337 réponses à ce sujet

[LeVaughnX]

I was surfing the threads as per usual and I saw ""Some Paragon Choices Should Backfire"" - instantly I thought ""Oh if this moron puts at the top of the list the Rachni Queen it just means he's a raging little kid.""...And what do you know, that was his very first complaint! I don't think the Renagade (Renegade?) players understand a little thing I'd like to call "logic"; let me help out with some examples.


If you are a "bad guy" who makes "negative choices" or basically do things that don't earn respect but does generate a "ruthless aura" about you - who is honestly going to give two sh*ts if you live or die? Only the other really rude/bad/cruel ****s will really care; and even then they are still rude/bad/cruel people who will probably either die before you do or just do their own thing without a second thought (no honor among theives etc).

If you are a "good guy" who makes "positive choices" or basically do things that help others or progress the over all progression of a persons life; you generate a commanding aura about you that genuinely makes everyone else inspired and feel more like they can trust you. This builds positive reinforcement and gives everyone you work with more of an optomistic (sp) feeling rather than doubt and dispaire. This means also they are more inclined to listen to you and follow you / care about you.


Now let me give you the ""Rachni Live or Die"" example real quick...



Rachni Queen Lives:: Paragon Points are given and now you have a new ally against the Reapers. The problem here is (as you've seen already) while we can use the Rachni and fight along side them; this also gives the Reapers a new tool to cause us more trouble during the fights. They can (as we've seen!) use the Rachni to make massive war-spider things to basically kick our asses! So its a double edged sword; we gain an ally but also gain a new enemy!


Rachni Queen Dies:: Renegade Points are given (killing someone who can't fight back) and you've lost the ally vs the Reapers. The good thing about this is; now you don't have any real chance that the Reapers can somehow magically find and use the Rachni against you! Your army may be smaller; but at least your enemy isn't as powerful either!





I could go on and on about the good vs bad choices and why it would negatively affect BOTH PARTIES but I don't think I really need to. I'm giving the community the benifit of the doubt that you guys aren't that niave >_>...

[Arppis]

It's just people who want no conciquences of their actions. They should stop watching Renegade and Paragon colors when they make decissions and decide what seems to be the best sollution.

[LeVaughnX]

Arppis wrote...

It's just people who want no conciquences of their actions. They should stop watching Renegade and Paragon colors when they make decissions and decide what seems to be the best sollution.

Yeah; the Renegade think they are losing "content" because they aren't acting like a hero constantly. If they really don't like that they "die" during the final battle in ME2 - well try not being a dick to everyone!

I've not really seen the Paragons complain about much (if anything) and they (if anything!) have said they will be getting concequences quite often during ME3; sometimes saving someone may sound noble but it could always come back and bite you in the ass.


I just don't understand the mindless war going on...There IS a logic behind it...unlike the other flame wars going on.


Gay vs Straight
Religion vs No Religion
Shooters vs RPG Fans

Blah blah blah...

[Davie McG]

I think renegade players will still face the Rachni. Cerberus is an antagonist now, and they had access to Rachni eggs. It wouldn't be very wise to exclude one or the other by limiting their content.

[Bcuz]

Arppis wrote...

It's just people who want no conciquences of their actions. They should stop watching Renegade and Paragon colors when they make decissions and decide what seems to be the best sollution.

Changing my sig to this.

[LeVaughnX]

Davie McG wrote...

I think renegade players will still face the Rachni. Cerberus is an antagonist now, and they had access to Rachni eggs. It wouldn't be very wise to exclude one or the other by limiting their content.

My god I hate stupid people like you. You ruin the game and community you know that?

For the last time - NO ONE IS "LOSING CONTENT"!! YOU STILL HAVE THE CONTENT JACKASS YOU JUST PLAY WITH THE DECISIONS YOU MADE!!

And I doubt the Rachni will be SUCH A THREAT in the game if you killed off the Queen. There may be SOME Rachni but many more will exist during the Paragon's run (because we saved the Queen and shes bringing them back).

Also - as I've said....RENEGADE PLAYERS HAVE THE SAME LEVEL OF CONTENT! You guys (and gals) just need to understand that your decisions influence what exactly you do, run into, and how the story plays out (to an extent). YOU DON'T "LOSE" ANYTHING!

[Seboist]

LeVaughnX wrote...

I was surfing the threads as per usual and I saw ""Some Paragon Choices Should Backfire"" - instantly I thought ""Oh if this moron puts at the top of the list the Rachni Queen it just means he's a raging little kid.""...And what do you know, that was his very first complaint! I don't think the Renagade (Renegade?) players understand a little thing I'd like to call "logic"; let me help out with some examples.


If you are a "bad guy" who makes "negative choices" or basically do things that don't earn respect but does generate a "ruthless aura" about you - who is honestly going to give two sh*ts if you live or die? Only the other really rude/bad/cruel ****s will really care; and even then they are still rude/bad/cruel people who will probably either die before you do or just do their own thing without a second thought (no honor among theives etc).

If you are a "good guy" who makes "positive choices" or basically do things that help others or progress the over all progression of a persons life; you generate a commanding aura about you that genuinely makes everyone else inspired and feel more like they can trust you. This builds positive reinforcement and gives everyone you work with more of an optomistic (sp) feeling rather than doubt and dispaire. This means also they are more inclined to listen to you and follow you / care about you.


Now let me give you the ""Rachni Live or Die"" example real quick...

Rachni Queen Lives:: Paragon Points are given and now you have a new ally against the Reapers. The problem here is (as you've seen already) while we can use the Rachni and fight along side them; this also gives the Reapers a new tool to cause us more trouble during the fights. They can (as we've seen!) use the Rachni to make massive war-spider things to basically kick our asses! So its a double edged sword; we gain an ally but also gain a new enemy!


Rachni Queen Dies:: Renegade Points are given (killing someone who can't fight back) and you've lost the ally vs the Reapers. The good thing about this is; now you don't have any real chance that the Reapers can somehow magically find and use the Rachni against you! Your army may be smaller; but at least your enemy isn't as powerful either!

I could go on and on about the good vs bad choices and why it would negatively affect BOTH PARTIES but I don't think I really need to. I'm giving the community the benifit of the doubt that you guys aren't that niave >_>...

Only a bleeding heart simpleton with a lack of imagination thinks renegade is about being a "bad guy" who makes "negative choices" that benefit nobody. There's plenty of renegade choices that should get Shepard respect and support like with the Krogans for killing the Rachni or the Quarians from destroying the heretic Geth in Legion's LM.

Of course with all the issues of cut corners, Bioware's moral dilema with dealing the two paths fairly, choices existing in vacuums from each other, etc none of this will come to fruition. The Renegade path is just a gimped version of the Paragon one with joke dialogue and cut content and exists soley to hide the story's linearity.

Modifié par Seboist, 05 septembre 2011 - 06:46 .

[ObserverStatus]

LeVaughnX wrote...
I just don't understand the mindless war going on...There IS a logic behind it...unlike the other flame wars going on.
Gay vs Straight
Religion vs No Religion
Shooters vs RPG Fans
Blah blah blah...

Don't forget
Mattock Fans vs Revenant Fans
Claymore Fans vs GPS Fans
Talimancers vs Talihaters
Geth Sapience vs Geth Inanimation
Geth Vs Quarian
Armor vs Spandex Body Suits
Jennifer Hale vs Mark Meer

[LeVaughnX]

EternalAmbiguity wrote...

Actually it's the same as all those: Someone has a belief, a firmly held belief, and the thought that someone else could have another and get away with it (about the same character/game) offends them.

Which is why I wish Bioware would have the balls to say the following...


1.) "We will not have Bisexual or Gay Relationships in the game that do not belong. Shut up."

2.) "We will not put in Religion or any form of Religious Celebration in the game. Shut up...."

3.) "We will not punish the Paragons or Renegades just because the other party is complaining. Shut the hell up!"

4.) "Again we are not going to pander to the Call of Duty, Halo, or Gears of War players. This will not be a full shooter but we will have an intelligent RPG/SHOOTER with great A.I. and Tactics along with tons of high level RPG elements. If you don't like it please shut the hell up already!"

5.) "NO! WE AREN'T GOING TO GIVE YOU A RACHNI CHARACTER! STOP ASKING!"

6.) "SHUT THE F*CK UP! WE AREN'T PUTTING IN MULTIPLAYER! WHY WON'T YOU JUST SHUT UP! THATS IT!! BAN BAN BAN BAN BAN!! THERE! IF YOU KEEP HARRASING EVERYONE AND MAKING THE COMMUNITY TURN TO SH*T WE'LL BAN YOU FASTER THAN YOU CAN ASK FOR MULTIPLAYER! HAHAHAHAHA! ****S!"

[LeVaughnX]

bobobo878 wrote...

LeVaughnX wrote...
I just don't understand the mindless war going on...There IS a logic behind it...unlike the other flame wars going on.
Gay vs Straight
Religion vs No Religion
Shooters vs RPG Fans
Blah blah blah...

Don't forget
Mattock Fans vs Revenant Fans
Claymore Fans vs GPS Fans
Talimancers vs Talihaters
Geth Sapience vs Geth Inanimation
Geth Vs Quarian
Armor vs Spandex Body Suits
Jennifer Hale vs Mark Meer

True enough; but I really don't care about minor issues..I'm a Tali-lover but I don't hate anyone who doesn't like her. And I think Jennifer Hale is an emotionless retard but I don't hate anyone who likes her either. I'm more open minded.

[LeVaughnX]

Seboist wrote...

LeVaughnX wrote...

I was surfing the threads as per usual and I saw ""Some Paragon Choices Should Backfire"" - instantly I thought ""Oh if this moron puts at the top of the list the Rachni Queen it just means he's a raging little kid.""...And what do you know, that was his very first complaint! I don't think the Renagade (Renegade?) players understand a little thing I'd like to call "logic"; let me help out with some examples.


If you are a "bad guy" who makes "negative choices" or basically do things that don't earn respect but does generate a "ruthless aura" about you - who is honestly going to give two sh*ts if you live or die? Only the other really rude/bad/cruel ****s will really care; and even then they are still rude/bad/cruel people who will probably either die before you do or just do their own thing without a second thought (no honor among theives etc).

If you are a "good guy" who makes "positive choices" or basically do things that help others or progress the over all progression of a persons life; you generate a commanding aura about you that genuinely makes everyone else inspired and feel more like they can trust you. This builds positive reinforcement and gives everyone you work with more of an optomistic (sp) feeling rather than doubt and dispaire. This means also they are more inclined to listen to you and follow you / care about you.


Now let me give you the ""Rachni Live or Die"" example real quick...

Rachni Queen Lives:: Paragon Points are given and now you have a new ally against the Reapers. The problem here is (as you've seen already) while we can use the Rachni and fight along side them; this also gives the Reapers a new tool to cause us more trouble during the fights. They can (as we've seen!) use the Rachni to make massive war-spider things to basically kick our asses! So its a double edged sword; we gain an ally but also gain a new enemy!


Rachni Queen Dies:: Renegade Points are given (killing someone who can't fight back) and you've lost the ally vs the Reapers. The good thing about this is; now you don't have any real chance that the Reapers can somehow magically find and use the Rachni against you! Your army may be smaller; but at least your enemy isn't as powerful either!

I could go on and on about the good vs bad choices and why it would negatively affect BOTH PARTIES but I don't think I really need to. I'm giving the community the benifit of the doubt that you guys aren't that niave >_>...

Only a bleeding heart simpleton with a lack of imagination thinks renegade is about being a "bad guy" who makes "negative choices" that benefit nobody. There's plenty of renegade choices that should get Shepard respect and support like with the Krogans for killing the Rachni or the Quarians from destroying the heretic Geth in Legion's LM.

Of course with all the issues of cut corners, Bioware's moral dilema with dealing the two paths fairly, choices existing in vacuums from each other, etc none of this will come to fruition. The Renegade path is just a gimped version of the Paragon one with joke dialogue and cut content and exists soley to hide the story's linearity.

It was an example...God you Renegade players sure get butt-hurt over the smallest fu*king thing....Get banned you goblin...

[ObserverStatus]

LeVaughnX wrote...

Which is why I wish Bioware would have the balls to say the following...

3.) "We will not punish the Paragons or Renegades just because the other party is complaining. Shut the hell up!"

^^^ qft.

[didymos1120]

LeVaughnX wrote...

 And I think Jennifer Hale is an emotionless retard but I don't hate anyone who likes her either.

Wait, her personally, or her performance?

[Davie McG]

To be fair I think the renegade / paragon system isn't exactly the best when the biggest boast for the game is choice. I'd prefer it if your decisions were morally ambiguous, to be faced with difficult decisions that are more shades of grey rather than selecting red or blue every time.

I also don't like the fact that your limited in your response just because you don't have enough points.

[LeVaughnX]

didymos1120 wrote...

LeVaughnX wrote...

 And I think Jennifer Hale is an emotionless retard but I don't hate anyone who likes her either.

Wait, her personally, or her performance?

Her performance; I don't know her personally so I can only rate her based on how I heard her in Mass Effect. She may be a very nice person but I thought her voice acting was very stale....

[ObserverStatus]

Davie McG wrote...

To be fair I think the renegade / paragon system isn't exactly the best when the biggest boast for the game is choice. I'd prefer it if your decisions were morally ambiguous, to be faced with difficult decisions that are more shades of grey rather than selecting red or blue every time.

I also don't like the fact that your limited in your response just because you don't have enough points.

I agree, I wish that they would just let you decide for yourself which options are moral, like in DA:O.

[mango smoothie]

I make my decisions based on what I would do in that situation. I really don't pay much attention to the paragon and renegade bars until after the game to see where I'm at according the to the game. Also almost every decision in the game I see the pros and cons for each one. People need to make decisions on what they feel is right to do, and not for trying to get red or blue

[Seboist]

LeVaughnX wrote...

It was an example...God you Renegade players sure get butt-hurt over the smallest fu*king thing....Get banned you goblin...

Learn not to make bull**** characterizations of the renegade decisions and the players who make them if you don't want to see anyone "butt-hurt".

[LeVaughnX]

Davie McG wrote...

To be fair I think the renegade / paragon system isn't exactly the best when the biggest boast for the game is choice. I'd prefer it if your decisions were morally ambiguous, to be faced with difficult decisions that are more shades of grey rather than selecting red or blue every time.

I also don't like the fact that your limited in your response just because you don't have enough points.

1.) More responses to broaden the decisions between good and evil would be fine. Getting random Renegade points for being sarcastic or something really pissed me off; but oh well, work with what you're given.

2.) Limited responces in ME1/2 because you don't have "enough points" makes a lot of sense. Think of the points as "experience in that field" if you will; and if you don't have "experience in that field" you can't easily cope and or comprehend what to do properly. I mean for the Renegades or the r-tards you could put in an option to just....

Liara: ""Shepard; I love you and I hope you forgive me for giving your body over to Cerberus...I know we haven't had time to talk but---"

***Not enough Renegade / Paragon Points but you want to interupt? Okay! **** Interupt!!***

Shepard: ""SUCK MY DICK!""

[DCarter]

You're just speculating about the rachni choice. Granted your outcomes seem plausible but you can't state them as definitive facts until we actually see them unfold as we play through the game.

Moving on, paragon vs renegade was never meant to equate to good vs bad. You play commander shepard an elite soldier saving the galaxies advanced species from doom at the hands of the reapers. Your a god damn hero regardless of whether you smile or scowl at people.

I agree with you that your actions should have consequences but the common theme with renegade choices in ME1 is that you end up with less content in ME2 (emails or characters).

[LeVaughnX]

Seboist wrote...

LeVaughnX wrote...

It was an example...God you Renegade players sure get butt-hurt over the smallest fu*king thing....Get banned you goblin...

Learn not to make bull**** characterizations of the renegade decisions and the players who make them if you don't want to see anyone "butt-hurt".

Oh get fu*ked goblin; stop interupting a discussion with your ignorant crying babble.

[ObserverStatus]

mango smoothie wrote...

I make my decisions based on what I would do in that situation. I really don't pay much attention to the paragon and renegade bars until after the game to see where I'm at according the to the game. Also almost every decision in the game I see the pros and cons for each one. People need to make decisions on what they feel is right to do, and not for trying to get red or blue

Exactly, a few blue paragon points aren't going to make me feel any better when the Thorian spores get off world and take root.
I usually try to avoid most of the flame wars.  The religion vs no religion ones are particularly annoying.  But there are certain some issues are more important.  If someone suggests, for example, that the Revenant is somehow worse than the Avenger, I cannot allow them to go uncorrected.

[DCarter]

Davie McG wrote...

To be fair I think the renegade / paragon system isn't exactly the best when the biggest boast for the game is choice. I'd prefer it if your decisions were morally ambiguous, to be faced with difficult decisions that are more shades of grey rather than selecting red or blue every time.

I also don't like the fact that your limited in your response just because you don't have enough points.

Agree completely. It's a completely unecessary system that only detracts from emotional engagement and player choices. 

[LeVaughnX]

DCarter wrote...

You're just speculating about the rachni choice. Granted your outcomes seem plausible but you can't state them as definitive facts until we actually see them unfold as we play through the game.

Moving on, paragon vs renegade was never meant to equate to good vs bad. You play commander shepard an elite soldier saving the galaxies advanced species from doom at the hands of the reapers. Your a god damn hero regardless of whether you smile or scowl at people.

I agree with you that your actions should have consequences but the common theme with renegade choices in ME1 is that you end up with less content in ME2 (emails or characters).

Lets play the logic game! 

Bioware showed Rachni Reaper Hybrids (Rachni Husks). They've said a lot of Paragon choices have the chance to really screw us over (no I'm not bothering to get proof I'm lazy - get it yourself if you direly need it). Its only LOGICAL to assume that the Rachni surviving would be the reason we fight Rachni Husks / possibly a Rachni Reaper! Why? Because we let the Queen of one loose! We told her ""go - be free - rebuild"" which basically gives the Reapers more ammo!

Renegades killed her - thus giving them less of a foe to fight in the long run! Why? SHE COULDN'T BRING HER PEOPLE TOGETHER AND REBUILD THEM! Durp!