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[Omega4RelayResident]

Commander Shepard is not a piece of meat. Male and female Sheps have feelings too. What the VS Ashley / Kaidan said on Horizon as a ME1 LI is unfogivable. In the real military the word "traitor" is not thrown around lightly. Them are some serious fighting words. Consequences are common for false implications.

Then the VS LI continues on to basically break up with Shep. I understand people grieve and it is an extensive process... I also understand that old wounds open up during this moment on Horizon. However the thing people forget is that Shep was the one that died. The VS LI shows no concern for Sheps feelings. The VS LI doesnt even try to watch what they say if Shep had been traumatized by the death.

As a huge supporter of Commander Shepard both male and female I would like to make BW aware that in this situation we should have a right to defend Shep's feelings. This has to actually spark some heated dialogue. For once let there be consequences for someone else.

Commander Shepard's last thoughts before he/she died could have been with VS LI. The first thing that happens in the reunion is he/she gets broken up with and called a traitor.

A lot of people want to see Commander Shepard take the "Everything Will Be Okay" gloves off and defend their new LI choice. We would like to see Shep get emotional, angry, defensive, and explain that he/she was the one that died and needed the VS LI with them after Horizon. That the only thing they were looking forward to was to get back together... and Shep gets his/her heart broken by a selfish person that did not realize Shep died to save them by ordering them off the Normandy during the initial Collector attack on the Normandy SR1.

Shep has feelings too and he/she has a right to defend them and their new LI from ME2.

Allow me to state that in no way do I want to take the VS LI away from those that want to be with them. I support your choice as well. Help us out though and support our choices and interpretation of the situation.

Modifié par Omega4RelayResident, 10 septembre 2011 - 02:34 .

[Willowhugger]

I think, ironically, there WAS a HUGE consequence for the Virmire Love Interest. Specifically, a lot of fans hooked up with one of the Normandy-II suicide squad. What's interesting will be how Bioware treats this.

A lot of Bioware developers talked about "cheating" on your ME1 LI. Except, the problem is that a lot of fans assumed they were WELL and TRULY broken up with Ashley or Kaidan.

Obviously A&K thought otherwise since after Virmire, you basically get a, "Okay, I was a bit harsh. SORRY! LOVE YOU!" e-mail.

[AdmiralCheez]

The VS was there when Shep died--probably watched Shep die--and was most likely destroyed by the event.

And then, two years later, Shep's back from the dead... with Cerberus.

I'd be hurt, confused, and pissed off, too. While you have a right to want to stick with your new LI, the VS had a right to get emotional, no matter how poorly the scene was done.

The VS is not a piece of meat.

[CrookedAsylum]

The VS had two years to move on. Two. Years.

I firmly believe there was no cheating involved if Shepard moved on, and the VS couldn't get their head out of their bum hole.

[Willowhugger]

CrookedAsylum wrote...

The VS had two years to move on. Two. Years.

I firmly believe there was no cheating involved if Shepard moved on, and the VS couldn't get their head out of their bum hole.

Yes, cheating implies that one party or the other didn't consider it a breakup. It requires deception. I hope Bioware gives the option of saying, "What you said to me was unforgivable. We were done."

Honestly, Bioware did a little TOO good a job in salting the Earth relationship wise.

I actually AM a bit curious though how Tali and Ashley will interact in my squad, however.

[AdmiralCheez]

CrookedAsylum wrote...

The VS had two years to move on. Two. Years.

I firmly believe there was no cheating involved if Shepard moved on, and the VS couldn't get their head out of their bum hole.

In those two years, they thought you were dead.  It was right for them to move on.  Then, suddenly, you're back.  Alive.  Cue total confusion and the onslaught of dozens of powerful emotions that don't make sense together, and you get an angry speech, followed by an apologetic email.

Meanwhile, in Shepard time, you were gone for a few weeks.

You didn't see your lover for a couple weeks, have one fight, and then go sleep with someone else.

PS: I cheated on Ashley with Miranda.  I consider myself (or my Shepard) the one at fault.

Actually, no.  Scratch that.  I blame Miranda's ass.  It was calling to me, Ash!  I couldn't stop myself!  Miranda has a mind-controlling ass!

And better ******.

*is slapped*

Modifié par AdmiralCheez, 09 septembre 2011 - 09:58 .

[lazuli]

It's kind of hard to see this accurately from Shepard's perspective because of the huge time gap between the release of ME1 and ME2.

[ladyvader]

I have many different Shepard. Most are with Liara, however. I have Shepards with both Ash and Kaidan. Two with Ash actually, one is now with Jack. Can't wait to see that play out in ME3. The other remained true to Ash. I did not do the same for Kaidan. That poor guy can't catch a break from my Shepards. First he gets dumped for Liara by one femShep. Another femShep was with him in ME, but is now with Jacob. Another femShep was with him until she ripped his head off after the Normandy got grounded. That ended it right there. She is still single too. That email of his didn't help any with him saying he saw someone else.

Unlike the email from Ash. She didn't mentioned that she was dating anyone. That is why I created another Shepard to remain with her.

[Zakatak757]

What is "VS"?

[BatmanPWNS]

I understand their feelings but................ I am gonna act like a hardass just to play hard to get.

[sorentoft]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Actually, no.  Scratch that.  I blame Miranda's ass.  It was calling to me, Ash!  I couldn't stop myself!  Miranda has a mind-controlling ass!

And better ******.

*is slapped*

It's true. That ass.

Modifié par sorentoft, 09 septembre 2011 - 10:31 .

[KingNothing125]

I'm just gonna copypasta what I said in the Ash thread. I have nothing else to add.

KingNothing125 wrote...

Ash has every right to be as distrustful on Horizon as she wants. Anyone familiar with what Cerberus was doing in ME1 should know that. They experimented with the Rachni and the Thorian, committing heinous acts on innocent humans.

Shep dies. Ash spends 2 years keeping her mind on her work, moving on. Meanwhile, something or someone starts wiping out human colonies in the terminus systems. No one knows who or what they are. The Alliance receives intel that Shep might be alive, with Cerberus, and headed to Horizon. Ashley goes to Horizon, officially as part of the Alliance outreach program, but unofficially to corroborate that intel. The Collectors show up and abduct half the colony (somehow missing Ashley, even though she was caught by the Seekers). Shep shows up, and he's with Cerberus.

Intel confirmed.

So here's a guy who's supposed to be dead, but now he's here with a known terrorist organization with a record of mind control experimentation (see above: Rachni, Thorian), and the colony just got wiped out. Is he a clone? Is he mind controlled? (And don't forget, Miranda pretty much admits to Shep that she wanted to mind control him with a neural implant). Was Cerberus behind the colony attack? How is Ash supposed to know that?

Ash can't be expected to know what the player knows. And even if she was in love with Shep... he's been gone for two years. How can she even be sure it's him, let alone trust him on faith?

The fact that she drops hints in her email that she believes Shep and "can't lose him a second time" tells me that she's inclined to believe him and that she's still carrying a torch for him.

I am inclined to not throw a whiny hissy-fit that Ash was angry and confused, and cut her some slack. Cerberus is f'd up... I wouldn't trust my girlfriend either if she was dead for two years and then somehow showed up with them.

[KawaiiKatie]

Cheated on Ashley with Miranda, didn't you?

[ADLegend21]

No.

[Made Nightwing]

[Omega4RelayResident]

Zakatak757 wrote...

What is "VS"?

Virmire Survivor

AdmiralCheez wrote...

In those two years, they thought you were dead. It was right for them to move on. Then, suddenly, you're back. Alive. Cue total confusion and the onslaught of dozens of powerful emotions that don't make sense together, and you get an angry speech, followed by an apologetic email.

Meanwhile, in Shepard time, you were gone for a few weeks.

You didn't see your lover for a couple weeks, have one fight, and then go sleep with someone else.

PS: I cheated on Ashley with Miranda. I consider myself (or my Shepard) the one at fault.

Actually, no. Scratch that. I blame Miranda's ass. It was calling to me, Ash! I couldn't stop myself! Miranda has a mind-controlling ass!

And better ******.

*is slapped*

I said this in other threads... and I do not mind allowing people know who I am...

10 years ago I saw my G/F get hit by a car and die in front of my eyes... If she was resurrected back to life I would not have reacted the same way Ashley / Kaidan did... I would run up to her hug her, kiss her, and worry about whether or not she was traumatized by the DYING thing...

Later I would ask the weird questions... about Cerberus... and all. Saying Ashley was not prepared for this was BS because Anderson sent her to Horizon because of the "rumors about Shep working with Cerberus and Cerberus targeting Horizon next"...

Sometimes the right thing to do is put aside your feelings (at least for a short time) for the person you love. If I reacted like Ashley / Kaidan did I would expect Shep to move on and find someone else. The e-mail was a half assed attempt at "O boy I just effed up I need to clear the air before it gets worse".

Did I forgot to mention that you cant romance anyone new in ME2 until after the Horizon mission... techincally Shep was faithfull until he/she got his/her heart broken.

[Omega4RelayResident]

KingNothing125 wrote...

I'm just gonna copypasta what I said in the Ash thread. I have nothing else to add.

KingNothing125 wrote...

Ash has every right to be as distrustful on Horizon as she wants. Anyone familiar with what Cerberus was doing in ME1 should know that. They experimented with the Rachni and the Thorian, committing heinous acts on innocent humans.

Shep dies. Ash spends 2 years keeping her mind on her work, moving on. Meanwhile, something or someone starts wiping out human colonies in the terminus systems. No one knows who or what they are. The Alliance receives intel that Shep might be alive, with Cerberus, and headed to Horizon. Ashley goes to Horizon, officially as part of the Alliance outreach program, but unofficially to corroborate that intel. The Collectors show up and abduct half the colony (somehow missing Ashley, even though she was caught by the Seekers). Shep shows up, and he's with Cerberus.

Intel confirmed.

So here's a guy who's supposed to be dead, but now he's here with a known terrorist organization with a record of mind control experimentation (see above: Rachni, Thorian), and the colony just got wiped out. Is he a clone? Is he mind controlled? (And don't forget, Miranda pretty much admits to Shep that she wanted to mind control him with a neural implant). Was Cerberus behind the colony attack? How is Ash supposed to know that?

Ash can't be expected to know what the player knows. And even if she was in love with Shep... he's been gone for two years. How can she even be sure it's him, let alone trust him on faith?

The fact that she drops hints in her email that she believes Shep and "can't lose him a second time" tells me that she's inclined to believe him and that she's still carrying a torch for him.

I am inclined to not throw a whiny hissy-fit that Ash was angry and confused, and cut her some slack. Cerberus is f'd up... I wouldn't trust my girlfriend either if she was dead for two years and then somehow showed up with them.

F*** Intel and the whole Cerberus thing... at least Tali assumed Shep was undercover trying to blow Cerberus up...

Tali: "I'll loan you a grenade" See Tali knows Shep well enough to assume he/she is still the good guy/chick.

Love is SUPPOSED to conquer all. Heck Ashley / Kaidan could have joined up with Shep to try to convince him/her to not work with Cerberus, and to send intel on Cerberus actions back to the Alliance... not only what the VS LI did was selfish but also very very stupid.

Finally I want to add one more thing... In my canon Shep is still a Spectre... I am loyal to the Citadel Council first and the Alliance second... we need to discuss our definition of "Traitor"... I would only betray the Council if they turned against humanity completely.

Modifié par Omega4RelayResident, 09 septembre 2011 - 11:08 .

[KingNothing125]

Good for Tali.

Doesn't change anything. Ashley and Kaidan have their own personalities. Sorry they don't see the world through the same lens as Tali and you do.

If your Shep wants to be petty and crap all over the VS because of a brief, heated exchange on Horizon, that's your business. Some of the rest of us can understand their point of view and can let that crap slide.

[CulturalGeekGirl]

A while ago I wrote up a hypothetical ideal conversation between my Shepard and Kaidan, about what happened. Maybe I'll try to dig it up later. It was meant to be a calm, reasonable adult sit down, where she'd basically say "Hey, I didn't plan this, but it happened. I'm sorry about everything you've been through, but maybe now you can really move on."

I'm one of those people who took the conversation and the resulting letter as official acknowledgement that we were broken up for the time being, but with a possibility of getting back together sometime in the future. That's pretty much what it says explicitly, and my Shepard isn't exactly an expert on dealing with long-term relationships.

I have no problem with the VS being hurt or upset, but if they actually consider it literally cheating I will be a bit annoyed.

Modifié par CulturalGeekGirl, 09 septembre 2011 - 11:01 .

[Omega4RelayResident]

KingNothing125 wrote...

Good for Tali.

Doesn't change anything. Ashley and Kaidan have their own personalities. Sorry they don't see the world through the same lens as Tali and you do.

If your Shep wants to be petty and crap all over the VS because of a brief, heated exchange on Horizon, that's your business. Some of the rest of us can understand their point of view and can let that crap slide.

That lens that Tali uses is the "I know Shep and he/she is not a bad peson lens. He/She proved that to me during the mission to destroy Saren." Tali apparently knows Shep better than the VS LI. Gold star for Tali.

I am not arguing that you dont have a right to get what you want... I am arguing that Shep should have a choice to defend her/his actions for us who feel what VS LI did to us was wrong.

Dont call our group of people petty... that is considered a hostile action. I respect your opinion and you have a right to be happy with your LI. You are the forgiving type. I and a good portion of this community is not. We want to be heard.

Modifié par Omega4RelayResident, 09 septembre 2011 - 11:06 .

[AdmiralCheez]

Omega4RelayResident wrote...

I said this in other threads... and I do not mind allowing people know who I am...

10 years ago I saw my G/F get hit by a car and die in front of my eyes... If she was resurrected back to life I would not have reacted the same way Ashley / Kaidan did... I would run up to her hug her, kiss her, and worry about whether or not she was traumatized by the DYING thing...

Ash and Kaidan are not you.  They're soldiers, and they've probably learned to keep their feelings in check.  You know, not act on impulse.  Especially since, you know, Cerberus.

Later I would ask the weird questions... about Cerberus... and all. Saying Ashley was not prepared for this was BS because Anderson sent her to Horizon because of the "rumors about Shep working with Cerberus and Cerberus targeting Horizon next"...

Hence the hugging and kissing was held back: suspicion.  They didn't know if it was you or not.  They were scared it wasn't.  It's easier to be angry than scared.

Sometimes the right thing to do is put aside your feelings (at least for a short time) for the person you love. If I reacted like Ashley / Kaidan did I would expect Shep to move on and find someone else. The e-mail was a half assed attempt at "O boy I just effed up I need to clear the air before it gets worse".

Half-assed?

Shepard,



I'm sorry for what I said back on Horizon. I spent two years pulling
myself back together after you went down with the Normandy. It took me a
long time to get over my guilt for surviving and move on. I'd finally
let my friends talk me into going out for drinks with a doctor on the
Citadel. Nothing serious, but trying to let myself have a life again,
you know?



Then I saw you, and everything pulled hard to port. You were standing in
front of me, but you were with Cerberus. I guess I really don't know
who either of us is anymore. Do you even remember that night before
Ilos? That night meant everything to me... maybe it meant as much to
you. But a lot has changed in the last two years and I can't just put
that aside.



But please be careful. I've watched too many people close to me die --
on Eden Prime, on Virmire, on Horizon, on the Normandy. I couldn't bear
it if I lost you again. If you're still the woman I remember I know
you'll find a way to stop these Collector attacks. But Cerberus is too
dangerous to be trusted. Watch yourself.



When things settle down a little... maybe... I don't know. Just take care.



--Kaidan

More like honest and emotional.  Let's try Ash...

Shepard-



I'm sorry for what I said back on Horizon. When I lost you two years
ago, it tore me up. I prayed for you every day. I read a lot of
Tennyson, thinking about you, just like I did when my dad passed. And
then you came back, and it was like my prayers were answered. But I'm
not who I was then, and neither are you.



I don't know what's true anymore. Part of me can't believe it's really
you. I keep going back to that night before Ilos, our night... I haven't
let myself think about those memories in over a year.



I wouldn't have expected you to work for Cerberus, but I know why they
sent you to Horizon. I saw how many people were lost there, and if
anyone can stop the Collectors, you can. I can't go where you're going,
but I can wish you luck.



Just stay alive out there... Skipper. I don't know what the future holds, but I can't lose you a second time.



--Ash



Death closes all: but something ere the end

Some work of noble note, may yet be done,

Not unbecoming men that strove with Gods.

Again, honest.  Emotional.  The only thing half-assed about it is how much it overlaps with Kaidan's, but that's VS syndrome for you.  What's clear from both is that they still love you.  A lot.  Even after you were dead for two years.

And then you get all worked up over one fight after not seeing them for a few weeks (a fight that only happened due to crazy, unbelievable circumstances), then sleep with someone else a few days later.

"Sometimes the right thing to do is put aside your feelings (at least for a short time) for the person you love. "

In other words, look at things from their perspective, understand them, and forgive them.  You know, not act on impulse and grab the nearest piece of ass.

Even if you really are in love with Tali, Thane, or whomever, Ash/Kaidan hasn't given up on you yet.

Sorry, bro.  You're cheating.  Hell, I'm cheating.  And Ash isn't going to buy the hypno-ass excuse.

Did I forgot to mention that you cant romance anyone new in ME2 until after the Horizon mission... techincally Shep was faithfull until he/she got his/her heart broken.

Well, you can't get anyone loyal until you've done a certain amount of missions, and if they're not loyal, they won't romance you.  You can also flirt with Kelly right off the bat.  Additionally, that's your Shep you're talking about.  Mine couldn't even stay faithful on the original Normandy.  Lusty scoundrel, he is.

[Funkcase]

Shepard got told off for working with a terrorist group so he decides to throw a hissy fit about it? Well I suppose it's good if you want the person who's supposed to unite all the races in the Galaxy against the Reapers to look like a d*ck.

[Collider]

1. I don't fault Kaidan and Ashley for deciding not to abandon their careers to work alongside terrorists.
2. I do fault them for their accusations of Shepard being a traitor and what not.
3. I don't think that moving on from Ashley/Kaidan is cheating - or at least, not necessarily cheating.
4. Shepard should be able to reconcile with the VS, brush the issue aside, or have an ongoing dislike towards them. And something in between.

And Kaidan should stop acting like Ashley.

[shepskisaac]

Zakatak757 wrote...

What is "VS"?

Valuable Sentinel