6494 réponses à ce sujet

[dreman9999]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Jack, like all biotics in ME2, is about ten times more powerful during cutscenes.  Meh.  It's actually one of the things I intensely dislike about ME2.   As it stands, I pretty much ignore the powers and power levels shown in cutscenes. 

Not really.
Mirada overloads the Asari vangruads shields and throws her due to anger. Adrinalin increase body functions...think woman lifting car off of her child on her own with what happened.
Samara is a very powerful biotic. She could easilly take that group out. And we came in at the very end of the fight, we did not see it to start to finish. She had time to do what she did.
Jack has a lot of stored up energy due to being in cryo. Biotic have to release that energy in their bodies ether through use or static eletricity. Being that she is a super biotic and she generates more biotic energy than most biotics.......what happen in her escape happened.

Overload doesn't work on biotic barriers. 

None of the biotics have the "float" power outside of cutscenes. 

Jack was in cryo, as you point out -- which means nothing building up.  The body is shut down, no nervous activity, no buildup of energy... that's the point of cryo.  

 

Samara has no overload so I don't get your point. I never seaid that she over load it. Just over whelmed it...The same a miranda.
Samara als has pull.
Controled cryo still has a persons inner working going so the person would not die...You brought that point when I stated that Shepard body was flashed freezed.

[dreman9999]

Arkitekt wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

No you haven't. All you seid is that Soverign is a billion as one mind and being that it you state that being stunning because he takes control of a second body and it gets destroyed it stupid. But you yet given reasons why Soverign can't have that weakness.

We are discussing the merits of a plot. We are not discussing physics of a real entity here. There does not exist a "reaper". All I have to do is to show how mind****ing ridiculous is the notion of having this weakness that wasn't even described off gameplay, to show that it shouldn't have been written this way.

As far as I know, Soverreign could be a giant spider that shouted KUMBAYAH to the galaxy and every flower died, or any other insanely ridiculous concept you can imagine. All this is "possible", so I would also be incapable of "showing" how this would be "impossible". But that question you pose is irrelevant. Get this into your brain if you can:

WE ARE DISCUSSING THE MERITS OF A PLOT, NOT PHYSICS.

Him being a mind as a billion joined as one is irrelivent...He took on a second body. Not shows that destroying that second body should not stun or harm him. That's my point. Your just saying it should not happen with out pointing to any thing.

I pointed to the assymetry of scale. You are admiting you are incapable of comprehending the problem. Perhaps you should read the words again, and again and again, and then give it some thought, like a week's long thought. "What did he mean by that?". Then come to me again, if you are still having problems.

Nothing states that a billion as one mind does not have that weakness.

In fact, gameplay states that it has. And in fact, I state that it is stupid, so it should be forgotten. I'm making this point for several pages already and you still miss it. Learn to ****ing understand your interlocutors before hitting the button "reply".

It's reavaled that it's a weakness and you state it's wrong and act like you know every detail of a reaper and anything like it and what should or shouldn't work. You still gave me no reason, no facts, no support to why it should not happen. Sorverign being a billion as one mind is not a reason why.

It happens but it shouldn't have happened. I gave you the best possible reason, which is one of lack of scale, lack of proportion. In a plot, this is all I need to show it's badly written as is. You simply deny reality and therefore deny that I have made a point. It's ****ing frustrating to have a conversation with someone that is even denying that I am making an argument. Unless you learn to educate yourself and drop this insulting shenanigan, we are done. Got it?

The game never state that it can;t happen to a billion in one mind... If your taking about Harbinger, he has safe guardes....Being that he is faaaaar away from the battle field and he is using and oporator to cut him from the controled body it time. Remember, it stuns not kill the reaper.
Also, it a science finction story, those type of stories have a tentency of using science fact...ME uses alot of science fact in it story. Stating that it does not need to expline how a billion in one mind work is irrelivent. The fact is their is no fact sheet for what would or would not work on a being like this...So that mean bioware can write in a weakness if they want. You stating that taking out a soverign total control saren husk should not work is like say in lord of the ring destory the one ring should not work...... It's written that way, and it works. If you don't have a real reason why it does not work than it just your own nick pick...Not bad writing.
As stated before, Nothing states that a billion as one mind does not have that weakness.

[Arkitekt]

You are unwilling to understand my point. Bioware as the authors can do whatever the **** they want, it's their story. And of course it "works", since the game doesn't crash at that point (that seems to be your criteria so I'll use it). If you think these are sufficient reasons for not making it "bad writing", then I'm afraid you'll fail to understand anything else I may try to educate you on, since this is as basic as it can get.

About being a "nitpick", I aint the one who brought it up, just stating my opinion about it. I don't have a grudge against it, it's just a sad simple fact that producing these games with dozens if not hundreds of developers and writers will always end up with these incoherency problems, specially if you are bound to a tight schedule of deliverance.

My "grudge" (if I can even describe it thus) is only with the people insisting that this is alright and there's no problem in maintaining it in the canon. These people have serious problems in their head.

[111987]

Arkitekt wrote...

You are unwilling to understand my point. Bioware as the authors can do whatever the **** they want, it's their story. And of course it "works", since the game doesn't crash at that point (that seems to be your criteria so I'll use it). If you think these are sufficient reasons for not making it "bad writing", then I'm afraid you'll fail to understand anything else I may try to educate you on, since this is as basic as it can get.

About being a "nitpick", I aint the one who brought it up, just stating my opinion about it. I don't have a grudge against it, it's just a sad simple fact that producing these games with dozens if not hundreds of developers and writers will always end up with these incoherency problems, specially if you are bound to a tight schedule of deliverance.

My "grudge" (if I can even describe it thus) is only with the people insisting that this is alright and there's no problem in maintaining it in the canon. These people have serious problems in their head.

So you know how much energy is requires to reanimate a corpse and give it superpowers?

[Sajuro]

Arkitekt, from what I understand your point is that you don't have a point. Sov shouldn't have been beaten by destroying Saren because you don't think it is good writing because apparently it ruins the Reapers for you or something >.> I'm not going to engage you on the level Dreman is, but I do not see the reason why it should be dropped from Canon.
Smudboy's videos are based on retcons and ignoring plot points from the previous Mass Effect, so doing a retcon just because "sov was too awesome to be killed by shepard and it sucks!'
Like my earlier post said: Deal with it.

[Arkitekt]

111987, Yes I do actually. Since Shepard is one such being (with biotic superpowers, etc.), I'd submit that the power needed to do so is in the same order of magnitude that *one* single human in a very good form like Shepard uses daily in his metabolism.

We could be kinky and multiply it by ten just to make sure. Are ten Shepards such a hassle for a 2 km Reaper?

Hell give it a hundred. Is this energy sufficient to give the reaper an headache? Puh leaze.

[dreman9999]

Arkitekt wrote...

You are unwilling to understand my point. Bioware as the authors can do whatever the **** they want, it's their story. And of course it "works", since the game doesn't crash at that point (that seems to be your criteria so I'll use it). If you think these are sufficient reasons for not making it "bad writing", then I'm afraid you'll fail to understand anything else I may try to educate you on, since this is as basic as it can get.

About being a "nitpick", I aint the one who brought it up, just stating my opinion about it. I don't have a grudge against it, it's just a sad simple fact that producing these games with dozens if not hundreds of developers and writers will always end up with these incoherency problems, specially if you are bound to a tight schedule of deliverance.

My "grudge" (if I can even describe it thus) is only with the people insisting that this is alright and there's no problem in maintaining it in the canon. These people have serious problems in their head.

Thing is that these thing are not radomly put in and cut out with no reason to why it happen. With what happen to Soverign, it's clear your comparing it to what Bioware did with Harbinger. Soverign was in a battle ageinst a fleet when he took control of Sarens body, Harbinger was closing in to the very fringes of our galaxy when he takes control of the collectors in the feild. You can't see the these are very different events? If Harbinger gets stunned....he not going to die, he is not surrounded by an armada trying to kill him. No matter what happens...he is safe. Soverign is dead locked in  two battles...trying to open a gate way to bring in the reapers.... If he get's stunned, he has no safe place to go. That's not obvious?
Meny people complain about the changes is the story and plot without realizing bioware adds reasons for that change...It's called progression. It not something random, it's even supported with facts from ME1. I can understand this feeling that adding thing left and right can be bad to the plot. but only if it retcons what ever has been set in stone before....That means pretends that what was set in stone before never happend!
But ME2 doesnot do this. It just adds to things stated before. That not bad writing....that's just progress in the story.

Modifié par dreman9999, 28 septembre 2011 - 03:51 .

[dreman9999]

Arkitekt wrote...

111987, Yes I do actually. Since Shepard is one such being (with biotic superpowers, etc.), I'd submit that the power needed to do so is in the same order of magnitude that *one* single human in a very good form like Shepard uses daily in his metabolism.

We could be kinky and multiply it by ten just to make sure. Are ten Shepards such a hassle for a 2 km Reaper?

Hell give it a hundred. Is this energy sufficient to give the reaper an headache? Puh leaze.

You not understanding....

Husk=remote control.

What soverign did to Saren's body=direct control.

It's one thing to bring a body back. It's another to directly control it.

Modifié par dreman9999, 28 septembre 2011 - 03:49 .

[111987]

Arkitekt wrote...

111987, Yes I do actually. Since Shepard is one such being (with biotic superpowers, etc.), I'd submit that the power needed to do so is in the same order of magnitude that *one* single human in a very good form like Shepard uses daily in his metabolism.

We could be kinky and multiply it by ten just to make sure. Are ten Shepards such a hassle for a 2 km Reaper?

Hell give it a hundred. Is this energy sufficient to give the reaper an headache? Puh leaze.

No, Saren's powers were far more powerful than Shepards. The guy was firing salvos of rockets off.

You're really misunderstanding what's going on. It's not that Sovereign invested all of its power into Saren, and that's why it shut down after Saren's death. It's just that it was investing a significant amount of power to renanimate, enhance, and directly control Saren. When Saren was destroyed, Sovereign is temporarily stunned. Stunned, but it didn't lose all of its energy.

[Arkitekt]

Sajuro wrote...

Arkitekt, from what I understand your point is that you don't have a point.

Don't insult my intelligence and we'll be fine Sajuro.

Sov shouldn't have been beaten by destroying Saren because you don't think it is good writing because apparently it ruins the Reapers for you or something >.> I'm not going to engage you on the level Dreman is, but I do not see the reason why it should be dropped from Canon.

It's exactly that, it ruins the reaper's scale for me. And of course it is "for me". I can't speak for anyone else but me, and I dare say that you are constrained by the same limitation. I won't make the same ridiculous mistake that Smudboy does and call my criticisms "objective absolute truths".

However, to disagree with my assessment on the assymetry of scale that is displayed in that event is to show a very very poor taste on your part. This should be reason enough for you to leave in shame and privately go have aesthetics lessons from some professional place. I won't tell anybody don't worry.

Smudboy's videos are based on retcons and ignoring plot points from the previous Mass Effect, so doing a retcon just because "sov was too awesome to be killed by shepard and it sucks!'

I'm not suggesting a retcon. I'm merely hoping that this "weakness" might not be even suggested / referenced, and least of everything, used in ME3. I'm hoping that the devs are sufficiently reasonable to just forget about this incident and pretend nothing like that happened. And invent other tactics.

Surely I'm also not suggesting a rewrite of ME1. Leave it as is, with its best things along with its errors. It's part of the gaming history now.

Like my earlier post said: Deal with it.

What you are really saying is "shut the **** up". I find your tone insulting and irritating.

[Arkitekt]

dreman9999 wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

111987, Yes I do actually. Since Shepard is one such being (with biotic superpowers, etc.), I'd submit that the power needed to do so is in the same order of magnitude that *one* single human in a very good form like Shepard uses daily in his metabolism.

We could be kinky and multiply it by ten just to make sure. Are ten Shepards such a hassle for a 2 km Reaper?

Hell give it a hundred. Is this energy sufficient to give the reaper an headache? Puh leaze.

You not understanding....

Husk=remote control.

What soverign did to Saren's body=direct control.

It's one thing to bring a body back. It's another to directly control it.

Pure bull**** speculation. Needs no retort.

[Arkitekt]

111987 wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

111987, Yes I do actually. Since Shepard is one such being (with biotic superpowers, etc.), I'd submit that the power needed to do so is in the same order of magnitude that *one* single human in a very good form like Shepard uses daily in his metabolism.

We could be kinky and multiply it by ten just to make sure. Are ten Shepards such a hassle for a 2 km Reaper?

Hell give it a hundred. Is this energy sufficient to give the reaper an headache? Puh leaze.

No, Saren's powers were far more powerful than Shepards. The guy was firing salvos of rockets off.

You're really misunderstanding what's going on. It's not that Sovereign invested all of its power into Saren, and that's why it shut down after Saren's death. It's just that it was investing a significant amount of power to renanimate, enhance, and directly control Saren. When Saren was destroyed, Sovereign is temporarily stunned. Stunned, but it didn't lose all of its energy.

I gave you two orders of magnitude above Shepard. That's more than enough. You still fail to show me how this is cumbersome for a 2km mega reaper that shreds cruisers in seconds either by ramming them or by giving them his reddish finger.

And how suddenly not having to use the energy being directed towards Saren-the-husk is a source of "stun" is also mega counter intuitive.

You keep telling me I am "misunderstanding", etc., when I clearly show you I am not. OTOH, you show to not understand my point by telling me that "saren the husk has ROCKEETZ! OMGBBQ!". Someone here has not a single atomic intuition about numbers. I'd say it's more than one though.

[dreman9999]

Arkitekt wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

111987, Yes I do actually. Since Shepard is one such being (with biotic superpowers, etc.), I'd submit that the power needed to do so is in the same order of magnitude that *one* single human in a very good form like Shepard uses daily in his metabolism.

We could be kinky and multiply it by ten just to make sure. Are ten Shepards such a hassle for a 2 km Reaper?

Hell give it a hundred. Is this energy sufficient to give the reaper an headache? Puh leaze.

You not understanding....

Husk=remote control.

What soverign did to Saren's body=direct control.

It's one thing to bring a body back. It's another to directly control it.

Pure bull**** speculation. Needs no retort.

Not speculation. If Soverign could do what he need to do with husk, he would of been turning people to husk left and right. Saren even tell you himself that that they are degrees of indocrination, the most valuble are kept intelligent while the rest are turn into mind less slaves. If Soverign could do what is need to do with a mindless husk or fully indorcinated mindless person, why allow Saren to keep him intelligents?
And that how I understand their are degrees of control a reaper can have on an indocrinated person....Saren experiance.

So.....
Husk =Remote control
They way soverign control Saren= Direct control.

The first thing spoken out of Saran's 100% controled form is"I am Soverign....Andf this is my station." Clearly, he is in direct control of Saren's body.

[dreman9999]

Arkitekt wrote...

111987 wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

111987, Yes I do actually. Since Shepard is one such being (with biotic superpowers, etc.), I'd submit that the power needed to do so is in the same order of magnitude that *one* single human in a very good form like Shepard uses daily in his metabolism.

We could be kinky and multiply it by ten just to make sure. Are ten Shepards such a hassle for a 2 km Reaper?

Hell give it a hundred. Is this energy sufficient to give the reaper an headache? Puh leaze.

No, Saren's powers were far more powerful than Shepards. The guy was firing salvos of rockets off.

You're really misunderstanding what's going on. It's not that Sovereign invested all of its power into Saren, and that's why it shut down after Saren's death. It's just that it was investing a significant amount of power to renanimate, enhance, and directly control Saren. When Saren was destroyed, Sovereign is temporarily stunned. Stunned, but it didn't lose all of its energy.

I gave you two orders of magnitude above Shepard. That's more than enough. You still fail to show me how this is cumbersome for a 2km mega reaper that shreds cruisers in seconds either by ramming them or by giving them his reddish finger.

And how suddenly not having to use the energy being directed towards Saren-the-husk is a source of "stun" is also mega counter intuitive.

You keep telling me I am "misunderstanding", etc., when I clearly show you I am not. OTOH, you show to not understand my point by telling me that "saren the husk has ROCKEETZ! OMGBBQ!". Someone here has not a single atomic intuition about numbers. I'd say it's more than one though.

Think about it this way.... Saren's body is taking in to Soverign to the point that it's part of Soverign body. The control is like a person controling their own body.... Every deteil felt by that body, good or bad is felt by Soverign in full detail. If the body is harmed, he feels it. So destroying that body is like someone crushing you foot with a hammer.  You get stunned from that.

[Argusrho34]

What the hell is going on in here.

[Killjoy Cutter]

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Jack, like all biotics in ME2, is about ten times more powerful during cutscenes.  Meh.  It's actually one of the things I intensely dislike about ME2.   As it stands, I pretty much ignore the powers and power levels shown in cutscenes. 

Not really.
Mirada overloads the Asari vangruads shields and throws her due to anger. Adrinalin increase body functions...think woman lifting car off of her child on her own with what happened.
Samara is a very powerful biotic. She could easilly take that group out. And we came in at the very end of the fight, we did not see it to start to finish. She had time to do what she did.
Jack has a lot of stored up energy due to being in cryo. Biotic have to release that energy in their bodies ether through use or static eletricity. Being that she is a super biotic and she generates more biotic energy than most biotics.......what happen in her escape happened.

Overload doesn't work on biotic barriers. 

None of the biotics have the "float" power outside of cutscenes. 

Jack was in cryo, as you point out -- which means nothing building up.  The body is shut down, no nervous activity, no buildup of energy... that's the point of cryo.  

 

Samara has no overload so I don't get your point. I never seaid that she over load it. Just over whelmed it...The same a miranda.
Samara als has pull.
Controled cryo still has a persons inner working going so the person would not die...You brought that point when I stated that Shepard body was flashed freezed.

1)  You said that Miranda "Overloads" Captain Enyala's shields.  Enyala doesn't have shields, she has a biotic barrier, and Miranda's Overload wasn't shown being used and wouldn't have much effect on a biotic barrier in ME2.  Has nothing to do with Samara. 

2)  "Pull" doesn't float the Biotic, it floats the target.  It's only in a couple of cutscenes that we see Biotics "fly". 

3)  Controlled cryogenic preservation stops all biological processes in the subject -- that's what preserves them.   It's not the stoppage of their "inner workings" that would cause damage.  (On the flash freezing suggestion for Alchera, there's nothing there that would actually flash freeze a human body, and uncontrolled freezing, flash or otherwise, causes massive cell damage as the ice crystals tear through cell walls, osmotic balances are upset, etc.)

[Killjoy Cutter]

The way I see it, when Sovereign took control of Saren's corpse, it was as if Sovereign had added another limb, another extension of itself.

Then Shep and the team stuck that limb into a flaming woodchipper.

Sovereign was taking a massive amount of fire from the combined fleets, trying to take over the citadel, and fighting the team.  Having its limb stuck into a flaming woodchipper was more than it could handle, and in the moment of its reaction, its shields came down enough for the massed firepower to start damaging, at which point we get the slightly cheesy cinematic moment of the Normandy striking the deathblow. 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 28 septembre 2011 - 05:03 .

[111987]

Arkitekt wrote...

111987 wrote...

Arkitekt wrote...

111987, Yes I do actually. Since Shepard is one such being (with biotic superpowers, etc.), I'd submit that the power needed to do so is in the same order of magnitude that *one* single human in a very good form like Shepard uses daily in his metabolism.

We could be kinky and multiply it by ten just to make sure. Are ten Shepards such a hassle for a 2 km Reaper?

Hell give it a hundred. Is this energy sufficient to give the reaper an headache? Puh leaze.

No, Saren's powers were far more powerful than Shepards. The guy was firing salvos of rockets off.

You're really misunderstanding what's going on. It's not that Sovereign invested all of its power into Saren, and that's why it shut down after Saren's death. It's just that it was investing a significant amount of power to renanimate, enhance, and directly control Saren. When Saren was destroyed, Sovereign is temporarily stunned. Stunned, but it didn't lose all of its energy.

I gave you two orders of magnitude above Shepard. That's more than enough. You still fail to show me how this is cumbersome for a 2km mega reaper that shreds cruisers in seconds either by ramming them or by giving them his reddish finger.

And how suddenly not having to use the energy being directed towards Saren-the-husk is a source of "stun" is also mega counter intuitive.

You keep telling me I am "misunderstanding", etc., when I clearly show you I am not. OTOH, you show to not understand my point by telling me that "saren the husk has ROCKEETZ! OMGBBQ!". Someone here has not a single atomic intuition about numbers. I'd say it's more than one though.

Two orders of magnititude above Shepard? First of all I don't even know what you are talking about here. Are you forgetting that it took two years for Shepard to be reanimated? Sovereign reanimated Saren almost immediately. The comparisons are not equal at all.

You obviously don't understand the idea that losing a significant amount of energy could stun a Reaper. Also consider this; Sovereign was in essence 'possessing' Saren's corpse and imbuing it with power. By killing Saren, you are in some ways killing Sovereign, as Sovereign has invested itself into the Saren corpse ("I am Sovereign, and this station is MINE!"). It is not ridiculous at all that Sovereign would be stunned briefly after being killed in another body.

[Shepard the Leper]

Arkitekt wrote...

"Thats a poor way to construct a plot".

I wonder what kind of education this genius that gives clues to professionals has.

So a plot that starts in chapter 1, is completely ignored in 2 - 9, and continues in chapter 10 just before it ends, is a good plot? What plot are you talking about anyway? What did you learn about the Reapers and how to stop them in ME2? I didn't find anything, it's only about hunting down a insignificant bunch of pawns who are completely irrelevant to the apocalypse at hand. That's a poor way to construct a plot, a 3 year old child can understand that.

BTW, are you a "graduated plot professor" or something? If not, what the hell are you doing here anyway?

[Shepard the Leper]

Il Divo wrote...

Again, what are you talking about? Show me where, in the narrative, it is established that this Reaper's ME fields could fail at any moment. Positive evidence is needed to support your claim. Consider that it's survived at least a millenia unscathed. You're basically making up non-existent scenario to justify your idiotic idea that Shepard should be dragging around a giant sentient space ship, ignoring what resources would even be necessary to move the Reaper. The narrative is fine there.

Shepard goes to recover the IFF (to stop the Collectors, plot of ME2), the plan goes to hell, and he's forced to leave the Reaper behind. 

 

Show me why you are completely sure the ME field will hold indefinitely. Do you have any evidence or is the fact that the thing is still there sufficient?

If you think that salvaging a GODDAMN Reaper is idiotic, I'm afraid you're a lost cause. That's a strategic mistake of galatic proportions.

Shep's purpose is to find a way to stop the REAPERS, not the Collectors. Are you saying the IFF is more important than studying a Reaper ship? Which version of ME2 did you play? One without the Reapers or something?

[tonnactus]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

The way I see it, when Sovereign took control of Saren's corpse, it was as if Sovereign had added another limb, another extension of itself.

Then Shep and the team stuck that limb into a flaming woodchipper.

Sovereign was taking a massive amount of fire from the combined fleets, trying to take over the citadel, and fighting the team.  Having its limb stuck into a flaming woodchipper was more than it could handle, and in the moment of its reaction, its shields came down enough for the massed firepower to start damaging, at which point we get the slightly cheesy cinematic moment of the Normandy striking the deathblow. 

I always imagined that the defeat of Saren led to a sort of program error or bluesreen that shut down souvereign for a moment.

[Shepard the Leper]

dreman9999 wrote...

1. You don't read the mission statements? It not like the game take you to some random place for random reasons. Each mission has a reason. Just because you don't pay attention does not mean the story is random.
2.I think you don't get what bioware is trying to show you with the dead reaper......Think of it this way....Even if the reaper is brain dead the body of a reaper is immortal. It body will always work if it's not broken apart. If left alone the reapers body will last forever. You looking at it as a ship....Look at it as someones body to understand it. The mind is gone but the body still works.
3. That how your write a trilogy.... Trilogies tend to not tell you everything bout the story at once.

1. I'm not discussing what the game tells me to do. I merely question the reasoning behind it. When the Reapers are the main threat, ignoring the only ship in existence waiting to give away its secrets, to grab a device to hunt a bunch of insignificant Collectors is stupid.

2. I don't want to think what Bioware might want to tell us. I want a story that's consistent and clear about the crucial events. The only thing Shep needs to know about the Reapers is how to kill them. The game throws all sort of worthless info at the player, a military (wo)man only needs to know how to kill its enemies. There's nothing in ME2 that even hints towards an attempt to figure this out.

3. A trilogy is a piece of work cut into three parts. That doesn't mean the first two parts tell little or nothing, and the last part explains it all. If that's the case it has been pointless to create a trilogy - the final part is all you need. Someone who hasn't played ME1 and 2, hasn't missed a thing about the main plot. The Reapers are coming and we have no clue how to stop them. We knew that already, or those who didn't will know after watching the ME3 intro.

[Il Divo]

Shepard the Leper wrote...

Show me why you are completely sure the ME field will hold indefinitely. Do you have any evidence or is the fact that the thing is still there sufficient?

Because it hasn't moved for over a millennia. Do you know what the odds are of a Reaper that old suddenly falling to pieces at that exact moment? Future events predicated on past events. You want another fun example: if I drop a rock a million times, gravity will always cause it to hit the ground. Prove to me (indefinitely) that if I conducted this experiment again that the rock will always hit the ground.

Sufficient evidence is based on the Reaper having survived next to the brown dwarf for a million years. In other words, you (not I) need evidence which demonstrates that Shepard has reason to think that the situation would change at this point in time.

If you think that salvaging a GODDAMN Reaper is idiotic, I'm afraid you're a lost cause. That's a strategic mistake of galatic proportions.

Shep's purpose is to find a way to stop the REAPERS, not the Collectors. Are you saying the IFF is more important than studying a Reaper ship? Which version of ME2 did you play? One without the Reapers or something?

Reading comprehension. There is nothing to suggest that Shepard cannot first collect the IFF. The Collectors are active agents of the Reapers, placing some plan into action, which carries its own benefits in discovering. The plan is as simple as get the IFF now, worry about the dead (not moving) Reaper later. Your idiotic plan assumes that Shepard went in planning to blow up the Reaper. What exactly are you expecting Cerberus to do? Tow a giant space ship halfway across the galaxy? 

Modifié par Il Divo, 28 septembre 2011 - 06:05 .

[Someone With Mass]

Il Divo wrote...

Reading comprehension. There is nothing to suggest that Shepard cannot first collect the IFF. The Collectors are active agents of the Reapers, placing some plan into action, which carries its own benefits in discovering. The plan is as simple as get the IFF now, worry about the dead (not moving) Reaper later. Your idiotic plan assumes that Shepard went in planning to blow up the Reaper. What exactly are you expecting Cerberus to do? Tow a giant space ship halfway across the galaxy? 

It'd break apart during FTL.

Granted, the initial setup of the little outpost aboard the Reaper could've been done better, but it's not something that makes the whole story fall apart.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Shepard the Leper wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

Again, what are you talking about? Show me where, in the narrative, it is established that this Reaper's ME fields could fail at any moment. Positive evidence is needed to support your claim. Consider that it's survived at least a millenia unscathed. You're basically making up non-existent scenario to justify your idiotic idea that Shepard should be dragging around a giant sentient space ship, ignoring what resources would even be necessary to move the Reaper. The narrative is fine there.

Shepard goes to recover the IFF (to stop the Collectors, plot of ME2), the plan goes to hell, and he's forced to leave the Reaper behind. 

 

Show me why you are completely sure the ME field will hold indefinitely. Do you have any evidence or is the fact that the thing is still there sufficient?

If you think that salvaging a GODDAMN Reaper is idiotic, I'm afraid you're a lost cause. That's a strategic mistake of galatic proportions.

Shep's purpose is to find a way to stop the REAPERS, not the Collectors. Are you saying the IFF is more important than studying a Reaper ship? Which version of ME2 did you play? One without the Reapers or something?

That of course assumes that the Reaper is salvagable. 

Maybe one of the reasons the Cerberus team was there was to determine if that was even possible.