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[Monica21]

RagingCyclone wrote...
..... and the singular racial makeup of DA is odd to me and a bit unrealistic. But I also understand that might just be my perception of the world. In either case I like that Isabela was designed like she is.

More of a singular ethnic makeup, but people in this thread seem to be using the two interchangeably so maybe I'm splitting hairs. Anyway, I don't find it unrealistic if only because Thedas seems to be a representation of medieval Europe. There are foreign merchants in trade cities, but not enough to change the ethnic makeup of a city or region. There just isn't enough travel by regular people for that. We never really got significant numbers of different races and ethnicities until travelling long distances became more common.

And Rivain is a peninsula just east of Antiva. The island of Llomerynn is just south, but it's not a country of islands.

[RagingCyclone]

Monica21 wrote...

RagingCyclone wrote...
..... and the singular racial makeup of DA is odd to me and a bit unrealistic. But I also understand that might just be my perception of the world. In either case I like that Isabela was designed like she is.

More of a singular ethnic makeup, but people in this thread seem to be using the two interchangeably so maybe I'm splitting hairs. Anyway, I don't find it unrealistic if only because Thedas seems to be a representation of medieval Europe. There are foreign merchants in trade cities, but not enough to change the ethnic makeup of a city or region. There just isn't enough travel by regular people for that. We never really got significant numbers of different races and ethnicities until travelling long distances became more common.

And Rivain is a peninsula just east of Antiva. The island of Llomerynn is just south, but it's not a country of islands.

Like I said it may just be my percerption, but it seemed odd to me in a fantasy world with the introduction of elves, dwarves, and qunari that humans would remain ethnically singular, or for that matter also the other races in the game.

And thanks for clarifying Rivain. I wasn't sure.

[Gnaeus Trebonius]

RagingCyclone wrote...


Being from "across the pond" * I like that* in America I think how those perceptions are also depends on what part of the US you are located. Midwesterners *like myself* view people differently than those on either coast, Southerners have a differnt view than the other three, and so do those who live in the upper western mountain states. But no matter where in the US there is a mixture of skins tones and races. So while the OP may be right in what they think is catering, I feel it's necessary. I was raised to be "color blind" when dealing with people, and one of the first mods I made for Origins was to add people of color into my game. I dont live in a one racial area but instead one with multiple races, and the singular racial makeup of DA is odd to me and a bit unrealistic. But I also understand that might just be my perception of the world. In either case I like that Isabela was designed like she is.

Thank you for the clarification! I've only visited the US once and that time I stuck to NYC, but I'm aware that there are cultural and political differences based on geography. But one thing I noticed about the New Yorkers was that they often clarified their ethinicity like: "I'm American, of Irish/Tunisian/Italian descent", but never "...of English descent". That's probably why I'm stuck with the definition that the WASPs are the "real" Americans.
Regarding the racial makeup of Thedas I feel quite the opposite actually, but I can understand how you americans want a fantasy world that reflects your own.

Modifié par Gnaeus Trebonius, 31 août 2011 - 03:29 .

[Monica21]

RagingCyclone wrote...
Like I said it may just be my percerption, but it seemed odd to me in a fantasy world with the introduction of elves, dwarves, and qunari that humans would remain ethnically singular, or for that matter also the other races in the game.

I'm not sure what you mean. Just on the technical side it's easier not to have half-race models because then you have that many more models you have to make. Dwarves mostly keep to themselves and have no interest in marrying humans, and humans probably have no interest in marrying dwarves. And it's been established that an elven-human child will be human. There are probably a lot of these than we know because we don't know who the parents are.

And Europe is pretty much a singularly ethnic area. You don't get into darker skin tones until you get into south-eastern Europe, and even then it's a crapshoot.

[RagingCyclone]

@Monica21, I don't mean intermingling of the species. I'll use the dwarves as an example, with the exception of Kal Shirok, the only dwarves remaining are on the surface, in Orzammar, or serving with the Legions of the Dead. So while I can accept humans being ethnically singular to a point (mostly of white complexion) I cannot understand why the dwarves follow the same pattern. Nor the elves who were enslaved, freed, and then split when the exalted march fell upon the Dales. I would think the elves would also have more variety in skin complexion than what was there. So while I can see Europe being a model for the humans, when the game adds more races than humans as those you see and interact with, the singularity in skin complexion is strange to me. Again it may just be my perception. (on the record I am of Irish decent with some Portuguese and Native American thrown in as well, the latter being a very small percentage.)

[Big I]

With regards to DA2 breaking down gender stereotypes, one of the things I've always liked about the Dragon Age IP is Andraste being a woman, along with all of the Chantry clerics. To me it always seemed like a great way of having a measure of gender equality in the world without compromising the "medieval" nature of the IP.

[Maconbar]

RagingCyclone wrote...

@Monica21, I don't mean intermingling of the species. I'll use the dwarves as an example, with the exception of Kal Shirok, the only dwarves remaining are on the surface, in Orzammar, or serving with the Legions of the Dead. So while I can accept humans being ethnically singular to a point (mostly of white complexion) I cannot understand why the dwarves follow the same pattern. Nor the elves who were enslaved, freed, and then split when the exalted march fell upon the Dales. I would think the elves would also have more variety in skin complexion than what was there. So while I can see Europe being a model for the humans, when the game adds more races than humans as those you see and interact with, the singularity in skin complexion is strange to me. Again it may just be my perception. (on the record I am of Irish decent with some Portuguese and Native American thrown in as well, the latter being a very small percentage.)

But we are still looking just at one continent. Maybe there is more diversity among elves once we consider other continents. If Thedas is relatively isolated then a lack of genetic diversity wouldn't be unexpected.

[RagingCyclone]

Maconbar, true if you leave out the lore that all the elves gathered in the Dales. Then were scattered afterwards. Same for the dwarves in only the opposite, they were scattered, and fled to Orzammar trying to flee the darkspawn. If you ignore parts or all of the lore of DA then I can understand it. But to each their own. It's just something I find very odd.

[Gnaeus Trebonius]

LookingGlass93 wrote...

With regards to DA2 breaking down gender stereotypes, one of the things I've always liked about the Dragon Age IP is Andraste being a woman, along with all of the Chantry clerics. To me it always seemed like a great way of having a measure of gender equality in the world without compromising the "medieval" nature of the IP.

It's also kind of funny how the Tevinter Imperium, who really comes off as the baddies, have their own male patriarchial "anti-pope" as opposed to the Divine in Val Royeaux. If they ever play a major part in a DA game I have a feeling I'll end up supporting them.

RagingCyclone wrote...

Maconbar, true if you leave out the lore that all the elves gathered in the Dales. Then were scattered afterwards. Same for the dwarves in only the opposite, they were scattered, and fled to Orzammar trying to flee the darkspawn. If you ignore parts or all of the lore of DA then I can understand it. But to each their own. It's just something I find very odd.

If you, like me, think the elves resemble the jews in medieval europe it makes sense that they're racially homogeneous. The difference in physical appearance between ashke**** , khazars and sephardic jews isn't exactly striking, in my oppinion. And apart from Sammy Davis Jr. there aren't many black jews, are there?

Modifié par Gnaeus Trebonius, 31 août 2011 - 05:02 .

[Monica21]

RagingCyclone wrote...

@Monica21, I don't mean intermingling of the species. I'll use the dwarves as an example, with the exception of Kal Shirok, the only dwarves remaining are on the surface, in Orzammar, or serving with the Legions of the Dead. So while I can accept humans being ethnically singular to a point (mostly of white complexion) I cannot understand why the dwarves follow the same pattern. Nor the elves who were enslaved, freed, and then split when the exalted march fell upon the Dales. I would think the elves would also have more variety in skin complexion than what was there. So while I can see Europe being a model for the humans, when the game adds more races than humans as those you see and interact with, the singularity in skin complexion is strange to me. Again it may just be my perception. (on the record I am of Irish decent with some Portuguese and Native American thrown in as well, the latter being a very small percentage.)

Surface dwarves are still kind of a rarity, but becoming less so. It takes a very very long time to change hereditary skin patterns, and really, dwarves should all be pale because they live underground. If you look at it from an evolutionary point of view dark-skinned dwarves should be incredibly rare. If you have generations upon generations of surface dwarves in Rivain, then they'll have naturally darker skin tones, but for now, the way they're represented in DA doesn't bother me.

And the elves I think are a bit of a different case. Their heritage is a bit ethereal and we know next to nothing about them, just as they know next to nothing about them. The elves perhaps should be genetically diverse, but again, that may just have to be chalked up to "fantasy world" rather than strictly biologic.

[Monica21]

Gnaeus Trebonius wrote...
And apart from Sammy Davis Jr. there aren't many black jews, are there?

Sure, if they converted. Like Sammy Davis, Jr.

[RagingCyclone]

@Gnaeus, it's probably because I live the US, but I see the elves more akin to Native American Indians especially around the turn of the 20th century. The city elves being those that lived on reservations and the Dalish being those living outside similar to Geronimo and his tribe before his surrender.

@Monica, I can accept that for the elves. The dwarves is a little more muddled because if I use the evolutionary pattern, then they should also be extremely light sensitive and almost blind on the surface due to very few light sources underground.

[Sepewrath]

Well no, because they do have plenty of light underground from fires and the magma, things that live in perpetual darkness are the ones who would be sensitive to light. Like the mole people from old cartoons lol. When it comes to skin colors, Monica is right, there should be no Dwarves with dark skin, because that is design to protect from the sun, something they don't have to worry about. It would take a long time for surface Dwarves even to develop a dark skinned variant, they would be tanned at best.

Elves from what we know about their society should all be cousins lol. I mean they live in small groups as even tens of thousands is considered small on the genetic level. A couple dozen generations and everyone is related, the Dalish clans are even smaller, even if they regularly trade people among clans, genetic diversity would be sparse.

Humans would be the group with the most genetic diversity, since they can spread anywhere they want and are in a large abundance.