236 réponses à ce sujet

[Catriana]

ipgd wrote...

The Xand wrote...

Catriana wrote...

Oh, good. I hope so. I never really cared for Isabela in DAII (she was like a female overly exaggerated Zevran to me), but I love learning more about character backgrounds and the like. I look forward to seeing how it plays out.

She was a damn dirty slag who'd spread her legs for anyone

*sigh*

One of these days, just one, I'd like to see Isabela come up in a thread without someone immediately piling on the slut shame.

I just ignored him/pretended he said nothing. If you don't give people like that more ammo, they eventually go away.

Modifié par Catriana, 12 septembre 2011 - 05:27 .

[The Xand]

Catriana wrote...

I just ignored him/pretended he said nothing. If you don't give people like that more ammo, they eventually go away.

That worked so well that I'm still here. Gz.

ipgd wrote...
*sigh*

One of these days, just one, I'd
like to see Isabela come up in a thread without someone immediately
piling on the slut shame.

Oh come on, it's not like that's necessarily a bad thing! Half her lines are sex innuendos, and some of them are actually pretty good. Faves being "master your taint" and "explore your deep roads" :L

RagingCyclone wrote...
*had to make sure I was in spoiler section [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/tongue.png[/smilie]*  
You are right, I think for Izzy it comes down to dealing with the
relic. After the end of Act 2, and when she returns, even in a non
romantic role she develops  a lot. None of the others do this, but she
does.

She did become much more bearable after it, though I was sorely tempted to let the Arishok cart her away after finding out the whole Qunari thing was her fault and then she bailed on me. Satisfying to slap her down with angreh responses though. But yeah, after that she goes all soft and gooey and is like "I'm glad to have a friend like you and I promise not to run away and stuffz."

Oddly though, she got pissed when you killed that guy whose pirate ship she wanted in Act 3 and insisted you let him go even after she got the rights to the ship.

Modifié par The Xand, 12 septembre 2011 - 05:44 .

[Cutlass Jack]

hoorayforicecream wrote...

The other thing I would like to add - Isabela's romance is definitely much more multi-dimensional, but you don't get all of it from just the conversations between Hawke and Isabela - the rest of it comes out through smaller actions and banters with teammates, especially with Merrill. The part I like most is that it makes perfect sense - it's things Isabela wouldn't say to Hawke directly, but would to someone else.

Exactly this. It was one of the things that really made the game for me. She's got a surprising amount of depth if you pay attention and really get to know her.  And she directly discusses people who judge her without knowing her in her conversations with Aveline. This forum proves her right on a regular basis.

Anyways, back on topic, I've been known to do 'gay' playthroughs for variety's sake. Or more specifically gender boundries have nothing to do do with me wanting to see content I haven't seen before. For example, If I haven't seen the Anders relationship yet and am playing a character that I think would relate to him, then that's all that matters really.

[happy_daiz]

ipgd wrote...

One of these days, just one, I'd like to see Isabela come up in a thread without someone immediately piling on the slut shame.

ipgd, I always enjoy your posts. 

And I agree wholeheartedly. I had that immediate (albeit brief) reaction in my very first playthrough, but realized very quickly on that there are a couple of dynamics at work with Isabela: she uses sex as a defense/distancing mechanism, to keep people from getting too close; and she simply enjoys sex. Once you get to "know" Isabela, you realize that she is one of the deepest characters in the game. If people can't see past the bawdy exterior, it's their loss, I guess.

Back to the main topic...I typically try playing each game through as both genders, but I never really saw it as a gay/straight thing. Perhaps it's different if you're female, I don't know. I just don't see myself as a lesbian if I romance Isabela in a Dragon Age game, you know? I think people need to squash this need to put a label on every little thing they do. I'm just sayin...

Modifié par happy_daiz, 12 septembre 2011 - 07:02 .

[aries1001]

The Xand wrote...

Catriana wrote...

Oh, good. I hope so. I never really cared for Isabela in DAII (she was like a female overly exaggerated Zevran to me), but I love learning more about character backgrounds and the like. I look forward to seeing how it plays out.

She was a damn dirty slag who'd spread her legs for anyone

If you truly believe this you didn't pay enough attention to what she was actually saying. I remember a conversation in The Hanged Man about pirates and how she used to give the crew 'turns' to keep the men happy. Then, suddenly, in the next line, she'll admit that she doesn't do this often and more often than not turns members of her male crew away. Although, she also does admit that she likes to watch a good muscular thorax (upper body? - sorry I'm not a native english speaker so I think this is the right word for it?)


From various conversations during the game, particularly with Merril, you'll learn that she doesn't want Merrill ot become like her, probably because she has taught herself to use sex as a way to distance herself from others e.g. she'll sleep with you, but she won't give her your soul. I have a hunch that Isabella has been hurt in varius ways - and is using sex to protect herself meaning she doesn't let anyone get close to her (soul) because she knows she'll be betrayed some time - by the people she trusts.

That's probablywhy she reacts the way she does when you show trust in her when dealing with book and the Quanari - and the reason why she, much later in the game, has the reaction she has. (if she's not run away that is) You have showed trust in her, you din't turn her away or betray her, so she now feels that she can trust you - for life - probably.

[hoorayforicecream]

aries1001 wrote...

From various conversations during the game, particularly with Merril, you'll learn that she doesn't want Merrill ot become like her, probably because she has taught herself to use sex as a way to distance herself from others e.g. she'll sleep with you, but she won't give her your soul. I have a hunch that Isabella has been hurt in varius ways - and is using sex to protect herself meaning she doesn't let anyone get close to her (soul) because she knows she'll be betrayed some time - by the people she trusts.

I'm not sure I agree with this. I always viewed Isabela as someone who likes having sex because she likes having sex. It's fun, pleasurable, and something she enjoys. As near as I can figure, to her, sex with someone is like going out for drinks, or playing cards. It's a fun pasttime that doesn't have much deeper meaning to it.  She doesn't use it as a tool to distance herself - she purposely separates any real feelings from the act.

This disconnect is partially because she doesn't want to hurt anyone, and likes that emotional distance. But further still, even when the emotional distance closes between her and Hawke, she still doesn't quite associate sex with emotion. That's the reading I got for why she was willing to go sleep with Zevran, even after confessing her feelings for Hawke. To her, love and sex are barely (if at all) connected, and any sort of monogamy would be out of respect for her partner more than any personal association of sex and emotion. Just my 2 copper armchair psychoanalysis, of course.

[LobselVith8]

Rifneno wrote...

Straight male and I've done gay romances of both genders... there's not much difference, except in Anders case he tells you about Karl being more than just his mentor. Which I really think should have been told to all Hawkes since it helps put his character in perspective (people will get FAR more emotional about the loss of a lover than a mentor).

I agree about Anders dialogue. I've chosen the third line of dialogue in that conversation because I get a better feel for what Anders is going through with Karl's demise, and it never seems to impact the romance with Merrill.

Rifneno wrote...

Oh, and lesbian romance with Isabela has one of the best jokes with obscure requirements to hear. Isabela asks Hawke is she wants to have some "girly fun" and sarcastic Hawke replies, "What, you want to go shoe shopping?" God I love sarcastic Hawke!

As for differences between straight and gay romances, I know that Merrill doesn't mention being the last of the Elven and having to preserve who her people are if Hawke is female (in the romance scene at the mansion, probably because Merrill doesn't have to worry about having biological children with a female Hawke).

[LobselVith8]

aries1001 wrote...


If you truly believe this you didn't pay enough attention to what she was actually saying. I remember a conversation in The Hanged Man about pirates and how she used to give the crew 'turns' to keep the men happy. Then, suddenly, in the next line, she'll admit that she doesn't do this often and more often than not turns members of her male crew away. Although, she also does admit that she likes to watch a good muscular thorax (upper body? - sorry I'm not a native english speaker so I think this is the right word for it?)

I think Isabela is talking about giving the crewmen "alone time" for themselves, not with her. That's why Merrill asks why she would give the crew time to be alone, and Isabela jokes to think about it, because the answer will come to her...

aries1001 wrote...

From various conversations during the game, particularly with Merril, you'll learn that she doesn't want Merrill ot become like her, probably because she has taught herself to use sex as a way to distance herself from others e.g. she'll sleep with you, but she won't give her your soul. I have a hunch that Isabella has been hurt in varius ways - and is using sex to protect herself meaning she doesn't let anyone get close to her (soul) because she knows she'll be betrayed some time - by the people she trusts.

Isabela tells a romanced Hawke about her mother selling her to her husband when she was very young, who was killed by Zevran (and who she inherited her last ship from).

aries1001 wrote...

That's probablywhy she reacts the way she does when you show trust in her when dealing with book and the Quanari - and the reason why she, much later in the game, has the reaction she has. (if she's not run away that is) You have showed trust in her, you din't turn her away or betray her, so she now feels that she can trust you - for life - probably.

Which would explain why Isabela asks Hawke to join her crew on her new ship.

[naledgeborn]

Aggressive Old Spice Manly Mage for Isabela is the only way to go. Sorry girls *looks at whykiky* ;p.

[whykikyouwhy]

@naledgeborn - Have you thrown the glove on the floor there, Ser? And here I thought we had come to a pleasant understanding just the other day.

(I find Old Spice's new line of scents to border on cloying, personally.) Besides, Isabela prefers the aromas of the wild and free ocean - salt spray, tar, etc.

[naledgeborn]

Yeah, remember the "plowing of the **** in the back alley"? That's all Manly Hawke. I brought up Old Spice because of Bruce Campbell I'm an Axe/Dial man myself.

[Lenimph]

*chuckles*
Male Hawke? pfft
*tries to hold in laughter*
BWAHAHAHAHA

[whykikyouwhy]

@naledgeborn - That was "w****s plying their trade..." - no mention of "plowing" was made. Kirkwall doesn't have any farms.

I'll not comment on your soap choices. Out of respect...

[naledgeborn]

LMBAO, okay okay, thanks for saying I smell. You got me on the quote though "plowing" as verb has many uses in vernacular..

[whykikyouwhy]

I didn't intend to imply that you smell in a negative sense. Dial can be rather crisp in scent, sure. It's just that Axe...well... x_x

Anyhow, yes, "plowing" is rife with innuendo. But given the locations in the game, a more nautical term would be appropriate.

The vocabulary mini-lesson is over. Time to veer back on topic.

[BroBear Berbil]

Haven't done a gay romance with Hawke. I did do a Leliana romance with my female Dwarf partly because it was just funny and partly because there were no Dwarven men who would have me.

Haven't done F/F in DA2 because there's no butch Dwarf to be found otherwise I might give it a go. M/M is too much of a stretch for me. Ironically I can play females and romance males easily enough but just cannot do it as a male. I've seen all the romance scenes on youtube anyway and Hawke kind of acts like a girl in the Anders one.

[Kaiser Shepard]

No, I wouldn't. But then again, I would never again romance one of DAII's ladies either.

If I'll ever romance someone in that game again, it will be on a Femhawke playthough.

[Cutlass Jack]

LobselVith8 wrote...

I think Isabela is talking about giving the crewmen "alone time" for themselves, not with her. That's why Merrill asks why she would give the crew time to be alone, and Isabela jokes to think about it, because the answer will come to her...

Aye, in fact during her cardgame cutscene with Merril (Her apology cutscene after the Fade), she says quite specifically she never sleeps with her crew. Because you can't respect a captain after you see their hindquarters up in the air (or something similar)

[The Xand]

aries1001 wrote...
If you truly believe this you didn't pay enough attention to what she was actually saying. I remember a conversation in The Hanged Man about pirates and how she used to give the crew 'turns' to keep the men happy. Then, suddenly, in the next line, she'll admit that she doesn't do this often and more often than not turns members of her male crew away.

I'm aware that while she might be deeper than she seems, it doesn't make her any less of a slag since she goes around sleeping with all and sundry and enjoying it almightily. That bit about a pirate gangbang doesn't really do her much favours in that regard either. She could be as hurt and sensitive on the inside as she wants but that doesn't change how her actions make her a slag. Though tbh she wouldn't stand out much from the girls in my part of the world lol, and there's nothing wrong with enjoying sex. Does make one wonde either a) what sort of preventatives the Dragon Age world has (lyrium tipped coathangers?) or just how many kids does she really have, and is there even any tread left on the tires or is it like throwing a hotdog down a hallway.

naledgeborn wrote...

LMBAO, okay okay, thanks for saying I
smell. You got me on the quote though "plowing" as verb has many uses
in vernacular..

Aye, it's fairly common to use the word ploughing to describe sex. Think it was first used like that in the Quran and Bible. http://quran.com/2/223

hoorayforicecream wrote...
I'm not sure I agree with this.
I always viewed Isabela as someone who likes having sex because she
likes having sex. It's fun, pleasurable, and something she enjoys. As
near as I can figure, to her, sex with someone is like going out for
drinks, or playing cards. It's a fun pasttime that doesn't have much
deeper meaning to it.  She doesn't use it as a tool to distance herself -
she purposely separates any real feelings from the act.

This
disconnect is partially because she doesn't want to hurt anyone, and
likes that emotional distance. But further still, even when the
emotional distance closes between her and Hawke, she still doesn't quite
associate sex with emotion. That's the reading I got for why she was
willing to go sleep with Zevran, even after confessing her feelings for
Hawke. To her, love and sex are barely (if at all) connected, and any
sort of monogamy would be out of respect for her partner more than any
personal association of sex and emotion. Just my 2 copper armchair
psychoanalysis, of course.

Pretty much this. She's not using sex as a means of distancing herself, it's just a fun thing to do for her without any emotional attachments.

Modifié par The Xand, 13 septembre 2011 - 07:56 .

[Boiny Bunny]

Is there a great difference between Zevran and Isabela with respect to their views and actions when it comes to sex (with either gender)?

I don't think so. But Isabela is apparently a '****' while Zevran is just charming?

It's disturbing to see the amount of gender double standards that still exist in people's minds today, and (mostly) young people here too...

[esper]

I don't like Isabella because of the book thing and not the sex thing- The sex thing is all right with me.
And there is gender double standards, however sad that is.
Sadly are lot of men and women are uncomfortable with women enjoying sex with a lot of different partners.

[whykikyouwhy]

Boiny Bunny wrote...

Is there a great difference between Zevran and Isabela with respect to their views and actions when it comes to sex (with either gender)?

I don't think so. But Isabela is apparently a '****' while Zevran is just charming?

It's disturbing to see the amount of gender double standards that still exist in people's minds today, and (mostly) young people here too...

I think you and esper pretty much have it right with regard to the double standards. It's always been incredibly interesting to me (and somewhat saddening) to see how divisive of a character Isabela is, specifically for her appearance, attitude towards sex, and perceived qualities (or lack thereof). I think most people who handle all of her dialogues and/or engage in a romance with her are often pleasantly surprised by her depth. She's the quintessential example of why someone shouldn't judge a book by its cover, imo. And for every argument made against her in the negative, there is almost always a counter in the positive.

Having done playthroughs with both Merrill and Isabela romances, I have to say that the latter is much more fulfilling. (Not that there's is anything wrong with Merrill - she's incredible.) It's just a shame when anyone feels the need to belittle a character with cheap names (which in turn, belittles the person flinging the insults) - regardless of love or hate for any of the characters, they're all great in their own way, they all have some merit, if just in the small fact that a writer and a VA put a bit of their heart and soul into fleshing them out. And job well done on that, since clearly people feel so strongly about them.

[Aradace]

Bi_Winning wrote...

 Has any straight male or female ever done a playthrough with a gay Hawke? Do you get anything special for having a gay relationship? All of my Hawkes are males so I might consider playing as a female to get the lesbo sexy scene with Isabela or Merril. 

1.) No, I havent.  If other people want to play homosexual characters, that's their business.  I personally steer clear of it.  

2.) No, you get nothing "Special" for it.  In fact, the romance scenes are pretty much the same (Going off of what I've seen my wife play) and there is no achievement/trophy for it.

3.) There are no lesbo sexy scenes, as I said, they're all pretty much the same clothes on dry-humping you get from ME2.

[Urzon]

I haven't romanced her yet. I might in the future play threw, but i haven't really decided yet. My Hawke doesn't mind that she likes to have sex. He just doesn't join in because he is afraid he might catch something. Because, he knows that she goes to Anders alot to be treated for all sorts of things...