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[Someone With Mass]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...
What is being exposed here is MY pettiness, stupidity and outright irrationality, and many posts in here, starting with mine.

fixed:P

No, the most exposed thing here is your level of humor, which is the equivalent of a twelve year old who just discovered that it's possible to post smileys on the internet.

[Phaelducan]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...
What is being exposed here is MY pettiness, stupidity and outright irrationality, and many posts in here, starting with mine.

fixed:P

No one will respect you if you keep doing this crap. Changing someone elses quotes and still quoting them, changing names and sophomoric crap like that is incredibly immature and stupid.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Phaelducan wrote...
More narcissism. So you are wrong, but should be right if more reviewers used a better system? 

Even in a "better system", games aren't being given 0% scores. The vast majority of games fall between 60 and 85... not because reviewers are dumb and have broken the system, but because very few AAA games could be considered the equivalent of academic failure (59% or lower).

Projecting much?

Of course you dont' see many 0% scores since they are the theorethical but unachievable extreems.. (actually you do..retards to give 0 and 10/100 scores).
Games aren't the exception to anything else when it comes to rating. Most of anything is average.

The reason it's relevant is that whenever Mass Effect 2's incredible success is mentioned, it's almost universally ignored or discredited by the detractors. Almost verbatim we hear "reviews don't mean anything, sales don't mean anything, user appreciation doesn't mean anything,"

Of course it doesn't. Becasue we're talking about WRITING and you're stuck talking about "Awesome ME2" like a broken record. Apples and oranges.

That is why this whole series of topics is so frustrating. We are called blind fanboys if we like the game, yet we are expected to accept the pointless whining over minutae from a few dozen yahoos over feedback from MILLIONS of people and concrete industry standardized data. When said data is referenced (such as review aggregates), we get "well that doesn't mean anything."

It's absolutely ridiculous.

You BS is redicolous.
No one is calling you a fanboy for liking the game. Heck, I like the game.

You're being called a fanboy for exactly what you are doing now. Defending ME2 till the last breath, despite not even fully grasping what the conversation is about (story, not the game as a whole). Or maybe you do understand, but your mind just doesn't see the difference.
"I liek teh gamez, so everythang about it must be brulliant! Duuurrr" - is that seriously how your though process goes?

Would it even matter what about ME2 some of us would critique? Textures? Music? Gun mechanics? Cover system? Conversation? Upgrades?
I bet you'd be screaming "Haters! ME2 is brilliant!" too....

[Arkitekt]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...


I'm no hater. But obviously I have to be..

There. Full proof anyone with some respect towards rationality should ignore you henceforth.

Misquoting is proof of something?

Misquoting you could potentially create something reasonable. I'm not here doing favours for you. You're the one saying you are no hater but you have to be one, which I thought was hilarious, even from you.

Dude, you are the last person who should use the word "rational". You don't know it's meaning.

Don't project your own failures unto others. It's not polite.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Phaelducan wrote...
No one will respect you if you keep doing this crap. Changing someone elses quotes and still quoting them, changing names and sophomoric crap like that is incredibly immature and stupid.

If by "no one" you mean you, then I couldn't care less.
And if you're trying to teach me respect and proper behavior..you're nto a good role model.

Physician, heal thyslef..

Someone With Mass wrote...
No, the most exposed thing here is your level of humor, which is the
equivalent of a twelve year old who just discovered that it's possible
to post smileys on the internet.

Aha....yeah.... I'm sorry, I couldn't hear you over how boring you were.
Shall we analyze your level of humor? no? Well, we best not. 12-year od boys would be like gods compared to that.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Arkitekt wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...


I'm no hater. But obviously I have to be..

There. Full proof anyone with some respect towards rationality should ignore you henceforth.

Misquoting is proof of something?

Misquoting you could potentially create something reasonable. I'm not here doing favours for you. You're the one saying you are no hater but you have to be one, which I thought was hilarious, even from you.

:O:O:lol:

Reding comprehension...Learn it.

Then go back and re-read my post. Then maybe you will grasp it's meaning.

[Arkitekt]

Ah, troll Soroner still thinks people are here defending ME2. Wake up, we are here trashing Smudboy's pretensious bull**** along with all his minion fanboys, from which you are the most juvenile member.

[Arkitekt]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

:O:O:lol:

Reding comprehension...Learn it.

Then go back and re-read my post. Then maybe you will grasp it's meaning.

This is becoming really pathetic. Now you even show that you can't even read what you yourself write, you're dragging BSN's level to a state of unheard stupidity.

[Fixers0]

Arkitekt wrote...

Ah, troll Soroner still thinks people are here defending ME2. Wake up, we are here trashing Smudboy's pretensious bull**** along with all his minion fanboys, from which you are the most juvenile member.

You can't trash something if you don't know what you're talking about, if you really think you can, post one of Smudboy's main points, and adress why it is completly incorrect.

[Arkitekt]

I've watched them all, FYFI, and I'm not your monkey. (we have been discussing one of them, which was, AHEM, introduced by myself, namely Shepard's ressurection, for the past 40/60 pages).

[Someone With Mass]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Aha....yeah.... I'm sorry, I couldn't hear you over how boring you were.
Shall we analyze your level of humor? no? Well, we best not. 12-year od boys would be like gods compared to that.

Case in point.

[100k]

Arkitekt wrote...

I've watched them all, FYFI, and I'm not your monkey. (we have been discussing one of them, which was, AHEM, introduced by myself, namely Shepard's ressurection, for the past 40/60 pages).

Then find another point to argue, quote the end result of one of the older arguments, or leave the thread. 

But insulting many fans who recognized that ME2 wasn't perfect-- and wasn't up to the standards of previous BW games doesn't help this thread. 

[Phaelducan]

That's the worst part, Arkitekt. It used to be a pretty good board. Lotion isn't the only offender, but he is one of the worst.

Lotion, do you even realize that most reviews DO mention the story, and they aren't saying how flawed it is. This is an imagined shortcoming, blown up under a hater-microscope the size of Jupiter. The story isn't Hemingway, but nothing IS Hemingway except Hemingway.

Of course, I don't hate the story, so clearly my opinion is inherently wrong.

[Phaelducan]

100k wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

I've watched them all, FYFI, and I'm not your monkey. (we have been discussing one of them, which was, AHEM, introduced by myself, namely Shepard's ressurection, for the past 40/60 pages).

Then find another point to argue, quote the end result of one of the older arguments, or leave the thread. 

But insulting many fans who recognized that ME2 wasn't perfect-- and wasn't up to the standards of previous BW games doesn't help this thread. 

Hold on dude, that's not even remotely fair. We are not insulting fans who don't think the game was perfect. It clearly wasn't perfect, but there is a different between acknowledging shortcomings (which has been done by several of us in this thread) and accepting Lotion's comments. The game had shallow RPG elements, not a lot of customization, and several of the hubs didn't feel fleshed out.

However, the writing is not one of the problems, and that HAS been addressed by those of us deriding Smudboy's silliness. The resurrection was the main one, but from the "rule of cool" to third party reviews and sales every single counter argument is patently ignored if not insulted.

How can you pretend that this discussion is even remotely impartial? 

[Nashiktal]

LeandroBraz wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

LeandroBraz wrote...

No, we don't. I played it just now, we don't see his body going into atmosphere. I research the wikia, nobody says nothing about where the body is found, not even in ME: Redemption. Legion found one piece of ONE Shepard's N7 armor in Normandy SR1, not the armor Shepard was with when he "died". That armor is restaured and given to us when we wake up.

The piece of armor you mention is well integrated in Shepard's suit when we see him falling. If the piece of armor is in the wreckage, how do you propose it got there?

And you claim we don't "see" his body going into atmosphere. Please. He's directly above a gravity well.

Sometimes I forget that everyone in the internet are physicists..

You don't need a degree to know that once you start burning up in the atmosphere you are not going to end up in orbit.

In both the comic, and the cutscene you can see shep hitting the atmosphere, and instead of orbit he is pumetting down to the planet. I'm sorry mate but your theory doesn't work.

[Arkitekt]

100k, I called you out on your shenanigans, not for the obvious fact that ME2 is far from a perfect game. But very well, let's get the party going in another direction.

What about the ridiculous smudargument that the team mates don't need to solve their own "daddy issues" because they are "professionals", before going into what might well be their final mission?

Just the naming "daddy issues" is already a mass failure...

[Killjoy Cutter]

Arkitekt wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

What if someone loves ME2, is still replaying it off and on, but is perfectly honest about the warts and shortcomings? 

If honesty had anything to do with it, we wouldn't be discussing anything, now would we? Simple logic: if people had different opinions due to their honesty or lack of it, why even bother discussing anything?

What is being exposed here is the pettiness, stupidity and outright irrationality of Smudboy's main plot videos and many posts in here, starting with many of yours.

Other than references from people who hate him, I think we've pretty much stopped talking about Smudboy and his videos. 

As for me, everything I've said in this thread is from my honest assesment of the game, or of a criticism of the game, or of someone's post or posting style.  I'm not here for the fight, I'm not here for the insults, I'm not here for the argument. 

You seem to be saying that there's no reason to have a discussion if you're not going to distort, attack, and insult.  That's all too typical these days, and a very sad aspect of where our culture is headed. 

[111987]

[quote]Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Which is why Shep should have gone to the Council/Alliance with all the information he gathered so far.
Or should have not gone in at all. [/quote]

That is an entirely different issue; did Shepard even have solid evidence? There's a different thread for that, but let's not start a side discussion about it.

Anyways, you have to remember this is a game, and while Bioware tries to give us as much choice has possible, the story still has to progress. You cannot do every single thing that you actually would. For example, there are some people on these forums who wanted to join Saren in ME1, or join Cerberus in ME3, but that isn't an option. We are still limited by the confines of the game, and complaining about every thing that we cannot do doesn't help.

The game made it very clear that the Council and the Alliance wouldn't do anything to help Shepard, so we have to do it on our own.


[quote]Lotion Soronnar wrote...

1. No shield is impenetrable. If it
has engines, it can be crippled. And crippling certanly was possible
when the Collector ship was drifting powered down.

3. Occams razor suggest nothing of the sort. Normandy passed right by the Occuli - at that close range stelath is of no use.

4.
The Collector ship took off, and very slowly. GUARDIAN turrets aren't
"powefull" - they're designed for anti-fighter role, not taking out
capital ships. And it still caused the Collectors to flee.
Prime time to go after it with the Normandy.

[/quote]

1. Shepard doesn't know how strong the shields are...for all he knows, they could be as strong as a Reaper shield, and this attacking it on Horizon would simply result in either the Normandy's destruction, or the Collector's leaving. Since this is a video game, the devs are going to choose the option that allows for more game play. It also makes sense to avoid the confrontation.

3. Point is, the simplest explanation is that the Collectors can track the Normandy. A hidden tracking beacon, or a traitor, would have been explained.

4. GARDIAN turrets on ships are meant for fighting off fighters and interceptors and torpedoes. The massive turrets on Horizon were obviously stronger than the ship-based ones. Anyways, what's the point of this again?


[quote]Lotion Soronnar wrote...
Shep has a
choice to go into the core or not, jsut as he has a chocie to attack the
Collector ship or not. Tehre is no excuse here.[/quote]


Indeed. So why not avoid confrontation behind the Omega4?
What was so pressing that Shep HAD to go there (beside the crew)? Why not scout out before going in?

[/quote]

Shepard had to go in to stop the abductions of the colonists. Once again, this is a game, and you are in a sense limited. Your Shepard DOES care about stopping the abductions, even if you wish that you could roleplay differently or not.

Shepard couldn't have avoided the confrontation with the Omega 4 Relay because he has no way of knowing whether the ship was there or not. Even if a probe did get through far enough to tell, it would only see the front of the base, and there could easily have been a docking station in the back.

I'm not sure how else I can put this, I'm afraid.

Finally, scouting ahead doesn't enhance the plot or the writing. The abduction of our crew is intended to give us a sense of tension and panic, and wants for the player to want to go through the Omega 4 Relay. Sending in probes or scout ships ahead of time grinds the pace of the plot to a screeching halt. And in any case, those scout ships and probes would be destroyed before yielding any useful data. Finally, by sending probes and scout ships through the relay, the Collectors now know that our IFF works properly and that we can launch an assault at them at any time, and so we lose whatever element of surprise we have.


EDIT: Please, can EVERYONE stop with the personal insults and jibes? Otherwise this thread will be locked, and there has actually been some pretty good discussion hidden amongst all the other shenanigans.

Modifié par 111987, 20 septembre 2011 - 03:49 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

Arkitekt wrote...

100k, I called you out on your shenanigans, not for the obvious fact that ME2 is far from a perfect game. But very well, let's get the party going in another direction.

What about the ridiculous smudargument that the team mates don't need to solve their own "daddy issues" because they are "professionals", before going into what might well be their final mission?

Just the naming "daddy issues" is already a mass failure...

I wouldn't have been called them "loyalty" missions.  What's really going on is focus -- each squadmate has unfinished business that they'd like to take care of before they die, that could distract them if it's not taken care of. 

And yes, calling them "daddy issues" reflects that person's need to fall back on belittlement and derision, because they can't make a point without it.  It's a sad attempt to manipulate the conversation by establishing biased terms. 

[Phaelducan]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

What if someone loves ME2, is still replaying it off and on, but is perfectly honest about the warts and shortcomings? 

If honesty had anything to do with it, we wouldn't be discussing anything, now would we? Simple logic: if people had different opinions due to their honesty or lack of it, why even bother discussing anything?

What is being exposed here is the pettiness, stupidity and outright irrationality of Smudboy's main plot videos and many posts in here, starting with many of yours.

Other than references from people who hate him, I think we've pretty much stopped talking about Smudboy and his videos. 

As for me, everything I've said in this thread is from my honest assesment of the game, or of a criticism of the game, or of someone's post or posting style.  I'm not here for the fight, I'm not here for the insults, I'm not here for the argument. 

You seem to be saying that there's no reason to have a discussion if you're not going to distort, attack, and insult.  That's all too typical these days, and a very sad aspect of where our culture is headed. 

Killjoy, that was fairly rational. I will say that I have a hard time seeing how you single him out, when numerous people on both sides of the issue went pretty negative.

Beyond that, the problem with the discussion, which I agree should be the main point, is that the smudboy worshippers continue to completely ignore any attempt at rebuttal. I'll admit flaws in my arguments, I would ask for the same courtesy from any opposition. We aren't getting that.

[Nashiktal]

I don't see why wanting professionals to do their job is such a bad thing. An unloyal miranda can do almost any job and not die. She can even hold the firing line by herself.

I don't see Legion, a machine, suddenly not operate at optimal efficiency just because we havn't touched the heretic station, when we can literally do it right after the mission. That stations not going anywhere.

Jacobs dad has waited ten years, he can wait a while longer.

Grunt said himself that he does just fine in combat, plus its a good fight.

There are some that can't wait, or some squadmates who won't wait. Thane is dieing,Jack is crazy, Tali's mission is pretty important, and Miranda's is an immediate problem, but others can either wait.s

[Killjoy Cutter]

Phaelducan wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...
What is being exposed here is MY pettiness, stupidity and outright irrationality, and many posts in here, starting with mine.

fixed:P

No one will respect you if you keep doing this crap. Changing someone elses quotes and still quoting them, changing names and sophomoric crap like that is incredibly immature and stupid.

Agreed. 

On both boards I used to be involved in moderating, "fixed" misquoting was grounds for banning. 

[Killjoy Cutter]

Phaelducan wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

What if someone loves ME2, is still replaying it off and on, but is perfectly honest about the warts and shortcomings? 

If honesty had anything to do with it, we wouldn't be discussing anything, now would we? Simple logic: if people had different opinions due to their honesty or lack of it, why even bother discussing anything?

What is being exposed here is the pettiness, stupidity and outright irrationality of Smudboy's main plot videos and many posts in here, starting with many of yours.

Other than references from people who hate him, I think we've pretty much stopped talking about Smudboy and his videos. 

As for me, everything I've said in this thread is from my honest assesment of the game, or of a criticism of the game, or of someone's post or posting style.  I'm not here for the fight, I'm not here for the insults, I'm not here for the argument. 

You seem to be saying that there's no reason to have a discussion if you're not going to distort, attack, and insult.  That's all too typical these days, and a very sad aspect of where our culture is headed. 

Killjoy, that was fairly rational. I will say that I have a hard time seeing how you single him out, when numerous people on both sides of the issue went pretty negative.

Beyond that, the problem with the discussion, which I agree should be the main point, is that the smudboy worshippers continue to completely ignore any attempt at rebuttal. I'll admit flaws in my arguments, I would ask for the same courtesy from any opposition. We aren't getting that.

Well, I have noted the general tone of the thread before, how there's a lot of hate and seemingly no room for a middle ground.  I've got at least one person on each side directly or indirectly insulting me.  It wasn't my intention to imply, in replying to that particular post, that only its author was engaged in poor discussion behavior. 


On the subject of the resurrection, since it was used as an example, I think both sides need to step back and take another look.  It's certainly plausible that Shep's body could be intact after a fall from orbit, if the atmospheric entry was at a low enough relative velocity.  You can only fall so fast through air, and after that, starting height doesn't much matter -- and people have LIVED through falls from extreme heights.   On the other hand, the damage to Shep's body as described by in-game sources makes restoration of Shep's personality and memories implausible in the extreme.  And from my perspective as both a player and as a writer myself, the sad part is that there's just wasn't any reason to write the opening the way they did. 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 20 septembre 2011 - 04:02 .

[Fixers0]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

On both boards I used to be involved in moderating, "fixed" misquoting was grounds for banning. 

Appearantly not for Zulu.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Fixers0 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

On both boards I used to be involved in moderating, "fixed" misquoting was grounds for banning. 

Appearantly not for Zulu.

????