6494 réponses à ce sujet

[Someone With Mass]

Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...
But that was a plothole/retcon

Ah, yes, "retroactive continuity".

The excuse many individuals have used to display their dislike for certain points and objects within a game story. We have dismissed those claims.

[Fixers0]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Remember the shields that were blocking Shepard on Feros and Ilos in ME1? I do.

Also, the derelict Reaper had its barriers up so you couldn't leave until they were down.

Those are all examples of incorect use of lore material within the Narative, Kinetic barriers/shields are only designed for Damage protection for ships/vehicals and infantry, there are no such things as blocking forcefields within Mass Effect lore, those were just invented for gameplay purposes.

And how do you explain those about the normandy? you could just walk right through them

[Contalion]

As I understand it, mass effect field effectively break the laws of physics in such a way as to negate or reduce the mass of any object the field is in contact with....this is how FTL works despite the anti FTL theories of all our real world physicists.....no mass=no physical limits. This also works as a shield simply because any solid projectile fired at you would have its mass reduced to almost or absolute zero upon hitting the field....and zero mass=zero momentum=zero impact force. Intertia simply does not apply to objects without mass. As such, I don't think an object's speed would matter.....it's not the object's speed that generates impact or penetration power, it is it's momentum, and momentum is mass dependant.

[dreman9999]

Fixers0 ....
Notlikeyoucare
.......READ...

Kinetic barriers are repulsive mass effect fields projected from tiny emitters. These shields safely deflect small objects traveling at rapid velocities. This affords protection from bullets and other dangerous projectiles, but still allows the user to sit down without knocking away their chair.
The shielding afforded by kinetic barriers does not protect against extremes of temperature, toxins, or radiation.

..............
.... Nothing there states it can't stop slow moving objects. Just temperatures, toxins and radiation.
....In ME1 YOU HAVE TO GET LIARA OUT OF A BARRIER THAT SHE IS INCASED IN.... You can't walk through it, you go under it. And that is from ME1 that made the lore.
It not that the writers don't understand their own lore.....YOU GUYS DON'T UNDERSTAND.

How many time do we have to stay that soldier sheilds react to fast moving object because it a safety mechanism? Nothing state slow moving object can't be stopped by sheilds and even goes into detail about what can or can't.....And slow moving object is not on of them. Sheild can stop any object and have been shown to do so in ME1 and ME2. You can lean agenst geth barrier in ME1 in combat. You have to get around the barrier that traps liara. You have to turn the barrier the Geth turn off on Feros to move forward. And that all from ME1 THAT MADE THE LORE !!!
How can you noy understand this?

[111987]

Fixers0 wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Remember the shields that were blocking Shepard on Feros and Ilos in ME1? I do.

Also, the derelict Reaper had its barriers up so you couldn't leave until they were down.

Those are all examples of incorect use of lore material within the Narative, Kinetic barriers/shields are only designed for Damage protection for ships/vehicals and infantry, there are no such things as blocking forcefields within Mass Effect lore, those were just invented for gameplay purposes.

And how do you explain those about the normandy? you could just walk right through them

Your whole argument is just dismissing several examples of kinetic barriers deflecting things other than small, fast moving objects. You can't simply dismiss them; that's not how debates work. Also, someone posted a link to the codex saying star ships use mass raising fields to push away debris in space. So there's your lore proof. Look up 'mass effect fields' in the codex.

Just walk away from this debate while you still have your dignity.

[Sebbe1337o]

Contalion wrote...

As I understand it, mass effect field effectively break the laws of physics in such a way as to negate or reduce the mass of any object the field is in contact with....this is how FTL works despite the anti FTL theories of all our real world physicists.....no mass=no physical limits. This also works as a shield simply because any solid projectile fired at you would have its mass reduced to almost or absolute zero upon hitting the field....and zero mass=zero momentum=zero impact force. Intertia simply does not apply to objects without mass. As such, I don't think an object's speed would matter.....it's not the object's speed that generates impact or penetration power, it is it's momentum, and momentum is mass dependant.

That imo is actually the beauty of the Mass Effect galaxy.

[Sebbe1337o]

111987 wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Remember the shields that were blocking Shepard on Feros and Ilos in ME1? I do.

Also, the derelict Reaper had its barriers up so you couldn't leave until they were down.

Those are all examples of incorect use of lore material within the Narative, Kinetic barriers/shields are only designed for Damage protection for ships/vehicals and infantry, there are no such things as blocking forcefields within Mass Effect lore, those were just invented for gameplay purposes.

And how do you explain those about the normandy? you could just walk right through them

Your whole argument is just dismissing several examples of kinetic barriers deflecting things other than small, fast moving objects. You can't simply dismiss them; that's not how debates work. Also, someone posted a link to the codex saying star ships use mass raising fields to push away debris in space. So there's your lore proof. Look up 'mass effect fields' in the codex.

Just walk away from this debate while you still have your dignity.

lol, what dignity?

[Fixers0]

dreman9999 wrote...
..............
.... Nothing there states it can't stop slow moving objects. Just temperatures, toxins and radiation.
....In ME1 YOU HAVE TO GET LIARA OUT OF A BARRIER THAT SHE IS INCASED IN.... You can't walk through it, you go under it. And that is from ME1 that made the lore.
It not that the writers don't understand their own lore.....YOU GUYS DON'T UNDERSTAND.

As i said before both in Mass Effect 1 And Mass Effect 2 Lore material is used incorrectly for gameplay purposes, Also i have to add that we don't know how much Prothean Shields differ from the Standar shields

dreman9999 wrote...
How many time do we have to stay that soldier sheilds react to fast moving object because it a safety mechanism? Nothing state slow moving object can't be stopped by sheilds and even goes into detail about what can or can't.....And slow moving object is not on of them. Sheild can stop any object and have been shown to do so in ME1 and ME2. You can lean agenst geth barrier in ME1 in combat. You have to get around the barrier that traps liara. You have to turn the barrier the Geth turn off on Feros to move forward. And that all from ME1 THAT MADE THE LORE !!!
How can you noy understand this?

That's the same argument, it's just the wrong use of codex material.

[Fixers0]

111987 wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Remember the shields that were blocking Shepard on Feros and Ilos in ME1? I do.

Also, the derelict Reaper had its barriers up so you couldn't leave until they were down.

Those are all examples of incorect use of lore material within the Narative, Kinetic barriers/shields are only designed for Damage protection for ships/vehicals and infantry, there are no such things as blocking forcefields within Mass Effect lore, those were just invented for gameplay purposes.

And how do you explain those about the normandy? you could just walk right through them

Your whole argument is just dismissing several examples of kinetic barriers deflecting things other than small, fast moving objects. You can't simply dismiss them; that's not how debates work. Also, someone posted a link to the codex saying star ships use mass raising fields to push away debris in space. So there's your lore proof. Look up 'mass effect fields' in the codex.

Just walk away from this debate while you still have your dignity.

I don't doubt that a Ship's kinetic barriers would be able to deflect space debries.

I do doubt the writers ability to arrange their own lore,

Just compare the opening sequance to the arrival prison scene, they both have a kinetic barrier, but in the first example the player can walk through them and in the second the player can't. oh boy what's going on.

[Someone With Mass]

From the Codex:

A rush ensued as corporations and private individuals tried to strike it rich on Omega, and thieves and outlaws followed in their wake. As space became tight, construction of processing facilities extended vertically from the asteroid, creating Omega's jellyfish-like silhouette. To prevent future collisions, the station is ringed with enormous mass effect field generators that redirect incoming debris.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

The Hammer should have been able to just fly through it, same way as shepard walked right through joker through a shield in the opinion mission but for some reason could not walk through the shield during arrival/

It's again yet another incosistancy for gameplay convienance.

It's not a incosistency.

Shields can be adjusted. DEAL WITH IT.

This is what I was talking about in an earlier post. 

Smudboy and his ilk and his fanclub want to continue to hammer on Bioware and ME2. 

Explanations and nuance and the little details are just seen as taking away their hammers, and they don't want that. 

[Notlikeyoucare]

Stop trying to prove that a ship can deflect space debris we're past that already. The point is, it isn't consistent. As I've said earlier, Mass Effect Shields are just plot devices: they are what the plot needs them to be at any moment and nothing more, which is my problem.

[dreman9999]

Fixers0 wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

It's not a incosistency.

Shields can be adjusted. DEAL WITH IT.

Give me concrete proof from within the lore.

Repeat after me:
Conjecture is Bad.

Sheild boost from ME1.
http://masseffect.wi...or#Shield_Boost

Electronics from ME1.
http://masseffect.wi...iki/Electronics

Geth sheild boost.
http://masseffect.wi...th_Shield_Boost

Tech Armor.
http://masseffect.wi...wiki/Tech_Armor

Barrier from ME1 and ME2..
http://masseffect.wi...om/wiki/Barrier
.......

I couldg o on..

[Someone With Mass]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Stop trying to prove that a ship can deflect space debris we're past that already. The point is, it isn't consistent. As I've said earlier, Mass Effect Shields are just plot devices: they are what the plot needs them to be at any moment and nothing more, which is my problem.

Within certain limits. Which can make anything a plot device.

[Killjoy Cutter]

Someone With Mass wrote...

From the Codex:

A rush ensued as corporations and private individuals tried to strike it rich on Omega, and thieves and outlaws followed in their wake. As space became tight, construction of processing facilities extended vertically from the asteroid, creating Omega's jellyfish-like silhouette. To prevent future collisions, the station is ringed with enormous mass effect field generators that redirect incoming debris.

Why bother?  Any published game, codex, or extended media example that contradicts their pre-formed criticism of Bioware or the game is just "Bioware screwing up".

[Killjoy Cutter]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Stop trying to prove that a ship can deflect space debris we're past that already. The point is, it isn't consistent. As I've said earlier, Mass Effect Shields are just plot devices: they are what the plot needs them to be at any moment and nothing more, which is my problem.

I thought we'd moved on to demonstrating that they're tuneable  / adjustable... 

[Someone With Mass]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Why bother?  Any published game, codex, or extended media example that contradicts their pre-formed criticism of Bioware or the game is just "Bioware screwing up".

Ah. Right. What a shame.

I guess technology can never improve either. 

[Notlikeyoucare]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Fixers0 wrote...

The Hammer should have been able to just fly through it, same way as shepard walked right through joker through a shield in the opinion mission but for some reason could not walk through the shield during arrival/

It's again yet another incosistancy for gameplay convienance.

It's not a incosistency.

Shields can be adjusted. DEAL WITH IT.

This is what I was talking about in an earlier post. 

Smudboy and his ilk and his fanclub want to continue to hammer on Bioware and ME2. 

Explanations and nuance and the little details are just seen as taking away their hammers, and they don't want that. 

Bioware is one of my favourite developers, hence why I was disappointed with ME 2 since I felt they dropped the ball in a few areas, particularly the story. Don't make the mistake of lumping what Smudboy says and what others say and take it as a collective argument.

[Fixers0]

dreman9999 wrote...

Sheild boost from ME1.
http://masseffect.wi...or#Shield_Boost

Electronics from ME1.
http://masseffect.wi...iki/Electronics

Geth sheild boost.
http://masseffect.wi...th_Shield_Boost

Tech Armor.
http://masseffect.wi...wiki/Tech_Armor

Barrier from ME1 and ME2..
http://masseffect.wi...om/wiki/Barrier
.......

I couldg o on..

1.So what, you can boost your shields, that's some news.
2.How is this related.
3.It's Mass Effect 2
4.It's Mass effect 2
5.Biotic's

[dreman9999]

Fixers0 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
..............
.... Nothing there states it can't stop slow moving objects. Just temperatures, toxins and radiation.
....In ME1 YOU HAVE TO GET LIARA OUT OF A BARRIER THAT SHE IS INCASED IN.... You can't walk through it, you go under it. And that is from ME1 that made the lore.
It not that the writers don't understand their own lore.....YOU GUYS DON'T UNDERSTAND.

As i said before both in Mass Effect 1 And Mass Effect 2 Lore material is used incorrectly for gameplay purposes, Also i have to add that we don't know how much Prothean Shields differ from the Standar shields

dreman9999 wrote...
How many time do we have to stay that soldier sheilds react to fast moving object because it a safety mechanism? Nothing state slow moving object can't be stopped by sheilds and even goes into detail about what can or can't.....And slow moving object is not on of them. Sheild can stop any object and have been shown to do so in ME1 and ME2. You can lean agenst geth barrier in ME1 in combat. You have to get around the barrier that traps liara. You have to turn the barrier the Geth turn off on Feros to move forward. And that all from ME1 THAT MADE THE LORE !!!
How can you noy understand this?

That's the same argument, it's just the wrong use of codex material.

What a second.....You just call ME1 A RETCON? What's next your going to detur ME1 lore facts too as retcons.
You do realise the ME1 you what a sheild can and can't protect ageinst right?

It stated the following details of what it can't stop.http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Codex/Weapons,_Armor_and_Equipment#Kinetic_Barriers_.28.22Shields.22.29


The shielding afforded by kinetic barriers does not protect against extremes of temperature, toxins, or radiation.

.......
And you say you know the lore.
The very moment you stated ME1 is a retcon is the moment you shown you don't understand anything about the lore.

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

classic Fixers0,disagreeing just to disagree.

[Someone With Mass]

Fixers0 wrote...

1.So what, you can boost your shields, that's some news.
2.How is this related.
3.It's Mass Effect 2
4.It's Mass effect 2
5.Biotic's

Shield Boost existed in ME1.

Geth Shield Boost is not that different.

[dreman9999]

Fixers0 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Sheild boost from ME1.
http://masseffect.wi...or#Shield_Boost

Electronics from ME1.
http://masseffect.wi...iki/Electronics

Geth sheild boost.
http://masseffect.wi...th_Shield_Boost

Tech Armor.
http://masseffect.wi...wiki/Tech_Armor

Barrier from ME1 and ME2..
http://masseffect.wi...om/wiki/Barrier
.......

I couldg o on..

1.So what, you can boost your shields, that's some news.
2.How is this related.
3.It's Mass Effect 2
4.It's Mass effect 2
5.Biotic's

And you ask for proof that it can be done.  The fact you did not know this shows you don't know the lore.

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

dreman9999 wrote...

And you ask for proof that it can be done.  The fact you did not know this shows you don't know the lore.

Oh, I thought him calling everything he doesn't like or agree with a plot hole or retcon showed he didn't know the lore.