759 réponses à ce sujet

[Destroy Raiden_]

Ghost Warrior wrote...

.But even more importantly,everybody seems to be forgetting that it's BioWare's game,it's their right to put whatever they want. They can't cater to every group of people,and now I'm not just talking about religion. There has also been a number of threads like this based on sexual orientation,race,sex and whatnot. They can't represent every single culture in the world,they should be able to choose without people getting offended and accusing them of...well I don't know what anymore. You ARE NOT Shepard,deal with the fact that you can't control him 100%.

HA! But some players are in the camp of BW should represent everything!:happy: Just like some people think its great for government to do everything just because it could doesn't mean it should. BW with every give in is essentally taking themselves out of the game and whatever path they origionally wanted the game to go in could be getting lost w/o knowing the true script I can only guess on the later.  But looking at this from an artist perspective if you make a peice you think is great then you invite your friends, family, and strangers over and they all start saying change this, add this, you should change this color, or add that color, draw the lines more like this, and you start doing even just half of it the peice its no loner of you it's of them.

[Golden Owl]

MrSuperCrazyAwesome wrote...

While I agree that political correctness sometimes goes too far in this day and age, Ghost Warrior is wrong in his assertion that Christianity is the "biggest religion on the planet." Because political correctness and actual correctness are different things.

On topic: somebody said earlier that we don't get to see Shepard going to the bathroom or eating or sleeping, but we know that he it she does these things. If an individual wants to believe that their Shepard also prays, they can do that for sure. I like to imagine that my Shep plays guitar and is working on a solo album, but I'm not demanding that Shepard should be seen with a guitar singing about hockey, Shep's favourite sport. My point is that the Shepard we see will never be 100% the way we want him or her to be, but we can use *gasp* our imaginations to fill in blanks about our personal Shepard's personality and beliefs.

Your Shep plays the guitar too huh.......so does mine....

[Davie McG]

Ghost Warrior wrote...

MrSuperCrazyAwesome wrote...

While I agree that political correctness sometimes goes too far in this day and age, Ghost Warrior is wrong in his assertion that Christianity is the "biggest religion on the planet." Because political correctness and actual correctness are different things.

Then please correct me. I was pretty sure that christianity was the most represented religion.

On topic: somebody said earlier that we don't get to see Shepard going to the bathroom or eating or sleeping, but we know that he it she does these things. If an individual wants to believe that their Shepard also prays, they can do that for sure. I like to imagine that my Shep plays guitar and is working on a solo album, but I'm not demanding that Shepard should be seen with a guitar singing about hockey, Shep's favourite sport. My point is that the Shepard we see will never be 100% the way we want him or her to be, but we can use *gasp* our imaginations to fill in blanks about our personal Shepard's personality and beliefs.

I agree with that,some things should be left to imagination.

I wouldn't disagree that seeing Shepard praying is unecessary. However the fact that there is quite a lot of religion in Mass Effect is exactly that, a fact. Whether it's alien religions or otherwise there's quite a bit of it in Mass Effect, having a discussion about it isn't any more or less relevant than discussing whether you should let Ash shoot Wrex or whether or not you should keep the genophage data.

Shepard can state that he believes in God in Mass Effect 1. To expect him to talk about his faith after being brought back from the dead and facing galactic genocide isn't unreasonable. It's not being forced on anyone either in the same way that choosing to romance a character isn't forced upon the player nor is playing the game as a male or what class the player is.

This is a game of choice. Shepard can state where he stands on his religion, and people on here have every right to talk about it in a reasonable and respectful manner.

Saddly this thread may get locked because people are too immature to discuss religion.

I've stated my view already, that if it is brought up in game it should be brief, ambiguous and optional. As it was in the first Mass Effect.

[HiroVoid]

Personally, I would think the best way to initiate something like this would for there just not to be any dialogue options, and have Shepard do an animation movement like the one Thane made when he was praying. That way it's left up to the player who he's praying to, yet you still know he's praying.

[ZenJestr]

In my opinion, the difference between professing belief and performing a ritual specific to a belief is grand in terms of ambiguity. Shep was vague if you told Ash you were also a theist. However, prayer is a specific act, how you pray in one religion is different from the next. I really don't think there is an ambiguous prayer pose that can apply to every single religion ever...

tbh I would prefer another religion talk if Ash and/or Thane survives on your playthrough....but a prayer scene is too specific; it can't be veiled. If you show Shepard praying he has to do a specific type of prayer, which will alienate people who don't pray like that.

Modifié par ZenJestr, 29 août 2011 - 02:23 .

[Luvinn]

HiroVoid wrote...

Personally, I would think the best way to initiate something like this would for there just not to be any dialogue options, and have Shepard do an animation movement like the one Thane made when he was praying. That way it's left up to the player who he's praying to, yet you still know he's praying.

It kind of reminds me in DA:O, after the night in Redcliff fighting zombies. When the chantry priestess says a prayer you can either remain silent, or pick the dialogue (escapes me at the moment, seemed to be used in the same context as Amen). It wasn't a big option, but you could kind of put the RP in RPG

[AnAccountWithNoName]

Davie McG wrote...

Ghost Warrior wrote...

MrSuperCrazyAwesome wrote...

While I agree that political correctness sometimes goes too far in this day and age, Ghost Warrior is wrong in his assertion that Christianity is the "biggest religion on the planet." Because political correctness and actual correctness are different things.

Then please correct me. I was pretty sure that christianity was the most represented religion.

On topic: somebody said earlier that we don't get to see Shepard going to the bathroom or eating or sleeping, but we know that he it she does these things. If an individual wants to believe that their Shepard also prays, they can do that for sure. I like to imagine that my Shep plays guitar and is working on a solo album, but I'm not demanding that Shepard should be seen with a guitar singing about hockey, Shep's favourite sport. My point is that the Shepard we see will never be 100% the way we want him or her to be, but we can use *gasp* our imaginations to fill in blanks about our personal Shepard's personality and beliefs.

I agree with that,some things should be left to imagination.

I wouldn't disagree that seeing Shepard praying is unecessary. However the fact that there is quite a lot of religion in Mass Effect is exactly that, a fact. Whether it's alien religions or otherwise there's quite a bit of it in Mass Effect, having a discussion about it isn't any more or less relevant than discussing whether you should let Ash shoot Wrex or whether or not you should keep the genophage data.

Shepard can state that he believes in God in Mass Effect 1. To expect him to talk about his faith after being brought back from the dead and facing galactic genocide isn't unreasonable. It's not being forced on anyone either in the same way that choosing to romance a character isn't forced upon the player nor is playing the game as a male or what class the player is.

This is a game of choice. Shepard can state where he stands on his religion, and people on here have every right to talk about it in a reasonable and respectful manner.

Saddly this thread may get locked because people are too immature to discuss religion.

I've stated my view already, that if it is brought up in game it should be brief, ambiguous and optional. As it was in the first Mass Effect.

Ya being brought back from the dead should really affect someone of faith.  It would be interestinf how a religious shepard would think of it.  Would Shepard think that perhaps s/he doesn't really have a soul it it was just mankind that brought her/him back (since i think people of faith believe that humanity does not have control of the soul, though i could be wrong)  And God had nothing to do with it?  Or would s/he think that perhaps God did have a hand in his/her resurrection?  Would being brought back from the dead strengthen or weaken his/her faith?

[bucyrus5000]

Are we ignoring the cost preventative nature of game design? Fully rounding out the everyday goings on of an individuals life, such as Sheppard, costs BW money they will need to recuperate by increasing the cost of the game to the player. BW could always bring the idea to a marketing focus group to see how much people will pay for a praying DLC, but assuming of all the people that want a praying DLC, only 50% would be willing to pay an extra $20 for it, it may be a loss for the company. Even it it is a win, do we want to see the dev group waste time on a praying DLC, eating DLC, sleeping DLC, or pooping DLC?

Modifié par bucyrus5000, 29 août 2011 - 02:26 .

[Davie McG]

HiroVoid wrote...

Personally, I would think the best way to initiate something like this would for there just not to be any dialogue options, and have Shepard do an animation movement like the one Thane made when he was praying. That way it's left up to the player who he's praying to, yet you still know he's praying.

Then your taking away peoples option whether or not they want there Shepard to believe in god. Shepard can also state in mass effect one he thinks religion is a lot of rubbish and he doesn't want it on his ship (if memory serves).

[Golden Owl]

bucyrus5000 wrote...

Are we ignoring the cost preventative nature of game design? Fully rounding out the everyday goings on of an individuals life, such as Sheppard, costs BW money they will need to recuperate by increasing the cost of the game to the player. BW could always bring the idea to a marketing focus group to see how much people will pay for a praying DLC, but assuming of all the people that want a praying DLC, only 50% would be willing to pay an extra $20 for it, it may be a loss for the company. Even it it is a win, do we want to see the dev group waste time on a praying DLC, eating DLC, sleeping DLC, or pooping DLC?

Someones actually suggested a Sims like DLC before....in the ME2 threads...eating, toilet, showering, etc...S/he got shouted down fast.

[HiroVoid]

ZenJestr wrote...

In my opinion, the difference between professing belief and performing a ritual specific to a belief is grand in terms of ambiguity. Shep was vague if you told Ash you were also a theist. However, prayer is a specific act, how you pray in one religion is different from the next. I really don't think there is an ambiguous prayer pose that can apply to every single religion ever...

tbh I would prefer another religion talk if Ash and/or Thane survives on your playthrough....but a prayer scene is too specific; it can't be veiled. If you show Shepard praying he has to do a specific type of prayer, which will alienate people who don't pray like that.

This is pretty much why I said just go with the Thane animation.  It just seemed like a prayer animation that is wide enough to cover a good bit of religions with a quick prayer since I'm imagining this situation being on the ship, and I doubt Mess Sergeant Gardner has an occupation as a priest as well for the religoins that require a priest.

Then your taking away peoples option whether or not they want there
Shepard to believe in god. Shepard can also state in mass effect one he
thinks religion is a lot of rubbish and he doesn't want it on his ship
(if memory serves).

Sorry.  I could've been more specific.  The dialogue wheel would still state something like [pray].  It'll just have brackets around it to indicate it's an action, and when Shepard's praying, there's no dialogue.  It can even black out the scene for a bit for players to use their imaginations a bit more.

Modifié par HiroVoid, 29 août 2011 - 02:32 .

[ZenJestr]

bucyrus5000 wrote...

Are we ignoring the cost preventative nature of game design? Fully rounding out the everyday goings on of an individuals life, such as Sheppard, costs BW money they will need to recuperate by increasing the cost of the game to the player. BW could always bring the idea to a marketing focus group to see how much people will pay for a praying DLC, but assuming of all the people that want a praying DLC, only 50% would be willing to pay an extra $20 for it, it may be a loss for the company. Even it it is a win, do we want to see the dev group waste time on a praying DLC, eating DLC, sleeping DLC, or pooping DLC?

My canon Shepard has type 1 diabetes...I want insulin injection DLC or bust...and when his blood sugar gets low from too much exercise and not enough meals...I need to bust out a little juice box of OJ and drink dat **** on the field like a bawss WITH A BENDY STRAW!

Modifié par ZenJestr, 29 août 2011 - 02:30 .

[Luvinn]

ZenJestr wrote...

My canon Shepard has type 1 diabetes...I want insulin injection DLC or bust...and when his blood sugar gets low from too much exercise and not enough meals...I need to bust out a little juice box of OJ and drink dat **** on the field like a bawss WITH A BENDY STRAW!

Rofl! I could picture Shep doing advertisements for a discount at a med store. "Hello, I'm commander sheperd, and i have DIABEETUS"

[jbblue05]

ZenJestr wrote...

bucyrus5000 wrote...

Are we ignoring the cost preventative nature of game design? Fully rounding out the everyday goings on of an individuals life, such as Sheppard, costs BW money they will need to recuperate by increasing the cost of the game to the player. BW could always bring the idea to a marketing focus group to see how much people will pay for a praying DLC, but assuming of all the people that want a praying DLC, only 50% would be willing to pay an extra $20 for it, it may be a loss for the company. Even it it is a win, do we want to see the dev group waste time on a praying DLC, eating DLC, sleeping DLC, or pooping DLC?

My canon Shepard has type 1 diabetes...I want insulin injection DLC or bust...and when his blood sugar gets low from too much exercise and not enough meals...I need to bust out a little juice box of OJ and drink dat **** on the field like a bawss WITH A BENDY STRAW!

My Shepard has narcolepsy.  I want him to fall asleep in the middle of battles and important conversations.

[Golden Owl]

jbblue05 wrote...

ZenJestr wrote...

bucyrus5000 wrote...

Are we ignoring the cost preventative nature of game design? Fully rounding out the everyday goings on of an individuals life, such as Sheppard, costs BW money they will need to recuperate by increasing the cost of the game to the player. BW could always bring the idea to a marketing focus group to see how much people will pay for a praying DLC, but assuming of all the people that want a praying DLC, only 50% would be willing to pay an extra $20 for it, it may be a loss for the company. Even it it is a win, do we want to see the dev group waste time on a praying DLC, eating DLC, sleeping DLC, or pooping DLC?

My canon Shepard has type 1 diabetes...I want insulin injection DLC or bust...and when his blood sugar gets low from too much exercise and not enough meals...I need to bust out a little juice box of OJ and drink dat **** on the field like a bawss WITH A BENDY STRAW!

My Shepard has narcolepsy.  I want him to fall asleep in the middle of battles and important conversations.

I knew a young girl who had that....and it hit her whilst she was in a public pool...she was lucky to live, stopped breathing, heart stopped pumping, etc...fast action didn't save her from brain damage though...poor kid.

[DRUNK_CANADIAN]

Add religion, our religious like behavior, don't identify the religion/religions belonged to though.

Great idea.

Plus on the topic of homosexuality, they are a much much much much much smaller portion of society relative to those with religious beliefs...actually I think there are more people that identify themselves as religious than there are who don't, especially on the global scale.

[medcsu]

Praying has NO place in this game. It is a stupid idea that I cannot believe has produced 15 pages worth of commentary.

Seriously, PRAYING? Absolute most ridiculous idea I have ever seen suggested here. I would much rather have Shepard be able to surf on Virmire rather then a "pray" option. Serves no point at all.

[Rockworm503]

Cheesy Blue wrote...

I'm an Atheist. I find that extremely offensive.

I'm a chicken-platapyus and I find this extremely offensive.

[ZenJestr]

Rockworm503 wrote...

Cheesy Blue wrote...

I'm an Atheist. I find that extremely offensive.

I'm a chicken-platapyus and I find this extremely offensive.

he was trolling, he admitted it...also you misspelled my favorite animal: platypus....unless they're too mainstream for you and just went ahead and made-up your own animal

Modifié par ZenJestr, 29 août 2011 - 02:56 .

[Rockworm503]

Dave of Canada wrote...

No.

If you'd like to imagine Shepard praying, imagine him/her doing it off-screen.

BAH thats lazy writing.  If I have to imagine a millisecond of offscreen stuff than I'm doing the writer's job

[Anacronian Stryx]

I don't think praying would work.

But they could do something like Shepard pondering what happened with his/her soul when he/she was dead for two years if the player chose to be religious in me 1.

[Frank0605]

Im ok with it is a self choice like same sex marriage i'm a Christian and i find that offensive.

[Rockworm503]

medcsu wrote...

Praying in the Mass Effect series.....

Worst idea ever to be set forth. Just utterly the worst ever.

I am the biggest Atheist you'll ever meet... Hate religion in all its forms and even I think this is close-minded and 

[DRUNK_CANADIAN]

medcsu wrote...

Praying has NO place in this game. It is a stupid idea that I cannot believe has produced 15 pages worth of commentary.

Seriously, PRAYING? Absolute most ridiculous idea I have ever seen suggested here. I would much rather have Shepard be able to surf on Virmire rather then a "pray" option. Serves no point at all.

Right and suddenly changing Shepard's sexual preference/orientation totally doesn't have the same effect.

Giving a religious background to the character in terms of dialogue and behavior makes it more personalized experience. Frankly this choice is more logical than the SS debate one, I can't see logically why this one wasn't within the game in the first place. Many human beings are religious, this is logical to include.

[AnAccountWithNoName]

DRUNK_CANADIAN wrote...

medcsu wrote...

Praying has NO place in this game. It is a stupid idea that I cannot believe has produced 15 pages worth of commentary.

Seriously, PRAYING? Absolute most ridiculous idea I have ever seen suggested here. I would much rather have Shepard be able to surf on Virmire rather then a "pray" option. Serves no point at all.

Right and suddenly changing Shepard's sexual preference/orientation totally doesn't have the same effect.

Giving a religious background to the character in terms of dialogue and behavior makes it more personalized experience. Frankly this choice is more logical than the SS debate one, I can't see logically why this one wasn't within the game in the first place. Many human beings are religious, this is logical to include.

QFT