19 réponses à ce sujet

[spartacusthegod]

 This is for both ME1 and ME2.  Mass Effect 1, for my Soldier, Throw or Warp seemed to be the best extra ability, to add a bit extra control or to decrease damage resistance.  For my Sentinel though (going with the Medic specialization) I gave him the Assault Rifle training at the start of the game.  My Sentinel ended up being my most effective playthrough, giving him the Assault Rifle was great since Sentinels can't have the maxed out Marksman ability.

For Mass Effect 2, however, I've got a few different things.  For my Vanguard, I gave him Energy Drain (upgraded to the area effect) so he can deal with shields.  He already has Incendiary Ammo, and Warp takes care of Barriers as well, so giving him something to deal with Shields as well makes perfect sense.  Also, both Energy Drain and Charge increase your shields, which is never a bad thing.

My Adept has Slam (mainly because it fits), but she normally plays on a lower difficulty anyways, just for fun.

I have two Soldiers though, one with Armor Piercing Ammo (upgraded to Squad ammo) and the other has Geth Shield Boost, and the Shield Boost is going to end up going to Improved to give a damage bonus as well.  AP gets the Widow, Shield Boost gets the Revenant and Hardened Adrenaline Rush instead of Heightened (which is what the Widow gets).

What do you think about these builds?  Any ideas for possible tweaks?

Feel free to list your own bonus power uses, I'm curious to see what other people are using.

[thisisme8]

Energy Drain can round an Adept out if you feel like you are weak vs. shields. Surprisingly, and it may sound like you're duplicating your efforts, but it also goes well with the Sentinel - making him an unstoppable tank.

Engineers can benefit the most from Reave if you don't mind sacrificing Incinerate - Dominate can be fun on them too. That way you'll have a power for all defense types.

The Soldier, Vanguard, and Infiltrator kits are so good, I can never find myself getting a bonus power on them since their class power is so awesome. Shields low on your Vanguard? Charge. Enemies still breathing on your Soldier? Adrenaline Rush. Enemies shooting at you with your Infiltrator? Cloak and clean up.

Notice the other common ability on those 3? Cryo Ammo. Pure awesomeness.

[FemShep 4 President]

spartacusthegod wrote...

 This is for both ME1 and ME2.  Mass Effect 1, for my Soldier, Throw or Warp seemed to be the best extra ability, to add a bit extra control or to decrease damage resistance.  For my Sentinel though (going with the Medic specialization) I gave him the Assault Rifle training at the start of the game.  My Sentinel ended up being my most effective playthrough, giving him the Assault Rifle was great since Sentinels can't have the maxed out Marksman ability.

For Mass Effect 2, however, I've got a few different things.  For my Vanguard, I gave him Energy Drain (upgraded to the area effect) so he can deal with shields.  He already has Incendiary Ammo, and Warp takes care of Barriers as well, so giving him something to deal with Shields as well makes perfect sense.  Also, both Energy Drain and Charge increase your shields, which is never a bad thing.

My Adept has Slam (mainly because it fits), but she normally plays on a lower difficulty anyways, just for fun.

I have two Soldiers though, one with Armor Piercing Ammo (upgraded to Squad ammo) and the other has Geth Shield Boost, and the Shield Boost is going to end up going to Improved to give a damage bonus as well.  AP gets the Widow, Shield Boost gets the Revenant and Hardened Adrenaline Rush instead of Heightened (which is what the Widow gets).

What do you think about these builds?  Any ideas for possible tweaks?

Feel free to list your own bonus power uses, I'm curious to see what other people are using.

I like Stasis, for many of the classes. It may not be the 'correct' bonus power to take, but I think it's pretty cool.

I use it with my Vanguard, and find that it can give me crucial breathing space when I charge into a few more enemies than I can handle. The other thing about Stasis, is that I find that it almost works better with at level 1 or 2, rather than level 3 or 4. So it's quite 'efficient' in that you don't need or want to max it out for it to be useful.

For the biotic classes I can see the attraction of Energy Drain, and I used it with my Adept. But it's a little boring.

I've messed with barrier in the past, but I think that its a bit of a waste.

I tend to pick bonus powers that look and feel fun, not necessarily the most logical ones. Therefore I like to play with  dominate, and used it with my Insanity Soldier. I also like to have fun with Inferno & Flashbang Grenades.

I think Warp Ammo is generally regarded as one of the most sensible choices, irrespective of what class you play as - especially if you max it out to squad warp ammo. But it isn't much fun. Yeah you kill people with bullets quicker - but its not as cool as brainwashing your enemies into killing each other.

Slam can be quite fun, but its effectively 'duplicated' by other powers, that I rarely use it.

[spartacusthegod]

The vanguard has cryo ammo? I thought they only had Incendiary? I know Soldiers have both, and the Infiltrator has cryo, but I don't recall the Vanguard having cryo... although it's still an amazing power if you have enough debuff on your squad.

My Sentinel playthrough will definitely have Energy Drain (as if he doesn't have enough buff-power already. When I do an Engineer, I don't know what I'll give him for a bonus power... maybe Stasis, just for the hell of it.

Infiltrator I gave Armor Piercing ammo to, that with the Widow was what got me through the survival part of the Arrival DLC.

[spartacusthegod]

FemShep 4 President wrote...
*logical thoughts*

I agree, sometimes it can be boring.  Vanguard is just too much fun though, even though mine has Energy Drain on it, I rarely use it unless I kick the difficulty up to Hardcore or Insanity.

Playing on Normal or even Veteran, using abilities for fun is absolutely the best thing to do.  It makes the game what it's supposed to be: a GAME.

Insanity though, good lord that's a challenge if you're not used to it.  My Soldier with the Revenant is doing everything differently from every single other Soldier I've made, and it's my first serious attempt at an Insanity playthrough for ME2 as well.  It's quite interesting so far... but idk how this is going to end up on the harder Insanity parts, like the Arrival DLC... 

[mredders91]

ive found stasis to be great for adept can be used even if enemy is protect, cause them to drop to the floor when its done and great damage bonus

for vanguard i would says it between ether area energy drain or area reave personly i think reave is the better pick give you more options than energy drain

Infiltrator is ether nerual shock to stun enemys for easy head shots AP ammo for extra kick for flashbangs to uterly nerf everyone it hits

[ryoldschool]

On ap ammo on a soldier, just had a thread about this

Geth Shield Boost - the descriptions says the weapon damage bonus only holds until the shields are broken, which is not long on insanity.  I've not had much luck with it when I've tried it.

Stasis is good on any class.  Lets you handle Ymir mechs, Insta-kills flying turrets ( like the ones on Freedom's Progress, LotSB, and Overlord ) and is priceless for the collector ship trap to kill a Scion.  I put either neural shock or slam ( 1 point ) on soldier for Horizon or Reaper IFF for husk killing.

Modifié par ryoldschool, 04 septembre 2011 - 02:25 .

[Xariann]

thisisme8 wrote...

Energy Drain can round an Adept out if you feel like you are weak vs. shields. Surprisingly, and it may sound like you're duplicating your efforts, but it also goes well with the Sentinel - making him an unstoppable tank.

I agree on both counts. Funny how much criticism I got when I talked about ED on Adept some time back.

About Sentinel, since Tech Armor stays up as long as your shields are up, ED helps a lot with that. Although I often just want to refresh regardless to get the power reset on my companions. I pretty much felt Sentinel had a lot of playground in terms of what bonus skills to use in general. 

[capn233]

Haven't played all the classes...

As a soldier I used AP ammo. Messed around with other ones. 0pts in bonus power as a Soldier is totally doable though, maybe even the best for a pure soldier. Flashbang can be useful if you know how to use it.

Infiltrator - used AP ammo. Flashbang, again, is not bad.

Sentinel - AP ammo again. Wanted to boost the sad weapon damage the class has. Has Warp and Overload to deal with barrier and shields. Messed around with stasis a little though.  As far as energy drain... the Sentinel is nearly invincible just by spamming tech armor... plus you reset your squad's powers when you do that.  So I didn't really feel the need.

Vanguard - I just started this. I took slam. I only have points in incendiary, charge, passive and slam at this point. I like slam because it neutralizes an enemy for a short time, and it has a fast cooldown. Plus it is fun to chain it after pull... was nice on Mordin's recruitment mission to pull the Vorcha off the ledge, then slam them from way up in the air. I was real close to using energy drain for anti-shield though. Only have 1 point in it... wanted something ok at only 1 pt so I could go for charge and passive quickly.

Modifié par capn233, 04 septembre 2011 - 03:32 .

[spartacusthegod]

Ah, I haven't fully evolved it yet (still about a level 14) I never knew that about the shield boost.

The AP Soldier was for a normal-difficulty playthrough, when it's maxed at Tungsten ammo I normally only end up using two shots to drop someone's health, NOT using Adrenaline Rush.

I think I might end up replacing the shield boost with Stasis then, for the other soldier. Something besides Geth Shield Boost, I guess. Hell, may as well ditch the Disruptor ammo and just go for Energy Drain instead, that could work too. Still gives me a buff, but it's offensive as well, and has a shorter cooldown than the shield boost.

Then again... insta-killing the flying turrets on LotSB and such would be very nice...

[capn233]

Yeah... I don't like protection bonus powers on the soldier either because the cooldown takes forever. Energy drain isn't terrible though since it is so rapid. I don't think it necessarily replaces a disruptor ammo though. I guess it depends on how you want to play. I prefer to basically just use adrenaline rush on the soldier as much as possible, with clutch concussive shots if I am in a bind. If I am on a synthetic heavy mission, I would prefer just to take two squadmates with overload (eg Miranda + Garrus) as well as the disruptor ammo.

Stasis works out alright if used judiciously. Makes enemies fall to the ground when it wears off so you can get some bonus damage in. As far as LOTSB... Liara is a squad mate and she has stasis. Granted, you can lock down the turrets faster with 2x stais, but they aren't that bad anyway. There are never more than 3 at a time if I recall correctly (2 at a time in the Vasir fight, waves of 3 in the unlock door part on the exterior of the ship). I just did that mission the other day with my Sentinel. I had heavy overload, so that helped, but you can easily just wait for Liara to cooldown to stasis them in order.

In the end, just pick what you want though since Soldier is pretty well rounded to begin with. If I do another one some time I might go with flashbang though.

[spartacusthegod]

Flashbang might be my choice for a random thing, it fits with the theme of a Shock Trooper anyways.

Then again, it's a soldier. It's not meant to have powers or anything, it's meant to blow everything up. The Soldier in Mass Effect does what the Engineer from TF2 says to do: Use more gun.

So then, what would fit with that idea for a soldier, hmm?

[Doriath]

ME1 (perpective as a veteran difficulty player)

Adept - Assault Rifles
Why? pistols take 5 points in basic armor to unlock, for a total 17 points to get master marksmen, which is easily better than master overkill with all the bonus achievements unlocked, but if you rate basic armor/shield boost as low as I do (especially for any class that has barrier or immunity), then that extra 5 points is more useful elsewhere, notably in the early game.

Engineer - Barrier
Why? No inherent lifesaver ability (I do not rate shield boost or the higher shield cap from electronics to be on the same level as barrier/immunity). If you don't take barrier you're relying on your shields to absorb all damage and while the engineer can become a fantastic support/squad medic character, I don't like to run the risk of heavy or prolonged combat where my shields are my first line of defense.

Infiltrator - Lift
Why? The only thing the infiltrator does not have to start with is legitimate crowd control. Lift can solve this, and you don't suffer too much from the lack of a bio amp because even advanced lift has a long enough duration to serve its purpose.

Sentinel - Assault Rifles
Why? This class can never get higher than base level marksmen with pistols so you probably want a weapon you can put 12 points of buff into, otherwise a much higher percentage of your damage has to come from your powers. Not saying you can't go with singularity instead and do just fine, but I prefer to have a full 12 points into the weapon of my choice for every class.

Soldier - Lift
Why? Like the Infiltrator, this class also lacks built-in crowd control. Just as a side note, I rate Lift a little higher than Singularity as a crowd control option for classes without a bio amp because it lasts a little longer than singularity with a nearly unnoticeably smaller AoE. The added duration is better for finishing with weapons fire than effecting a slightly larger radius in my opinion.

Vanguard - Singularity
Why? Reinforces the main combat strategy of the class, which is crowd control + close range weapons fire and you don't suffer from the lack of a bio amp so this fits in nicely. That much crowd control + adrenaline rush gives the vanguard probably the best battlefield control in the game.

ME2 (perspective as an insanity difficulty player)

Adept - Energy Drain
Why? No built-in way of dealing with shields. If you have a power to strip every defense, your biotics can take effect sooner. That leads to more biotic combinations which leads to more damage done without firing a shot. Considering this is the truest 'caster' class in the game, this is important in my opinion. Plus, there are almost as many shielded enemies in the game as there are armored, and the secondary effect can provide some degree of a legitimate defensive buff if combined with shield boosting armor pieces.

Engineer - Reave
Why? Combined with an attack drone, you gain a significant enough boost to against barriers that you now have that defense covered. It also is, in my opinion, a little better than incinerate because it hits instantly (which I prefer). I don't know how the damage levels compare, but I can tell you that if it deals less to armor than incinerate, its not much. Taking Reave as your anti-barrier option also frees up points to max cryo blast, which further adds to the control ability of the engineer (cryo's freeze, combat drone's high priority & reave's leach effect).

Infiltrator - Reave (note: I play more of a control-style infiltrator than the traditional pure damage dealer)
Why? Without this or wap ammo, you have no dedicated power to deal with barriers. Because I prefer a controller build, reave is better for me because I can forgo incinerate (which is annoying to cast while in sniper zoom...yes, I do that sometimes) and because the leach effect can set up an easy headshot as opposed to cloak + reaction shot. Because reave can handle my weakness to barriers and fill the role of incinerate, it allows me to take squad cryo ammo, which is a central part of my control-style infiltrator.

Sentinel - Reave
Why? Oh look, reave again...what delightful variety. Because I play max evo characters, I don't like using warp because it forces me to spend points in throw. That plus I don't use biotic combinations on my sentinel due to the aggressive playstyle I use with this class. Using Reave as a replacement for warp allows for maxed out cyro blast as well, which is great for the class that has probably the most efficient defense stripping in the game.

Soldier - Slam/Neural Shock
Why? Now the truth is, I really don't use it very often and its not by any means an integral part of my build (I only put one point in it), but slam works nicely with squad cryo ammo to thin the herd a bit and most importantly, it doesn't blok me from using adrenaline burst for any significant amount of time (which I view as 5 or more seconds). Neural shock does basically the same thing, so they are pretty much interchangeable.

Vanguard - Slam
Why? Doesn't block you from charging, combines nicely with squad cryo ammo, and crippling evo can just add to the amount of incap enemies on the battlefield allowing safer charges and more isolated targets. A lot of people prefer reave, but I don't like the cooldown time cutting into your ability to charge for that long, as the vanguard is about timing ability use more than any other class in my opinion.

[Quething]

I can't say anything about ME2 that others haven't said before and better, but folks don't talk about ME1 much so I'll throw my two cents in.

I agree with chrisnabal on Sentinels and Vanguards. The Singularity Vanguard is a mainstay for a reason, and a Sentinel simply doesn't need anything else (plus it's nice to have a second gun on hand when facing enemy engineers).

Infiltrators, though, to round out the hybrid classes, I think benefit most from AI Hacking. Like the Singularity Vanguard, it gives them every important skill from their caster side while retaining medium armor and Immunity. Plus, you want that cooldown improvement. A good omni-tool and a maxed AI Hacking and you don't even need the second med exo to cast as fast as you can hotkey.

Soldiers, I like giving Electronics to. Tech mines are nice for a quick shield-strip or AoE when you need it - even against unshielded organics - and the shield boost makes you that much more tanky, but mostly it means you can hack stuff, which allows you to use Garrus as your tech guy in the early game when all he can manage is Decrypt.

Adepts can carry Decryption or Electronics for similar reasons (Decryption is fun for an all-biotic party, letting Liara take up the Electronics slack), but generally I give mine assault rifles; they're a pretty complete class already in terms of powers, and it's good to have at least two guns in case you get Sabotaged.

Engineers probably do benefit most from Barrier, and are less self-sufficient than Adepts or Sentinels in terms of powers, but as a lore purist myself, I consider "lore purity" a legitimate component of the "best power" question, so I often also default to assault rifles or shotguns for them, if only on the strength of "nothing else fits lore-wise" and "being Sabotaged sucks."

Modifié par Quething, 04 septembre 2011 - 08:00 .

[turian councilor Knockout]

ME 2:
Adept- Stasis good C&C and enemy lockdown ability.
Vanguard- Reave, Very useful lockdown and health boosting ability in tough situations
Sentinel- Ammo power, cause it's the only thing they lack or energy drain to replenish their shields.
Soldier- i'm personally very fond of flashbang cause it's disables enemy weapons and biotics.
Infiltrator, geth shield or ammo power, more durabilty never hurts.
Engineer, Ammo power or energy drain.

Modifié par turian councilor Knockout, 04 septembre 2011 - 09:21 .

[Bozorgmehr 2.0]

I'm not a big fan of giving Biotic or Tech skills to classes that should not be able to use them. No Stasis Soldiers for me, nor Energy Drain Adepts, or Reave Engineers.

Soldier - no bonus power needed, I'd take Warp Ammo or Inferno/Flashbang grenades.

Infiltrator and Engineer - Energy Drain (for Geth missions only), Neural Shock for everything else.

Sentinel - already have all they need plus the option to reset squad cooldowns with their Tech Armor, Stasis helps to speed up YMIR killing but isn't needed.

Vanguard - Slam for the early parts and when I'm not going to invest points in Pull; with Pull and Shockwave I'd go for Stasis.

Adept - Stasis, no question (should have been an Adept exclusive power at release IMHO), Barrier is also nice and looks cool.

[Xariann]

The point of bonus powers is to allow classes to get additional skills. It just makes you play with a lot of variation. There's nothing wrong with using what Bioware wants you to use. It's not like you re modding the game to get extra powers.

If you decide to not use them it's your choice and I think it's awesome that the game allows you to have the choice to use certain skills. Makes for interesting replaying.

So many Adepts are using shotguns (others use Assault Rifles). But Adept doesn't have the ability to use those as default. Infiltrator doesn't either. In ME 1 it was the same, you get bonus powers/weapons that weren't in the original class, what's wrong with picking one that helps you where you are lacking?

And yes, Stasis... Liara has it, but they didn't give it to the Shep Adepts. Meanies :<

Modifié par Xariann, 04 septembre 2011 - 01:23 .

[Simbacca]

ME1:
Soldier - Singularity or Lift
Vanguard - Singularity
Adept - Weapon or Decryption
Sentinel - Singularity or Weapon
Engineer - Singularity (or Barrier if you just want to make a weaker version of the Infiltrator)
Infiltrator - AI Hacking

ME2:
Soldier - a 1pt wonder (Slam, Neural Shock, or Stasis)
Vanguard - Slam or Stasis
Adept - Stasis or Barrier
Sentinel - Energy Drain
Engineer - Neural Shock
Infiltrator - Neural Shock or Heavy Warp Ammo

Just my personal opinion though, there are many capable variations.

Modifié par Simbacca, 04 septembre 2011 - 05:56 .

[spartacusthegod]

My goodness, I just realized what putting Electronics on a Soldier would do, I never thought about the shield boost when I was building a character in ME1. Overload lowers damage resistance in the first game as well, that would work beautifully with a Soldier.

Infiltrators having Lift is just hilarious in my opinion, I agree with how it's effective besides making it easy and entertaining to snipe people.

ME2 though, personally I think Energy Drain works great with a Vanguard. It buffs your max shields for a little bit as well, making something like Heavy Charge even more effective. Plus, it gives you something extra against shields, and the Vanguard already has Incendiary Ammo as well to take care of armor. Most shotguns have a base 1.5X damage against barriers anyways, they're quite good at stripping defenses (especially the charged shot for the Geth shotgun). I would personally use the Mattock and the Geth Plasma Shotgun, instead of getting the Claymore, because the Claymore actually has decreased damage against shield and barrier, instead it has 1.25X increased damage against all types of protection, instead of just two.

A friend of mine was doing Arrival as a Sentinel with Stasis and Shotguns, on Insanity. It was surprising how easily he was doing it, and NOT because of the Tech Armor. The knockdown at the end of Stasis is amazingly useful, because while enemies are ragdolled (under the effects of biotics and knocked down or floating, something like that) they take an extra 100% damage as well. Shotguns with Stasis or Singularity is amazing, personally.