34 réponses à ce sujet

[Skadison]

Yes I'm trying to make a black character in NWN2.  Sure you can change the skin colour to brown but I'm not so sure about the hairstyles.  I can create a wild elf with dreadlocks (not sure if elfs can be black by ethnicity anyway) but as for half elfs and humans there isn't a dreadlock hairstyle or an afro.  Thats a bit annoying because in NWN 1 there were black characters in the OC  and there was a dreadlock option.  Now you have one hairstyle that kinda  looks like that but I have a feeling it's straight hair.

Anyway I'll probably go back to playing a Drow.

[kamal_]

There's a short dreads looking hairstyle. And of course shaved. A few of the heads look possibly african looking with dark skin. Not so easy though. Don't really blame anyone for that, it's not as if tons of other games implement many different real world ethnicities.

[Lugaid of the Red Stripes]

There are some NPC heads that are distinctly African, maybe a BIC editor like LETO for NWN1 could enable you to change your character's appearance type.

[Skadison]

 I found the dreadlock hairstyle, my bad.

kamal_ wrote...

There's a short dreads looking hairstyle. And of course shaved. A few of the heads look possibly african looking with dark skin. Not so easy though. Don't really blame anyone for that, it's not as if tons of other games implement many different real world ethnicities.

Well as long as they have dreadlocks I'm happy.  Just giving you the heads up for next time, other people may want it.  Actually kudos to NWN2 they have an aasimar face that looks distinctly African.  This is probably because some aasimar come from Mulhorand which is the forgotten realms equivalent of ancient Egypt.

Just note I'm not saying that this applies for all races, obvoulsy NWN2 is based on ancient Northern European mythology and obvoulsy the people featured in those myths were white.  I wouldn't expect a moon elf to have an afro because they are obvoulsy based on caucasians and thats how they look.  However we know for a fact in this fictional setting there are black humans and aasimar so these options would apply to these races or other sub-races that may include that eg Tiefling, Half-Orc etc. 

Modifié par Skadison, 15 septembre 2011 - 12:41 .

[dunniteowl]

This has been one of my biggest gripes about the models for characters. There should have been representative examples of every morphological ethnicity. Not to satisfy some politically correct concept, either. Just so that people could create the characters they wanted. I would have liked to be able to choose a North American Native look for my Ranger or Druid, but NOOOO! I had to have a European looking person. Thanks. I couldn't create a party of people from all over, unless I wanted a Dwarf, Elf, and Half Orc. Come on, why not an asian dude with big bulging arms and an african with long skinny legs or a white guy with a pot belly and long, wispy, scraggly beard as adventuring companions? It's the FR for crying out loud. One of the most cosmopolitan fantasy realms like, Evar!

sorry, got carried away.

dno

[The Curt Jester]

Actually, one of the male heads does look sort of Asian. And there are a number of heads that look somewhat Black, particularly from SoZ. There are also custom heads that help out. In particular there's an Asian female head.

[MasterChanger]

The Curt Jester wrote...

Actually, one of the male heads does look sort of Asian. And there are a number of heads that look somewhat Black, particularly from SoZ. There are also custom heads that help out. In particular there's an Asian female head.

There are some very good custom heads, though there should definitely be more. Xaltar has an excellent female head pack that is specifically intended to offer options for different ethnicities: 1 Arab/Mid-Easterner, 1 based on the Maasai people, 1 East Asian. They are perhaps the most beautifully-done heads for NWN2.

[Dann-J]

Even the mohawk hairstyles look caucasian. I pity the fool who doesn't include an afro mohawk option...

[The Fred]

kamal_ wrote...
Don't really blame anyone for that, it's not as if tons of other games implement many different real world ethnicities.

Yeah, to be fair, the Sword Coast is a generic quasi-medieval fantasy setting, and in medieval Europe meeting someone of basically any non-European ethnicity was either very rare, or they were an infidel you were about to kill (or be killed by) or something. Still, given the scope of the game for making your own settings and stuff, you think they'd broaden their horizons a bit.

[Skadison]

DannJ wrote...

Even the mohawk hairstyles look caucasian. I pity the fool who doesn't include an afro mohawk option...

LOL.  I kinda noticed that with the dreadlock hairstyle didn't want to sound too fussy.

The Fred wrote...

Yeah, to be fair, the Sword Coast is a generic quasi-medieval fantasy setting, and in medieval Europe meeting someone of basically any non-European ethnicity was either very rare, or they were an infidel you were about to kill (or be killed by) or something. Still, given the scope of the game for making your own settings and stuff, you think they'd broaden their horizons a bit.

Yes thats true.  Actually I suspect people were less racist then.  I can't be 100% sure but I think the Vikings saw black people and there were lots of black people in Spain.  I don't actually think black people were THAT rare, there were also black people in the Roman army that settled in England.

It is a misconception that in those time people didn't travel around and just stayed in their countries.

[Arkalezth]

There were many arabic people in Spain. And slaves and such could be from anywhere. I'm not so sure about less racism, though, specially with people with a different religion.

[The Fred]

During the time of the Roman Empire, a lot of people travelled to a lot of places. Also, the Romans I think were pretty racist in a Roman > everyone else way, but anyone of any race could become a Roman citizen, so in that sense they were very... um... not racist. In an FR setting, though, it's hard to say, because whilst the Sword Coast is meant to be very similar to medieval Britain or maybe Europe, there was no Roman Empire or equivalent. I guess you have to ask which regions of Faerun have which ethnicities in them (and how they relate to real-world ones, because all the areas of the FR are based on real-world ones, but possibly loosely) and how would those people have travelled around.

[Arkalezth]

If this is true, different regions of Faerun are based on specific countries:

http://www.sorcerers...ds/FR/where.php

[Skadison]

Arkalezth wrote...

There were many arabic people in Spain. .

Yes I know not all Africans are black.

Arkalezth wrote...


And slaves and such could be from anywhere..

Are you trying to imply that the only black people in Spain were slaves? The Africans that conquered Spain were the Almovarids alot of them were mixed race or black, Anyway sometimes mixed race and black can sometimes become semantics but unfortunately racist people try to emphasis that mixed race individuals are white if they achieve anything great.

Arkalezth wrote...



I'm not so sure about less racism, though, specially with people with a different religion.

Well The Roman Empire wasn't racist they just wanted you to submit to the will of Rome.

[Arkalezth]

Skadison wrote...

Arkalezth wrote...

There were many arabic people in Spain. .

Yes I know not all Africans are black.

Where did I say the opposite exactly? I say "there were many Arabic people in Spain", and you read "not all Africans are black"?

I just meant that arabic people were common, and probably more common than blacks in Spain. They dominated most of the country for 700 years, after all...

Arkalezth wrote...

And slaves and such could be from anywhere..

Are you trying to imply that the only black people in Spain were slaves? The Africans that conquered Spain were the Almovarids alot of them were mixed race or black, Anyway sometimes mixed race and black can sometimes become semantics but unfortunately racist people try to emphasis that mixed race individuals are white if they achieve anything great.

No, I'm not trying to imply anything. Please, stick to what I say and don't try to find out what I may be "implying".

I just mentioned slaves (no matter their color) because they count as people living in a country, but probably not as adventurers, which is what you play in the game. And some of those slaves were foreigners, and probably non-white. Not all, but some.

I'm not racist or anything, you couldn't be more wrong if that's what you're thinking... but anyway, I think I'm going to leave the conversation before it goes ugly.

Arkalezth wrote...

I'm not so sure about less racism, though, specially with people with a different religion.

Well The Roman Empire wasn't racist they just wanted you to submit to the will of Rome.

I'm not talking about the Roman empire. As a example, there were jew ghettos in many cities (at least in Spain), and they were rejected by many people just because they were jews. Just an example, maybe it's not exactly "racism", but it's the same in the end, some people were rejected just because they were different.

But then again, are we talking about medieval racism, or about making a black character in a game?

Modifié par Arkalezth, 24 septembre 2011 - 02:24 .

[zootie]

Look for the United Colors mod on the nwvault.com site. It bumps the character colors to 256 and covers the whole range of tones.

[kamal_]

Human male heads 4 and 7 make good black characters. Not sure on the female side, but at least one head does (the companion from al-Qasr was Moorish).

[Skadison]

Arkalezth wrote...

Skadison wrote...

Arkalezth wrote...

There were many arabic people in Spain. .

Yes I know not all Africans are black.

Where did I say the opposite exactly? I say "there were many Arabic people in Spain", and you read "not all Africans are black"?

I just meant that arabic people were common, and probably more common than blacks in Spain. They dominated most of the country for 700 years, after all...

Arkalezth wrote...

And slaves and such could be from anywhere..

Are you trying to imply that the only black people in Spain were slaves? The Africans that conquered Spain were the Almovarids alot of them were mixed race or black, Anyway sometimes mixed race and black can sometimes become semantics but unfortunately racist people try to emphasis that mixed race individuals are white if they achieve anything great.

No, I'm not trying to imply anything. Please, stick to what I say and don't try to find out what I may be "implying".

I just mentioned slaves (no matter their color) because they count as people living in a country, but probably not as adventurers, which is what you play in the game. And some of those slaves were foreigners, and probably non-white. Not all, but some.

I'm not racist or anything, you couldn't be more wrong if that's what you're thinking... but anyway, I think I'm going to leave the conversation before it goes ugly.

Arkalezth wrote...

I'm not so sure about less racism, though, specially with people with a different religion.

Well The Roman Empire wasn't racist they just wanted you to submit to the will of Rome.

I'm not talking about the Roman empire. As a example, there were jew ghettos in many cities (at least in Spain), and they were rejected by many people just because they were jews. Just an example, maybe it's not exactly "racism", but it's the same in the end, some people were rejected just because they were different.

But then again, are we talking about medieval racism, or about making a black character in a game?

*sigh*  Arabs are not blacks  (not in the context in which you used it) and if you thought that the slaves were probably non-white that means that you thought that the only black in Spain were slaves.  Thank you proving me right.

Let me correct you on that.  The Islamic Empire had alot of white slaves, the only time that black people got enslaved in mass was due to the Transatlantic slave trade.  You don't know anything about black African history the only thing you probably know is about the slave trade, so you made some ill-informed assumption that in mediaval Spain most slaves had to be non-white (what you mean't to say was black).

At this point I don't really care about what you're talking about but don't make assumptions about sensitive issues.

Modifié par Skadison, 06 octobre 2011 - 04:14 .

[Arkalezth]

Ok, maybe I wasn't clear in my first post and looked like a direct response to yours, but it wasn't. Let me explain myself because I think you misunderstood me:

I never said that arabics are black. I said that there were many arabics in Spain, period. It wasn't a response to anything, nor I used it in any context. It was just an example of non-European people in Europe.

I said that slaves could be from anywhere, meaning that they could be white, black or of any other color. Maybe I should have never mentioned slaves, but please, point me to where I said (where I said, not where you interpreted) that most were black, because I can't see it. I saw that SOME could be from non-white races (I didn't even say black), but I never spoke of mass black enslaving. I said that there were many arabics in Spain, you interpreted that I said that all arabics are black and they were massively enslaved.

I think that what I tried to say should be clearer now, if not, I'll try to explain it again. But I'm not the one making assumptions here.

Modifié par Arkalezth, 06 octobre 2011 - 10:11 .

[kamal_]

Neither of those has any bearing on making black characters in nwn2, so please stop it before a mod decides they need to step in.

[Arkalezth]

Yes, you're right. Sorry for the off-topic, I was only trying to explain myself. But I think I already did (so I think at least), so I don't have anymore to say off-topic.

As for the topic itself, I played at least a black character in NWN2, but I don't remember him looking bad. Which is good, because some of the faces/hair in the game are pretty fugly. That said, I agree with DNO. And races apart, I'd also like games to start allowing fat, thin, tall, or small people. I'm tired of all characters having the same body type in pretty much every game.

[kamal_]

Discussing real world slavery is likely to draw moderator attention is all I'm saying, as it's a naturally touchy subject.