be a mystery, much like those horrendous paragon and renegade algorithms.

Add the invisibility of the hidden math, plus the visual uselessness of a good chunk of our crew... It makes me feel even more disdain for all of our party members. I have said it before, but Bioware really needs to find some way to incorporate our squadmates into the general gameplay instead of doing nothing. Perhaps if those squadmates did something useful during battle, they wouldn't feel as useless, if not finding a way to make them useful during the SM.

For example, if using research we could unlock more collector data from Grunts head, making him a navigator of sorts for the base. Little stuff like that to tie it together.

[Nashiktal]

Bourne Endeavor wrote...



I never claimed to agree with Smudboy wholeheartedly, nor his approach when discussing the plot. Nevertheless, no his points are not all subjective, in fact many have merit. I shall meet you half way through and offer Shamus Young's analysis: similar intentions; less presumptuous attitude. If you merely scream "it isn't a critique" yet cannot refute the arguments, then you have no leg to stand on. Coincidently, you have now engaged in what you just called, "a whine session?"

That was an excellent analysis! A good read, thank you for posting it.

This is a good example of criticism, not mindless bashing some seem to think we are doing. We already know the positive, so we are epanding on the negative.

[Bourne Endeavor]

didymos1120 wrote...

Bourne Endeavor wrote...

 Coincidently, Thane is completely useless on the Suicide Mission, being the only squadmate with literally no role.

Uh, hardly.  What's Mordin's role?  What's Grunt's?  Zaeed's?  And don't give me "They're useful in Shep's squad", because Thane is too.  More than many to boot, as he's one of only two squadmates with Warp, and he has the same damage bonuses as Zaeed.  And also don't give me "good defenders", because none of that is made transparent by the game the way other roles are, and in any case, neither Zaeed nor Grunt are necessary for success during the "Hold The Line" sequence.

So don't give you the actual answer? Perfect.

Thane is the only squadmate who literally has no role throughout the game with the exception of being just another guy. When our initial objective was to recruit the best group of badasses in the galaxy, it damages that ideology when one is useless. Mordin had a plot integral role at an earlier juncture and was also provided a plausible reason why he had nothing in the Suicide Mission; too many seekers for his upgrades to be efficient. You are arguing gameplay mechanics, while I argue story. If you want to get straight down to it, one of ME2's problems was the fact only Miranda and Mordin had any connection to the plot whatsoever, and ultimately adds credence the game had too many characters.

What I will say though is "Hold the Line" was a kick in the teeth for no adequately explained reason. It amounted to punishing the player for nothing beyond yet another gimmick. Nonetheless, you still technically need at least two of Garrus, Zaeed and Grunt otherwise the result is death for someone else. If you can argue gameplay mechanics then so can I.

Edit: I'll give you that we do not choose their role though. Just makes the squad feel even less useful, which Nashiktal just touched on

dreman9999 wrote...

So your saying the intell we got from the collector ship would not have detail about that?
The thing is, if they did, why use one ship? And why not just attack earth and be done with it and not nick colonies?
As for the crew, they made it so we have something of everything. More than something then everything. As for Kasumi, she a master thief , think about what your skills have to be in Mass effect to be a master thief and you'll understand her use.

As for the probe theory, as I said before in this topic, that would giveaway the fact that the Normandy is about to attack and allow the collectors to be able to set a trap to contour it. No matter how long you wait and try to plan out the attack by probing the relay, all your doing is giving the collectors time to set a trap.

Yes, because the game never provides this intel. It only reveals the location of the Collector homeworld. We only ever witness a scan of the base once we already have passed through the relay and have a visual. If that was the case, then why not blow up that one ship? The Normandy has plenty of opportunities to bombard the thing into the next galaxy. For why they wouldn't use multiple ones? Perhaps because enormous mountain warships might attract attention, whereas one would not, at least not on a wide scale.

Yeah, and we have Thane for the sneaking role and gathering intel. Kasumi's role was already covered by three different people. Her selling feature was being a master thief, which was useless on a suicide mission where no thievery was intended. I may love the character but from a story perspective, she was "just another squadmate."

No, no it doesn't. They already know we are coming both due to us having the IFF thanks to the genius of Harbinger and since they took our crew; for the Shepards who give a damn. What they don't know is when we are coming. Technically they already had a trap when the multiple Oculus spring into action. We can always set a trap of them by waiting for the Collector Ship to pop out, blow it to smithereens, send something else through ahead of the Normandy to distract or trigger whatever they have hidden away, then follow in ourselves. Granted, this is only one method.

What Shepard does instead is simply hope for the best. We have no intel what is on the other side nor the logistics of our enemy. Hell we still have no idea our group of twelve badasses will even do all that much. This is terrible planning because it entirely reliant on everything working out in the best case scenario, which fortunately for Shepard, is exactly what happens.

Food for thought, Shadow Broker sent in a probe and they never even seemed to notice or didn't care considering the defenses were not exactly top notch when Shepard and crew roll in.

Modifié par Bourne Endeavor, 19 septembre 2011 - 08:34 .

[Bourne Endeavor]

Nashiktal wrote...

Bourne Endeavor wrote...



I never claimed to agree with Smudboy wholeheartedly, nor his approach when discussing the plot. Nevertheless, no his points are not all subjective, in fact many have merit. I shall meet you half way through and offer Shamus Young's analysis: similar intentions; less presumptuous attitude. If you merely scream "it isn't a critique" yet cannot refute the arguments, then you have no leg to stand on. Coincidently, you have now engaged in what you just called, "a whine session?"

That was an excellent analysis! A good read, thank you for posting it.

This is a good example of criticism, not mindless bashing some seem to think we are doing. We already know the positive, so we are epanding on the negative.

Aye, while I don't mind smudboy myself, Shamus definitely has the better approach.

Nonetheless, I want to emphasis this post. I love ME2, and in fact am presently a few hours away from completing my seventh file. We already know why the game is awesome, some of us wish to highlight the negatives in hopes they are addressed or simply for the sake of debate. In addition, BioWare has long claimed to sell a story driven experience, boasting quality written plots in their games. They have even been so bold as to claim superiority to JRPGs, which have released some of the greatest games the RPG genre as a whle has ever seen, although not so much recently.

Therefore, I personally hold them to a much higher standard. I do the same for the Final Fantasy series, and why I have been quite critical of Square after FFX. ME2 is a fantastic game, just is falls short of BioWare's elevated standard.

Modifié par Bourne Endeavor, 19 septembre 2011 - 08:51 .

[Nashiktal]

I have to say Bioware needs to work on transmitting the proper info to the user, and not hide it all away in the background. Whether its story and lore details, or game mechanics, they have a bad habit of hiding it away.

For example, I see many threads and questions asked that could be avoided if the codex was only read. However the codex is pretty big, and it takes time and effort to read, time not everyone can afford, especially for a vague detail in a big book.

Translators for example, are hidden away in a single codex entry. Just skimming through the thing, you might not get that, and as I said before the invisible hold the line and morality math.