6494 réponses à ce sujet

[Someone With Mass]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Bollocks, bollocks, bollock and bollocks.

Mass effect fields function the same on a person and a ship. They're just scaled differently. There is no difference in function between two persons and two starships. ME fields functio non the EXACT SAME principle.

You're inventing redicolous explanations, one worse than another.

Are you seriously that stupid?

Are you honestly trying to tell me that a person punching another person and debris the size of a fotball field hitting a space ship is the exact same thing?

Go away, and take your retarded assumptions with you.

[Notlikeyoucare]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Then how were Shepard and co still breathing? The fields were still up.

Other emitters around the hole could've just expanded their fields.

Then how did the Occulos enter the ship?

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

You all also need to learn to spell debris,it is spelled the same way singular or plural...debris.

[Someone With Mass]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

I'm inclined to call Kinetic Barriers PTS = Plot Triggered Shield. Because they apparently only work or not depending on what the plot requires and nothing else.

Then why didn't they protect against the Oculi's particle beams?

Right, because shields don't protect against that kind of weponry, which is why we had to upgrade the armor. 

[dreman9999]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
No. What makes you think the Collectors would know everything?

It not that they know everything. It the fact they have way better sensor then we do. If a stealth ship can hide and surpise them, how could any other ship.

No sensors are infallible and perfect. We don't evne know how the
Collectors tracked the Normandy. They were after it for a while. It's
qutie possible they slipped a homing beacon on board at some point, so stealth would be useless.
Even
if we assuem theri sensors are that good, we're still talking about a
debris field. That's a very sensor-unfriendly enviroment.

Also, a thousand kilometers is nothing in space. A gun fireing at 0.05%
can easily have a effective range of several thousand kilometers.

And thousands of kilometer is everthing  in a 4 dimentional space fight. Location and detection is the most important part of space battle. Why? because any one can come at you in any direction. It's not 3d planet side combat like flying with a fixed vector based physic feild.(AKA earth.)
Think of space combate as an imploding sphere and a ship is at the very center. Who even knows who is who in space in thattype of environment hit first and the collector ship attack is a one hit kill if it's direct.

Wut? What are you talking about. You're making no sense here at all.

And space has 3 dimensions, not 4. What drugs are you using?

No, planets are. 3D is X,Y and z.  AKA a plane with vector points going up(Geometry terms). Space has no plane. It's W,X,Y and Z.  In 3D up, left and right is infinite while down is not. In 4D all points are infanite. Space has no end point just points in it making it 4D.

[Someone With Mass]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Then how did the Occulos enter the ship?

They entered before the emitters expanded their fields.

[Lotion Soronarr]

[quote]
1. Sovereign's impact simply overwhelmed the kinetic barriers of the cruiser[/qutoe]

Or tehy did nothing at all.

[quote]
2. Shepard was held back by the Shadow Broker's shield. Unless you're talking about that special shield he brings up after you strip his defenses? That clearly is a different type of shield[/quote]

I'm talking abotu Sheppard, not hte SB.

[quote]
3. The Normandy barriers did protect it from the debris field. The debris that brushed against the hull was stationary, so that's different from moving slowly. Clearly the barriers did affect the debris because they went from 40% capacity to 30.[/quote]

Smaller, faster moving objects and occulus shooting at it.
Stationary is not really different from moving slowly. Especially since movement is relative.

[quote]
4. Chairs are stationary objects. Moot point[/quote]

no

[quote]
5. Not sure what this one is about, but once again, force overwhelming kinetic barriers[/quote]

Did we see them fizzle out like they do when they're overwhelmed? No. We saw NOTHING.

[quote]
6. The Occulus used a lazer to punch a hole in the Normandy, thus destroying the shield emitter in that section.
[/quote]

Assumption with nothing to back it up. Even worse if you assume they did it TWICE.


[quote][quote]
Then how were Shepard and co still breathing? The fields were still up.

[/quote]Key word is  section. They a can close that section off and keep going.
[/quote]


Shep and crew are in that section...

Modifié par Lotion Soronnar, 01 septembre 2011 - 09:04 .

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

dreman9999 wrote...
No, planets are. 3D is X,Y and z.  AKA a plane with vector points going up(Geometry terms). Space has no plane. It's W,X,Y and Z.  In 3D up, left and right is infinite while down is not. In 4D all points are infinite. Space has no end point just points in it making it 4D.

Schooled....his rebuttal should be quite humorous


:bandit:also I fixed your typo.

Modifié par Humanoid_Typhoon, 01 septembre 2011 - 09:06 .

[Lotion Soronarr]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Then how did the Occulos enter the ship?

They entered before the emitters expanded their fields.

So ..your explanation is a series of extreemly unlikely and convoluted events happning in JUST the exact right sequence....twice?

[Someone With Mass]

By the way, Shepard and the crew weren't in the hangar when the Oculus punched through the hull.

[dreman9999]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

And fail. Because we've nto seen a singel instance of a kinetic barrier stoping large objects. Ever.

Everything implies otherwise.
Sovereing ramming the Turain cruiser- ti's kinetic barriers did nothing.
Sheppard ramming teh Shadow Broker - the barriers did nothing
Normandy moving trough the debris field - we see debries hitting the HULL
People sitting on chairs with barriers on
Liara getting hammered by Atlas (it's fists are a large object)
Occulus entering the Normandy cargo bay.

etc...etc...

1. Could've just as easy simply chosen to not activate them at that point because the situation didn't require it, like any ship can.

2. There's a difference between two persons tackling each other and spaceship debris hitting another ship.

3. I think they mentioned a noticeable decrease in the shield's strength afterwards.

4. Sensors makes sure they don't activate. Read the ****ing Codex for once.

5. Same situation as with the chair.

6. The Oculus went in there while burning a hole into the hull, while also burning away the shield emitters at the same time. The whole ship isn't covered by one big shield emitter if you thought that.

Bollocks, bollocks, bollock and bollocks.

Mass effect fields function the same on a person and a ship. They're just scaled differently. There is no difference in function between two persons and two starships. ME fields functio non the EXACT SAME principle.

You're inventing redicolous explanations, one worse than another.

Their is a reason why soldier have it automatic, if it was not they could not breath, touch things or interact with any one. It turn on with speed with them.
Ships don't need that because they don't need to interact, breath or touch things in a battle. Iy just has an on switch.

[dreman9999]

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
No, planets are. 3D is X,Y and z.  AKA a plane with vector points going up(Geometry terms). Space has no plane. It's W,X,Y and Z.  In 3D up, left and right is infinite while down is not. In 4D all points are infinite. Space has no end point just points in it making it 4D.

Schooled....his rebuttal should be quite humorous


:bandit:also I fixed your typo.

I thank school and Orson scott card for this info.

[Lotion Soronarr]

dreman9999 wrote...

No, planets are. 3D is X,Y and z.  AKA a plane with vector points going up(Geometry terms). Space has no plane. It's W,X,Y and Z.  In 3D up, left and right is infinite while down is not. In 4D all points are infanite. Space has no end point just points in it making it 4D.

Wut?

There are no limits to the vectors/planes

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four-dimensional_space

Modifié par Lotion Soronnar, 01 septembre 2011 - 09:08 .

[Someone With Mass]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

So ..your explanation is a series of extreemly unlikely and convoluted events happning in JUST the exact right sequence....twice?

How is a shield emitter expanding its fields an unlikely event? It's pretty much what the biotic escort is doing on the Collector base at the end.

And heat can pass through the shields without a problem. The Oculi burned the emitters away and entered before other emitters kicked in or they expanded their fields over the holes. Simple as that.

If you want a more believable scenario, think one up yourself without resorting to your childish exclamations of the whole event being a plot hole.

[Lotion Soronarr]

The stupid here.....it is painfull.

[111987]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

I'm inclined to call Kinetic Barriers PTS = Plot Triggered Shield. Because they apparently only work or not depending on what the plot requires and nothing else.

No-one cares what you call it. No offense.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Bollocks, bollocks, bollock and bollocks.

Mass effect fields function the same on a person and a ship. They're just scaled differently. There is no difference in function between two persons and two starships. ME fields functio non the EXACT SAME principle.

You're inventing redicolous explanations, one worse than another.

Are you seriously that stupid?

Are you honestly trying to tell me that a person punching another person and debris the size of a fotball field hitting a space ship is the exact same thing?

Go away, and take your retarded assumptions with you.

Are you honestly telling me the basics physics of how a ME field functions changes just because it's up-scaled?

Go away and [CENSORED CENSORED, CENSORED, CENSORED]

[Notlikeyoucare]

111987 wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

I'm inclined to call Kinetic Barriers PTS = Plot Triggered Shield. Because they apparently only work or not depending on what the plot requires and nothing else.

No-one cares what you call it. No offense.

Good, they shouldn't.

[Someone With Mass]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

No, planets are. 3D is X,Y and z.  AKA a plane with vector points going up(Geometry terms). Space has no plane. It's W,X,Y and Z.  In 3D up, left and right is infinite while down is not. In 4D all points are infanite. Space has no end point just points in it making it 4D.

Wut?

There are no limits to the vectors/planes

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four-dimensional_space

http://www.physorg.c...ws67773542.html

[111987]

Okay, this debate is CLEARLY going nowhere...this is the point where rational, mature people agree to disagree, and leave it at that...

We're talking about kinetic barriers because we were debating whether or not a probe should be sent through the Omega 4 Relay. Some people believe the absence of this probe=plot hole, bad writing, etc...other people, such as myself disagree, arguing that recon via probes would not yield useful data.

Two sides that will likely never come to an agreement. Let's leave it at that, shall we?

[Someone With Mass]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Are you honestly telling me the basics physics of how a ME field functions changes just because it's up-scaled?

Go away and [CENSORED CENSORED, CENSORED, CENSORED]

Hell, I'll just say it:

The shields aboard the Normandy requires a lot more power to repel the debris, not to mention that the speed and force difference between Shepard's punches and the debris hitting the Normandy is...I'd guess...a couple of hundred thousand times greater.

It's not the exact same thing.

Not to mention that there's not just one impact point when the debris connects with the ship.

Modifié par Someone With Mass, 01 septembre 2011 - 09:20 .

[Someone With Mass]

111987 wrote...

Okay, this debate is CLEARLY going nowhere...this is the point where rational, mature people agree to disagree, and leave it at that...

We're talking about kinetic barriers because we were debating whether or not a probe should be sent through the Omega 4 Relay. Some people believe the absence of this probe=plot hole, bad writing, etc...other people, such as myself disagree, arguing that recon via probes would not yield useful data.

Two sides that will likely never come to an agreement. Let's leave it at that, shall we?

I also think that sending explosives through would just create more debris, which could be even more dangerous for the Normandy, when something as small as a metal bolt can severely damage a ship in FTL.

[Kaiser Shepard]

I find amusement in the fact that this topic essentially boils down to the usual BSN discussion: Paragons vs Renegades, where the former are thoroughly apologetic towards the powers that be (in this case Bioware), while the latter group takes every chance to criticize said powers, the Paragons and their train of thought.

Also, Lotion, some of those examples a couple of pages ago aren't examples of kinetic barriers being hit by large objects, but rather being hit by not sufficiently fast enough objects.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Kaiser Shepard wrote...

I find amusement in the fact that this topic essentially boils down to the usual BSN discussion: Paragons vs Renegades, where the former are thoroughly apologetic towards the powers that be (in this case Bioware), while the latter group takes every chance to criticize said powers, the Paragons and their train of thought.

Also, Lotion, some of those examples a couple of pages ago aren't examples of kinetic barriers being hit by large objects, but rather being hit by not sufficiently fast enough objects.

Note, I'm a 90% paragon player. And I'm neither a blind Bio fanboy nor a blind Bio hater.

As far as the examples go - that's the whole point. Kinetic barreirs work agaist small, fast moving objects.
The bigger the object, the slower it is, the less it's able to stop/deflect.

Seen the 20-kilo slug the DN uses? It's small. The bullets in the guns? They are the size of a grain of sand. Yet they travel very, VERY fast.
It's those things that kinetic barriers were made to protect against. The name itself sez is - KINETIC barriers.
Kinetic energy is defined mostly by speed. Ek = mv^2/2

They repulse the object going towards them by basicly pushing it back. Biggers objects have a LOT more momentum, as momentum is defined by mass a lot more. P =mv. And big momentum is a LOT harder to stop.

Understand now?

Modifié par Lotion Soronnar, 01 septembre 2011 - 10:30 .

[Lotion Soronarr]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

No, planets are. 3D is X,Y and z.  AKA a plane with vector points going up(Geometry terms). Space has no plane. It's W,X,Y and Z.  In 3D up, left and right is infinite while down is not. In 4D all points are infanite. Space has no end point just points in it making it 4D.

Wut?

There are no limits to the vectors/planes

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four-dimensional_space

http://www.physorg.c...ws67773542.html

It's fascinating that you post links to things yo do not even understand.

Space is a 3D battlefield.