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[LGTX]

Some choices should backfire. Paragon/Renegade alignment irrelevant.

[Nashiktal]

Big_Stupid_Jelly wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

I wouldn't call the Rachni benevolent. They took control of an Asari, planted her with hidden memories he has no control of, and seem to have indoctrinated her as much as any reaper. She points to trouble for me, and I am the one who saved her. I just hope whatever trouble she causes is worth her support in the reaper war.

The Asari was dead at the time, and she was only 'used' to communicate with Shepherd, what else was the Rachni supposed to do?

Let her go and if she has to keep her location secret, erase her memories of the location. Instead she brainwashes the Asari. She could do just fine on her own, all she needs is food and minerals and her drones can do the rest. She might be preparing for the reapers, which is dandy, but the very fact that she is indoctrinating people like the reapers is a BAD thing. What happens once the reapers are gone? Or what if she decides she doesn't like how you are fighting the reapers?

She was used for far more than communicating with shep, go talk to her again.

[Big_Stupid_Jelly]

Nashiktal wrote...

Big_Stupid_Jelly wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

I wouldn't call the Rachni benevolent. They took control of an Asari, planted her with hidden memories he has no control of, and seem to have indoctrinated her as much as any reaper. She points to trouble for me, and I am the one who saved her. I just hope whatever trouble she causes is worth her support in the reaper war.

The Asari was dead at the time, and she was only 'used' to communicate with Shepherd, what else was the Rachni supposed to do?

Let her go and if she has to keep her location secret, erase her memories of the location. Instead she brainwashes the Asari. She could do just fine on her own, all she needs is food and minerals and her drones can do the rest. She might be preparing for the reapers, which is dandy, but the very fact that she is indoctrinating people like the reapers is a BAD thing. What happens once the reapers are gone? Or what if she decides she doesn't like how you are fighting the reapers?

She was used for far more than communicating with shep, go talk to her again.

I think you're missing the point here. You killed the Asari, she was one of the commando's, the Rachni was just using her 'empty' corpse to communicate with you, as soon as the Rachni leaves, the corpse falls down again.

Modifié par Big_Stupid_Jelly, 04 septembre 2011 - 11:29 .

[Nashiktal]

Big_Stupid_Jelly wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

Big_Stupid_Jelly wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

I wouldn't call the Rachni benevolent. They took control of an Asari, planted her with hidden memories he has no control of, and seem to have indoctrinated her as much as any reaper. She points to trouble for me, and I am the one who saved her. I just hope whatever trouble she causes is worth her support in the reaper war.

The Asari was dead at the time, and she was only 'used' to communicate with Shepherd, what else was the Rachni supposed to do?

Let her go and if she has to keep her location secret, erase her memories of the location. Instead she brainwashes the Asari. She could do just fine on her own, all she needs is food and minerals and her drones can do the rest. She might be preparing for the reapers, which is dandy, but the very fact that she is indoctrinating people like the reapers is a BAD thing. What happens once the reapers are gone? Or what if she decides she doesn't like how you are fighting the reapers?

She was used for far more than communicating with shep, go talk to her again.

I think you're missing the point here. You killed the Asari, she was one of the commando's, the Rachni was just using her 'empty' corpse to communicate with you, as soon as the Rachni leaves, the corpse falls down again.

Wrong Asari, I am talking about the one on Illium mate.

Edit: sorry said the wrong planet, I am talking about the Asari on Illium, the one who delivers the message to say she is doing alright. The corpse was necessity, the asari on illium was not.

Modifié par Nashiktal, 04 septembre 2011 - 11:31 .

[LilyasAvalon]

Nashiktal wrote...

Big_Stupid_Jelly wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

I wouldn't call the Rachni benevolent. They took control of an Asari, planted her with hidden memories he has no control of, and seem to have indoctrinated her as much as any reaper. She points to trouble for me, and I am the one who saved her. I just hope whatever trouble she causes is worth her support in the reaper war.

The Asari was dead at the time, and she was only 'used' to communicate with Shepherd, what else was the Rachni supposed to do?

Let her go and if she has to keep her location secret, erase her memories of the location. Instead she brainwashes the Asari. She could do just fine on her own, all she needs is food and minerals and her drones can do the rest. She might be preparing for the reapers, which is dandy, but the very fact that she is indoctrinating people like the reapers is a BAD thing. What happens once the reapers are gone? Or what if she decides she doesn't like how you are fighting the reapers?

She was used for far more than communicating with shep, go talk to her again.

That sounded more like gratefulness than indoctrination to me... The Asari has given her life to the rachni, yes, but I wouldn't call it indoctrination.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Modifié par Grand Admiral Cheesecake, 04 septembre 2011 - 11:32 .

[Big_Stupid_Jelly]

Nashiktal wrote...

Big_Stupid_Jelly wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

Big_Stupid_Jelly wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

I wouldn't call the Rachni benevolent. They took control of an Asari, planted her with hidden memories he has no control of, and seem to have indoctrinated her as much as any reaper. She points to trouble for me, and I am the one who saved her. I just hope whatever trouble she causes is worth her support in the reaper war.

The Asari was dead at the time, and she was only 'used' to communicate with Shepherd, what else was the Rachni supposed to do?

Let her go and if she has to keep her location secret, erase her memories of the location. Instead she brainwashes the Asari. She could do just fine on her own, all she needs is food and minerals and her drones can do the rest. She might be preparing for the reapers, which is dandy, but the very fact that she is indoctrinating people like the reapers is a BAD thing. What happens once the reapers are gone? Or what if she decides she doesn't like how you are fighting the reapers?

She was used for far more than communicating with shep, go talk to her again.

I think you're missing the point here. You killed the Asari, she was one of the commando's, the Rachni was just using her 'empty' corpse to communicate with you, as soon as the Rachni leaves, the corpse falls down again.

Wrong Asari, I am talking about the one on Illium mate.

Oh Ilium, ok. She only conveyed the message, there was no harm done really.

Modifié par Big_Stupid_Jelly, 04 septembre 2011 - 11:34 .

[Nashiktal]

LilyasAvalon wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

Big_Stupid_Jelly wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

I wouldn't call the Rachni benevolent. They took control of an Asari, planted her with hidden memories he has no control of, and seem to have indoctrinated her as much as any reaper. She points to trouble for me, and I am the one who saved her. I just hope whatever trouble she causes is worth her support in the reaper war.

The Asari was dead at the time, and she was only 'used' to communicate with Shepherd, what else was the Rachni supposed to do?

Let her go and if she has to keep her location secret, erase her memories of the location. Instead she brainwashes the Asari. She could do just fine on her own, all she needs is food and minerals and her drones can do the rest. She might be preparing for the reapers, which is dandy, but the very fact that she is indoctrinating people like the reapers is a BAD thing. What happens once the reapers are gone? Or what if she decides she doesn't like how you are fighting the reapers?

She was used for far more than communicating with shep, go talk to her again.

That sounded more like gratefulness than indoctrination to me... The Asari has given her life to the rachni, yes, but I wouldn't call it indoctrination.

Her mind gets fuzzy if she tries to think around the rachni, chunks of her memory are missing, including WHEN she got "changed" and she quickly tries to quell and fears about being controlled, and does so in a creepy manner that sounds religious in how peacful it is. '

Its nothing if not suspicious, the Rachni changed her somehow. Push the Asari on all conversations, even she shows a hint of doubt when pressed.

[Nashiktal]

Big_Stupid_Jelly wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

Big_Stupid_Jelly wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

Big_Stupid_Jelly wrote...

Nashiktal wrote...

I wouldn't call the Rachni benevolent. They took control of an Asari, planted her with hidden memories he has no control of, and seem to have indoctrinated her as much as any reaper. She points to trouble for me, and I am the one who saved her. I just hope whatever trouble she causes is worth her support in the reaper war.

The Asari was dead at the time, and she was only 'used' to communicate with Shepherd, what else was the Rachni supposed to do?

Let her go and if she has to keep her location secret, erase her memories of the location. Instead she brainwashes the Asari. She could do just fine on her own, all she needs is food and minerals and her drones can do the rest. She might be preparing for the reapers, which is dandy, but the very fact that she is indoctrinating people like the reapers is a BAD thing. What happens once the reapers are gone? Or what if she decides she doesn't like how you are fighting the reapers?

She was used for far more than communicating with shep, go talk to her again.

I think you're missing the point here. You killed the Asari, she was one of the commando's, the Rachni was just using her 'empty' corpse to communicate with you, as soon as the Rachni leaves, the corpse falls down again.

Wrong Asari, I am talking about the one on Illium mate.

So was I, ahh you mean the one in the main area who attacks you, with the others - wasn't she following Benezia's orders? and will have been under REAPER indoctrination.

I edited my post, reread it. I meant the one on illium not noveria.

[Nashiktal]

I urge you to find the video with her conversation, preferably one with all the conversation options chosen. Even she shows a hint of doubt when pressed, its not just a harmless message. The rachni are as dangerous as they are useful.

[Big_Stupid_Jelly]

Nashiktal wrote...

I urge you to find the video with her conversation, preferably one with all the conversation options chosen. Even she shows a hint of doubt when pressed, its not just a harmless message. The rachni are as dangerous as they are useful.

Nothing is perfect in this world, I wasn't willing to sacrifice the queen on what her ancestors had done - if in the future she shows that she needs to be killed, i'll do it.

On that score all Humans should be shot on sight, but that's not how we do things. Krogans are as dangerous as Rachni but again Krogans aren't shot straight away.

[LilyasAvalon]

Nashiktal wrote...

Her mind gets fuzzy if she tries to think around the rachni, chunks of her memory are missing, including WHEN she got "changed" and she quickly tries to quell and fears about being controlled, and does so in a creepy manner that sounds religious in how peacful it is. '

Its nothing if not suspicious, the Rachni changed her somehow. Push the Asari on all conversations, even she shows a hint of doubt when pressed.

They're not so much missing as, repressed, which is perfectably understandable. The rachni are still to be feared in the galaxy and having someone walk away who knows where they are, even with good intentions, is a stupid move. I personally would've done the same thing in queen's position.

And if the rachni go insane again? Well, that's what the Krogan are for.

[havoc373]

 at gamescom during the EA community lounge Q&A with mike gamble they said that making nothing but paragon choices wont always result in a favorable outcome and vice versa

[Nashiktal]

Its a little to late to just kill the rachni. They are free, she has begun rebuilding her race, and it only takes one egg to do so.

I just hope she's worth it. Although I should point out, humans don't have the ability to erase your memory, or alter your personality on their own, at least no so completely, and not in such a short amount of time.

Although the reapers can, and so can the Rachi. If the rachni can indoctrinate, then we have problems.

I am not condemning saving the queen, she might very well be needed and I did as well. However would you prefer to be that Asari on illium? I suppose you would be happier if nothing else.

[Dunmer of Redoran]

Great potential paragon backfirings:

1. After getting saved by Shepard so many times, Conrad Verner finally gets his act together and quickly becomes the biggest hero in the galaxy, stealing the spotlight from the guy who defeated Saren.

2. Because you're too nice, your crew starts to see you as exploitable and unwilling to ever punish them:

-Joker flies around wherever he wants instead of going to the proper destinations.
-Garrus becomes a lazy-ass who uses calibrations as an excuse to never do anything.
-Grunt beats you up and kicks you out of the Captain's Quarters, taking it for himself.
-Jack blows Kelly out the airlock when nobody's looking.
-Your LI becomes a **** and starts sleeping with everyone else on board. Especially with Jacob (if they're female) or Miranda (if they're male).
-Tali tries to use her cuteness to get Shep to give her whatever she wants, whenever she wants.
-Mordin injects you with a vaccine that's actually botulism.

[HogarthHughes 3]

Big_Stupid_Jelly wrote...

Nothing is perfect in this world, I wasn't willing to sacrifice the queen on what her ancestors had done - if in the future she shows that she needs to be killed, i'll do it.

On that score all Humans should be shot on sight, but that's not how we do things. Krogans are as dangerous as Rachni but again Krogans aren't shot straight away.

Not to turn this into a debate thread but...

It isn't really the same same situation.  Every single Rachni from known history (or even the drones in the lab) has been completely hostile, except for that one Queen.  Her willingness to talk does nothing to help her case, anyone with a modicum of desire for self-preservation would do the same.  All her life she has been imprisoned and used for her children (which were to be taken as obedient slaves), there is good reason to believe that she will want nothing but ill for aliens (ignoring the penchant her entire species thus far has for attacking everything else).  Oh and there is no guarantee that the Rachni were ever indoctrinated, the Queens passing remark of a "sour yellow note" is not nearly enough proof to convince me.  Even if they were, who is to say that the Rachni could not simply be indoctrinated again in short order?  Especially with the entire Reaper fleet in attendance.

The Rachni Queen can reproduce as quickly (if not even faster) than the Krogan and apparently produce hordes of battle-ready young in a relatively short period of time.  Hell given enough time she might even be able to rebuild her entire race (or at least produce enough Queens to do so with or without her).  The danger the Rachni Queen presents is far beyond just one creature and could not be dealt with as simply as some seem to think (ah no worries if she betrays us or gets indoctrinated I'll just kill her no problem).

And I've said my piece.

Modifié par HogarthHughes 3, 04 septembre 2011 - 12:00 .

[Dunmer of Redoran]

In all seriousness, keep in mind that as ME1 proves, there's other rachni in other places. Just because you didn't spare the queen doesn't mean they're all extinct.

[crimzontearz]

Punk4Real wrote...

Some good choices should backfire to keep things interesting.

Example ONE: Spare the rachni queen (good choice) or kill the rachni queen (bad choice). 

I feel the game rewards you for good behaviour way too much.
If you spared the queen, there was a good chance that the rachni would not keep their word and terrorize the galaxy once again. But obviously, that need not happen, and they became our allies.

Example TWO: Destroy the collector base (good choice) or keep it (bad choice). 

Again, there was a small chance cerebrus would keep their word and use the collector base for doing good.
But no, they turned out to be liars. Again, the good choices always win - this doesn't happen in real life.

Just a suggestion.
What do you guys think?

this is not real life

not that I disagree with the concept of your thread, I do agree to a point.....just needed to say this

[HogarthHughes 3]

DaftArbiter wrote...

In all seriousness, keep in mind that as ME1 proves, there's other rachni in other places. Just because you didn't spare the queen doesn't mean they're all extinct.

True, we'll likely end up fighting indoctrinated Rachni in ME3 regardless of our decisions.  However I would think that killing the last known Queen in existence would set them on the path towards extinction, unless there are others out there.

Modifié par HogarthHughes 3, 04 septembre 2011 - 12:06 .

[Someone With Mass]

Just as long as some Renegade choices have equally as negative outcomes. And I'm not talking about missing out on lame cameos as some would see as a "punishment", which it's not.

[Big stupid jellyfish]

LGTX wrote...

Some choices should backfire. Paragon/Renegade alignment irrelevant.

this

[Arppis]

They have... But reasonable choices where almost everyone is left happy, rarely backfire completely. And yeah, is it paragon or renegade, it shouldn't matter. I choose always the best possible option for sittulation. It usualy is paragon one.

Modifié par Arppis, 04 septembre 2011 - 12:13 .

[RyuujinZERO]

HogarthHughes 3 wrote...

It isn't really the same same situation.  Every single Rachni from known history (or even the drones in the lab) has been completely hostile, except for that one Queen. 

I think you're forgetting the details of the conversation with her. It COULD just be that she's bluffing but her bluff is amazingly accurate.

She talks of a "sour yellow note" that corrupted the "song" of her race (Their communal means of communication) and made them frenzied against the other species, it sounds a LOT like the original rachni were indoctrinated. HOWEVER, it still leaves to the possibility of it turning bad again even without needing a heel-face-turn on the queens part. If the rachni song was corrupted by indoctrination once, who's to say it won't happen again?

That said, any organic shock troops used against the reapers for any extended period will end up indoctrinated so that could apply to any organics you've earned the respect of... on that basis, befriending the Alliance or any of the council races is a risk factor because they might get indoctrinated

Modifié par RyuujinZERO, 04 septembre 2011 - 12:14 .

[KotorEffect3]

oh look another antiparagon thread.

[Arppis]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

oh look another antiparagon thread.

Makes me think of that Xar guy from Baldur's Gate. How he complains about "goodie-twoshoes" or something. XD