759 réponses à ce sujet

[mjb203]

111987 wrote...

mjb203 wrote...

Made Nightwing wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

The Twilight God wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

Last I checked, Athiests don't kill for their beliefs. So you can scratch the 'militant' term, flyingwalrus.

Saddam Hussien, the Chinese government, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao, etc. A lack of belief in a deity has never stopped man from being man. Even from an atheistic view, there being no god, religion is inherently the work of man and mankind itself is responsible for it. Ergo, religion is is poor scapegoat as it is the human condition that results in suffering, not an invisible man in the sky. It's like saying capitalism is the cause of wars. Capitalism is just an institution that reflects man's nature.

Religion is one of the most effective mediums for dogma, submision to authority, and belief without proof. Call it the human condition if you want. 

Most religions also encourage justice, the right of every individual to life and liberty, the pursuit of personal peace and enlightenment. The Inquisition also set the standard for modern day legal trials, by requiring the burden of proof to be on the prosecution, not on the defendant. (Also a good thing for poor old ladies accused of witchcraft. Instead of being 'Tried by Water', they could declare a minor heresy, be tried by the Inquisition, fined and then released.)

Religion has inspired beautiful works of art. It has inspired works of amazing (and insane) acts of courage and defiance in the face of oppression, and sets a moral and ethical standard for people to live by. Religion isn't a bad thing at all.

This pretty much.  Also, whether or not this thread was started as a serious topic or not, prayer could easily be included by making it a silent prayer, which would be satisfactory for religiousSheps of any religion.

Buddhists do not pray. it's easier and a lot less controversial to just not include religion. And really, does it really add much to the games? A relationship does, but a prayer?

You could easily interpret it as meditation for any BuddhistSheps.  You know, since it's silent.  And like a lot of the s/s supporters argue, if you don't like it, don't choose that dialogue option.

[mjb203]

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

Bluko wrote...

sympathy4saren wrote...

Just putting it out there for discussion:

Why is it ok to express all sides of sexual orientation but not all sides of religious or non-religious belief?

Because there's basically only 3 sexual orientations one can be. You'er either Straight, Bi, or Gay. Sure your preferences may have a lot more variation then that, but ultimately there's only 3 ways to go about things. Only the opposites, only the same, or some of both. Well there's also none at all if you so choose. So at most you have 4 options, which is pretty easy to implement given that the romances really have no effect on the actual story progression itself.

In a way, you could simplify it fairly well.

Muslum, Christian, and Jewish:  "Help us, God. We need it." This could be said right before the final battle, staring up at whatever it will be.

"I know we can do this. The Way is stronger than the greatest chaos/darkness." --Very impromptu idea for something like Hinduism and Buddhism. I don't know particularly much about either so I really can't elaborate.

"All you weirdos who believe in the invisible boogeyman, now's where you get on your knees and weep." --an impromptu version for atheists.

There are five sections on the dialog wheel, with the default one being just to head straight into the fight. I think it could MAYBE be done.

Excellent breakdown for choices on the dialogue wheel.  I think that would pretty much cover all the bases.

[111987]

mjb203 wrote...

111987 wrote...

mjb203 wrote...

Made Nightwing wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

The Twilight God wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

Last I checked, Athiests don't kill for their beliefs. So you can scratch the 'militant' term, flyingwalrus.

Saddam Hussien, the Chinese government, Stalin, Pol Pot, Mao, etc. A lack of belief in a deity has never stopped man from being man. Even from an atheistic view, there being no god, religion is inherently the work of man and mankind itself is responsible for it. Ergo, religion is is poor scapegoat as it is the human condition that results in suffering, not an invisible man in the sky. It's like saying capitalism is the cause of wars. Capitalism is just an institution that reflects man's nature.

Religion is one of the most effective mediums for dogma, submision to authority, and belief without proof. Call it the human condition if you want. 

Most religions also encourage justice, the right of every individual to life and liberty, the pursuit of personal peace and enlightenment. The Inquisition also set the standard for modern day legal trials, by requiring the burden of proof to be on the prosecution, not on the defendant. (Also a good thing for poor old ladies accused of witchcraft. Instead of being 'Tried by Water', they could declare a minor heresy, be tried by the Inquisition, fined and then released.)

Religion has inspired beautiful works of art. It has inspired works of amazing (and insane) acts of courage and defiance in the face of oppression, and sets a moral and ethical standard for people to live by. Religion isn't a bad thing at all.

This pretty much.  Also, whether or not this thread was started as a serious topic or not, prayer could easily be included by making it a silent prayer, which would be satisfactory for religiousSheps of any religion.

Buddhists do not pray. it's easier and a lot less controversial to just not include religion. And really, does it really add much to the games? A relationship does, but a prayer?

You could easily interpret it as meditation for any BuddhistSheps.  You know, since it's silent.  And like a lot of the s/s supporters argue, if you don't like it, don't choose that dialogue option.

True. As long as the Buddhist isn't kneeling with his/her hands clasped and is sitting in the correct position, there's no problem with that. Good idea

[Made Nightwing]

'Yo Bredren, we gunna smoke dem Reapas!'-Rastafarian option.

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

Modifié par sH0tgUn jUliA, 30 août 2011 - 03:13 .

[S.A.K]

111987 wrote...

Buddhists do not pray. it's easier and a lot less controversial to just not include religion. And really, does it really add much to the games? A relationship does, but a prayer?

Thats right we don't pray(I am buddhist). It will be a bad idea to include religion ingame. Frankly I don't have any problem if shepard is shown to be christian or something because I am not very religious. But there might be fans who are offended by it. So its better to keep it out.
Btw I thought religious talk isn't allowed on BSN.:innocent:

[Sundance31us]

Blacklash93 wrote...
Now you're just being silly.

Comparing a sick fetish to a sexual orientation (between consenting adults) is a plain fallacy.

I don't consider necrophilia, pedophilia and bestiality to be fetishes, nor do I consider the persons who practice them to be part of the other orientations listed.

[J-Sheridan]

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

Bluko wrote...

sympathy4saren wrote...

Just putting it out there for discussion:

Why is it ok to express all sides of sexual orientation but not all sides of religious or non-religious belief?

Because there's basically only 3 sexual orientations one can be. You'er either Straight, Bi, or Gay. Sure your preferences may have a lot more variation then that, but ultimately there's only 3 ways to go about things. Only the opposites, only the same, or some of both. Well there's also none at all if you so choose. So at most you have 4 options, which is pretty easy to implement given that the romances really have no effect on the actual story progression itself.

In a way, you could simplify it fairly well.

Muslum, Christian, and Jewish:  "Help us, God. We need it." This could be said right before the final battle, staring up at whatever it will be.

"I know we can do this. The Way is stronger than the greatest chaos/darkness." --Very impromptu idea for something like Hinduism and Buddhism. I don't know particularly much about either so I really can't elaborate.

"All you weirdos who believe in the invisible boogeyman, now's where you get on your knees and weep." --an impromptu version for atheists.

There are five sections on the dialog wheel, with the default one being just to head straight into the fight. I think it could MAYBE be done.

Now, which one of those is going to be Paragon and which one is going to be Renegade.

Seems rather obvious which one you would make paragon since you framed it with such nice bias.

[Made Nightwing]

*Comment I was responding to was removed.*

Modifié par Made Nightwing, 30 août 2011 - 03:16 .

[mjb203]

[quote]111987 wrote...

[quote]mjb203 wrote...

[quote]111987 wrote...

[/quote]

Buddhists do not pray. it's easier and a lot less controversial to just not include religion. And really, does it really add much to the games? A relationship does, but a prayer?

[/quote]

You could easily interpret it as meditation for any BuddhistSheps.  You know, since it's silent.  And like a lot of the s/s supporters argue, if you don't like it, don't choose that dialogue option.[/quote]

True. As long as the Buddhist isn't kneeling with his/her hands clasped and is sitting in the correct position, there's no problem with that. Good idea

[/quote]

Well, a simple kneel would be good for any religion I'd imagine.  It's a simple way of conveying the idea that one has a religiousShep, like the "there's no athiest in a foxhole" comment from Shep in ME1 without having to get in the specifics of which religion Shep would belong to.

[Davie McG]

Cephalopods wrote...

Quite frankly, Ashley Williams and anyone else in ME who believes in a sentient, non-corporeal omnipotent energy is not of sound mind. Hundreds of worlds with extraterrestrial life, and the machine Reapers who have harvested them for millions of years, utterly and completely destroy theism's credibility. Religion in the universe of Mass Effect is, quite frankly, defunct and a sign of denial-based insanity.

Not entirely, Catholics can believe in science. But this is besides the point and way off topic. Religion is a part of mass effect. It was in Mass Effect 1 and was much more prominent in 2. Not to mention theirs a massive amount of religious symbolism in the game. Thane is religious, Mordin is religious, Ash is religious, the hanar are religious, the turians are religious, the Asari are religious, the batarians even seem religious.

Shepard can state whether or not he believes in a god. He and his crew (some of whom are religious) are going through what could well be described as an apocalypse. To seriously expect none of this to be brought up in Mass Effect 3 is a little unrealistic.

[Sundance31us]

S.A.K wrote...
Btw I thought religious talk isn't allowed on BSN.:innocent:

[Made Nightwing]

Davie McG wrote...

Cephalopods wrote...

Quite frankly, Ashley Williams and anyone else in ME who believes in a sentient, non-corporeal omnipotent energy is not of sound mind. Hundreds of worlds with extraterrestrial life, and the machine Reapers who have harvested them for millions of years, utterly and completely destroy theism's credibility. Religion in the universe of Mass Effect is, quite frankly, defunct and a sign of denial-based insanity.

Not entirely, Catholics can believe in science. But this is besides the point and way off topic. Religion is a part of mass effect. It was in Mass Effect 1 and was much more prominent in 2. Not to mention theirs a massive amount of religious symbolism in the game. Thane is religious, Mordin is religious, Ash is religious, the hanar are religious, the turians are religious, the Asari are religious, the batarians even seem religious.

Shepard can state whether or not he believes in a god. He and his crew (some of whom are religious) are going through what could well be described as an apocalypse. To seriously expect none of this to be brought up in Mass Effect 3 is a little unrealistic.

Not only that, the general opinion of most priests and College of Cardinals is that, being an infinite universe, it's more than likely that there is other life out there. Alien life is certainly not incompatible with theism.

[Gorosaur]

General Question: Since when was the expression of a characters beliefs considered offensive?


Also, why is Ashley called a Bible thumper? She speaks like three lines about God in the entire game and she's labeled as a racist and a religious bigot.

[slimgrin]

Davie McG wrote...

Not entirely, Catholics can believe in science. 

Not without some serious mental dissonance.

[mjb203]

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

S.A.K wrote...

111987 wrote...

Buddhists do not pray. it's easier and a lot less controversial to just not include religion. And really, does it really add much to the games? A relationship does, but a prayer?

Thats right we don't pray(I am buddhist). It will be a bad idea to include religion ingame. Frankly I don't have any problem if shepard is shown to be christian or something because I am not very religious. But there might be fans who are offended by it. So its better to keep it out.
Btw I thought religious talk isn't allowed on BSN.:innocent:

I think that's more about people comparing religions and insulting, not about implementing it in the game. I'm certain there's at least one mod watching over us with a wary eye.

You're right EternalAmbiguity.  Rule #2 for the boards:
---
No slander. Insults, language, belittling of others or anything else deemed offense will be deleted without warning if considered unacceptable by an official Moderator or member of BioWare/Electronic Arts staff. Content that is insulting to anyone based on gender, lifestyle, religion, ethic group, race etc. is unacceptable and will be deleted without warning. A person or persons found to repeatedly slander others may be banned from these forums at the discretion of the staff.
---

As long as we keep it related to in game implementation and don't start flaming and insulting each other, we should be fine.

[Volus Warlord]

This sums up the thread pretty nicely:

[Cephalopods]

@ Shotgun Amen sista

Religion serves no good. It has been the cause of more war, death, and intolerance than any other factor. This is a fact that cannot be denied, numbers do not lie.

Then again, its common courtesy for the religious to ignore evidence and facts in favor of thoughtless, baseless faith.

Psalm 23: The lord is my Shepard. Oh, the irony. For a Shepard does not protect his flock out of kindness nor love. Sheep are watched so they may be prepared for the slaughter, kept ignorant of their true fate. The lord is thy Shepard, and thou art his sacrifice.

[Quole]

Gorosaur wrote...

General Question: Since when was the expression of a characters beliefs considered offensive?


Also, why is Ashley called a Bible thumper? She speaks like three lines about God in the entire game and she's labeled as a racist and a religious bigot.

Why are you even talking to us? Register some games and maybe you will get taken seriously.

Modifié par Quole, 30 août 2011 - 03:21 .

[Made Nightwing]

slimgrin wrote...

Davie McG wrote...

Not entirely, Catholics can believe in science. 

Not without some serious mental dissonance.

Commonly held false truth = that being religious excludes you from scientific research. No mental dissonance required, just a hunger for knowledge about the world God put us in.

[Gorosaur]

slimgrin wrote...

Davie McG wrote...

Not entirely, Catholics can believe in science. 

Not without some serious mental dissonance.

Eh. I'm Catholic. I enjoy sci-fi, subscribe to Nature, and hold scientific discussions with my friends. Funny how stereotyped religious people are these days. 

[Gorosaur]

Quole wrote...

Gorosaur wrote...

General Question: Since when was the expression of a characters beliefs considered offensive?


Also, why is Ashley called a Bible thumper? She speaks like three lines about God in the entire game and she's labeled as a racist and a religious bigot.

Why are you even talking to us? Register some games and maybe you will get taken seriously.

So now we're elitist too huh? Pretty cool. I just haven't bothered to register games. Don't really see the benefit outside of the LOOKY WHAT I PLAYED aspect of this site.