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Some Paragon Choices Should Backfire


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#251
Notlikeyoucare

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sorentoft wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

GodWood wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...
Do the math. One queen lays one egg per day. ONE.

365 * 3 =/= a million.

Where you pulling this information from?

Because the codex says

They are said to be able to lay an egg every few hours, resulting in an entire rachni colony within days.

Sorry, I read wrong.

Well. If we convert 'every few hours' into 1 egg per 2 hours all we have to do is add 12 to the equation.

365 * 12 * 3 = 13140

So to get a million you would need around 100 queens all laying eggs 24/7 (probably more as the new queens has less time to reproduce). Or 297 more years for the single queen (a bit less than 297, but I am just rounding it to 10.000 for the sake of making it easy). That is not taking deaths into account either.


And what stops the Queen from breeding more Queens and breeding more Rachni?

#252
Bozorgmehr 2.0

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azerSheppard wrote...

Agreed, if you shot the last 3 guys that lied to you, you should have the option to say as much.


Indeed. A Shepard who chose to save the workers during Zaeed's loyalty mission might influence the way other "terrorists" view Shep. They may not take Shepard's threats too seriously knowing (s)he has shown to value the life of innocents over taking out "terrorists". A Shepard who didn't care about innocents in the past would be a lot more frightning and intimidating in the eyes of ruthless criminals.

#253
sorentoft

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Notlikeyoucare wrote...

sorentoft wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

GodWood wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...
Do the math. One queen lays one egg per day. ONE.

365 * 3 =/= a million.

Where you pulling this information from?

Because the codex says

They are said to be able to lay an egg every few hours, resulting in an entire rachni colony within days.

Sorry, I read wrong.

Well. If we convert 'every few hours' into 1 egg per 2 hours all we have to do is add 12 to the equation.

365 * 12 * 3 = 13140

So to get a million you would need around 100 queens all laying eggs 24/7 (probably more as the new queens has less time to reproduce). Or 297 more years for the single queen (a bit less than 297, but I am just rounding it to 10.000 for the sake of making it easy). That is not taking deaths into account either.


And what stops the Queen from breeding more Queens and breeding more Rachni?

Read the text below the equation. Nothing stops it, I am actually just giving a number of how many queens are needed.

Aside from that, we do of course have the question of resources and food for the Rachni, but in any case I have my doubts that the population will near that of any other race in ME3, but do think there will certainly be new queens that may or may not have been indoctrinated. I do not think all of the queens should have to be indoctrinated though.

Modifié par sorentoft, 06 septembre 2011 - 01:43 .


#254
Someone With Mass

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Well, if the rachni can reproduce at such a fast rate, how come the krogans were able to kill all their queens and then wipe them all out?

#255
Notlikeyoucare

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sorentoft wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

sorentoft wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

GodWood wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...
Do the math. One queen lays one egg per day. ONE.

365 * 3 =/= a million.

Where you pulling this information from?

Because the codex says

They are said to be able to lay an egg every few hours, resulting in an entire rachni colony within days.

Sorry, I read wrong.

Well. If we convert 'every few hours' into 1 egg per 2 hours all we have to do is add 12 to the equation.

365 * 12 * 3 = 13140

So to get a million you would need around 100 queens all laying eggs 24/7 (probably more as the new queens has less time to reproduce). Or 297 more years for the single queen (a bit less than 297, but I am just rounding it to 10.000 for the sake of making it easy). That is not taking deaths into account either.


And what stops the Queen from breeding more Queens and breeding more Rachni?

Read the text below the equation. Nothing stops it, I am actually just giving a number of how many queens are needed.


Ah, sorry I misread your post.

#256
Notlikeyoucare

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Someone With Mass wrote...

Well, if the rachni can reproduce at such a fast rate, how come the krogans were able to kill all their queens and then wipe them all out?


Because "Prior to the genophage, krogan could reproduce and mature at an astonishing rate."

#257
Lotion Soronarr

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KotorEffect3 wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...
Yes because project Overlord went so well without any trouble, oh wait.  Also reaper tech=indocrtination.  Indoctrination is bad.   

bub


Really? EDI indoctrianted us so badly... as did the Thanix.... And the Relay network!


The relay network led us to the citadel and the citadel is a trap.


You said INDOCTRINATE.  I ask where do you see indoctriantion there?

#258
Someone With Mass

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Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Well, if the rachni can reproduce at such a fast rate, how come the krogans were able to kill all their queens and then wipe them all out?


Because "Prior to the genophage, krogan could reproduce and mature at an astonishing rate."


If the krogans have a even higher birth rate than the rachni, then the rachni won't be much of a problem if they turn out to be indoctrinated.

Modifié par Someone With Mass, 06 septembre 2011 - 01:51 .


#259
sorentoft

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Someone With Mass wrote...

Well, if the rachni can reproduce at such a fast rate, how come the krogans were able to kill all their queens and then wipe them all out?

Krogans are really good fighters - in fact their entire culture is built around war, I assume they are especially good against the Rachni because most of the Rachni attacks seems based on biology, not technology. Krogans have adapted to a world where everything wants to eat them. It seems like the perfect counter to the Rachni, especially with Salarians tech and Turian military expertise backing them up.

#260
Lotion Soronarr

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Kaiser Shepard wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Kaiser Shepard wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

And Cerberus isn't a hive mind that if you indoctrinate a queen, EVERY LAST MEMBER OF THE ENTIRE RACE gets indoctrinated too.

Arguable; independent cells might be able to go rogue, but the organisation as a whole is only able to function with the Illusive Queen at its head.


And yet indoctrinating him doesn't automaticly indoctrinate everyoen else.
And Cerberus doesn't have millions of operatives.

Not automatically, but seeing as how he is the undisputed, sole figure of authority in Cerberus I don't see anyone non-Lazarus willing to go against his orders, unless said orders would very obviously counter human progression.

And while Cerberus might not have the numbers the Paragon'd rachni have, they should be able to greatly surpass them in terms of effectiveness.


That remains to be seen.
The Rachnii were considered a galactic menace that Turians+Asari+Salarians couldn't deal with.

#261
Someone With Mass

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Lotion Soronnar wrote...

You said INDOCTRINATE.  I ask where do you see indoctriantion there?


Where does it say that there isn't any indoctrination there?

#262
Notlikeyoucare

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Someone With Mass wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Well, if the rachni can reproduce at such a fast rate, how come the krogans were able to kill all their queens and then wipe them all out?


Because "Prior to the genophage, krogan could reproduce and mature at an astonishing rate."


If the krogans have a even higher birth rate than the rachni, then they won't be much of a problem if they turn out to be indoctrinated.


Yes, but Krogan don't have an army or the numbers needed to drive them off like they did in the past.

#263
Someone With Mass

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Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Yes, but Krogan don't have an army or the numbers needed to drive them off like they did in the past.


Bah, just send the geth after them.

#264
Lotion Soronarr

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Someone With Mass wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Well, if the rachni can reproduce at such a fast rate, how come the krogans were able to kill all their queens and then wipe them all out?


Because "Prior to the genophage, krogan could reproduce and mature at an astonishing rate."


If the krogans have a even higher birth rate than the rachni, then the rachni won't be much of a problem if they turn out to be indoctrinated.


Krogans don't have a higher birth rate. Krongs are just much tougher than your average Rachnii.

In other words, Krogans kill more a day then Queens make. Makes even mroe sense when you know Krogans are not shy of using any weapon. During the war they probably performed Exterminatus on rachnii colonies regulary.

#265
sorentoft

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Someone With Mass wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Yes, but Krogan don't have an army or the numbers needed to drive them off like they did in the past.


Bah, just send the geth after them.

But we just want to upload to our megastructure. :o

#266
Lotion Soronarr

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Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

You said INDOCTRINATE.  I ask where do you see indoctriantion there?


Where does it say that there isn't any indoctrination there?


Those who claim that ALL reaper tech is evil, should back that claim up.

#267
Kaiser Shepard

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Someone With Mass wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Yes, but Krogan don't have an army or the numbers needed to drive them off like they did in the past.


Bah, just send the geth after them.

Geth do not infiltrate rachni hives.

#268
sorentoft

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Kaiser Shepard wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Yes, but Krogan don't have an army or the numbers needed to drive them off like they did in the past.


Bah, just send the geth after them.

Geth do not infiltrate rachni hives.

Geth do not intentionally infiltrate Rachni hives.

#269
Notlikeyoucare

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Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

You said INDOCTRINATE.  I ask where do you see indoctriantion there?


Where does it say that there isn't any indoctrination there?


Those who claim that ALL reaper tech is evil, should back that claim up.


If all Reaper tech could indoctrinate, Sovereign would have just indoctrinated someone to activate the Citidal Master Control unit by using the Citidal itself.

#270
Someone With Mass

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Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Those who claim that ALL reaper tech is evil, should back that claim up.


Okay, if that doesn't work, I'm just going to say that the Cerberus clowns have to show that they're actually capable of handling the base, and considering that they can't even handle a dead Reaper, (it was a very good opportunity to study the Reapers in high detail, by the way) then why should I assume that they can handle the secrets of the Collector base?





Spoiler


#271
Guest_The Big Bad Wolf_*

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Of course some paragon choices should backfire (at least one already has), being the "nice guy" isn't always smart.....

#272
Kaiser Shepard

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sorentoft wrote...

Geth do not intentionally infiltrate Rachni hives.

^_^

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

If all Reaper tech could indoctrinate, Sovereign would have just indoctrinated someone to activate the Citidal Master Control unit by using the Citidal itself.

If the Reapers were that competent, they would've made Citadel Relay so that they could've activated it themselves.

#273
Wulfram

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Lotion Soronnar wrote...

That remains to be seen.
The Rachnii were considered a galactic menace that Turians+Asari+Salarians couldn't deal with.


[pedant]Turians weren't around yet[/pedant]

Modifié par Wulfram, 06 septembre 2011 - 02:02 .


#274
Kaiser Shepard

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Someone With Mass wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Those who claim that ALL reaper tech is evil, should back that claim up.


Okay, if that doesn't work, I'm just going to say that the Cerberus clowns have to show that they're actually capable of handling the base, and considering that they can't even handle a dead Reaper, (it was a very good opportunity to study the Reapers in high detail, by the way) then why should I assume that they can handle the secrets of the Collector base?

Because the Collector Base is just that, a base. The only pieces of equipment active will be those Cerberus wants active. Any indoctrinating going on will be their own terms.


Spoiler

Who's to say that's an accident?

#275
MrProliferation

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I think this is the wrong way to frame the issue. No choice "backfires," it just puts you on another path. The Renegade way is the expedient way, the most straight-forward path. A sort of "end justifies the means." It would make since that acting in an expedient way would tend to have different sets of consequences than acting in a more morally upright manner.

That said, I think just stating whether all of these will "backfire" depends on how you look at your Shephard and what the outcome is. The Renegade path is always focused on the more narrow objective of victory at whatever costs. The Paragon path is a little more nuanced. I think in ME3 it will depend on what you want your Shephard to be concerned with. Is the objective simply saving Earth at all costs? Or is the objective to unite the galaxy against the threat? If it is the latter, then yes, I would expect making a lot of renegade decisions would have hurt you. If it is the former, then I doubt you'll have much problem.

A renegade Shephard is going to go out and grab whatever is the bare minimum necessary to stop the threat and not waste time playing nice and building alliances that are unnecessary, whereas a paragon Shephard is going to be more consumed with trying to achieve the unity necessary to not just defeat the Reapers, but to rebuild the galaxy in the aftermath of it.

This is an oversimplification of the two paths, and everyone is going to be somewhere in between them, but talking about "backfiring" depends on what your objectives are going to be and how you are going to roleplay your character in the first place. My Renegade killed the Rachni but saved the Council whereas my Paragon spared the Rachni but let the Council perish. Neither of them let the Collector base survive, but my Renegade was a hell of a lot more sympathetic to Cerberus' other goals. I even plan to do a playthrough where my Renegade is going to turn Legion in to Cerberus for research just to see what happens. I doubt many people took their Renegades that far.