110 réponses à ce sujet

[sympathy4saren]

The game is still in development and there are no doubt a lot of wrinkles to work out. It is, however, worth keeping an eye on.

It does beg to question: is faster gameplay flow for those who run and gun influencing and causing compromise to animation movement?

[el master pr]

More than 6 months to release dude. They need to polish the gameplay, that's all.

[CARL_DF90]

Ahem. Judging a product still so far from release is nonsense.

[hawkens982]

VeR0se wrote...

 I was so excited to see the new combat reveal, and then when I actually watched it, I thought, wth has bioware done to my Mass Effect?

It's very clunky and glitchy, I understand it's a combat reveal but even the gun animations were bad. Or did Shepard suddenly gain the ability to have a floating gun?

Link:

Hmmmm the only thing I found glitch or cluncky is the way the weapons dont actually bobble(? think this is the correct term) when sheppard was moving near the beginning of the trailer, it feels like the weapon was dragging sheppard forward or something. Also the way that sheppard is moving while not sprinting, it feels like he has hardly any animation at all.

Otherwise everything seems fine to me.

[sedrikhcain]

Hathur wrote...


Running / walking unfortunately has been exceedingly problematic in Mass Effect since part 2... it was riddled with problems / weirdness and seems ME3 will have its share of it as well. Shame too because the running and walking animations in ME1 were fluid and quite natural looking in comparion. I'm guessing all the new armor model designs in ME2 / ME3 really messed up the skeletal rigging and they never could get the movement animation to look half as good as ME1 did.

Do you have a link to some video with an example of this? Because I don't know what you're talking about. The only problem I've had with walking or running animations in either game is the way Shep twists his/her head and neck around unnaturally in the direction of nearby crew members when walking/running past them on the Normandy.

[Gatt9]

jojon2se wrote...

It MAY partly be a side effect of the incremental speeding up of combat, between episodes.

If you want instant response to player input, there is no time for animation transitions, like the relatively smooth and natural ones in ME1, so you get the wierd movements, with skips and sudden tempo changes and "magical momentum".

I'm sure it's hard to strike a good balance between flow in motion and flow in responsiveness -- the player can easily direct Shepard in a way that would make him/her trip, if not given the time, or situational alternative animation of equal duration; to adjust footing.

That's actually not the problem,  pushing through the computer changes in inertia,  skeletal physics,  and other such data isn't much of a problem for either the 360 or the PC,  even though the 360's hardware is generations old it's got 3 cores and a tightly bound GPU,  the bandwidth and processing power is available.

The problem is the animators.  It requires you to implement a transition animation for each possible action,   it's a huge increase in money/time.

The other problem is potentially the engine,  since Bioware's essentially got 0 experience with Shooters,  there's a very real chance that the engine team just didn't think of it when they wrote the code and that changing it to accomidate Shooter gamplay is beyond the scope of the project.  I'd venture this is where most of the problem lies.

[robarcool]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

TALK A LOT DURING COMBAT: THE GAME

Because Duke Nukem Forever was not proof enough that characters that try too hard at being cool end up... well... not cool at all.

"GARRUS! HIDE BEHIND THE BOXES!"
"OKAY SHEPARD! I'M HIDING BEHIND THOSE BOXES NOW!"
"WHEN I TELL YOU TO SHOOT AT THEM YOU WILL SHOOT AT THEM LIARA!"
"OKAY SHEPARD! I'M ON IT NOW!"

I seen that somewhere...

I loled!

[Alock1a]

That is kinda painful to watch.

[VeR0se]

CARL_DF90 wrote...

Ahem. Judging a product still so far from release is nonsense.

AGAIN, don't release something if it's not as polished as it should be. You want to attract consumers not make them turn their heads and go, wtf is this?

Alock1a wrote...

That is kinda painful to watch.

At least you see it. :3

Modifié par VeR0se, 29 août 2011 - 05:35 .

[Gravity Bun]

It's not finished yet.
It's like pulling a cake out of the oven and complaining because the hot, sticky cake mix doesn't taste like cake.

[NotSoIllusiveMan]

Gravity Bun wrote...

It's not finished yet.
It's like pulling a cake out of the oven and complaining because the hot, sticky cake mix doesn't taste like cake.

Then why showing it when it's not finished? Some animations really look weird. And why always showing the same thing? You know: ATLAS, Cerberus Soldiers... I want to see Reapers and husks (our MAIN enemy...). 

[LGTX]

Showing the same thing by making it look different is good marketing, which gives the illusion of fresh media but doesn't spoil anything new.

They show WIP material because THAT'S THE ONLY THING THEY CAN SHOW. Even the music and the Atlas landing sequence were dragged in from other videos and previous games.

[NotSoIllusiveMan]

Yeah I know. I don't want any spoilers. But Cerberus is really getting boring.

[sedrikhcain]

VeR0se wrote...

CARL_DF90 wrote...

Ahem. Judging a product still so far from release is nonsense.

AGAIN, don't release something if it's not as polished as it should be. You want to attract consumers not make them turn their heads and go, wtf is this?


[

That's a fair critique of ME3's marketing but it's not a justification for asserting that the game is going to be awful because you saw a trailer that wasn't up to snuff 7 or 8 months before release.

[Hathur]

They're (Bioware) is damned if they do.. damned if they don't.

Leading up to ME2's release, people (like me) got annoyed / upset because they let loose some pretty big spoilers - from locations to story, etc... they revealed / showed a lot more than they probably should have - and the community voiced this complaint.

Now for ME3, they're showing just a small segment and recycling it over and over, probably out of fear / concern to repeating what they did with ME2 (showed off too much prior to release).. so they're being conservative / cautious this time around.

But now this upsets a whole new group of people... the impatient, people who MUST see something new every week leading right up to release.

I for one am more than happy if they show us nothing more than what they have so far right up to release and just keep re-showing the same stuff (I have no interest in re-watching the same stuff - but they showed us a couple nice tidbits and that will tide me over until release).

[jojon2se]

Gatt9 wrote...

jojon2se wrote...

It MAY partly be a side effect of the incremental speeding up of combat, between episodes.

If you want instant response to player input, there is no time for animation transitions, like the relatively smooth and natural ones in ME1, so you get the wierd movements, with skips and sudden tempo changes and "magical momentum".

I'm sure it's hard to strike a good balance between flow in motion and flow in responsiveness -- the player can easily direct Shepard in a way that would make him/her trip, if not given the time, or situational alternative animation of equal duration; to adjust footing.

That's actually not the problem,  pushing through the computer changes in inertia,  skeletal physics,  and other such data isn't much of a problem for either the 360 or the PC,  even though the 360's hardware is generations old it's got 3 cores and a tightly bound GPU,  the bandwidth and processing power is available.

The problem is the animators.  It requires you to implement a transition animation for each possible action,   it's a huge increase in money/time.

The other problem is potentially the engine,  since Bioware's essentially got 0 experience with Shooters,  there's a very real chance that the engine team just didn't think of it when they wrote the code and that changing it to accomidate Shooter gamplay is beyond the scope of the project.  I'd venture this is where most of the problem lies.

Umm... I fail to see how you inferred my saying anything whatsoever about processing load. If it's the comment about momentum, that does not refer to physics simulation, but just the common sense impression of the viewer.

As you say and as I said; it's the headache of the animators and the animation logic system programmers.

(Ok; so our character is running to the left and the player prompts it to roll
right.
Given our new sped up gameplay target, will the player be pissed off
with us if we allow time for the character to realistically stop and turn its momentum
around?
Do we let it put its preferred foot ahead before rolling, or do we make one righthanded rolling animation and one lefthanded/diving alternative, where the character adjusts to circumstances?
Etc, etc...)

For ME1, Bioware actually proudly beat their chests about how seemlessly it mostly worked -- ME2, all the way to the finished product, lost that.


About marketing... There is so much time to go, that I can't help but to wonder if the constant barrage will make the world be completely: "meh", when the game is finally released to the market and wish someone would rein David in a little.

[Luigitornado]

It just looks like some shoddy editing work: note how it jumps to squad back to commander Shepard. IMO it should not even have been edited. Also if the commander is more vocal in the game during combat...then fine...but it seems like it was just thrown in there.

[Reptillius]

Truthfully if you look at what's going on here. They did a pretty good job overall. Would you rather they waste hours or days polishing this up when people wanted new material and they wanted to give the fans something new to see?

Or spend that time on the real game?

Because honestly. This would be hard to polish up for just about anybody... You have what looks to be game play from 3 different classes plus cinematic sequences to all try and link together into something that looks good.

And for anybody that's not sitting on these forums day in and day out and taking every single piece of footage that they release and analyzing it practically in slow motion second by second and frame by frame this trailer is going to look good even with a few inconsistancies. There is only one that truely may stand out to most casual observers and that is the gun change. But when you go from Engineer, to what looks like Infiltrator footage, to engineer, to soldier game footage and then toss in a bunch of hard set cinematics all into one trailor that is made for Con-Crowds that are looking for early release work and not necessarily super polished finish work game release time work... They did a good job.

Modifié par Reptillius, 29 août 2011 - 02:06 .

[TheMakoMaster]

most shooters (yeah im calling it that) don't look that great outside of first person or third person view. look at overhead view replays of halo or call of duty battles. pretty clunky. doesn't seem that way while your playing though.

Modifié par TheMakoMaster, 29 août 2011 - 02:10 .

[Dyorgarel Inkin]

The worst Mass effect trailer I've ever seen. I agree with the op. And that Shepard and teammates who can not stop talking... mon dieu... "Shut up for christ's sake!"

I puked

[davidshooter]

The banter actually is more worrisome to me than the animations- I find it really bad.

Also, I've seen quite a few enemy rolls in the footage so far, both Cerberus and Geth. I can take or leave Shep rolling but if this whole game looks like I'm storming a Cirque du Soleil compound I'm going to be disappointed.

I love this series, and I really hope things get better on the combat front, but so far I'm kinda underwhelmed

[ODST 3]

Yeah that trailer was crap. Looked no better than Mass Effect 2.

I don't really care if the big machine can pick up Liara now, unless it means she dies and stays dead. But no, she gets her spine snapped and is back on her feet after a quick Medi Gel.

[Brenon Holmes]

I don't think that video is that representative... looks like an old build, and I'm not really sure about some of the stuff in there, for example henchmen don't talk that much.

Some of those cuts look like they're from a cutscene from a different area of the game.

[shepskisaac]

Brenon Holmes wrote...

of those cuts look like they're from a cutscene from a different area of the game.

That's what we thought This Cerberus fight doesn't actually happen on Mars does it? It was copied from Sur'Kesh right?

[Fiery Phoenix]

I found Garrus' animations to be awkward. Really hope this gets reworked a little before launch.