549 réponses à ce sujet

[Someone With Mass]

Kaiser Shepard wrote...
Because the Collector Base is just that, a base. The only pieces of equipment active will be those Cerberus wants active. Any indoctrinating going on will be their own terms.

You mean...like the derelict Reaper?

[Kaiser Shepard]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Kaiser Shepard wrote...
Because the Collector Base is just that, a base. The only pieces of equipment active will be those Cerberus wants active. Any indoctrinating going on will be their own terms.

You mean...like the derelict Reaper?

No, because that wasn't a base, but an already made and partially active Reaper.

[Notlikeyoucare]

Someone With Mass wrote...

Kaiser Shepard wrote...
Because the Collector Base is just that, a base. The only pieces of equipment active will be those Cerberus wants active. Any indoctrinating going on will be their own terms.

You mean...like the derelict Reaper?

There's no reason to assume that the Collector base can indoctrinate, Collector Base =/= Derilect Reaper. Why weren't Shepard and his crew indoctrinated? Why weren't tthe un-processed humans indoctrinated? Remember, the Collectors were indoctrinated about 50,000 years ago, not by the base itself. If the Collectors were made a base in an area to protect and conceal themselves, why would it have indoctrinating capabilities, if it was not intended for anyone else to be there?

[mredders91]

it is possible that the baby reaper could indoctrinate as for indoctrination itself it is possible that it happens over a long period of time not instantly

[Dave of Canada]

Indoctrination on the Collector Base would be counter-productive, any use they'd get from indoctrinated individuals as workers on the Base itself would serve nothing as they'd start impaling themselves shortly.

[Dave of Canada]

In addition to that, Cerberus work in Cells. An indocintrated cell isn't going to risk much, considering we're looking at 20-30 individuals. They'd load the technology and ship it to another location, which another cell will study.

The Illusive Man will never be at risk to direct exposure, therefore Cerberus remains capable of studying technology without the leadership suffering from any ill effects and any security compromise would be minor in the grand scheme of things.

TIM has the resources to eliminate any indoctrinated Cells (excluding the gigantic resource hit in the novel as that happens after the choice) and has shown himself as somebody with the galaxy's best interests (surviving) in mind.

[Notlikeyoucare]

mredders91 wrote...

it is possible that the baby reaper could indoctrinate as for indoctrination itself it is possible that it happens over a long period of time not instantly

It could, but its a moot point as the thing is destroyed anyway. As for indoctrination, yes that is certainly possible, but it brings into question just how long did it take to indoctrinate TIM's science team. And if I remember correctly, the "Reaper artifact" indoctrinated the science team in a few days.

So it also brings into question as to why no-one apparently started feeling the effects of indoctrination at all.

[Annoyed Dragon]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Kaiser Shepard wrote...
Because the Collector Base is just that, a base. The only pieces of equipment active will be those Cerberus wants active. Any indoctrinating going on will be their own terms.

You mean...like the derelict Reaper?

There's no reason to assume that the Collector base can indoctrinate, Collector Base =/= Derilect Reaper. Why weren't Shepard and his crew indoctrinated? Why weren't tthe un-processed humans indoctrinated? Remember, the Collectors were indoctrinated about 50,000 years ago, not by the base itself. If the Collectors were made a base in an area to protect and conceal themselves, why would it have indoctrinating capabilities, if it was not intended for anyone else to be there?

The Collector base was very big, so there could have been no contact with the indoctrination equipment also it only occurs due to prolonged contact. If that wasn't the case then Shepard would have been indoctrinated back in ME1.

In the "Arrival" DLC a science team was indoctrinated while studying the Rho object, that was over a period of time and when you consider the the Collector base was also a factory to create Reapers; then you would think that some kind of indoctrination technology would be in the base,

[Someone With Mass]

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

There's no reason to assume that the Collector base can indoctrinate, Collector Base =/= Derilect Reaper. Why weren't Shepard and his crew indoctrinated? Why weren't tthe un-processed humans indoctrinated? Remember, the Collectors were indoctrinated about 50,000 years ago, not by the base itself. If the Collectors were made a base in an area to protect and conceal themselves, why would it have indoctrinating capabilities, if it was not intended for anyone else to be there?

Indoctrination won't take effect over a few hours and the Reaper IFF seemed like it only served to make the ship perform more accurate jumps, but it also sent out a signal the Collectors picked up.

And why not use some of those captured humans as slave labor or sleeper agents?

[Notlikeyoucare]

Annoyed Dragon wrote...

Notlikeyoucare wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

Kaiser Shepard wrote...
Because the Collector Base is just that, a base. The only pieces of equipment active will be those Cerberus wants active. Any indoctrinating going on will be their own terms.

You mean...like the derelict Reaper?

There's no reason to assume that the Collector base can indoctrinate, Collector Base =/= Derilect Reaper. Why weren't Shepard and his crew indoctrinated? Why weren't tthe un-processed humans indoctrinated? Remember, the Collectors were indoctrinated about 50,000 years ago, not by the base itself. If the Collectors were made a base in an area to protect and conceal themselves, why would it have indoctrinating capabilities, if it was not intended for anyone else to be there?

The Collector base was very big, so there could have been no contact with the indoctrination equipment also it only occurs due to prolonged contact. If that wasn't the case then Shepard would have been indoctrinated back in ME1.

In the "Arrival" DLC a science team was indoctrinated while studying the Rho object, that was over a period of time and when you consider the the Collector base was also a factory to create Reapers; then you would think that some kind of indoctrination technology would be in the base,

This is a possibility. EDI does state that the technology used to create the Terminator is not the Collector's. This brings up the question of what that technology actually is, and if they have "more" of it or not.

[Annoyed Dragon]

Dave of Canada wrote...

In addition to that, Cerberus work in Cells. An indocintrated cell isn't going to risk much, considering we're looking at 20-30 individuals. They'd load the technology and ship it to another location, which another cell will study.

The Illusive Man will never be at risk to direct exposure, therefore Cerberus remains capable of studying technology without the leadership suffering from any ill effects and any security compromise would be minor in the grand scheme of things.

TIM has the resources to eliminate any indoctrinated Cells (excluding the gigantic resource hit in the novel as that happens after the choice) and has shown himself as somebody with the galaxy's best interests (surviving) in mind.

(Warning Spoiler)

///

Isn't TIM already being slowly indoctrinated by his exposure to "Husk" creation device in the "Mass Effect: Evolution" book; with TIM idoctrinated the rest of Cerberus will be over time,

///

(Warning Spoiler)

[Mr.Zinn]

Just getting some experience dealing with reaper tech in controlled circumstances is reason enough to keep the base. Probably need to find some way to resist indoctrination to be able to win a large scale war anyway.

[NICKjnp]

There are no consequences in the ME universe...only e-mails.

[sagefic]

Yes, I think they should.

Real question is, IF they backfire, will you go back and unmake your backfired choices, or just live with them?

[marshalleck]

sagequeen wrote...

Yes, I think they should.

Real question is, IF they backfire, will you go back and unmake your backfired choices, or just live with them?

I've already gone back with one of my Shepards and unmade my "focus on Sovereign" decision, because I find the attendant lack of content in ME2 disappointing. Whereas if you save them, you get all the comedy associated with "ah yes, reapers" and the usual antics of Larry, Moe, and Curly. The "consequence" payoff for that decision from ME1 in ME2 is massively, HUGELY in favor of paragons in terms of tangible gameplay experience.

Modifié par marshalleck, 06 septembre 2011 - 07:03 .

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

marshalleck wrote...

sagequeen wrote...

Yes, I think they should.

Real question is, IF they backfire, will you go back and unmake your backfired choices, or just live with them?

I've already gone back with one of my Shepards and unmade my "focus on Sovereign" decision, because I find the attendant lack of content in ME2 disappointing. Whereas if you save them, you get all the comedy associated with "ah yes, reapers" and the usual antics of Larry, Moe, and Curly. The "consequence" payoff for that decision from ME1 in ME2 is massively, HUGELY in favor of paragons in terms of tangible gameplay experience.

Anywho, the only paragon decision that I can see really "backfiring" would be the rachni, and I would rather go fight a horde than spend a year babysitting Cerberus...again.

[outmane]

marshalleck wrote...

sagequeen wrote...

Yes, I think they should.

Real question is, IF they backfire, will you go back and unmake your backfired choices, or just live with them?

I've already gone back with one of my Shepards and unmade my "focus on Sovereign" decision, because I find the attendant lack of content in ME2 disappointing. Whereas if you save them, you get all the comedy associated with "ah yes, reapers" and the usual antics of Larry, Moe, and Curly. The "consequence" payoff for that decision from ME1 in ME2 is massively, HUGELY in favor of paragons in terms of tangible gameplay experience.

The payoff youre talking about is mostly content (which im not saying isnt important. There is definitly an imbalance of content between paragon and renegade playthroughs, starting with not meeting the new Council).

But i wouldnt say that sacrificing 10k human soldiers and the human fleet ressources is being paid off by hearing 'ah yes Reapers' by our 3 favorite clowns on the story level.

You play nice, sacrifice human lives, set your species back in its defense against the Reapers and they still give you the finger. But a polite one, called 'restoring your spectre status'. Hense when Shep stops the collectors (without any fund or support from the council) theyll be able to say a citadel spectre did it ! (Now be grateful and fall in line.)

[TheOptimist]

marshalleck wrote...
I've already gone back with one of my Shepards and unmade my "focus on Sovereign" decision, because I find the attendant lack of content in ME2 disappointing. Whereas if you save them, you get all the comedy associated with "ah yes, reapers" and the usual antics of Larry, Moe, and Curly. The "consequence" payoff for that decision from ME1 in ME2 is massively, HUGELY in favor of paragons in terms of tangible gameplay experience.

Except there are no actual consequences.  There is no story backfire if Shepard chooses to concentrate on Sovereign or even to outright abandon the council.  Yes, Councilor Velarn is funny and you don't get to talk to him if you let him die (because he's dead), but nothing happens to Shepard for letting them die.  There is nothing you need to accomplish that requires the council. At all.

[Almostfaceman]

TheOptimist wrote...

marshalleck wrote...
I've already gone back with one of my Shepards and unmade my "focus on Sovereign" decision, because I find the attendant lack of content in ME2 disappointing. Whereas if you save them, you get all the comedy associated with "ah yes, reapers" and the usual antics of Larry, Moe, and Curly. The "consequence" payoff for that decision from ME1 in ME2 is massively, HUGELY in favor of paragons in terms of tangible gameplay experience.

Except there are no actual consequences.  There is no story backfire if Shepard chooses to concentrate on Sovereign or even to outright abandon the council.  Yes, Councilor Velarn is funny and you don't get to talk to him if you let him die (because he's dead), but nothing happens to Shepard for letting them die.  There is nothing you need to accomplish that requires the council. At all.

It's about six months too soon to be saying that, since that's when the story will be finished.

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

TheOptimist wrote...

marshalleck wrote...
I've already gone back with one of my Shepards and unmade my "focus on Sovereign" decision, because I find the attendant lack of content in ME2 disappointing. Whereas if you save them, you get all the comedy associated with "ah yes, reapers" and the usual antics of Larry, Moe, and Curly. The "consequence" payoff for that decision from ME1 in ME2 is massively, HUGELY in favor of paragons in terms of tangible gameplay experience.

Except there are no actual consequences.  There is no story backfire if Shepard chooses to concentrate on Sovereign or even to outright abandon the council.  Yes, Councilor Velarn is funny and you don't get to talk to him if you let him die (because he's dead), but nothing happens to Shepard for letting them die.  There is nothing you need to accomplish that requires the council. At all.

[marshalleck]

TheOptimist wrote...

marshalleck wrote...
I've already gone back with one of my Shepards and unmade my "focus on Sovereign" decision, because I find the attendant lack of content in ME2 disappointing. Whereas if you save them, you get all the comedy associated with "ah yes, reapers" and the usual antics of Larry, Moe, and Curly. The "consequence" payoff for that decision from ME1 in ME2 is massively, HUGELY in favor of paragons in terms of tangible gameplay experience.

Except there are no actual consequences.  There is no story backfire if Shepard chooses to concentrate on Sovereign or even to outright abandon the council.  Yes, Councilor Velarn is funny and you don't get to talk to him if you let him die (because he's dead), but nothing happens to Shepard for letting them die.  There is nothing you need to accomplish that requires the council. At all.

I know that, and I've said as much in this thread earlier. There is a distinct lack of consequence associated with much of the renegade playthrough. And some people, Someone With Mass in particular, are now taking to calling that very lack of consequence a consequence in its own right.

[marshalleck]

Almostfaceman wrote...

TheOptimist wrote...

marshalleck wrote...
I've already gone back with one of my Shepards and unmade my "focus on Sovereign" decision, because I find the attendant lack of content in ME2 disappointing. Whereas if you save them, you get all the comedy associated with "ah yes, reapers" and the usual antics of Larry, Moe, and Curly. The "consequence" payoff for that decision from ME1 in ME2 is massively, HUGELY in favor of paragons in terms of tangible gameplay experience.

Except there are no actual consequences.  There is no story backfire if Shepard chooses to concentrate on Sovereign or even to outright abandon the council.  Yes, Councilor Velarn is funny and you don't get to talk to him if you let him die (because he's dead), but nothing happens to Shepard for letting them die.  There is nothing you need to accomplish that requires the council. At all.

It's about six months too soon to be saying that, since that's when the story will be finished.

ME2 came out in January 2010. It might help for you to actually read the posts and comprehend what people are talking about. 

[TheOptimist]

marshalleck wrote...
I know that, and I've said as much in this thread earlier. There is a distinct lack of consequence associated with much of the renegade playthrough. And some people, Someone With Mass in particular, are now taking to calling that very lack of consequence a consequence in its own right.

Uh...are you sure it was this thread? Cause I just went back and looked, and I saw you arguing with SWM about the Rachni, and whether you'll get a krogan army or not and one quote about consequences= no consequences on page 8, but you haven't posted anything in this topic that I can find about how the renegade playthrough has no backfires either. 

[Humanoid_Typhoon]

Let some of the paragon choices backfire,then we have to go fix it,MORE CONTENT FOREVER [insert evil laugh]